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Posted 4/27/08

Ratman21 wrote:

Skygod, happy or unhappy at the point of death. What follows if your with out Jesus, is very unhappy (I am not trying to be funny). I have seen shipmates go to hell and I have some one dear to me in Hell. I have no wish to see one more there. If I was to die now, I would be unhappy but happy after death. Why Unhappy because I fell I have just started to do things right in the Lord. Happy because I was with the Lord. Even thou I failed him, he still loves me


I'd rather die happy, knowing that I achieved everything and did everything I ever wanted, go to Hell, than dying unhappily and entering heaven. I'd rather die doing what I loved best than in on my back. In short, damnation does not bother me because I will have done everything I'd ever wanted to do by the age of 35.
Posted 4/27/08

AburaiRukia wrote:

I would like your definition...if we have souls then we obviously originated from some creator right?


Not necessarily no, hence why I asked you for what you meant by it. If by a soul you mean there is an immortal being within all of us, the one part of us that can never die then no we don't have one. Everything we are will cease to be upon death, if anything the 'soul' is the first to die. I do think that humans have souls but not of that nature. A 'soul' is simply your identity, your soul is who you are, your thoughts and feelings, it is what makes a human truly unique, it is a sense of right and wrong, your morals, your memories everything like that, which I do see as an amazing thing. However this is nothing more than information of who you are recorded in your brain, if your brain dies your soul dies, it is something that we make ourselves after we are born through our experiences not something that is given to us ready made. We mold it ourselves and it is ever changing.

Would you like to tell me your definition now?
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Posted 4/27/08
if I died like now I wouldnt be particularly happy or unhappy. There's a lot on this world that I would never experience but I've already done plenty. As for the destination? hopefully heaven
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Posted 4/27/08 , edited 4/27/08
sure
Our souls are our true selves and our nature. Our soul is who we are. The bodies we live in are temporary homes where our souls reside. What defines you on the outside will no longer define you when you die.

"Man not only has a living soul but he is a living soul. The Bible says: “And the Lord God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life, and man became a living soul” (Genesis 2:7)."

oh and by the way even a long and "happy" life on earth is nothing when compared to an eternity of torture, horrible heat, and undying thirst.
Posted 4/28/08

AburaiRukia wrote:

sure
Our souls are our true selves and our nature. Our soul is who we are. The bodies we live in are temporary homes where our souls reside. What defines you on the outside will no longer define you when you die.

"Man not only has a living soul but he is a living soul. The Bible says: “And the Lord God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life, and man became a living soul” (Genesis 2:7)."

oh and by the way even a long and "happy" life on earth is nothing when compared to an eternity of torture, horrible heat, and undying thirst.



Your right about that being worse, but luckily for us that is not going to happen to anyone so lets not worry about it And even if I thought that was true I would not learn love and respect and follow your God I would follow him out of fear. I see several similarities here between God and Hitler- conform to my way or be punished. Kind of contradicts what you say he's all about doesn't it, you say he's loving and forgiving yet he likes a good bit of eternal torture with no hope of forgiveness from time to time doesn't he.
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Posted 4/28/08
the bible is saying fear as reverere tho... not fear as real fear.......
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Posted 4/28/08

Stickmania wrote:


AburaiRukia wrote:

sure
Our souls are our true selves and our nature. Our soul is who we are. The bodies we live in are temporary homes where our souls reside. What defines you on the outside will no longer define you when you die.

"Man not only has a living soul but he is a living soul. The Bible says: “And the Lord God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life, and man became a living soul” (Genesis 2:7)."

oh and by the way even a long and "happy" life on earth is nothing when compared to an eternity of torture, horrible heat, and undying thirst.



Your right about that being worse, but luckily for us that is not going to happen to anyone so lets not worry about it And even if I thought that was true I would not learn love and respect and follow your God I would follow him out of fear. I see several similarities here between God and Hitler- conform to my way or be punished. Kind of contradicts what you say he's all about doesn't it, you say he's loving and forgiving yet he likes a good bit of eternal torture with no hope of forgiveness from time to time doesn't he.


Stick Hell was not created for man but for the devl and his demons. We only fall in to by rejecking God and his gift (his son). You see before even time was started. The Devl was a high order angel. But, he wanted to be more. He rejecked God and wanted to be as God. So God put him down. The Devil being not alittle upset about this desided to try and ruin God Creations. Which we are part of But, we are only part that can deside to take his gift or not. God can not tolerate SIN, he can not even be in the presen of it. So all the Devil has to do is get man kind to sin. Which is all to easy. Which lumps us togeter with you know who. Its kind of like the devil saying well if I cant have cake, I will ruin it for the rest.
Posted 5/2/08
And Ratman, I'm getting sick of you saying shit like "I know X (person) is in Hell because they didn't have God on their side when they died". Firstly, you are not God, you have no knowlegde of how judgment was passed. It is not for you to judge them and place them accordingly. Secondly, you have no knowledge of what went through their minds as they died. How could you know whether or not they accepted Christ before they died?

Not to mention, God defends the righteous. Even if they are the most sinful people on Earth, God defends them. Don't hand me horse shit like "If you haven't accepted Jesus, you aren't righteous". If I stand up for a smaller kid being beaten up by a larger bully and die for it, I am righteous. Even if I haven't accepted Jesus, I am righteous. It is for God alone to judge and place us accordingly. So quit your griping about acceptence of Christ and eternal damnation. You do not know what happens in all cases.
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Posted 5/2/08

skygod333 wrote:

And Ratman, I'm getting sick of you saying shit like "I know X (person) is in Hell because they didn't have God on their side when they died". Firstly, you are not God, you have no knowlegde of how judgment was passed. It is not for you to judge them and place them accordingly. Secondly, you have no knowledge of what went through their minds as they died. How could you know whether or not they accepted Christ before they died?

Not to mention, God defends the righteous. Even if they are the most sinful people on Earth, God defends them. Don't hand me horse shit like "If you haven't accepted Jesus, you aren't righteous". If I stand up for a smaller kid being beaten up by a larger bully and die for it, I am righteous. Even if I haven't accepted Jesus, I am righteous. It is for God alone to judge and place us accordingly. So quit your griping about acceptence of Christ and eternal damnation. You do not know what happens in all cases.




Your right I dont know if they did accepted Jesus before they died. But, given their personality and life stile, I doud it.. Hai your also right that I can not pass judgment on any one. And I do not even want to try to do so. But, as to righteousness, it says in the Bible that all our righteousness is as filty rags. You can not earn your way to Heven. The only way to Heven is thuo Jesus. Check the Bible it stats that is the only way.
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Posted 5/2/08 , edited 5/2/08
Actually I really don't want an argument but I have to say that there is a difference in righteousness. When people walk with God and lead holy lives they automatically live righteous lives and usually don't notice or even care. They're just running after Jesus and doing their best to be like him in every way possible and be a shining light in this world of darkness. In the end God gets the glory.

A person that lives without God doing good deeds and taking all the glory for themselves is a self-righteous person. A good example of this (sadly) is Oprah Winfrey. She does good for as many people as she can, but takes all the credit for herself and even calls herself a holy person. Self-righteous people aren't really looking out for the betterment of people as a whole but for the betterment of themselves and their own names. Sadly even some Christians fall into this category when they lose their way and forget that God should be the center of everything they do.

Who are we to judge anyone? The Bible says: "Judge not lest ye be judged"... but what Ratman said is true. We don't know who goes to heaven and who doesn't. Some people live their whole lives as "Christians" but in reality are much farther than God than anyone would be led to believe. The thing is that God knows all of our hearts. All the sins that we've committed, all the thought's we've had, and all the tear we've shed. In the end our eternities rest in his hands and it's up to us to follow the Word of God to the best of our abilities. The only way to God is through Jesus Christ. He is the light, the salvation of our souls, and the Prince of Peace.

Lastly, we shouldn't just become Christians because we want to go to heaven, God created us so that we could worship him. Our daily lives should bring glory to his name in every way possible. Thank God! When we screwed our own futures up he was gracious enough to give us a second chance by sending his only son to die brutally battered and scarred to cleanse us of our sins. Who are we to complain when we are given so many chances to reach salvation?

Posted 5/3/08

Ratman21 wrote:


skygod333 wrote:

And Ratman, I'm getting sick of you saying shit like "I know X (person) is in Hell because they didn't have God on their side when they died". Firstly, you are not God, you have no knowlegde of how judgment was passed. It is not for you to judge them and place them accordingly. Secondly, you have no knowledge of what went through their minds as they died. How could you know whether or not they accepted Christ before they died?

Not to mention, God defends the righteous. Even if they are the most sinful people on Earth, God defends them. Don't hand me horse shit like "If you haven't accepted Jesus, you aren't righteous". If I stand up for a smaller kid being beaten up by a larger bully and die for it, I am righteous. Even if I haven't accepted Jesus, I am righteous. It is for God alone to judge and place us accordingly. So quit your griping about acceptence of Christ and eternal damnation. You do not know what happens in all cases.




Your right I dont know if they did accepted Jesus before they died. But, given their personality and life stile, I doud it.. Hai your also right that I can not pass judgment on any one. And I do not even want to try to do so. But, as to righteousness, it says in the Bible that all our righteousness is as filty rags. You can not earn your way to Heven. The only way to Heven is thuo Jesus. Check the Bible it stats that is the only way.


I don't care what the Bible says. Righteousness is righteousness, Bible-approved or not. The Bible is not God's word. It is an interpretation of God's word by human beings.
Posted 5/3/08

AburaiRukia wrote:

Actually I really don't want an argument but I have to say that there is a difference in righteousness. When people walk with God and lead holy lives they automatically live righteous lives and usually don't notice or even care. They're just running after Jesus and doing their best to be like him in every way possible and be a shining light in this world of darkness. In the end God gets the glory.

A person that lives without God doing good deeds and taking all the glory for themselves is a self-righteous person. A good example of this (sadly) is Oprah Winfrey. She does good for as many people as she can, but takes all the credit for herself and even calls herself a holy person. Self-righteous people aren't really looking out for the betterment of people as a whole but for the betterment of themselves and their own names. Sadly even some Christians fall into this category when they lose their way and forget that God should be the center of everything they do.

Who are we to judge anyone? The Bible says: "Judge not lest ye be judged"... but what Ratman said is true. We don't know who goes to heaven and who doesn't. Some people live their whole lives as "Christians" but in reality are much farther than God than anyone would be led to believe. The thing is that God knows all of our hearts. All the sins that we've committed, all the thought's we've had, and all the tear we've shed. In the end our eternities rest in his hands and it's up to us to follow the Word of God to the best of our abilities. The only way to God is through Jesus Christ. He is the light, the salvation of our souls, and the Prince of Peace.

Lastly, we shouldn't just become Christians because we want to go to heaven, God created us so that we could worship him. Our daily lives should bring glory to his name in every way possible. Thank God! When we screwed our own futures up he was gracious enough to give us a second chance by sending his only son to die brutally battered and scarred to cleanse us of our sins. Who are we to complain when we are given so many chances to reach salvation?



People who 'walk with god' do not automatically lead righteous lives I'm afraid. People who call themselves christians, who genuinely believe in the existance of god and accept jesus can still be murderers and rapists. There are plenty of christians in jail and they are not righteous by anyones standards, hence why they are there. Also I don't agree with your view that 'god created us so we could worship him'. It makes him sound like an arrogant jerk, which I don't believe he is. If he created us for his own selfish purposes then I find it very hard to believe that he loves us. I do accept God and Jesus in my heart and I know that they are not as you seem to think AburaiRukia, they are loving and kind.
Posted 5/3/08

skygod333 wrote:


Ratman21 wrote:


skygod333 wrote:

And Ratman, I'm getting sick of you saying shit like "I know X (person) is in Hell because they didn't have God on their side when they died". Firstly, you are not God, you have no knowlegde of how judgment was passed. It is not for you to judge them and place them accordingly. Secondly, you have no knowledge of what went through their minds as they died. How could you know whether or not they accepted Christ before they died?

Not to mention, God defends the righteous. Even if they are the most sinful people on Earth, God defends them. Don't hand me horse shit like "If you haven't accepted Jesus, you aren't righteous". If I stand up for a smaller kid being beaten up by a larger bully and die for it, I am righteous. Even if I haven't accepted Jesus, I am righteous. It is for God alone to judge and place us accordingly. So quit your griping about acceptence of Christ and eternal damnation. You do not know what happens in all cases.




Your right I dont know if they did accepted Jesus before they died. But, given their personality and life stile, I doud it.. Hai your also right that I can not pass judgment on any one. And I do not even want to try to do so. But, as to righteousness, it says in the Bible that all our righteousness is as filty rags. You can not earn your way to Heven. The only way to Heven is thuo Jesus. Check the Bible it stats that is the only way.


I don't care what the Bible says. Righteousness is righteousness, Bible-approved or not. The Bible is not God's word. It is an interpretation of God's word by human beings.


Wow, a Christian who actually has common sense
'I don't care what the Bible says. Righteousness is righteousness, Bible-approved or not. The Bible is not God's word. It is an interpretation of God's word by human beings'
I agree completely with this, even assuming that God exists you can't take the bible seriously because it is undeniably written by mankind.
Posted 5/3/08

Stickmania wrote:


skygod333 wrote:


Ratman21 wrote:


skygod333 wrote:

And Ratman, I'm getting sick of you saying shit like "I know X (person) is in Hell because they didn't have God on their side when they died". Firstly, you are not God, you have no knowlegde of how judgment was passed. It is not for you to judge them and place them accordingly. Secondly, you have no knowledge of what went through their minds as they died. How could you know whether or not they accepted Christ before they died?

Not to mention, God defends the righteous. Even if they are the most sinful people on Earth, God defends them. Don't hand me horse shit like "If you haven't accepted Jesus, you aren't righteous". If I stand up for a smaller kid being beaten up by a larger bully and die for it, I am righteous. Even if I haven't accepted Jesus, I am righteous. It is for God alone to judge and place us accordingly. So quit your griping about acceptence of Christ and eternal damnation. You do not know what happens in all cases.




Your right I dont know if they did accepted Jesus before they died. But, given their personality and life stile, I doud it.. Hai your also right that I can not pass judgment on any one. And I do not even want to try to do so. But, as to righteousness, it says in the Bible that all our righteousness is as filty rags. You can not earn your way to Heven. The only way to Heven is thuo Jesus. Check the Bible it stats that is the only way.


I don't care what the Bible says. Righteousness is righteousness, Bible-approved or not. The Bible is not God's word. It is an interpretation of God's word by human beings.


Wow, a Christian who actually has common sense
'I don't care what the Bible says. Righteousness is righteousness, Bible-approved or not. The Bible is not God's word. It is an interpretation of God's word by human beings'
I agree completely with this, even assuming that God exists you can't take the bible seriously because it is undeniably written by mankind.


Some of it can be taken seriously. The rest is metaphoric.
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Posted 5/3/08
First of all, no murderer or rapist should be considered a true Christian because it obviously goes against the word of God and are definitely not walking with God. But, God is a God of forgiveness so they could be forgiven if they truly regretted their actions from the bottom of their hearts.

We weren't created just to worship God. It's not like God was bored one day and decided to create a whole ecosystem in order to bring glory to himself. He doesn't need us to worship him, the Bible says that even the rocks would cry out to worship the God in heaven. God created us because he loves us. We were created in his own image so that we would bring glory to his name.

You seem to have misunderstood. God is Love. Everything he does is done in love. He loved us so much that he gave the live of his son for us. But we can't all go around doing whatever we please because we know there is always forgiveness. We need to lead better lives as Christians in order to form a closer relationship with our Father in heaven.

I'm sorry if some of my posts come out sounding cold but it's rather difficult to display any emotion on the internet . Last of all I want to say that God looks at our hearts. If we claim to be Christians on the outside but deny him with our lifestyles and thoughts, we aren't really Christians. If we do good works just to make ourselves look better, we're denying Jesus with every action we make. Being a righteous person means that you acknowledge God in everything that you do. IF you follow God's commandments and make him the center of your life, you'll automatically lead a life that is pleasing to God and live righteously.

You guys seem to be missing the point. I'm not here to argue with you or to prove my points. As Christians we should be building each other up, not putting others down. That's the point of having any Christian group or association. If you have anything to say seriously consider a person's feeling because you never know what a person is going through. And even if you're not a Christian, be courteous to everyone in this group at least ok?

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