First  Prev  1  2  3  4  5  Next  Last
Post Reply Is there a character that you feel sorry for?
7739 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
35 / Pacific North West
Online
Posted 3/11/18 , edited 3/11/18

runec wrote:

Kirito's problem is he's a Gary Stu and that's why he gets all the rather deserved flake he does. He has few real flaws, little character development, is always the "chosen one" or otherwise special somehow and amasses a harem of female followers simply because he exists. Other characters are always in amazement at how super awesome he is and any consequences that come his way tend to get brushed aside by a deus ex machina. With the pinnacle proverbial middle finger of the first season being that when it came down to brass tax Kirito was not actually subject to the same rules as everyone else was in SAO and thus was essentially never in any danger.


While I get what your saying... Your description of his flaws describes maybe 70% of MCs in same or similar genre's. Even if we were to dissect say.... Grimgar the later leader of the group other then internal dialogue is a horrible leader, has a relatively easy job, and no real traits that would lead one to believe people view him as a leader. I could continue on with (insert anime here) but my point is at least IMO Kirito gets hated for exactly the same crap other MCs have/do but are generally more accepted. Its hypocrisy at it's worst.


EDIT: I would say Lelouch is fFAR more deserving of hate then Kirito. No personality, immune to everything, no character development, and generally a douche bag.
Posted 3/11/18 , edited 3/11/18
The whole cast of Rainbow Nisha Rokubou no Shichinin.
21379 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
36 / M / SoFlo
Online
Posted 3/11/18 , edited 3/11/18

cooldogdonnie wrote:

Kotonoha Katsura from School Days:

Not only was she bullied and stepped on by others throughout her life, the one time that she finds someone who she cares for and treats her with respect (other than her little sister but, come on, she's family), the guy turns out to be a complete piece of shit who continuously cheats on her, occasionally with the girls who previously bullied her giving her an even bigger puncch to the gut.
She was kind, sweet, and academic. She was a good cook who always tried her best to make it through life despite the pain she has went through only to be completely crushed by the one person she trusted. She could have had such a bright future, she was a good cook and was smart so she could have made a beautiful wife but NOPE, Makoto happened and fucked everything up. There couldn't be a more tragic anime heroine.


This was actually the first character I thought of too. She turned out to get completely messed up at the end. Mainly because everyone around her are assholes. And it's heavily implied she gets raped.
4126 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
25 / M / North America
Offline
Posted 3/11/18 , edited 3/11/18
I felt sorry for Kikyo when I first watched InuYasha
3170 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
M / Mega-City One
Offline
Posted 3/11/18 , edited 3/11/18
Deserved to win:

5436 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
24 / M / Finland
Online
Posted 3/11/18 , edited 3/11/18

cooldogdonnie wrote:

Kotonoha Katsura from School Days:

Not only was she bullied and stepped on by others throughout her life, the one time that she finds someone who she cares for and treats her with respect (other than her little sister but, come on, she's family), the guy turns out to be a complete piece of shit who continuously cheats on her, occasionally with the girls who previously bullied her giving her an even bigger puncch to the gut.
She was kind, sweet, and academic. She was a good cook who always tried her best to make it through life despite the pain she has went through only to be completely crushed by the one person she trusted. She could have had such a bright future, she was a good cook and was smart so she could have made a beautiful wife but NOPE, Makoto happened and fucked everything up. There couldn't be a more tragic anime heroine.


Nice one. And i still get shivers whenever i think about the end of the series. Just because Makoto messed up, the worse happens.
runec 
41032 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
Online
Posted 3/11/18 , edited 3/11/18

DevinKuska wrote:
While I get what your saying... Your description of his flaws describes maybe 70% of MCs in same or similar genre's. Even if we were to dissect say.... Grimgar the later leader of the group other then internal dialogue is a horrible leader, has a relatively easy job, and no real traits that would lead one to believe people view him as a leader. I could continue on with (insert anime here) but my point is at least IMO Kirito gets hated for exactly the same crap other MCs have/do but are generally more accepted. Its hypocrisy at it's worst.

EDIT: I would say Lelouch is fFAR more deserving of hate then Kirito. No personality, immune to everything, no character development, and generally a douche bag.


There's not much comparison with Grimgar. Haruhiro struggled with his role, did not strike awe into every other character around him, had no super powers and did not amass a harem. Comparing Kirito and Lelouch is rather baffling. Lelouch's flaws saw him go from freedom fighter to legitimately evil villain, while destroying everyone around him and eventually himself. He was not immune to everything, his personality was his downfall and his ambitions made him willing to sacrifice everything for his goals. Innocent people and allies included. You weren't suppose to like Lelouch. Lelouch driving the entire world to hate him was kind of the whole point and his entire objective. Saying he had no character development ignores the whole plot arc of the show.

As for "hypocrisy at it's worst"; putting the hyperbole aside you have this backwards. The reason Kirito gets so much hate is not because there aren't other MC's with similar issues but because Kirito is emblematic of all of these issues. He's the poster child of everything wrong with the genre's MC''s and he isn't even subject to the rules the entire plot is based on.

Though he would not get so much hate if SAO didn't have so much exposure and fan's convinced the series is the pinnacle of anime.





38415 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
F
Offline
Posted 3/11/18 , edited 3/12/18
Sekai Saionji (School Days). Yes, really.

The anime adaptation followed one possible path along her route, and along the better paths she's a sweet girl who's just having a hard time figuring out what she wants and in need of a boost in confidence and self-worth. Sekai so infrequently gets credit for that, and she really ought to. On her better paths Sekai is really wonderful once she's given half a chance to be. She made a mistake passing Makoto along to Kotonoha, then she made another mistake by trying to get him back the way she did. That's universal, intrinsic to her character no matter the path, and legitimately a problem. But she's not inherently a conniving liar with violent tendencies, and frankly Makoto and Kotonoha's relationship was going over like a lead balloon up to the point where Sekai made her second mistake anyway.
7739 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
35 / Pacific North West
Online
Posted 3/11/18 , edited 3/11/18

runec wrote:

Though he would not get so much hate if SAO didn't have so much exposure and fan's convinced the series is the pinnacle of anime.


So because SAO was popular its ok to dislike it? I will never understand the whole anti-big media logic. Its baffles me. I have the two examples of other MCs who have major flaws. As far as Lelouch goes no... he was never in danger. That's my biggest issue with that particular show. Every time he would panic, minutes later he would be fine because he already had a full proof counter plan in motion. I am not sure we saw the same show. I don't believe I saw Lelouche betray friends or allies. Or perhaps I just saw it differently. Lelouch sought to free the world from a Tyrannical govt. his "betrayals" didn't put anyone in harms way except for the extras(because if your an extra your a body). His betrayals were all to keep them from being associated with his final "form." How was he Evil? his plan all along was to overthrow the british dictatorship no? Who was destroyed? His core team all got pardons and lived happily ever after, His sister you would assume likewise. That said he basically exchanged one dictatorship for another. However I digress... my point was I don't see how some MCs can be demonized for traits almost every MC has. If all there is to the hate is because it was a big name production... to me that just tells me the reasons are invalid, and based on a completely different motivation.


EDIT I realize everyone has characters they like and dislike, also others may disagree. I just cant wrap my head around how certain characters get demonized for doing the EXACT same thing their favorite characters do. That is hypocrisy, justifying it because it was a best seller or had a big budget just strikes me as deluded self justification of your other choices.
runec 
41032 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
Online
Posted 3/11/18 , edited 3/11/18

DevinKuska wrote:So because SAO was popular its ok to dislike it? I will never understand the whole anti-big media logic. Its baffles me.


That is not what I said. I said exposure ( the more people know about something the more people there are with an opinion on it ) and that some SAO fans are insufferable online which further drives dislike of the MC and the series. With a secondary effect of also making them easy to troll due to their overreactions.



DevinKuska wrote:As far as Lelouch goes no... he was never in danger. That's my biggest issue with that particular show. Every time he would panic, minutes later he would be fine because he already had a full proof counter plan in motion. I am not sure we saw the same show. I don't believe I saw Lelouche betray friends or allies. Or perhaps I just saw it differently. Lelouch sought to free the world from a Tyrannical govt. his "betrayals" didn't put anyone in harms way except for the extras(because if your an extra your a body). His betrayals were all to keep them from being associated with his final "form." How was he Evil? his plan all along was to overthrow the british dictatorship no? Who was destroyed? His core team all got pardons and lived happily ever after, His sister you would assume likewise.


.....er. I am not sure we saw the same show either or you didn't watch season 2(?). Lelouch's mistakes lead to one of the most tragic events in the show ( Euphemia's massacre and Lelouch having to kill his own half sister to stop it ) which sets his best friend off on a lifelong goal to murder Zero and leads to a further crackdown on the Japanese people. His Geas commands backfiring with unintended consequences even cause Suzaku to literally nuke Tokyo and apparently kill Nunnally thus robbing his entire grand plan of any point ( and turning him suicidal for a time ). His entire plan was to unify the world in it's hatred of him then have himself killed as to make a peaceful world for Nunnally. In order to do this, he took the world over to begin with and held it hostage under the threat of nuclear holocaust.

I mean cripes, his ability is to rob people of their free will. You're suppose to question his methods and each new length he's willing to go in order to achieve them. While the consequences of his actions, intentional and unintentional, affect those around him.



DevinKuska wrote:
That said he basically exchanged one dictatorship for another. However I digress... my point was I don't see how some MCs can be demonized for traits almost every MC has. If all there is to the hate is because it was a big name production... to me that just tells me the reasons are invalid, and based on a completely different motivation.


Not a lot of MC's are narcissistic would be dictators robbing people of free will as part of their grand plan. -.-



DevinKuska wrote:
EDIT I realize everyone has characters they like and dislike, also others may disagree. I just cant wrap my head around how certain characters get demonized for doing the EXACT same thing their favorite characters do. That is hypocrisy, justifying it because it was a best seller or had a big budget just strikes me as deluded self justification of your other choices.


You're drifting into a strawman argument territory now I'm afraid.



7739 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
35 / Pacific North West
Online
Posted 3/11/18 , edited 3/12/18

runec wrote:


DevinKuska wrote:So because SAO was popular its ok to dislike it? I will never understand the whole anti-big media logic. Its baffles me.


That is not what I said. I said exposure ( the more people know about something the more people there are with an opinion on it ) and that some SAO fans are insufferable online which further drives dislike of the MC and the series. With a secondary effect of also making them easy to troll due to their overreactions.



This I can understand at least to some degree. I dislike people who are fanatical about shows. I get a lot of Full Metal Alchemist fans flaming me because its not my cup of tea. I am not a fan of SAO but I don't dislike it either.

Ah yes but you dont troll right?
17320 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
37 / M / UK
Offline
Posted 3/11/18 , edited 3/12/18

DevinKuska wrote:

his plan all along was to overthrow the british dictatorship no?


Objection.

It was not a British dictatorship. From my understanding of the series Britain gained independence from the Britannian Empire and formed a republic in union with other European states. It would be more accurate to call it an American dictatorship, even if they did take the name Brittanian.
67362 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
21 / M
Offline
Posted 3/11/18 , edited 3/12/18

runec wrote:



I don't mean to jump into this argument, but you just casually gave away nearly every single plot twist in Code Geass without warning...
7739 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
35 / Pacific North West
Online
Posted 3/11/18 , edited 3/12/18

MidoriNoTora wrote:


DevinKuska wrote:

his plan all along was to overthrow the british dictatorship no?


Objection.

It was not a British dictatorship. From my understanding of the series Britain gained independence from the Britannian Empire and formed a republic in union with other European states. It would be more accurate to call it an American dictatorship, even if they did take the name Brittanian.


My apologies Britannian for some reason I had it in my head it was Great Britain. Damn dictators taking names resembling respectable nations.
runec 
41032 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
Online
Posted 3/11/18 , edited 3/12/18

DevinKuska wrote:
This I can understand at least to some degree. I dislike people who are fanatical about shows. I get a lot of Full Metal Alchemist fans flaming me because its not my cup of tea. I am not a fan of SAO but I don't dislike it either.

Ah yes but you dont troll right?


No, I don't troll. You need to be kind of a sociopath to enjoy trolling. Hell, it's not like I hated SAO or anything. The idea of it was compelling and it does start out good. But it begins to unravel by the mid point of the first season and then it shark jumps. Then nothing past the first season is the same kind of show. That's probably where a portion of the backlash the show gets is coming from to be honest: Disappointment.

Kirito ends up not being subject to the stakes the first season raises and then no other season ever has those kind of stakes again.




PhantomGundam wrote:
I don't mean to jump into this argument, but you just casually gave away nearly every single plot twist in Code Geass without warning...


The show is like 12 years old.... -.-

Also, Snape kills Dumbledore.

First  Prev  1  2  3  4  5  Next  Last
You must be logged in to post.