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Post Reply Star Wars Episode VIII: The Last Jedi
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Posted 12/27/17 , edited 12/30/17
Have very mixed feelings about the film. Felt that the first half just dragged and was overly uninteresting. I was definitely more engaged with second half. Finally, two main questions popped into my mind.

Kylo went on about letting go of the past, and establish a new order. Yet, isn't he just continuing Darth Vader's legacy (dethroning the master "Sith Lord" and taking the throne for yourself)? Furthermore, I doubt he would consider Rey as an equal, but rather as an apprentice; then the cycles of conflict would just continue. If he did throw away his attachment to Vader, what's he trying to accomplish with the First Order? Why reason does he have now to care about intergalactic government? What is his motivations? He killed his dad, and his mentors (Luke/Snoke) are both dead. His only remaining attachment to the past is his mother. After (if/when) Leia dies, is the Rey the only thing that will drive him (drive him to what?)?

Speaking of cycles of conflict, I wonder how the next movie will resolve this trilogy. Reflecting on the Jedi from the prequel movies, I thought Luke deviated from the regular Jedi conduct (with his strong attachments to others). But in quick time, Luke's Jedi Order collapsed similarly to older Jedi orders (in that a promising young member becomes tempted to join the Dark Side). I'm curious what could Rey, who seems bent on the Jedi path, and Kylo do to break that cycle of conflict. Or they'll patch things up without changing much, and we'll have a new set of trilogy in 10 or so years, featuring a disillusioned Rey and so forth...

On a side note, seeing Leia fly made me wonder why Palpatine didn't fly/propel himself when Vader tossed him over the rails. Also wonder why Leia didn't try to force push the rocks (compared to the space feat, it seems simpler), rather than Rey doing it.
Posted 12/31/17 , edited 1/1/18
Seen this last night. I'm actually happy with the way things have ended.
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Posted 12/31/17 , edited 12/31/17

Austershalin wrote:

Have very mixed feelings about the film. Felt that the first half just dragged and was overly uninteresting. I was definitely more engaged with second half. Finally, two main questions popped into my mind.

Kylo went on about letting go of the past, and establish a new order. Yet, isn't he just continuing Darth Vader's legacy (dethroning the master "Sith Lord" and taking the throne for yourself)? Furthermore, I doubt he would consider Rey as an equal, but rather as an apprentice; then the cycles of conflict would just continue. If he did throw away his attachment to Vader, what's he trying to accomplish with the First Order? Why reason does he have now to care about intergalactic government? What is his motivations? He killed his dad, and his mentors (Luke/Snoke) are both dead. His only remaining attachment to the past is his mother. After (if/when) Leia dies, is the Rey the only thing that will drive him (drive him to what?)?


I think at the end, Kylo is still a child. His goal isn't maintenance of some grand order, but instead to assert his own position on the world. To disown subservience. He doesn't care what banner he rules under, he just seeks the power. I think Luke dying is quite interesting, because Luke was largely an outlet for that insecurity. Because Luke died after essentially beating Kylo, Kylo has lost the rest of his main outlets (except for perhaps his mother, but it doesn't seem like she is an avenue for his hate) but still holds that anger.

Overall, it is that conflict which will define the next movie: Kylo's internal conflict with his own insecurity. Losing those who previously made him feel insecure (Luke, Han and Snoke) could leave Kylo feeling his actions are meaningless which could cause him to seek positive reinforcement (within Rey) instead of those negative avenues (within Luke, Han and Snoke).

These past two movies have been about taking away his meaning, the last movie will focus on him finding new meaning.

(imo)
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Posted 12/31/17 , edited 1/2/18
I liked the movie while I was processing it during and immediately afterwards but the more I thought about it, and after a second viewing, I realized that I absolutely hate this film. Hates a strong word though. Maybe strongly dislike is better.

...I think because the film turns the franchise into a joke. It felt as though there was comic relief every couple of minutes or so, sometimes less. And the comedic elements were very Marvel like in their jarring nature. Frankly, if comedic relief pulls you out of world building, it's failed writing. The film seems to relish in this.

The Finn gambling story arc felt forced and didn't make a whole lot of sense. The film is filled with plot holes and instead of taking a sci fi setting and pushing the boundaries and creating new narrative it stays predictable.

Ray is a Mary Sue and seems to be completely uninhibited by the universes constraints. She learns tasks that took Anikans offspring time to learn from arguably the best teacher in the entire universe. Then they say, well it's cause the force created a rival in the dark side. I'm all for a yin and yang but that just doesn't make any sense in the lore. Hell, the force doesn't just make you master a saber instantly. If guppies simply become masters the entire reason for having anything prior means nothing.

The film treats Star Wars like it's a cartoon filled with simple and cheap payoff. It tried to turn a beloved franchise into something that has no framework for suspension of disbelief. Humans floating through space and surviving. Characters saving animals and leaving slave children there and thus negating the sympathetic meaning we are supposed to derive from the scene. Strange plot sequences that are surrealist and don't drive the story towards being more impactful.

And luke, don't get me started there. The hero of the galaxy that left a map so that he could be found suddenly claiming that he didn't want to be found and showing absolutely no strength from the person he became after the end of the original trilogy.

This is a star wars film written by someone who isn't investing in what star wars is. If not for the gorgeous sequences and and select moments that left me in awe it would be despicable.
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Posted 1/3/18 , edited 1/3/18

mxdan wrote:

I liked the movie while I was processing it during and immediately afterwards but the more I thought about it, and after a second viewing, I realized that I absolutely hate this film. Hates a strong word though. Maybe strongly dislike is better.

...I think because the film turns the franchise into a joke. It felt as though there was comic relief every couple of minutes or so, sometimes less. And the comedic elements were very Marvel like in their jarring nature. Frankly, if comedic relief pulls you out of world building, it's failed writing. The film seems to relish in this.

The Finn gambling story arc felt forced and didn't make a whole lot of sense. The film is filled with plot holes and instead of taking a sci fi setting and pushing the boundaries and creating new narrative it stays predictable.

Ray is a Mary Sue and seems to be completely uninhibited by the universes constraints. She learns tasks that took Anikans offspring time to learn from arguably the best teacher in the entire universe. Then they say, well it's cause the force created a rival in the dark side. I'm all for a yin and yang but that just doesn't make any sense in the lore. Hell, the force doesn't just make you master a saber instantly. If guppies simply become masters the entire reason for having anything prior means nothing.

The film treats Star Wars like it's a cartoon filled with simple and cheap payoff. It tried to turn a beloved franchise into something that has no framework for suspension of disbelief. Humans floating through space and surviving. Characters saving animals and leaving slave children there and thus negating the sympathetic meaning we are supposed to derive from the scene. Strange plot sequences that are surrealist and don't drive the story towards being more impactful.

And luke, don't get me started there. The hero of the galaxy that left a map so that he could be found suddenly claiming that he didn't want to be found and showing absolutely no strength from the person he became after the end of the original trilogy.

This is a star wars film written by someone who isn't investing in what star wars is. If not for the gorgeous sequences and and select moments that left me in awe it would be despicable.


sums up my thoughts pretty nicely. at first after it ended, i felt 'weird' about it but i also liked it. like you said, the more i thought about it, the more i hated it. luke skywalker develops into a strong character throughout three movies seeing plenty death and tragedy, even learning that his father is a genocidal maniac responsible for all of it. and yet, he didn't give up and hid away. he faced the strongest forces in the galaxy and won. this film is telling me that all it took was one spoiled brat to change luke skywalker into a mountain hermit who wanted to stay away from everyone? poor mark hamill. i read a trivia fact that he didn't even agree the way his character was handled. also, the casino scene shouldn't have even been possible. i understand why it happened and it is a good story arc i guess. but why would the new order even let that ship leave the rebel ship and go to that planet? the movie made a joke out of its' own supposed perilous set ups by allowing fin and the other character go back and forth whenever they wanted from the supposed 'stalemate' going on.
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Posted 1/4/18 , edited 1/4/18
I loved the movie.

I understand the parts that people complain about, and I can see why a lot of fans didn't like it. However, those negatives weren't negatives for me at all. I really can't think of anything I had a problem with in the show, and Rey is my all-time favorite Star Wars character. In fact, the only thing close to a problem for me would be that Rey doesn't have more scenes.
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Posted 1/21/18 , edited 1/22/18
I don't think there are any bad Star Wars movies really, even my lowest rated one Attack of the Clones I gave a 6, but The Last Jedi wasn't much better and goes down as the second worst one in the series as a 6.5 imo.
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Posted 2/11/18 , edited 2/12/18
I really did not like this movie.

I was totally fine with just having the original trilogy and the prequels but then Abrams came along and come up with another storyline.
Granted, he did a good job, but then after all of the fan theories, I think the director just threw them all in a box and was like: lets do this. Even if it wasn't the best choice.
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Posted 2/17/18 , edited 2/17/18
I kind of wish that Rey and Kylo legitimately teamed up like Anakin did with Palpatine.
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Posted 7/7/18 , edited 7/7/18

Alviarin wrote:





In my opinion rogue one has been the best film thus far and that's not saying much... But at least it made sense and was an honest film.

I know this is kind of a bump out of the blue but I still get bothered by this film to be honest with you. I see there being very clear notions of agenda pushing and ideology setting that are rampant throughout its screening and also throughout Solo. As a result, Solo is losing a bunch of money in the box office. Honestly, they shot themselves in the foot. Instead of hiring skilled scifi screen writers for these films (Which as a genre is a notoriously hard thing to write) they treated the source like it was something that could be marginalized and still make money. Well here we are... We've learned that star wars fans are self aware and people don't like having socio-political fodder shoved in their mouths for no reason.

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Posted 7/19/18 , edited 7/19/18
Considering how much Ruin "Round-Head" Johnson and Kathleen "I hate men" Kennedy are now attacking the fan base and Disney is doing nothing to stop them, I can only see this beloved franchise going even further down hill. I loved the original star wars, I even loved the prequels to some degree. But when you get on twitter and call me a misogynist, or a racist because I don't like how they decided to completely rewrite characters entirely without any real explanation as to why I get upset.


Pando Clarrisian
Fluke "Hides-in-His-Hut" Walker

Can you hear that my dear old Star Wars fans? Can you hear the sounds of the Mary Sues screaming that they are stronger than you?
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Posted 7/19/18 , edited 7/20/18
From my personal perpective, this was the worst Star War movie I have ever seen. It Ranks lower then the Phantome Menace.

First, in a trilogy, you have to follow the story began in the first movie and keep continuity, it's not time to subvert fan expectation, If you want to do that, you must do it at the start of the trilogy... not in the middle.

Second, left any kind of politic out of the movie that do not belong to the universe.

Third, don't treat your fans like shit because it will backlash.

Fourth, you can't change the audience of an established franchise and expect it to work. It's a bad idea to forget who is your basic audience.

I can't wait for this horrible trilogy to end. Normally I would have been happy with a female lead trilogy, but what they have done with Rey is hard to swallow, she is the definition of a Mary Sue, the pottential of what she shown in the first movie was what I would expect of her after 3 episodes of hard traning, like almost all the other heros. I hate the fact she doesn't need to learn and that she doesn't need help. It'S sedning a wrong message regardless of he gender.. If she is so perfect, why making a movie about her, you can't empathise with her. I think Finn was ok and never really liked Poe, but all the Holdo thing in the Last Jedi made me feel sorry for him. I liked Rose Tico, but admit she was useless for the plot.

I just hope they will kill Rey at the end of episode IX so we could have no sequel with thpose dissapoiting character. The Force Awakening wasn't a bad movie, but many of the problems of this current trilogy began there and the incompetence of Rian Johnson made it even worse. Rogue One was a better movie by far.

This whole trilogy should be cancel and remade the right way. No more poorly written plots with overpowered characters. I wish that the next trilogy will also have a strong female lead,, but don't make her a Mary Sue. Be respectful of George Lucas' vision and stay away from Identity politics and all SJW nonsense.

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Posted 1/21/18 , edited 1/22/18


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Posted 7/30/18 , edited 7/30/18
Was The Last Jedi by any chance a 3 hour long standup show, written by Eddie Izzard? I half-expected John McClain would blast through a spaceship window with Spock shouting "You Shall Not Pass!" Oh, and robot chickens. Robot chickens covered in bees.
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Posted 24 days ago , edited 24 days ago
contrary to what people here have said the new Star Wars movies made the franchise better.

first of all like Rey, Luke himself was a Mary sue as well, and making him flawed in this movie redeemed him from being a Mary sue, and I only find Luke interesting now because he is an imperfect and conflicted white male rather then a flawless hero and his death at the end of the movie was very heroic

And no it was not a forced out of character change, if one were to experience what he did they too would have had their personalities changed, he is much more believable now XD


Yes I said it, Luke was a Mary sue for white males, and aside from that was a boring character until now XD in fact Luke in this movie was my favorite part of it, however I will admit that Snooks death was kinda anticlimactic and aside from Luke, Yoda, Luke's death and the Force tree I actually found the movie kinda boring, but thats okay because it improved upon Luke making the franchise as a whole better XD

Just like how the prequels made the original trilogy better because originally Darth Vader had good in him for absolutely no reason at all and without explanation, but in the prequels we get to see how he had good in him and how he became evil XD

honestly people are all just angry because a white male Mary sue is no longer a Mary sue, and thats actually a good thing that hes not XD

And you hate what I said because its true XD
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