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Can a meaningful romantic relationship exist between an adult and a child?
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Posted 1/15/10

azuretome wrote:

Until you have had an adult tell you how special you are to them and how good looking you are and how they need to be close to you. Then. you as a lonely, overlooked child feel you have found someone who will be your friend. Right to the point where they gently, lovingly push something inside you...a pain a violation that you can't explain or comprehend. Inside you know something is damaged, you feel dirty and ashamed without anybody telling you. You keep your secret, you won't even tell the person who did this to you because you are afraid that you will lose that special friend, you even let them do a second time because they love you. Then your body betrays you. At premature ages you get sexual urges that you can't explain, and can't always control because your body is responding before you can grasp whats happening, you get confused about sex and love. You hate yourself because every time you let yourself be touched, violated your mind screams in protest even as your body responds. In order to be loved you must be sexual, and there are plenty of people out there who are willing to 'love' you until they get tired of you. I never told anyone my story until I became an adult. I suffered in silence and in fear of rejection until the day I became strong enough to say no and avoid my rapist. My late teen years and early adult years were a mess because an older person 'loved' me.
I do not judge you for your sexual urges, I know people who struggle with this..... BUT DO NOT try to rationalize or justify your pedophilia. Deal with it just like an alcoholic or drug addict. The person you 'love' is now permanently damaged. Love should never hurt physically or emotionally!


This should be the poster statement/ "case and point" argument.

I saw a few cases growing up, and a couple girls even revealed to me a stories in my teen years.. those people had a hard time living any semblance of a normal lifestyle. This all happened around me growing up, so I didn't fully understand it at the time, but looking back, they really seemed out of touch with everyone. The love kids need is a different kind, and not to be confused. This sort of thing does something to them at the core. I think azuretome's post covers it.

I won't lie, I've on occasion thought girls maybe as young as 13 were beautiful in a way I shouldn't. But all you need is to hear them talk to understand that they may look that way, but they're really just kids. As for people who find kids devoid of any... features, attractive, I lose the ability to fathom or sympathize what they are feeling. Maybe a severe lack of self confidence.

Somewhere, maybe pedophiles confuse what is cute and should probably trigger some kind of feeling to be a guardian, with sexual feelings.

As for OP, The relationship would probably be conflicting types of love.
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Posted 1/16/10 , edited 1/16/10
I'm going to go with 'possibly'.

But I find it a little difficult to believe that children would be aware of what romantic love means, and the other adult would have to be the most responsible and patient person in the world. X3

People who have screamed 'PEDOPHILIA!' in this thread are really silly. Pedophilia is sexual relations between an adult and a child -- with is pretty much ALWAYS depicted as sexual abuse on the adult's side. This thread is about a ROMANTIC relationship.

Perhaps if our society was more romance-focused, not just for adults but for everyone, and romance was exposed to children, gently, from a young age -- maybe then... but even if children were taught that romantic love is something to really aspire towards it probably wouldn't work, children don't tend to understand objectives like 'get a good job' or 'start a family' unless they're about 10 and have had it drummed into them.

Plus, you'd have to wonder what the adult's outlook on the child was. Surely the relationship would be partly parental? I find that a little disturbing when put synonymously with 'romantic love' in this case. The child's mind hasn't fully developed either, in my opinion. Love is a very abstract concept.
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Posted 1/18/10
First of all, a relationship requires two partners interacting within certain parameters and understanding those parameters: Work relationship, parent/child relationship, friendship, romantic relationship.
Biology says that children even if taught cannot understand Romantic love. Gosh, even teenagers are in and out of 'love' so often and I am sure they are convinced that it is 'Romantic love' at the time (and it probably is).
I just did a wiki on 'romantic love' apparently even 'experts' do not have the capacity to understand what 'romantic love' is. lol
That is such a vague, overused term.
Define what is meant by Romantic Love.

For the most part Romance is based in illusion, we have fantasies of the perfect man, perfect woman, perfect date, but the reality is way different. An adult individual who fantasizes about a child being the perfect man/woman has unresolved issues. A child can not properly respond back because children are need based by nature (not sacrificially based) as they get older they are better able to meet their own needs so their dependency on others should lessen. An adult that idolizes a child is also need based. Two needy people responding to each other is a very selfish love, too co-dependent and unhealthy. As the child's need for the other lessens then what? Also, most definitions of Romantic love DO include some level of physical/sexual attraction even if it is suppressed. The supression is part of the romance.

Children going through puberty have enough confusion about their feelings and urges because of biology and physiology, they do not need an outside 'Romantic Lover' clouding the issue. My friend's daughter (age 13) had a 30 yr old approach her at the gym. He likes her and talks to her and asked her out on a date. She is just now aware of her sexuality. She on one hand thinks this is cool to have an older guy interested in her. She thinks it means she must be more mature than other girls her age (yeah, right) On the other hand, behind his back she is laughing at him. She thinks he must be a loser or something. Her mom is just as bad. She is flattered that her daughter is getting noticed but she thinks the guy is sick. THIS IS REALITY. But that guy will never know thew truth because he is caught up in his fantasy perception. He is caught up in the romance of the moment.

In romanticizing love we see ourselves as the givers, the noble ones, the ones who suffer with unrequited love, the ones who will sacrifice anything for that one we love. This is not reality nor how we really are at our base, but it sure sounds good and feels good. I am a crazy romantic when it comes to my husband but I understand who he really is. When he is a jerk, I know it but I like the rose colored glasses. (He looks a lot prettier that way)
Romance is great as long as we respect the fact that it is our inner fantasy role playing; not the basis of our relationship but the frosting on the cake, Romance adds idealism, purity, and sometimes spice to a relationship. Romance helps us to love somebody when they are being a jerk. Romance can also blind us to the truth! Romantic love can easily lead to obsession and instability when not controlled.

People who fantasize romance with a child, why? That child can not love you back as an equal. Why are you not attracted to an adult? What do you see in that child? When that child grows up, what then? Children are not innocent in behavior, they cry, scream , lie, throw temper tantrums, they can be very manipulative too. You cannot mold them into being the person you want them to be. If you try to mold them that is manipulation and that is not love. Can you truly say you are acting in the best interest of that child? or yourself?
Again, I do NOT condemn the feelings or urges just do not fixate in any way upon a child or act out those fantasies.
Posted 1/18/10

Yatsuan wrote:



Gosh, thanks so much for telling me it's a mental condition, I'm so fortunate. ._.

I know pedophilia is a mental condition. Pedophilia was not mentioned in the question. We're basically discussing whether or not an adult and a child can have a romantic relationship /without it being pedophilia/.

I wouldn't think it was 'wrong' -- how can it be wrong? What do you mean by wrong? Going against nature? How? Making out, by the way, isn't the same as having sex and reproducing, neither is sex for pleasure, so don't give me the whole 'it's not what our bodies are meant to do' routine. I would think it be socially unacceptable, nor would I be able to see it for long because that adult would no doubt be arrested immediately.

I don't think a child has the mental capacity to understand what romantic love is, no. But like I said, were children introduced to the idea of romantic love at an early age, who's to say they couldn't understand it then? The first first chance you actually get of working out what romantic love is, and how you would experience it, is when you're a young teenager, most likely.
The premise about discussing pedophilia was already established by the OP of this topic, the "Yes I mean pedophiles" topic description was self-sufficient enough to say the least. Not to mention is the fact that the OP himself requested to discuss "Should pedophilia be considered a mental disorder or a sexual orientation?" And even then I can prove with my own logic that pedophilia is indeed a mental disorder. While children OTOH aren't as nearly matured enough both mentally or emotionally to be considering romantic relationships, regardless of how are they being exposed to the concept of romance.

The concept of children can understand romantic love relationship is indeed wrong because the natural maturation of the human's brain is at age 25.
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Posted 1/18/10 , edited 1/18/10
I have to apologise there, I don't remember seeing the topic description.

Why is pedophilia a mental disorder? All you're saying is how the CHILD is unable to consider a romantic relationship. Pedophilia isn't the label being branded on the child. If an adult feels more attracted to children, whether sexually or romantically, why is that a mental disorder?

If the natural maturation of the human's brain is at age 25, do you, then, consider a romantic relationship between a 26 year old and a 20 year old morally wrong? What about a romantic relationship between two 20 year olds?

Like I said, I wonder whether children could understand romantic love had they actually been exposed to it from a young age. I mean, being taught what it is, rather than being told around age 5 that people should aspire to be married, and then around 11 or whatever hitting puberty. I appreciate that you don't think they could ever understand romance if they're exposed to it, but... well, that might not be what I think. I'm undecided on the matter anyway.
Posted 1/18/10

Yatsuan wrote:

I have to apologise there, I don't remember seeing the topic description.

Why is pedophilia a mental disorder? All you're saying is how the CHILD is unable to consider a romantic relationship. Pedophilia isn't the label being branded on the child. If an adult feels more attracted to children, whether sexually or romantically, why is that a mental disorder?

If the natural maturation of the human's brain is at age 25, do you, then, consider a romantic relationship between a 26 year old and a 20 year old morally wrong? What about a romantic relationship between two 20 year olds?

Like I said, I wonder whether children could understand romantic love had they actually been exposed to it from a young age. I mean, being taught what it is, rather than being told around age 5 that people should aspire to be married, and then around 11 or whatever hitting puberty. I appreciate that you don't think they could ever understand romance if they're exposed to it, but... well, that might not be what I think. I'm undecided on the matter anyway.


Pedophilia is a mental disorder because it is classified as such by professionals (psychologists) because a child CANNOT understand romance, weather it is taught to love... Anyways, it is wrong to teach something to love another, it has to be felt naturally. A 20 year old can understand what love is and is classified an adult in many countries, is it not?

BTW, Apologize is spelled as such. Its kind of my habit for correcting people.
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Posted 1/18/10

MrMelancholy wrote:


Yatsuan wrote:

I have to apologise there, I don't remember seeing the topic description.

Why is pedophilia a mental disorder? All you're saying is how the CHILD is unable to consider a romantic relationship. Pedophilia isn't the label being branded on the child. If an adult feels more attracted to children, whether sexually or romantically, why is that a mental disorder?

If the natural maturation of the human's brain is at age 25, do you, then, consider a romantic relationship between a 26 year old and a 20 year old morally wrong? What about a romantic relationship between two 20 year olds?

Like I said, I wonder whether children could understand romantic love had they actually been exposed to it from a young age. I mean, being taught what it is, rather than being told around age 5 that people should aspire to be married, and then around 11 or whatever hitting puberty. I appreciate that you don't think they could ever understand romance if they're exposed to it, but... well, that might not be what I think. I'm undecided on the matter anyway.


Pedophilia is a mental disorder because it is classified as such by professionals (psychologists) because a child CANNOT understand romance, weather it is taught to love... Anyways, it is wrong to teach something to love another, it has to be felt naturally. A 20 year old can understand what love is and is classified an adult in many countries, is it not?

BTW, Apologize is spelled as such. Its kind of my habit for correcting people. :)


Like I said, pedophilia is the name branded to the ADULT. If we agree that the child is unable to understand romance, then lets look at the adult, the pedophile. The adult has a sexual or romantic attraction to children, whether or not a child can understand romance or not. Pedophilia when defined as a mental disorder should concern the ADULT not the object; i.e., children.

No, apologise is spelt as such. I'm British. I'll have to point out that you'd use 'whether' not 'weather' where you did...
Posted 1/18/10 , edited 1/18/10

Yatsuan wrote:


MrMelancholy wrote:


Yatsuan wrote:

I have to apologise there, I don't remember seeing the topic description.

Why is pedophilia a mental disorder? All you're saying is how the CHILD is unable to consider a romantic relationship. Pedophilia isn't the label being branded on the child. If an adult feels more attracted to children, whether sexually or romantically, why is that a mental disorder?

If the natural maturation of the human's brain is at age 25, do you, then, consider a romantic relationship between a 26 year old and a 20 year old morally wrong? What about a romantic relationship between two 20 year olds?

Like I said, I wonder whether children could understand romantic love had they actually been exposed to it from a young age. I mean, being taught what it is, rather than being told around age 5 that people should aspire to be married, and then around 11 or whatever hitting puberty. I appreciate that you don't think they could ever understand romance if they're exposed to it, but... well, that might not be what I think. I'm undecided on the matter anyway.


Pedophilia is a mental disorder because it is classified as such by professionals (psychologists) because a child CANNOT understand romance, weather it is taught to love... Anyways, it is wrong to teach something to love another, it has to be felt naturally. A 20 year old can understand what love is and is classified an adult in many countries, is it not?

BTW, Apologize is spelled as such. Its kind of my habit for correcting people. :)


Like I said, pedophilia is the name branded to the ADULT. If we agree that the child is unable to understand romance, then lets look at the adult, the pedophile. The adult has a sexual or romantic attraction to children, whether or not a child can understand romance or not. Pedophilia when defined as a mental disorder should concern the ADULT not the object; i.e., children.

No, apologise is spelt as such. I'm British. I'll have to point out that you'd use 'whether' not 'weather' where you did...


The unofficial term for a child liking an adult is Abutophilia, coming from the Latin words Abutor (adult) and -philia (like, live, love). This is EXTREMELY rare, because a child (like ive said before) cannot understand a physical/mental relationship without being taught to, therefore it is classified pedophilia.

I have a sister who thinks its ok to love a person older than she is, and we sent her away for trying to destoy our family... the sad sack of shit i call a sister is being fostered by two homosexual women. She is 15 (or 16, im not sure) now. I dont have a problem with homosexuals by the way, if you are wondering.

(Well, I guess my spell-checker is wrong...[I'm using Mozilla])

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Posted 1/18/10
...I'm not disputing any of that, I'm saying that I don't agree with pedophilia being classified as a mental disorder. A fetish, perhaps -- a fixation. What are you saying is pedophilia? A relationship between an adult and a child? The pedophile is the adult, not the child, in that case.

What are you trying to prove by your sister anecdote? Of course it's 'okay' to love a person older than you are, I don't get what you're trying to say. First you claim the age the brain naturally matures at is 25, and use that as a reason why children cannot understand love. Now you're saying that a 20 year old understands love?

If you don't have a problem with homosexuals, why on earth did you just mention, specifically, that she's being fostered by lesbians?

If you're talking about apologise not being in your spell-checker, my Opera spell-checker constantly tells me all my British spellings are wrong, and I can't be bothered to go change it. If you're talking about 'weather'... well, that's grammar, not spelling.
Posted 1/18/10

Yatsuan wrote:

I have to apologise there, I don't remember seeing the topic description.

Why is pedophilia a mental disorder? All you're saying is how the CHILD is unable to consider a romantic relationship. Pedophilia isn't the label being branded on the child. If an adult feels more attracted to children, whether sexually or romantically, why is that a mental disorder?

If the natural maturation of the human's brain is at age 25, do you, then, consider a romantic relationship between a 26 year old and a 20 year old morally wrong? What about a romantic relationship between two 20 year olds?

Like I said, I wonder whether children could understand romantic love had they actually been exposed to it from a young age. I mean, being taught what it is, rather than being told around age 5 that people should aspire to be married, and then around 11 or whatever hitting puberty. I appreciate that you don't think they could ever understand romance if they're exposed to it, but... well, that might not be what I think. I'm undecided on the matter anyway.
Pedophilia is classified as a mental disorder by the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders, because by psychologists studying individual pedophiles, we concluded that while pedophiles are unable to empathize the mental and emotional states of children, the majority of them also suffer from mental and emotional disorders other than pedophilia.

According to neurophysiology, the physical maturation of the human brain occurs in various stages. With the frontal lobe being the last stage of its development. And considering the fact that the frontal lobe is responsible for logic reasoning, aka judgment. We aren't really providing the ideal environment for individuals to develop their own sense of morality, when modern society primed and programed the teens, with their underdeveloped frontal lobes for instant gratification due to overexposure.

Not to mention when we consider how the psychology of happiness works like a fuzzy logic, we really aren't teaching our children and teens much about what romantic relationship really is like, when we don't even know for sure how happiness works.
Posted 3/1/10 , edited 3/1/10
Absolutely not, no grown up man that is right in the head will want to be with a child, they are taking advantage of the dumbass kid by telling them they "love" them and these young girls are ignorant and stupid enough to believe it.
Posted 3/4/10 , edited 3/4/10
No. Just no.
Children, if we're referring to anything under teenage status, are just not ready for this kind of relationship yet, especially with adults and especially intimate and serious relationships. And of course, they wouldn't be able to take heed of this both physically and mentally. They're just not old and mature enough, whatever you may think. I'm pretty sure that a romantic relationship is something they wont even know about let alone be thinking about at this time, they need to grow and gain experience... with those of the same age.

I mean, c'mon...
Pedophilia is just wrong, full stop.
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Posted 3/19/10
My opinion is absolutely not. A child is too immature to understand the "love" that the other person is asking for. Even if the child somehow understands (which rarely or never will happen), there still shouldnt be a relationship. Pedophilia is very serious. I know it is impossible to terminate, but we as a society should do everything to prevent it. Anything close or similar to pedophilia should be abolished.
Like, even if the relationship is not physical, whouldnt the adult and child (if it is really love) want to be physical sooner or later(relationships work that way)? Once it gets physical, whether in a relationship or not, its pedophilia. If ppl start accepting relationships like that it will just be the first step into more pedophile cases. If ppl accept these relationships, the children are even more of a target....quiet openly, really. Even the thought of this makes me angry..
Posted 3/19/10

soccer_rocks wrote:

My opinion is absolutely not. A child is too immature to understand the "love" that the other person is asking for. Even if the child somehow understands (which rarely or never will happen), there still shouldnt be a relationship. Pedophilia is very serious. I know it is impossible to terminate, but we as a society should do everything to prevent it. Anything close or similar to pedophilia should be abolished.
Like, even if the relationship is not physical, whouldnt the adult and child (if it is really love) want to be physical sooner or later(relationships work that way)? Once it gets physical, whether in a relationship or not, its pedophilia. If ppl start accepting relationships like that it will just be the first step into more pedophile cases. If ppl accept these relationships, the children are even more of a target....quiet openly, really. Even the thought of this makes me angry..
Sometimes a pedophile isn't born, when they could be made into one.

In some cases, a pedophile was in fact a victim of abuse at a young age. Or the act and even the concept itself was like an addiction to the individual:

Among the approaches to treatment that have been employed however is the method of treating the pedophile for post-traumatic stress disorder as a result of child abuse however this treatment clearly relies on establishing that the pedophile was actually a victim of child abuse. Another approach to treatment recognizes pedophilia as an addiction that requires the support of a 12-step program like other orders of addiction. Psychodymanic therapy has been employed to assist the pedophile in developing some sort of insight into the childhood needs and conflicts that might have contributed to his behavior however this, like the other treatments presented have not been widely used or carefully tested in order to determine their effectiveness .

One of the most recent advances in the treatment of pedophiles however has been found in the effectiveness of group therapy, which employs a number of methods for developing self-control and changing the beliefs, attitudes and behaviors of pedophiles. These methods include imaginal desensitization, a method in which the pedophile is encouraged to describe sexual situations in detail while practicing muscle relaxation techniques designed to suppress the sexual urge and allow him to tolerate the associated discomfort . Another method employed during the group session is covert sensitization, a method in which the pedophile practices imagining the consequences of his behavior including public exposure as well as imprisonment.

Read more: http://www.papermasters.com/treating-pedophiles.html#ixzz0ifwtBBIR
What's also interesting from the above source is the part about group therapy. As in cognitive conditioning by using behavioral pattern change within a peer support group environment, based on the principle of human condition is caused by human behavior.

However, none of them will have any effect on a pedophile, if the individual doesn't acknowledge that it is indeed a problem that cannot be solved independently. Furthermore, a society that shunt at pedophiles may even scare them away from getting the help that they desperately need. Therefore the society also has a responsibility to be aware of its initial intention towards a pedophile individual, otherwise the most dangerous element for pedophiles aren't themselves. But a society that hunts down and discriminates them due to misunderstandings.

I'm by no means asking the society to accept pedophiles and pedophilia, when understanding nor consideration doesn't automatically results in acceptance. But how can anyone is willing to accept help from others, when that individual was misunderstood by them? Thereby not getting the proper help that the individual needs due to a lack of trust.
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Posted 3/19/10 , edited 3/19/10
Children can't understand the concept of love - as much as they think they can - Not until you are about the age of 15-16 do you experience your first real "love"... and even then, it gets even more confusing.

Adults find love a difficult concept, children just cannot understand it - and a simple liking someone is so very often mistake for full-blown love.

No I don't think a child and an adult could have a meaningful relationship - and with all respect - I think it's very wrong.
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Posted 3/19/10
no and even if the child is in their teens it doesn't mean that they have the mentality to truly access the situation, even so there are a few like in every other matter that it may work but the chance is so slim its not going to happen...sorry if i crushed anyones hopes but its reality
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