The girls act dumb & wait for the guy to sweep her off her feet. This kind of plot is alright but I have no idea why majority of all shoujo manga have this plot. I mean replace the girl with someone with guts. Ouran is great cause Haruhi is plain straight foward & dosen't act cute & dumb.

Well about Yuuki, I considered her in the weak heroine bunch sorry I know she's not, its just that she can really be annoying sometimes. Like I said one time, she easily "gives-in to anything" I mean anything for the person she cares for. And to the point that she becomes like the other girls in shoujo.
Its like, "Please do anything to me, I dont care... take my blood eat me till your satisfied but pls dont hurt Zero and Kaname." then when Zero swoops in to attack the vampire woman who was going to bite her she acts like a human shield to protect her I mean, c'mon! Thats so lame! I know the story but, sheesh it just felt so typical shoujo chick. Gomene Yuuki fans...
The anime looks cool, but never tried watching it. From what you stated I think I prolly would never touch it. I didnt like her in the manga, what more in the anime if she's so dumb and retarded (according 2 u).



Is it a stereotype in japanese society for females to be submissive? - In the past "yes", women are only seen as housewives always ready to tend to their husbands and children. In todays generation maybe not anymore, me'thinks but Im not sure coz Im not Japanese. Gomen...
I.e tohru in Fruits baskets - well she is strong, in a way...she may not have a tough exterior, although she tends to be a little too goody-goody sometimes too like "...I dont wanna be a burden to Kyoukun, but I love him so much."
Isn't there a phrase for it like yamato nadeshiko??? - Whats that?
Shall have to look it up on wiki. lol - Tell me when you find it...

LOL, you wouldn't like Chizumi and Fujiomi then I guess I don't know, I always liked those plots but some do get on my nerves( Miki from Marmalade Boy). I agree that it has to do a lot with the culture. Maybe it's seen that if you're meek, quite, shy, and naive you are more lady like? And I also think why alot of the male characters are strong and stoic has to do with the culture also. I dunno, just guesses.

P.S. has anyone ever noticed that the guy in shoujo manga always has family problems??? It happens so often.

ROFL.... :w00t:

well said... BRAVO!!!

Girl power? Kay, well continuing...

I know...

Even if they start off 'strong', it's usually an annoying type of strong, like incredibly cliché to me...
Like, I'm standing up for you, blah blah.
Then half way through the first volume, they start crying or something.
They always like to start them off seeming strong but they become all pathetic in a second.

The only one where I quite like the girl is Beauty Pop.
She remains indifferent the entire time. And she's cool. And she dresses like a guy. Then that got boring quickly...
But yeah, I usually steer clear of them but if teh plot is decent it's okay.
Honestly, I prefer minimum crying and some kind of violence though.

Although, yes I do love Ouran High.
But Haruhi isn't all pathetic so s'alright.
And Vampire Knight, has an excellent plot.
I guess I like the occasional shoujo though.

I prefer shonen. just more interesting. less predictable.

XD

MARY SUE! Is that it?
I think so...

Wiki says its true->

'Yamato Nadeshiko (大和撫子, Yamato Nadeshiko?) is referred to by Japanese as a woman with attributes that were considered traditionally desirable from the perspective of a male dominated society; generally ascribed to people with traditional upbringings. It is an extremely broad, but complicated Japanese aesthetic concept. The name is believed to originate from the willowy Dianthus superbus or the Japanese Nadeshiko flower.

Kenkyūsha's New Japanese-English Dictionary (5th ed., 2003) translates Yamato-nadeshiko: "a Japanese woman (with all the traditional graces); an ideal Japanese woman." Daijirin (3rd ed., 2006) defines it: "1 ナデシコの別名。2 日本女性の清楚な美しさをほめていう語。", "1. another name for Dianthus superbus. 2. A figure of speech for the beauty of Japanese women who are neat and tidy."

Also known as an ideal Japanese woman, it basically revolves around acting for the benefit of the family and following instructions or acting in the best interest of patriarchal authority figures. Virtues include: loyalty, domestic ability, wisdom, and humility.'

but it's wiki->aka place for bored uni students to write stuff to confuse school kids.

With "stereotype" shoujo manga, the male and female leads are always Mary Sues and Larry Stus XD. I don't mind Yanki type heroines as much though.
Tohru can be submissive at times (and a bit annoying) but she gets better as the series goes on. Also Haruhi Fujioka and Yuuki Cross are awesome heroines, because they can *actually* take care of themselves.

Anyway, worst shoujo manga heroines are:
-Riiko from Zettai Kareshi. At first I just tolerated her, but after rereading it, she's really annoying.
-Hiyo (?) from Love Monster. She's so annoying and happy and her character is all over the place >_> can't stand her.

" Girl power? Kay, well continuing..." lol you should know



Me like Tohru towards the end of the series, but she "did" have her "shoujo-cliche" moment when she saw Kyou and ran away from him instead of talking then just started crying... but I forgive her for that coz she ended up with Kyou and everyone was happily settled with the person they love.
Yuki...me no like still. sorry...if she looses her "so very nice" attitude maybe I'll consider her.
Haruhi me loves very muchas!

LOL I loathe those two manga's you mentioned. even though the stories were interesting & not to mention the guys were hot (they always are) but the heroines were so annoying! Especially in Love Monster, just one whiff and it'll fall to the hentai category and all the guys just wants her ass!

YES!
Ouran is so funny...i love having the heroine being the steady one and the guys become the dramatic and sensitive one...And its one manga where the girls arent taken advantage of..
Hikari from Special A and Hina from Penguin Revolution are just what girls ought to be...
I'm really sick of girls being portrayed as weepy and stammering to confess their feelings for guys...
What has happened?
Should'nt it be the other way around?
And how come in Japan,the girls are the ones giving the guys chocolates?
I'm blur on that coz i thot that's the day guys give flowers to girls...

Yeah! If i had to pick a girl to be like in Vampire Knight,I wanna be Ruka...bitchy and possessive...guys dont only have to be the only selfish ones out there:D

Sorry! I didn't understand what you meant.
I'm slow, you'll have to explain...
What should I know?

they sometimes have a strong sense of justice and are spunky... and on the other side, they can be clumsy, stubborn, and love sick!

no comment >.< seem too like it tho. need MORE girls.