First  Prev  1  2  3  4  5  6  Next  Last
Post Reply Boy jumps off bridge, kills woman instead
9153 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
27 / M / U.S.A
Offline
Posted 10/31/17 , edited 11/1/17
He should be convicted of murder
35304 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
23 / M / U.S.A.
Offline
Posted 10/31/17 , edited 11/1/17
The apolegetics in this thread is astounding. It's like when the bullied kid decides to reciprocate by taking his dad's glock to school, and everyone rushes to his defense. Owait
mxdan 
11843 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
27 / M / A Husk.
Offline
Posted 10/31/17 , edited 10/31/17

XxDarkSasuxX wrote:

The apolegetics in this thread is astounding. It's like when the bullied kid decides to reciprocate by taking his dad's glock to school, and everyone rushes to his defense. Owait


Completely different actually. A twelve year old threw themselves off a bridge. I don't know how many times I have to repeat myself. A twelve year old doesn't have the same brain functioning that a nineteen year old or a twenty five year old does.

A fair comparison would be a kid taking his fathers glock to his room, killing himself, and accidentally having a bullet ricochet and kill someone next door.


Cardamom_Ginger wrote:


mxdan wrote:


So a child is helping their father with yard work and sets a hammer on the edge of a table. His younger brother sits under the lip and the center of gravity finally switches sides and the hammer falls on his head and kills him. Your saying that the child should face jailing consequences. I'm saying that an understanding of consequence and life needs to be established or charging them is literally meaningless.

If a 12 year old with no basis of action can be charged beyond the scope of their cognitive ability a 4 year old can be charged as well.

Mistakes happen and some things can never be taken back but I don't think it's right to define justice a rigid thing without context.


What? Okay, I really slammed hard on my mental brakes when I read this.

I try.


"I'm not saying he should be jailed for manslaughter or whatever degree murder." amejia0 explicitly said that. No, he did not say the kid should be jailed, but, instead, quite the opposite. You kind of went off of the rails here.

He said he should still face charges and what do those look like? Accidental murder? Look, the only point I made is one that is backed by cognition. The brain is still developing for more then a decade. A child that age isn't weighing consequences because their brain influences a, for lack of a better term, 'choice'. But really at that age it's hard to even call it that.

Do I think that kid should be made aware what his actions caused? Yes, to the fullest extent. Do I think he should have his life ruined? No. He needs therapy and time. This is the only way to actually fix his issues.

I can assure you as someone who used to get in a fair bit of trouble himself the threat of my father spanking me with a wire coat hanger didn't stop me much >_>.

But I digress, I don't even think the kid was making judgements calls at that point. He just wanted to stop the suffering and took the first route he could. This is how a twelve year old's brain usually works.


Also, I question your comparison. The hammer situation is a bona fide accident, lacking any sort of premeditation for any sort of harm. Foolish, sure, but you certainly stretch the parallels to the limit. Your scenario grants the child plenty of wiggle room. Meanwhile, this twelve year-old not only sought out a highway overpass, but then jumped down onto blatantly busy roads. No, no... Frankly, it seems as though you gravely underestimate the intelligence of the average twelve year-old. Hell, I daresay you've forgotten just how smart you were at that age. Undeveloped or not, twelve year-olds deserve a hell of a lot more credit than you give them.
I've provided you with sources that delve into what a 12 year old can't do. I suggest you go into that rabbit hole as it's a bit shocking. The hammer situation is no accident. Any adult with children understands where you can and can't put stuff. Why? Because their brain premeditates it. A twelve year old with a hammer is therefore just an 'accident', so you agree. Because a twelve year old isn't thinking about full cause and effect. They are just acting with themselves as the full center.

What you need to understand is that the way you think about scenarios is demonstratably different than your basic prepubescent child. It's a slippery slope to say that it's ok to charge someone who doesn't even fully understand law let alone someone whose mind isn't weighing consequence during emotional stress great enough to cause them to kill themselves.



The pendulum swings in both directions. Too much punishment onto the head of a twelve year-old is certainly bad, but absolution of responsibility is also warped.


Punishment is only effective when the punishee understands the reasons for it. Even then it's not really all that effective. The people involved usually repeat again by and large. All it does is offer condolences to the harmed. But there is little joy in that when the person involved doesn't understand and remedy what it is that caused them to harm someone else.
31182 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
21 / M / Bundaberg, Queens...
Online
Posted 10/31/17 , edited 10/31/17

XxDarkSasuxX wrote:

The apolegetics in this thread is astounding. It's like when the bullied kid decides to reciprocate by taking his dad's glock to school, and everyone rushes to his defense. Owait


just like the amount of people who want to charge the kid with murder and have him rot in a cell it's astounding and stupid asf.

There is a difference between a kid shooting up a school and a kid accidentally killing someone when attempting suicide.
a HUUUUUUGE difference.

The kid deserves punishment but not to the extent of murder.
31182 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
21 / M / Bundaberg, Queens...
Online
Posted 10/31/17 , edited 10/31/17

kincon wrote:

People who say that this kid should be punished obviously have no idea what it is like to attempt suicide. You don't think about what it does to affect others not because you choose not to but because the pain you are suffering from literally prevents you from doing so. If any one should be punished it's the people who pushed him to do this in the first place. Speaking as someone who attempted suicide twice.


Exactly but you can't blame people for having no idea
qwueri 
23796 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
32 / M / TN
Online
Posted 10/31/17 , edited 10/31/17
A kid accidentally kills someone in his own failed suicide attempt, and people are calling for punishment and lobbing insults to make him feel even more miserable? What could be a classier way to address a senseless tragedy?
26461 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
22 / M / In Jail, On Death...
Online
Posted 10/31/17 , edited 10/31/17

XxDarkSasuxX wrote:

The apolegetics in this thread is astounding. It's like when the bullied kid decides to reciprocate by taking his dad's glock to school, and everyone rushes to his defense. Owait


I would say that where the mentality may differ in terms of being a criminal and being negligent, and reckless. While I believe intent does matter in gauging the criminal, as is the mindset, an act is of course still an act, and taking a life isn't something that should be taken lightly.

Negligence is less a sign of malicious intent than of general stupidity, carelessness, selfishness, etc. For twelve year old persons, this is to be expected to some extent, I assume.

Of course, in my view, I see no reason to have him locked up for life. He does not appear to be a Willie Bosket type juvenile. Whether or not criminal charges can be filed is something I am still wondering.

I see no reason to impugn him the way that some are doing, as if he is an irredeemable criminal.
148 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
24 / F / Asia
Offline
Posted 10/31/17 , edited 10/31/17
If I were the kid I may have been enlightened on how important life is but would feel so much regret on being the reason behind a death of a person. It'll be a baggage to be carried for life.
118 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
27 / M
Offline
Posted 10/31/17 , edited 10/31/17
The kid doesn't deserve punishment, what he needs is mental help, he's clearly depressed and suffering. Her death is a tragic accident that was unintentional.
11629 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
35 / M / People's Republic...
Offline
Posted 10/31/17 , edited 11/1/17

GrandMasterTime wrote:

Suicide is messed up.


It's also a terrible sin.
415 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
Offline
Posted 10/31/17 , edited 10/31/17

mxdan wrote:Punishment is only effective when the punishee understands the reasons for it. Even then it's not really all that effective. The people involved usually repeat again by and large. All it does is offer condolences to the harmed. But there is little joy in that when the person involved doesn't understand and remedy what it is that caused them to harm someone else.


Lol. Punishment isn't effective? So a person's actions shouldn't have consequences? Not totally sure what you're going for here.

On topic though, whether or not it was intentional, this kid directly caused the death of another innocent person. And as somebody who works with kids, a 12 year old is fully capable of realizing that jumping into a busy freeway could cause an accident. They knew, they just didn't care. I'm not a lawyer, but pretty sure that goes under manslaughter or negligent homicide. Realistically speaking however, they probably belong in a psych ward, not a prison.

As a side note, for all the apologists, suicide is about the most selfish thing a person can do. The people who don't like you won't care that you're gone, so the only thing you're doing is hurting the people who actually do care.
-OlE- 
1429 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
24 / M / Nebraska
Offline
Posted 10/31/17 , edited 10/31/17

karatecowboy wrote:


GrandMasterTime wrote:

Suicide is messed up.


It's also a terrible sin.


agreed. if there is one thing people who are so depressed they would attempt to take their own life need, its to be shamed and rebuked
REPENT O YE OF LITTLE FAITH
-OlE- 
1429 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
24 / M / Nebraska
Offline
Posted 10/31/17 , edited 10/31/17

djason1988 wrote:



Lol. Punishment isn't effective? So a person's actions shouldn't have consequences? Not totally sure what you're going for here.

On topic though, whether or not it was intentional, this kid directly caused the death of another innocent person. And as somebody who works with kids, a 12 year old is fully capable of realizing that jumping into a busy freeway could cause an accident. They knew, they just didn't care. I'm not a lawyer, but pretty sure that goes under manslaughter or negligent homicide. Realistically speaking however, they probably belong in a psych ward, not a prison.

As a side note, for all the apologists, suicide is about the most selfish thing a person can do. The people who don't like you won't care that you're gone, so the only thing you're doing is hurting the people who actually do care.


dude. he is 12. and we don't know this kids story. we have no idea what he may have been through. maybe we should hold off on the fire and brimstone until all the facts are on the table
415 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
Offline
Posted 10/31/17 , edited 10/31/17

-OlE- wrote:


djason1988 wrote:



Lol. Punishment isn't effective? So a person's actions shouldn't have consequences? Not totally sure what you're going for here.

On topic though, whether or not it was intentional, this kid directly caused the death of another innocent person. And as somebody who works with kids, a 12 year old is fully capable of realizing that jumping into a busy freeway could cause an accident. They knew, they just didn't care. I'm not a lawyer, but pretty sure that goes under manslaughter or negligent homicide. Realistically speaking however, they probably belong in a psych ward, not a prison.

As a side note, for all the apologists, suicide is about the most selfish thing a person can do. The people who don't like you won't care that you're gone, so the only thing you're doing is hurting the people who actually do care.


dude. he is 12. and we don't know this kids story. we have no idea what he may have been through. maybe we should hold off on the fire and brimstone until all the facts are on the table


You missed the part where I said he belongs in a psych ward, not a prison. There needs to be consequences for his actions, but at the same time I recognize that he is hurting.
11629 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
35 / M / People's Republic...
Offline
Posted 10/31/17 , edited 11/1/17

-OlE- wrote:


agreed. if there is one thing people who are so depressed they would attempt to take their own life need, its to be shamed and rebuked
REPENT O YE OF LITTLE FAITH


Mock it all you want, in the end you'll pay the Piper

The fear of Hell kept me from it when I was in my rougher years, and I grew up in a shame-based environment.

https://stream.org/americas-suicide-crisis-dying-lack-hope/

One study of 89,000 people showed that those “who attend any religious service once a week or more were five times less likely to commit suicide” than those who don’t. And “of the 6,999 Catholic women who attended Mass more than once a week, none committed suicide.”

That's none. Zero. Zilch. Nil.

"Come to Me, all who are weary and heavy-laden, and I will give you rest." Jesus. Matthew 11:28

First  Prev  1  2  3  4  5  6  Next  Last
You must be logged in to post.