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Feminists
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31 / M / Washington
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Posted 9/3/07
you know.... so what? really, feminists, anyone useing that name to describe themselves.. is really doing wierd stuff... its sorta like guys who call themselves dogs or pigs... rrmmm anyways, generally most guys are nice, kind, interested, even have been known to go overboard on kindness when it comes to women whether they be cute, ...well mostly the cute or sexy ones... but also the women that are elderly too, so many guys go outa their way to help women, sons help thier mothers reguardless of age so often, do errans for them, assist or offer it.

and you know what? sometiems pay is standard for everyone, sometiemes pay is affected by sex, but not that much.. you konw what? men get stuck with alomoney if they divorce, child pay, not to mention countless gifts, and the more times they get divorced teh more bills... we need the freakin extra money and most of the time thier isnt enough... you wanting more moeney just caus we migh get a few extra dollers... what differnece? i mean its the guys who pay so many more bills and more so its up to the guys to pay for the dates and everything, its our responsibilitiy not yours so shhhh,,

other then that... be happy? i mean be happy! its a good life for most people stop worrying about independence and go find a guy you can be happy with while doing your work inbetween go out with girlfriends, live and stop bitching... life is very nice and happy here compared to so many other places... and as i said.. guys have more bils then women and its our duty to pay for you not you for us.. although someteims things happen and we should take it with a shy grin.
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30 / M / Melbourne
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Posted 9/3/07

artgeek707 wrote:

I am a feminist and I fail to see whypeople hate feminists for wanting equal rights and equal pay. (which still hasn't happened in the U.S yet) I mean I hear stuff like feminazi's all the time and I still can't figure out how self empowerment and equal opporatunity equates with genocide in some peoples minds. (Rush Limbaugh). This forum thread will be a discussion about the feminist movement (anywhere in the world) and womens rights. Feel free to express your opinions as long as they are not threatening or excessive hate.


take ur rights to a place that matters, the us goverment.
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35 / F / Montreal
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Posted 9/4/07

Tyrfing wrote:


esilabet wrote:
I'm sorry, I don't deny the part of a man in reproduction... but you sure don't have to carry, give birth, feed and raise the child... the point is easy to understand, man and woman are not equal, not equivelent, not the same....

Men don't raise children? Fathers don't raise their children? What kind of men do you know? Or do they all leave once the children are born? :fury:

and I,m a woman, so of course I think my job is more important than yours!

There are so many things I could say about this sentence, but I don;t wish to infer meaning that isn't there.


I don't plan to give 1000 explainations about that, yes they can vote, run for office.... but the truth is.. it's just a matter of title ; ''public knowledge of'', I speak about the real power, what can change things, change the world, for better or worse, and that, women have done it before. They ruled over the familly, the village even country.


Matriarchal societies have been largely supplanted by patriarchal ones that is true, I'm not sure how it happened but I think it has something to do with the DaVinci Code.


Now women have to get in the 'man system' to do so.


It's not "the man system" its just the "system" women shouldn't have any short cut to power by virtue of being women. Which is exactly what you are suggesting.


all the problems that the early feminists were planing to solve are not solved, and more problems apeared.


Could you vague that up a little please? What problems were they trying to fix if not for the discrepancy in rights between men and women? And what new problems are there?


Sorry I've been away..... here's the answer....
1. I don't deny the part of a man..... again, and you see, both are important (2.) I am a woman, so to do mine correctly, it's essencial I find mine to be more important. Like in anything you do or attempt, if you start to dout the worth or your work, you'll end up doing a crapy job. So yes, it's quite reassuring to see you condradict me on that, and just prouved the point.

3. about the ''man system'', I did not mean it that way.... There's isn't only one way to rule the world, and not only one system. For centuries, pillow talk have lead the countries. Madame de Pompadour have led Louis XIV by the nose and Elizabeth I refused to take husband. Woman spies have been the most efficient for any general, and Marie-Antoinette have caused the downfall of the french royalty, leading to despotic-wisdom era..... and changed the world.
That's what I talk about.... the big diffence now is that woman share ambition of men. In witch they miserably fail causing the other side to go in the extremist opposite direction and worsenig the status of woman, while a vast minority enjoy their new found freedom, witch is not that much.

4. The so said problems are :
Women getting beat up... that still happens last time I checked
Not getting the credit for the importance of their traditional duty. that part is even worst now, even woman thinks that to raise a child is not a proper job.
Women not be able to live (having a family) and raised their child proprely without the assistance of a man. (think about single mothers now a days, and don't tell me it has gotten better.)
Reality check : we are... I mean I am as dependant as ever on my man... I still have the short end of the stick because a simple ''I'm asking a divorce'' can make my life miserable as much as it would have done it in the past.
and I have to work, have a share at paying bills, do the cooking and cleaning as well and make a budget to decide if I'm ready or not to have children. Oh. also I have to split up the furniture even before I get married, just in case (or maybe just when) I'm getting divorced.

I'm sorry for the very long explaination.... very sorry.....
Posted 9/4/07
Note about nurturing;
=> If men did not give an adequate amount towards their offspring's survival they would have been forced out by evolution. Because they haven't means that they must be caring for thier children sufficiently for women to think it worth having children with them, therefore men do do an adequate amount in child upbringing.

Note on the "man system"
=> Once equality is a right the system becomes a "people system."
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31 / M / Washington
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Posted 9/4/07
hey... feminist"nazis" are nearly all american that ive seen of or in england perhaps too i guess... you know what.... take some guns, go to were women are actually opresed and help them out...stop harrasing us inocent and gentle guys here... :P


oh...by the way... are you saying that women have caused the falls of civilizations and caused rulers to opres their poeple? caus... i do blame the women for theat.. not the men.... but thats just me
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35 / F / Montreal
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Posted 9/4/07
well said... then, this people system, in my opinion, deserve to be looked upon, and resuts to be analysed.... briefly, a step back is needed now, before the western civilization is widely overthrown by the lack of offspring!
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29 / M / somewhere
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Posted 9/4/07
@Esilabet: Yeah, you basically do deny men any part in raising a child by basically calling it a women's job when, in most cases, and to do so properly, it is both a man and a women's job. Also you don't have to consider your work more important than someone else's in order to do a good job, all you have to believe is that your important. I believe that a stay at home mom's, which is what you appear to be describing, job is of equal importance as that of the father who works to provide for the family.

If when you say "Women getting beat up" you mean spousal abuse, then I don't think that problem will ever completely go away. I agree that it is a problem, but it isn't exclusivly women who encounter spousal abuse. It's rare but possible for men to be victims of spousal abuse, which is more than just "women getting beat up", it is also verbal and mental abuse, but I won't go there since that's off-topic. Again you talk about raising a child as an exclusivly female job, which isn't true. I agree that single mothers, and parents in general, is a problem, but there is no easy solution for a parent who, by choice or other less fortunate cricumstances, solely raises a child.

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Posted 9/4/07
Here's a scenario.
A woman has just got a job one month into the job she reports she is pregnant she decides to have the child,we now have in 7-8 months maternity leave thats 6months of pay with no work done.
Men do not have the same liability thus if you want equal pay then sacrifice your rights to a child
The reason that feminism is so looked down on is it's rammed down our throats,such as opening the door all of a sudden we are pigs yet man or woman we would probably hold the door open by sheer reaction like closing a fridge once your done you see someone in the corner of your eye you hold the door open.
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31 / M / Washington
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Posted 9/4/07
the new crazy feminiscists arent polite.... they lack civility... they lack care.... they are proply unpleasent spouses at times... perhaps even unbarable parents.... but most of alll.. do they know how to cook?!?
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29 / M / La Ville De Musiq...
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Posted 9/4/07

esilabet wrote:


Tyrfing wrote:


esilabet wrote:
I'm sorry, I don't deny the part of a man in reproduction... but you sure don't have to carry, give birth, feed and raise the child... the point is easy to understand, man and woman are not equal, not equivelent, not the same....

Men don't raise children? Fathers don't raise their children? What kind of men do you know? Or do they all leave once the children are born? :fury:

and I,m a woman, so of course I think my job is more important than yours!

There are so many things I could say about this sentence, but I don;t wish to infer meaning that isn't there.


I don't plan to give 1000 explainations about that, yes they can vote, run for office.... but the truth is.. it's just a matter of title ; ''public knowledge of'', I speak about the real power, what can change things, change the world, for better or worse, and that, women have done it before. They ruled over the familly, the village even country.


Matriarchal societies have been largely supplanted by patriarchal ones that is true, I'm not sure how it happened but I think it has something to do with the DaVinci Code.


Now women have to get in the 'man system' to do so.


It's not "the man system" its just the "system" women shouldn't have any short cut to power by virtue of being women. Which is exactly what you are suggesting.


all the problems that the early feminists were planing to solve are not solved, and more problems apeared.


Could you vague that up a little please? What problems were they trying to fix if not for the discrepancy in rights between men and women? And what new problems are there?


Sorry I've been away..... here's the answer....
1. I don't deny the part of a man..... again, and you see, both are important (2.) I am a woman, so to do mine correctly, it's essencial I find mine to be more important. Like in anything you do or attempt, if you start to dout the worth or your work, you'll end up doing a crapy job. So yes, it's quite reassuring to see you condradict me on that, and just prouved the point.

3. about the ''man system'', I did not mean it that way.... There's isn't only one way to rule the world, and not only one system. For centuries, pillow talk have lead the countries. Madame de Pompadour have led Louis XIV by the nose and Elizabeth I refused to take husband. Woman spies have been the most efficient for any general, and Marie-Antoinette have caused the downfall of the french royalty, leading to despotic-wisdom era..... and changed the world.
That's what I talk about.... the big diffence now is that woman share ambition of men. In witch they miserably fail causing the other side to go in the extremist opposite direction and worsenig the status of woman, while a vast minority enjoy their new found freedom, witch is not that much.

4. The so said problems are :
Women getting beat up... that still happens last time I checked
Not getting the credit for the importance of their traditional duty. that part is even worst now, even woman thinks that to raise a child is not a proper job.
Women not be able to live (having a family) and raised their child proprely without the assistance of a man. (think about single mothers now a days, and don't tell me it has gotten better.)
Reality check : we are... I mean I am as dependant as ever on my man... I still have the short end of the stick because a simple ''I'm asking a divorce'' can make my life miserable as much as it would have done it in the past.
and I have to work, have a share at paying bills, do the cooking and cleaning as well and make a budget to decide if I'm ready or not to have children. Oh. also I have to split up the furniture even before I get married, just in case (or maybe just when) I'm getting divorced.

I'm sorry for the very long explaination.... very sorry.....


The more of your posts I read it seems it's slowly creepy into another men vs women thread. No offense to you, but I fail to see the point of whatever statistics that you type. And the single mother bit about not having a family without the "assistance" of a man is more than a little off. My mother raised me and my 3 brothers without the "assistance"of a man untill the youngest one was 15.
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28 / M / UK
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Posted 9/4/07

Sorry I've been away..... here's the answer....
1. I don't deny the part of a man..... again, and you see, both are important (2.) I am a woman, so to do mine correctly, it's essencial I find mine to be more important. Like in anything you do or attempt, if you start to dout the worth or your work, you'll end up doing a crapy job. So yes, it's quite reassuring to see you condradict me on that, and just prouved the point.


Hmm? I’ve never actually thought of it like that, interesting.


Elizabeth I refused to take husband.


But was that related to her success? Queen Victoria was married, and was a more successful sovereign and ruled for longer. The only direct result of that, that I can think of is the end of her Dynasty…


Woman spies have been the most efficient for any general,

Where did you get that? Each spy would be valuable in different circumstances, I can think of situations where female spies wouldn’t have even been able to be present. And a few useful opportunities that they could take advantage of.


Marie-Antoinette have caused the downfall of the french royalty, leading to despotic-wisdom era..... and changed the world.


By most accounts she did it through a mixture of indifference and incompetence. Unless she was secretly working for the revolutionaries, in which case she was doing very well until her decapitation.


4. The so said problems are :
Women getting beat up... that still happens last time I checked


There are a lot of abusive females that beat their partners too; I think you’d be surprised. :(


Reality check : we are... I mean I am as dependant as ever on my man... I still have the short end of the stick because a simple ''I'm asking a divorce'' can make my life miserable as much as it would have done it in the past.

Do you want a divorce? If you do then I’m very sorry for you, I think that nay man’s life would be made miserable by that too.

I may be generalising, but I only know two divorced couples, one of who is my aunt and uncle. Due to a long term illness (something to do with his spleen I think) he is now earning about half of what he was earning before, however he still had to pay her a lot of money that he can no longer really afford. Another person I know is still paying large amounts of money to his ex despite the fact that she is now being supported by her boyfriend (a doctor).

That doesn’t seem fair either.


do the cooking and cleaning


Well, my father has done that ever since my mother decided that she wanted to work full time so I can’t really comment on that.



Oh. also I have to split up the furniture even before I get married, just in case (or maybe just when) I'm getting divorced.


Sorry why do you have to do that?


@Esilabet: Yeah, you basically do deny men any part in raising a child by basically calling it a women's job when, in most cases, and to do so properly, it is both a man and a women's job.


It takes a village to raise a child.
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Posted 9/4/07
I dont hate them, but my friends one and she can get a little annoying since I'm more of a tomboy. but i dont think thats the same thing. rofl
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35 / F / Montreal
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Posted 9/4/07
Like always I seem to think of the grand picture a bit too much, so why not take one at a time... by the way Tyrfing... your old man seems great!

witch part first??? your choice.... victoria vs Elizabeth success rate....
the contract-divoce part (yes it's a law)
or my interesting view about the worth of each task... hahah.
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27 / M
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Posted 9/4/07
"There are a lot of abusive females that beat their partners too; I think you’d be surprised. :("

Very true actually, I've known two guys who had that problem. Here's the deal though: Most police and judges treat it as a joke. You even lay a single finger on a woman, and you're screwed. If a woman beats her husband to a bloody pulp then it's like half the sentence and fines and some of the time it's knocked down to "Assault" instead of "Domestic violence/abuse"

My dad handles the cooking and lots of the cleaning... And to be honest, he is better at it than my mom ever was.

"I still have the short end of the stick because a simple ''I'm asking a divorce'' can make my life miserable as much as it would have done it in the past."

This goes back to what I said in "the worst thing about women" thread. Women automatically assume that men have no feelings, and when speaking of emotional matters, tend to be extremely selfish. Trust me, a divorce is just as hard on a guy as it is on a woman.

"Women not be able to live (having a family) and raised their child proprely without the assistance of a man. (think about single mothers now a days, and don't tell me it has gotten better.)"

Society actually dotes on Single moms. There is so much low-budget housing, government aid, and student aid available for single moms. I have a waitress friend who refuses to marry her boyfriend and father of her 5 year old boy so she can get student aid. She gets about $6000 a quarter with barely any effort.
=====
I think if we don't get back on subject a mod is going to come in here and whale on us.
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35 / F / Montreal
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Posted 9/4/07
I agree we sould get back on tracks....
I hate feminists, not what they attempted to do but the real result of their doings, I say that as a real modern educated and working woman myself, I'm the full result of their work and I'm not happy with it.
Any male or 16 y-old girl who never set foot in the ''system'' can't get me to change my mind ...no-way!
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