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Post Reply Legend of the Galactic Heroes: Die Neue These Discussion
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Posted 4/10/18 , edited 4/10/18
crap, I did my link wrong. Sorry. https://myanimelist.net/forum/?topicid=487887
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Posted 4/10/18 , edited 4/10/18
So we got the UN's side of the story this time, and then everyone ends up chasing each other's tails for awhile until everyone got dizzy and fell asleep.
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Posted 4/10/18 , edited 4/11/18
Lol, this is setting up for Lao to die horribly.
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Posted 4/10/18 , edited 4/11/18
I am hooked on this show now. Space ships, war, strategic battles, and two formidable foes. Good episode to see the other perspective of the opposing forces.
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Posted 4/10/18 , edited 4/11/18
Really liking the op, after hearing it again in the 2nd episode, it's become one of my favorites of the season.
Kintor 
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Posted 4/10/18 , edited 4/11/18

borderliner wrote:

Yes, I do have an opposing philosophy. Strategies to a degree and tactics in their entirety are dependent on the means by which war is waged. For example, it is a very recent phenomenon that fighting might be limited by the availability of fuel and ammunition. Also as the scale of armies grow they can no longer commandeer food and lodgings around the areas of engagement these things now need to be carried or supplied by the military themselves, logistics is a massive part of modern warfare and this has lead to most military posts being non combatant. Imagine how many service personnel it takes to put one jet fighter in the sky. In the sci-fi universe of infinite power and ammunition these things mean nothing but in real life if you can't carry enough provisions to feed yourself power your equipment and arm your weapons you're dead on the battlefield. The soldier with the last bullet wins.

I don't think you realise that you've just betrayed your own argument. Logistics are inherently about people, feeding and equipping a military force - it's an inherently human quality even if you don't realise it. Nobody cares if you have more bullets, when you lead your army to certain death because you don't understand basic human psychology. This is in essence what LothGH is all about, winning battles and campaigns before it becomes a war of attrition, exploiting the mental weaknesses of the enemy commanders is the name of the game. The future is just tomorrow's history, with war no different to the past.
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Posted 4/11/18 , edited 4/11/18

Kintor wrote:


borderliner wrote:

Yes, I do have an opposing philosophy. Strategies to a degree and tactics in their entirety are dependent on the means by which war is waged. For example, it is a very recent phenomenon that fighting might be limited by the availability of fuel and ammunition. Also as the scale of armies grow they can no longer commandeer food and lodgings around the areas of engagement these things now need to be carried or supplied by the military themselves, logistics is a massive part of modern warfare and this has lead to most military posts being non combatant. Imagine how many service personnel it takes to put one jet fighter in the sky. In the sci-fi universe of infinite power and ammunition these things mean nothing but in real life if you can't carry enough provisions to feed yourself power your equipment and arm your weapons you're dead on the battlefield. The soldier with the last bullet wins.

I don't think you realise that you've just betrayed your own argument. Logistics are inherently about people, feeding and equipping a military force - it's an inherently human quality even if you don't realise it. Nobody cares if you have more bullets, when you lead your army to certain death because you don't understand basic human psychology. This is in essence what LothGH is all about, winning battles and campaigns before it becomes a war of attrition, exploiting the mental weaknesses of the enemy commanders is the name of the game. The future is just tomorrow's history, with war no different to the past.


What do you mean logistics are inherently about people, I was making the point that strategy and tactics change over time.
I can't imagine for one second this show will explore the logistics of getting people and materials into space, maintaining equipment, keeping personnel healthy and moral high.

It will just showcase a bunch of historical tactics shoehorned onto a "space" navy that never has to deal with all the things that make naval engagements interesting like extreme weather, a weapons platform that is in constant random motion, extreme supply chains, there's not even a horizon to worry about in space.

I was prepared to go to Ep3 but then this episode invoked magically bypassing the comms jamming to invoke a pre-recorded order that foresaw the exact chain of events, leading to some magically synchronised retreat that magically resolved into two fleets chasing each other's tails in space.

Sorry, I give up on this show.
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Posted 4/11/18 , edited 4/11/18

borderliner wrote:

What do you mean logistics are inherently about people, I was making the point that strategy and tactics change over time.
I can't imagine for one second this show will explore the logistics of getting people and materials into space, maintaining equipment, keeping personnel healthy and moral high.

It will just showcase a bunch of historical tactics shoehorned onto a "space" navy that never has to deal with all the things that make naval engagements interesting like extreme weather, a weapons platform that is in constant random motion, extreme supply chains, there's not even a horizon to worry about in space.

I was prepared to go to Ep3 but then this episode invoked magically bypassing the comms jamming to invoke a pre-recorded order that foresaw the exact chain of events, leading to some magically synchronised retreat that magically resolved into two fleets chasing each other's tails in space.

Sorry, I give up on this show.

The idea of war in LotGH is that strategy and tactics don't change over time, rather the familiar motifs of history are just repeated in a new age. After all, the narration throughout each episode really hammers this point home. You should notice that everything is narrated in the past tense, with keen attention to dates (using two different calendars no less), as though someone is reciting the story from the pages of a history book.

So you shouldn't think of LotGH like it's some sort of dry manual, rather LotGH is a romanticised history about something that has already happened. Like say the life of Napoleon Bonaparte or the career General Patton, only about fictional people. Personally I think that Reinhard and his officers, fictional though they are, have certain parallels with Alexander the Great and his companions, both being larger than life figures who sought to conquer the known universe at a relatively young age.

If you keep this all in mind you're in for a real treat, the original LotGH is regarded by many as the greatest anime of all time and this new version is doing well so far to meet those same lofty expectations. Remember, it's not just about flashy space battles. LotGH is a space opera in the true sense of the phrase; a sweeping human drama that as its heart talks about politics, history and the senseless tragedy that occurs when good people on opposite sides go to war.
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Posted 4/11/18 , edited 4/11/18
I kind of see where the pacing is going with this. One conflict I have that a lot of people probably have as well is that this type of plot progression is slower than what we're used to. Considering most shows want to pump out seasons and be done with it, this one has all the signs of wanting to paint a complete picture of a massive melodrama, it hardly even feels like it has a main character yet. To enjoy this one you're going to have to invest in it, and not many these days are willing to do that. In terms of plot I'm drawing a lot of parallels between this show and Star Trek, where on the surface the show is not the slightest bit deep. After you give it some time to grow though, there's a lot going on behind the scenes. More importantly everyone lives in their own world. If all they have to offer if these types of battle scenarios the show is doomed.

I still can't get over how the fight animations are dull and repetitive with what seems to me like a Star Wars type of battle where everything fighting is space garbage and the ships with important characters on them have incredibly powerful plot armor. They need to improve in that area quickly. On the other side, they did a really good job of showing off some of the ship tech this episode, from ship navigation systems to ship designs and even propulsion technology. It's a sci-fi treat I'm sure a few people noticed.

As for the voice acting there's a strong sense that they really want to be overly dramatic, which some will like and others will hate. Without a real background to the characters there's no way we can connect to them or their feelings, so I expect a breather episode next. Are they taking this too slow? Yeah. I'm expecting a SoL tone to take over in between the battles.
xxJing 
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Posted 4/13/18 , edited 4/13/18

GotenLoooovesCorn wrote:

I kind of see where the pacing is going with this. One conflict I have that a lot of people probably have as well is that this type of plot progression is slower than what we're used to. Considering most shows want to pump out seasons and be done with it, this one has all the signs of wanting to paint a complete picture of a massive melodrama, it hardly even feels like it has a main character yet. To enjoy this one you're going to have to invest in it, and not many these days are willing to do that. In terms of plot I'm drawing a lot of parallels between this show and Star Trek, where on the surface the show is not the slightest bit deep. After you give it some time to grow though, there's a lot going on behind the scenes. More importantly everyone lives in their own world. If all they have to offer if these types of battle scenarios the show is doomed.

I still can't get over how the fight animations are dull and repetitive with what seems to me like a Star Wars type of battle where everything fighting is space garbage and the ships with important characters on them have incredibly powerful plot armor. They need to improve in that area quickly. On the other side, they did a really good job of showing off some of the ship tech this episode, from ship navigation systems to ship designs and even propulsion technology. It's a sci-fi treat I'm sure a few people noticed.

As for the voice acting there's a strong sense that they really want to be overly dramatic, which some will like and others will hate. Without a real background to the characters there's no way we can connect to them or their feelings, so I expect a breather episode next. Are they taking this too slow? Yeah. I'm expecting a SoL tone to take over in between the battles.


The battles for the most part don't improve. The show isn't necessarily about the progress of the battles, it's about the results and also the motivations that lead to them. Think of LotGH more like Les Miserables in Space than like Star Wars. This show is a drama more than anything else, not a romantic drama mind you though, more of a periodical drama.

As an example, if you remember that infamous slaughter scene from Code Geass. Code Geass basically stole that scene from LotGH, though depending on the pacing I'm not sure if they will manage to get to it in the next 10 episodes.
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Posted 4/17/18 , edited 4/17/18
Episode 3

This episode is a history lesson, first about the Empire and how Rudolf's dictatorship led to the formation of the Alliance by those wanting to escape Rudolf's rule, and then the moment when Reinhard met Kircheis. Things were going well until Reinhard's sister Annerose became the consort to the kaiser, and that made Reinhard want to become a soldier with Kircheis following him. Reinhard would work his way up to being the captain while Kircheis gets the role of the fleet admiral. And thus, Reinhard began his mission to make the universe his own. That was a good way to explain Reinhard's background there as the bottom line is that Reinhard has something in common with the Alliance in that they both oppose Rudolf's dictatorship. The big difference is that Reinhard is trying to change it from within and proving doubters wrong that one man can't change the universe.
Kintor 
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Posted 4/17/18 , edited 4/17/18
Wow, things are really speeding up in the new version. There's all kinds of stuff thrown in that was in half a dozen different episodes in the original OVA.

Like that history lesson before the opening about the rise of the Galactic Empire and the Free Planets Alliance that took about two minutes to show? That was a whole episode by itself in the original OVA! The only thing they left out was explaining why Terra (planet Earth) lost its importance. But I suppose that the whole Church of Terra situation isn't relevant yet in the story, so it's understandable why this was left out.

Regardless this is a fast-paced narrative that neatly explains Reinhard and Kircheis' relationship. To explain what motivates these two and why they are so obsessed with climbing the social ladder in the Galactic Empire. If you make the aristocracy a meritocracy then that means somebody else can become Kaiser one day and found their own dynasty.

Plus, we get our first look at Olberstein. He's as creepy as ever.
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Posted 4/17/18 , edited 4/17/18
Aww man soo good love this episode- story is going warp speed but this will help new fans to show-the bond and drive of Reinhold will never waver and his sidekick Kircheis really cool stuff this episode gets me fired up for more.
Note to self: creepy eyes screams of bizarre behavior watch him going forward
xxJing 
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Posted 4/17/18 , edited 4/17/18

Kintor wrote:

Plus, we get our first look at Olberstein. He's as creepy as ever.


Oberstein was my favorite character in the original, I can't wait to see more of him. Most people who watched the show hated him, but he had some really strong character development. He was also unique that, unlike pretty much every other big character in the Empire side, Oberstein wasn't bogged down by pride.
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Posted 4/17/18 , edited 4/17/18
Eyes in Statue sounded kinda loud has the camera focused
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