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Post Reply Should they start making more diverse Santa Clauses?
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Posted 12/23/17 , edited 12/23/17
The saddest thing is most have no idea of traditions outside of their own, Santa Claus is the Americanized commercialized name of Saint Nicholas, take a look into history for more. There are already versions of Saint Nicholas all over the world, and not all of them are red and white in costume, or white in color.








Try taking a look at why your own version is as it is, (ask Thomas Nast and Coke-a-Cola,) and learn a bit about your own past before worrying about having to fix yours for everyone else, since we've already got our own.
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Posted 12/23/17 , edited 12/23/17
Good ol St Nicholas

the patron saint of prostitutes..........kind of fitting when you think about it
Posted 12/23/17 , edited 12/23/17

runec wrote:

Well, given that St Nicholas wasn't even white to begin with.

Though I am amused you put the topic in spoilers.







Arguable. He was born in a Greek settlement. Are Latin Europeans not "white" ? Also its important to note that the depiction of "Santa claus" or father Christmas originates from 16th century Europe, I highly doubt people of his home settlement ever celebrated him as a figure of Christmas. That is to get to my next point. There is a difference between the historical figure "St Nicholas" and the children's fable, "Father Christmas".

To answer the question, Santa is a character. He can be played by anyone as long as they stick to basic archetypes of "Father Christmas" like for example giving children toys. If you're attempting to portray the historical figure in some sort of historical documentary or something then I probably wouldn't like to see an Aboriginal Australian portray him.

I personally hold no meaningful significance to the character.
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Posted 12/23/17 , edited 12/24/17
Santa claus can be whatever the hell he wants to be ( yes I said he)

If Santa wants to have rail guns attached to his sleigh, and Rudolph shoots laser out of his nose, then let Santa be himself.

Santa can be anything, but if you expect me to believe in this nonsense of being diverse

Do you really think that would be good for a commercial? Advertisement, Think about it, do we really need to single out Santa's only redeeming feature in order to assimilate to those who wish for.... fairness because of the race card oh god what am I saying. We want to promote an iconic figure in ways that shows a meaning to someone, not a mascot for you country. Sure, you can promote that within your culture, but that's all you can do, you can't force people to do it for their own.

Pretty soon it won't be cookies and milk. Maybe Santa prefers something a little healthier to help deter people from being fat and jolly. Actually scratch that, we want people to buy more on the holidays, so we make that a good thing because it's only for a month

Again, it's an idea, because the reality of the situation basis his whole existence on being this symbol, or icon. Black, blue, purple, who gives a shit we will almost always see him as a White fat, and jolly man.

If you don't, good for you, would you like a cookie?
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Posted 12/23/17 , edited 12/24/17
Start? They make Santa for every ethnicity. I've seen an asian Santa, a black Santa, a white Santa, I even saw someone selling a native american Santa once that they had made themselves.
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Posted 12/23/17 , edited 12/24/17

GrandMasterTime wrote:
Arguable. He was born in a Greek settlement. Are Latin Europeans not "white" ? Also its important to note that the depiction of "Santa claus" or father Christmas originates from 16th century Europe, I highly doubt people of his home settlement ever celebrated him as a figure of Christmas. That is to get to my next point. There is a difference between the historical figure "St Nicholas" and the children's fable, "Father Christmas".


The modern depiction of Santa Claus is an amalgamation of quite a few different sources. But there's a fairly clear line to St Nicholas as the inspiration for some of the big points. The rest were swiped from various cultures and religions then glued together and basically cemented by Coca Cola ads so.

As for skin colour; Many Greeks would not be what America would define as "white" no. Hell, even the Irish weren't considered white in America at one point. Greek heritage has a pretty wide range of skin tones that goes all the way into dusky/olive and darker. So its unlikely that Saint Nick was the pale white rosy cheeked Nordic sleigh elf we have now as Santa Claus. Most depictions of him were dusky skinned or darker.

That said I only mention it in the first place because Fox News and that media sphere ramp up into their War On Christmas mode around this time each year. And one of the big things that Fox swears up and down on around Christmas is that Santa and Jesus were white. Santa no, not really. Jesus, most definitely not.

Personally, Santa should be whatever colour/race/gender/fluffy animal you want him to be. I just find it irksome when someone insists he can't be anything else except their colour because of a mistaken belief all Europeans are pale white Nordic lillies.


Posted 12/23/17 , edited 12/23/17




The modern depiction of Santa Claus is an amalgamation of quite a few different sources. But there's a fairly clear line to St Nicholas as the inspiration for some of the big points. The rest were swiped from various cultures and religions then glued together and basically cemented by Coca Cola ads so.


I wouldn't deny it has a compilation of multiple sources but they are all European (Germanic paganism and Christianity, even though Christianity is a Semitic religion the character "father Christmas" stems from European traditions of Christianity).


As for skin colour; Many Greeks would not be what America would define as "white" no. Hell, even the Irish weren't considered white in America at one point.


When people refer to "white" I always take the United States Census definition of "white" which is "A person having origins in any of the original peoples of Europe, the Middle East, or North Africa.". I don't like the term at all because as you say, Europeans have a lot of phenotypical variation amongst their populations and when you say "white" you almost always think of Anglo/Nordic/Slavic peoples. It should also be noted that the greeks you see today are phenotypically different from the Greeks of the past. The vast majority of greek art and descriptions of them we find, paint them as "white" as well.



Greek heritage has a pretty wide range of skin tones that goes all the way into dusky/olive and darker. So its unlikely that Saint Nick was the pale white rosy cheeked Nordic sleigh elf we have now as Santa Claus. Most depictions of him were dusky skinned or darker.


As I said, the character Saint Nick and Santa Claus are not one and the same. One has heavy Germanic pagan/16th Century English protestant influences the other is a historical figure who's legends were used as one of the archetypes that define "Santa Claus".




That said I only mention it in the first place because Fox News and that media sphere ramp up into their War On Christmas mode around this time each year. And one of the big things that Fox swears up and down on around Christmas is that Santa and Jesus were white. Santa no, not really. Jesus, most definitely not.



As far as how I've defined "white" goes. Jesus was probably "white". "White – A person having origins in any of the original peoples of Europe, the Middle East, or North Africa.", the only way he couldn't be "white" according to this definition is if he somehow wasn't born in modern-day Palestine so Fox News is right on this one it seems. Did Jesus look anything like modern-day Nordic/Germanic/Slavic peoples? Absolutely not. Did Jesus look anything like the modern-day inhabitants of Nazareth? Probably not. I find it highly unlikely that the phenotype maintained the same level of pigmentation as there have been massive movements of varying peoples between 33 CE and present day. I do believe I have seen evidence that those from 1st century Nazareth would been slightly darker skinned that the average Jew at the time but I can't confirm historical consensus on it currently.
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Posted 12/23/17 , edited 12/24/17

Humms wrote:
If Santa wants to have rail guns attached to his sleigh, and Rudolph shoots laser out of his nose, then let Santa be himself.


I'm thinking magic beam sword myself.

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Posted 12/24/17 , edited 12/24/17
I take it that you guys have not seen the new children's book where there are two Santa's and they are a gay interracial couple?
Its about black gay Santa with his white gay Santa partner... and no i am not making this up...
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Posted 12/24/17 , edited 12/24/17
"They" should just have St. Nicholas and none of this fake Santa Clause whatever crap
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Posted 12/24/17 , edited 12/24/17

MrAnimeSK wrote:

I take it that you guys have not seen the new children's book where there are two Santa's and they are a gay interracial couple?
Its about black gay Santa with his white gay Santa partner... and no i am not making this up...


I have 2 questions...

Why does this exist?
What does it's existence accomplish?
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Posted 12/24/17 , edited 12/24/17

byClear wrote:

I have 2 questions...

Why does this exist?
What does it's existence accomplish?


I imagine it exists because gay couples raising children exist. And it's a closer reflection of the parents than a straight Santa, helping their kids feel that much more normal on Christmas.
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Posted 12/24/17 , edited 12/24/17
The version of Santa Clause we see today was actually created by the COLA COLA company to promote the brand in the early 1930's.

That is the reason he is always depicted in red and white, just like the logo colour of America's favourite diabetes causing cola.
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Posted 12/24/17 , edited 12/24/17

MrAnimeSK wrote:

I take it that you guys have not seen the new children's book where there are two Santa's and they are a gay interracial couple?
Its about black gay Santa with his white gay Santa partner... and no i am not making this up...


Why would you be?
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Posted 12/24/17 , edited 12/24/17

byClear wrote:


I have 2 questions...

Why does this exist?
What does it's existence accomplish?


Two very good questions.


octorockandroll wrote:


Why would you be?


Well i guess because who in their right minds would want their child seeing/reading that?
I know it actually pissed a lot of black people off because there is a genuine belief that there is some sort of agenda to pusg being gay onto the black man and destroy the black family lol.
I dont see the book as being progressive. But iam willing to bet my own life that you do?
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