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Revenge.... When does it end?
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Posted 4/27/08
Depends on the act that caused the need for vengence.

Take this for example.

A murderer killed your parents.
He got caught.

What do you want the punishment for him to be?


Then take this as the opposite example.

Your classmate you dislike told everyone that you were XYZ (subsitute something)
You and him are alone. You got a baseball bat.

What do you want to do?

Some people will say that they will forgive the murderer and the classmate. However if the murderer's event actually happens to them, i seriously doubt their emotional and mental state will allow them to start talking about forgiveness. The conflict of Id, Ego and Super ego
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Posted 4/27/08

the_glob wrote:

Depends on the act that caused the need for vengence.

Take this for example.

A murderer killed your parents.
He got caught.

What do you want the punishment for him to be?


Then take this as the opposite example.

Your classmate you dislike told everyone that you were XYZ (subsitute something)
You and him are alone. You got a baseball bat.

What do you want to do?

Some people will say that they will forgive the murderer and the classmate. However if the murderer's event actually happens to them, i seriously doubt their emotional and mental state will allow them to start talking about forgiveness. The conflict of Id, Ego and Super ego


For the first, the law will punish him. He'd be sentenced to death in Singapore. That's not entirely revenge though. That's justice. And saving people from his homicidal rampage. At least, that's what the law says its doing. I'd probably be angry, but then it's out of my hands.

For the second, I'd probably laugh at whatever my classmate I disliked called me when I hear about it. I don't know, maybe its just me but I find amusement in people trying to put me down. Mostly it IS funny. And I don't get mad when people I dislike say bad things about me. I get more upset when people I like do it, and more when they were being completely unfair.

Inevitably, its those we care about that can hurt us most. And against them I really can't be very vengeful. Not because I'm a saint but because hurting someone you care about comes back to haunt you with regret more than you can imagine. And to answer the questions OP asked, revenge is not sweet, but sometimes its a solution people will choose, because everything else doesn't seem to work.
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Posted 4/27/08

cardmage wrote:
For the first, the law will punish him. He'd be sentenced to death in Singapore. That's not entirely revenge though. That's justice. And saving people from his homicidal rampage. At least, that's what the law says its doing. I'd probably be angry, but then it's out of my hands.


If you ask people why they took revenge, they would have given you the same answer. Justice.

If he was sentenced to death, how would you have felt.

If he was let off on a technicality in the law or sentenced to 6 months jail, due to insufficent hard evidence. How would you feel?

The law in this case is the instrument of revenge.

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Posted 4/27/08

the_glob wrote:

If you ask people why they took revenge, they would have given you the same answer. Justice.

If he was sentenced to death, how would you have felt.

If he was let off on a technicality in the law or sentenced to 6 months jail, due to insufficent hard evidence. How would you feel?

The law in this case is the instrument of revenge.



I suppose I should clarify. The workings of the law is not revenge. My personal motive might be, but the law deciding to give him the death penalty isn't. I might not feel satisfied after a light sentence for him but as I've said, its out of my hands once the law has gotten a hold on him. And eventually, once the headiness of fulfilled revenge passes (in the case it gets fulfilled), I'd probably see that this is justice and think less about my personal hatred for the man.

If it doesn't I'll still know that the feeling of injustice will one day just fade away like all my past injustices that I have felt done to me or people around me that I care about. It probably would take some time to go away since its a huge injustice.

If I can't live with that then I'll just kill the guy. And that I would do knowing the law will grant me my death. Since its not something I can live with then I might as well die. And that's not justice. That's just bitter revenge. And given the circumstances, it might as well be the most mature thing you could do. Unless you thought that somehow you could change the legal system so that others like you in the future would not suffer this injustice or something obscure along those lines.

Satisfying one's vengeance is usually never really satisfying though.
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33 / F / greece
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Posted 4/27/08
i think taking revenge makes yourself hurt first rather the other person.
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26 / F / Reality
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Posted 4/28/08
i read this quote that i think makes sense.

an eye for an eye makes the world full of blind people.
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Posted 4/28/08

cardmage wrote:
I suppose I should clarify. The workings of the law is not revenge. My personal motive might be, but the law deciding to give him the death penalty isn't. I might not feel satisfied after a light sentence for him but as I've said, its out of my hands once the law has gotten a hold on him. And eventually, once the headiness of fulfilled revenge passes (in the case it gets fulfilled), I'd probably see that this is justice and think less about my personal hatred for the man.

If it doesn't I'll still know that the feeling of injustice will one day just fade away like all my past injustices that I have felt done to me or people around me that I care about. It probably would take some time to go away since its a huge injustice.


That is your primal need for revenge. The law is merely fufiling its need or prevent its completion. Fufiling a primal need is "sweet" in itself but there are other factors that create a lack of satisfaction for the revenge being taken, from the disappearence of a motivation in your life to the realisation that nothing really changed and the balance is merely equalled

Again depending on the motive for revenge, this primal need is either extremely strong or very weak (hence my 2 previous examples) and in cases of it being extremely strong, if the person is not extremely strong willed, handling it in a "mature" manner is very difficult. Handling the non fufilment of the need for revenge is just as difficult and time consuming.
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Posted 4/28/08

the_glob wrote:

That is your primal need for revenge. The law is merely fufiling its need or prevent its completion. Fufiling a primal need is "sweet" in itself but there are other factors that create a lack of satisfaction for the revenge being taken, from the disappearence of a motivation in your life to the realisation that nothing really changed and the balance is merely equalled

Again depending on the motive for revenge, this primal need is either extremely strong or very weak (hence my 2 previous examples) and in cases of it being extremely strong, if the person is not extremely strong willed, handling it in a "mature" manner is very difficult. Handling the non fufilment of the need for revenge is just as difficult and time consuming.


Firstly, I don't think we actually disagree. We both know that the law giving the man a death penalty is one issue and revenge is another. The law isn't an instrument of my revenge. The law just happens to be the helpful man with the power to make it happen, and just happens to actually grant my revenge or not. And the law in itself deals justice, not revenge as the law is self-serving. It doesn't care whether you get your revenge or not.

Also, whether I feel that the action of the law is revenge is another point of contention, but that is purely subjective, so its hard to qualify. One person would say yes but the other might feel that the law has robbed him of his revenge. Since it differs from person to person I don't think an argument on this is a good idea.

Lastly you likened revenge to a basic, "primal" need, which would be rewarding when fulfilled. I suppose it might be evolutionarily adaptive given that this need would lead to increased reproductive success as it serves as deterrence against aggressors as well as a protection for mates. However, cost of revenge is often also high. Would it be evolutionarily adaptive to adopt behavior against an aggressor that could have caused grievous harm in the first place? Research shows that between fight-or-flight, it seems more adaptive to choose flight especially in the case of humans. I would like to read something about the "need" for revenge if you have anything.

Personally though, I would think of need for revenge as removal of a negative reinforcement. This thought of revenge ultimately stems from the cost of losing whatever it is one feels that one has lost. This perceived loss is probably a strong negative reinforcer for the party involved. If one is unable to gain it back, an act that makes the other lose something of equal value would lessen this negative reinforcement as social comparison makes it so that one no longer loses out, especially to this other that have caused such a loss. The need for removal of this negative reinforcement will depend on the strength of the reinforcement which stems from the perceived value of what the person has lost.
Posted 5/1/08
Revenge will never end. Unless, humankind loses its sense of pride. Highly impossible.
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24 / M / S'pore
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Posted 5/1/08
To me , revenge is bad and unnecessary. For example , in the murderer's case , whats done is done, killing the person involved would help reserruct or save the one dead. I do not even think it is a form of closure. I am sure that a mother who has lost a child, even after seeking revenge on the party, by self or law, they would still see the death as unnecessary and hurtful, it doesn't lessen anything. But if the murderer was put to corrective work order for life, he could benefit society in the safe confines of prison. Even though the mother would still weep, at least the society suffers minimal losses, maybe even gains. What the mother felt sad about was that her child died prematurely, especially by someone else who was blamable.

But , then again , the world is not perfect , but , if everyone is willing to contribute a little by not holding grudges and taking revenge, im sure the world would be a nicer place to live in. Rather than the mindless slaughterhouse at the moment.
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26 / M / Peliphines
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Posted 5/1/08
It is when one decided to give up and have a peaceful life... and revenge will be sweet if the victim would be a helpless idiot after what you did...

Well, good thing Im too lazy to be bothered getting a revenge...
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23 / F / somewhere under t...
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Posted 5/2/08
when you're dead.. i guess
lol
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25 / M / lei sla bonita
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Posted 5/2/08

. if u hate the person sooo much for doing something would u get the person back or solve it like a mature person
no i would solve it like a my mature person i would make planns to kick the shit out of them!... then slowly get over it until i 4get and go on to dreaming of killing some other person and so on.
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20 / F / my imagination
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Posted 5/2/08
sumtimes its sweet but its wrong
Posted 5/2/08
The cycle will never end. It will perpetuate for eternity.
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