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Post Reply UK to expel 23 Russian diplomats and freezes all assets following the attempted murder of a UK spy.
mxdan 
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Posted 3/14/18 , edited 3/14/18
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/uk-politics-43402524

Crazy stuff, I recommend you guys take a moment to watch all the Parliament videos that are up. This situation is about to get really hairy and apparently there will be more things to happen in a few hours. It's really amazing how much faster action happens in the U.K. in comparison to the U.S.
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Posted 3/14/18 , edited 3/14/18
Shameful that the British PM has bigger balls then our president
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Posted 3/14/18 , edited 3/14/18

mxdan wrote:
Correction to title: Attempted murder of a spy. My apologies.


I've fixed that.
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Posted 3/14/18 , edited 3/14/18
It is crazy how fast a monarchy can get things done in comparison to a shitty psuedo-democracy that thankfully, yet, also unfortunately relies on checks and balances that keeps both stupid and progressive ideas from being passed at any one moment.

Although this is a severe simplification of both political systems, I can imagine you at least get the point.
mxdan 
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Posted 3/14/18 , edited 3/14/18

XxDarkSasuxX wrote:

It is crazy how fast a monarchy can get things done in comparison to a shitty psuedo-democracy that thankfully, yet, also unfortunately relies on checks and balances that keeps both stupid and progressive ideas from being passed at any one moment.

Although this is a severe simplification of both political systems, I can imagine you at least get the point.


Well, I'd hardly call the U.K. a monarchy anymore. But Parliament is noticeably more efficient and has it's fair share of checks and balances. What makes it more efficient is how power is divided instead of segmented pushing the parties to appease each other more then tends to happen in the U.S.

Parliament tends to be the favored system in highly regarded and successful countries and it would appear is less prone to corruption. But don't take my word for it:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parliamentary_system


lorreen wrote:


mxdan wrote:
Correction to title: Attempted murder of a spy. My apologies.


I've fixed that.


Thank you Lorreen!
mxdan 
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Posted 3/14/18 , edited 3/14/18

uncletim wrote:

Shameful that the British PM has bigger balls then our president


In his defense I doubt the British PM could do much if she was President as well. Our system is bogged down by financial corruption and division, not that Britain isn't, but I don't think anyone would argue it's comparable to the U.S.
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Posted 3/14/18 , edited 3/14/18
looks like that rare moment when someone got caught for murdering a "spy". there have been spies for so long... regardless, it's a double edged sword, Russia is playing in the game as well. what I find ironic, some of Russia is part of the UK... at any rate, another line and the patience to see who crosses it, that's how it is with that area not to mention the world.
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Posted 3/14/18 , edited 3/14/18
Ah fun spy games. Where everyone is lying to everyone for political gain. I wonder if what was said was even true. We know that sky knew something that someone didn't want released but who was it that really didn't want it released? The world may never know!
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Posted 3/14/18 , edited 3/14/18
I don't think it's so much that they tried to kill the guy but more what the used
Novichok is no fucking joke that shit 5 times deadlier then VX and VX is the strongest Chemweapon ever made by the USA
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Posted 3/14/18 , edited 3/14/18

uncletim wrote:
I don't think it's so much that they tried to kill the guy but more what the used
Novichok is no fucking joke that shit 5 times deadlier then VX and VX is the strongest Chemweapon ever made by the USA


Considering 21 other people were sickened just being in the area and a responding officer is also in hospital. Using a highly lethal nerve agent in a public assassination is beyond the pale even for Russia.

Russia's response so far sounds like a copy paste of North Korea's press releases.
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Posted 3/14/18 , edited 3/14/18
Nikki Haley just told the UN that Russia was responsible for the poisoning of the Russian spy and now it is only a matter of time before trump fires her and replaces her with a wagon full of red maga hats
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Posted 3/15/18 , edited 3/15/18

niotabunny wrote:

looks like that rare moment when someone got caught for murdering a "spy". there have been spies for so long... regardless, it's a double edged sword, Russia is playing in the game as well. what I find ironic, some of Russia is part of the UK... at any rate, another line and the patience to see who crosses it, that's how it is with that area not to mention the world.


If they just bumped off the former spy there would be moral indignation and various diplomatic retaliatory actions.

The key problem here is they let off a chemical weapon (banned under international treaties that Russia is signed up to) on UK soil and did it in a way that affected many uninvolved members of the public.

The UK has to take action or it will be seen as a green light for them to try it again on other Kremlin opponents who have sought sanctuary in the West. Next time it might be someone who is living in your town that is the target.

The UK has suggested two possibilities for this situation:

1) The Russian authorities sanctioned use of a chemical weapon on UK soil.
2) A rogue element has gained access to Russia's chemical weapons stocks and acted without authorisation.

However, I think there may be a third possibility:

3) Russia ordered the death of the former spy but the choice of murder weapon and delivery route was made by someone further down the chain of command and they implemented the attempted murder in an incompetent manner.



I am curious about your comment that some of Russia is part of the UK. What exactly do you mean by that?
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Posted 3/15/18 , edited 3/15/18

MidoriNoTora wrote:


niotabunny wrote:

looks like that rare moment when someone got caught for murdering a "spy". there have been spies for so long... regardless, it's a double edged sword, Russia is playing in the game as well. what I find ironic, some of Russia is part of the UK... at any rate, another line and the patience to see who crosses it, that's how it is with that area not to mention the world.


If they just bumped off the former spy there would be moral indignation and various diplomatic retaliatory actions.

The key problem here is they let off a chemical weapon (banned under international treaties that Russia is signed up to) on UK soil and did it in a way that affected many uninvolved members of the public.

The UK has to take action or it will be seen as a green light for them to try it again on other Kremlin opponents who have sought sanctuary in the West. Next time it might be someone who is living in your town that is the target.

The UK has suggested two possibilities for this situation:

1) The Russian authorities sanctioned use of a chemical weapon on UK soil.
2) A rogue element has gained access to Russia's chemical weapons stocks and acted without authorisation.

However, I think there may be a third possibility:

3) Russia ordered the death of the former spy but the choice of murder weapon and delivery route was made by someone further down the chain of command and they implemented the attempted murder in an incompetent manner.



I am curious about your comment that some of Russia is part of the UK. What exactly do you mean by that?


You don't really need a lot to kill someone in a discreet manner. You can pass someone in a bar or on the street spill your drink on them. If the drink you were holding has cyanide in it, they'll eventually die because it'll sink into their pores. The KGB have also available to them umbrellas which shoot out tiny needles embedded with ricin that can kill people but that was ages ago, who knows what methods and tools are available to them now.

Choosing to kill someone with a nerve agent seems erroneous even for Russia, that doesn't mean I doubt the story of course there are strong indications that Russia may of been involved in the double assassination just based on the history of the people murdered. However choosing to act before a full investigation has been undertaken and come to a consensus on exactly who is involved seems to be a knee jerk reaction.

I don't know though maybe that's what the assassin wanted to make it look like. That this was something carried out and planned by the Russians. If Russia really wanted to carry out more assassinations on people in the UK they easily could even with sanctions, if they're capable of going this far with their methods then I doubt they'd have any qualms with using micro drones that can be used to murder people. Also what happens if Russia commits another crime, do the UK then set up internment camps for Russians..?
qwueri 
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Posted 3/15/18 , edited 3/15/18
Seems like Russia has settled into playing smug snake since the 2016 elections. Which isn't a smart move when another country is accusing them of an act of war.
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Posted 3/15/18 , edited 3/15/18

Rujikin wrote:

Ah fun spy games. Where everyone is lying to everyone for political gain. I wonder if what was said was even true. We know that sky knew something that someone didn't want released but who was it that really didn't want it released? The world may never know!


Isn't that what the guy your a fanboy of does also....
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