First  Prev  1  2  3  4  5  6  7  8  9  10  11  Next  Last
Religion a cause for World ills?, or a spiritual refuge that ascertain existence
4294 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
forgot where
Offline
Posted 3/17/09

ShroomInferno wrote:

what i don't understand is that such things as rights to discriminate is quite an often seen fact in religion, mainly because of society's moronic idea to give unadulterated and unquestioning respect to religion, so the hate-mongering of the religious is being freely tolerated while criticising religion is strongly disliked and looked upon as if it was a crime to question the existence of god, or the doctrine's rightfulness. what a nice double-standard.

only very few people dare to question the conflicts between religion and human rights today, and if they do they are said to be insulting someone's right to have a religion. some people would even go so far to disallow criticism against religion in general, expecting from us to honour religion with the same respect as its followers. whenever we try to question, or point out how very intriguing some issues are such as creationism, gay rights, or abortion; religious automatically come up with the argument that they have the right as a human being to have their religious harmony preserved, and thus demanding respect from non-adherents, i.e. not daring to question the religious doctrines.

of course, i do partly agree, everyone should have the right to devote his life to one's beliefs, as undoubtedly it is a fundamental human right to have the freedom of worship, of course, that's a fair argument, but this line of reasoning should not force us to give extravagant respect to some religious views.

despite their religion's message of love and patronage, archaic laws such as burying homosexuals alive, honour killings, marital abuse and female genital mutilation, etc. are respected/accepted by the religious. of course this is kind of generic, as there were also christians, too, who've been known to argue against female rights, gays, citing passages of the bible to support the enforcing of the subdued place of women in home and society.
that such archaic patriarchal-based sentiments can be still seen in our advanced world, is surely evidence of how much religion is being tolerated and unquestionably respected.

most of us shy away from questioning religions and religious beliefs because it is simply too much of a hassle. amusing is that religious people are never short of citing "hurt/offense" at criticism hurled at their religion, but often have no scruple about causing real damage and pain in form of words and, sadly, even actions, in other words, massively disrespecting the rights and liberties of other individuals.

allowing them to hold sway over policies and laws that discriminate others is unacceptable. here i am not trying to insult, this is just a simple form of realisation that religion and the religious are not that golden, saint as they present themselves.

other than that i find it rather troublesome that religion asserts itself as the unquestionable absolute truth, and doesn't tolerate any other form of thinking. demanding more blind respect than they deserve, even from those who don't share the same religion, if in any way religious at all.

spreading and evangelising, by any means, should not be allowed, as people should have the right to decide what they want to believe in without pressure from others.
only those who have the desire to keep it to themselves out of consideration for others, deserve my respect. sadly, only very few would meet those standards. ; /

while some moral values taught in the many holy books are universally accepted, not all of those views taught by religions are universally acceptable, or lawful. and that's where we should set a straight line, between the tolerable and non-tolerable.

other than that, referring to the absolute truth of a religion. it is a fact that many religions made/make various claims about this world that have been proved, later on, to be wrong. but since this claims are set under the category of religion, we are somewhat prohibited from questioning them with the same combativeness with which we'd be questioning other "truth" claims(for example questioning the truth that someone got abducted by aliens), and instead of that we are compelled to respect them, due to fear that we'd get accused of insulting someone's religion. being strongly discouraged from challenging beliefs, because if we'd do we'd get called "racist"(yeah, i know, ridiculous, but some of them really call you racist if you don't show any form of empathy for their belief), and if we dare then we would risk that some religious fundamentalists would take serious offence and make a fuss when their beliefs are challenged( for example the reaction that arouse after the publication of cartoons of the Prophet Muhammad in Jyllands-Posten).

by all means, i do not say that we should completely abolish the idea of respect/existence for religion and the religious, but demanding to let religions reside on an elevated pedestal, shielded from criticism and arguments that we'd be vigorously applying to any other form of truth claims, is simply asking too much, as i don't see where you'd be deserving to get such special rights, those still existing special rights for the religions and religious are simply not defeated because the mere possibility that some religious zealots might take serious offence by it, and due to that would thanks to blind rage make a serious ruckus and endanger other people's life, generally sets people in fear. there is nothing more annoying and endangering than the vengeful spirit of a fundamentalist.

ps: i don't know why i posted this in the islam thread, this thread seems to be more suited for my post, so =S

moved~


im confused...r we talking about government? or religion? or government and religon? USA has a secular government, so rights have nothing to do with religion. Niether does discrimination or any of those legal terms. peace over war
4294 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
forgot where
Offline
Posted 3/17/09

sevendarkdays wrote:

Pretty much all religion sucks ass. There's been too many wars (and still is) because of it, and i seriously can't see a single little benefit with it either. Why should we follow books that are thousands of years old in these times? It's not just the extremists that's the problem, there's tons of hindus that don't believe in healthcare because of their religion. The kids that are born with four arms or two heads are being greeted as gods, and receive no help for their condition whatsoever, causing them to die at a young age.

And to all people saying that we cant blame war on religion.
Not all wars can but all too many can.
Sure it's true that sometimes it's a pure scapegoat to hide the real reason behind the war.
But! What if they didn't have that scapegoat? What if they suddenly couldn't unite their people by saying:
"Deus le volt!" (God Wants it). Theres a chance of course that they could just brainwahs their people in some other way but...

Religion is intolerance, and to all that say different...

According to a Time/CNN poll from 2002, 59 percent of Americans believe the events in the
book of Revelation will take place.

Whats in that thing then? The rapture is in there, meaning that 59 percent of the americans think that all non-christians will be left behind to burn and live through torture on the earth while they themself are up in heaven laughing their asses off.

THATS BEING TOLERANT?!

And don't say extremist again cause first of all i said 59%.
Second of all Religion is a safe place for these extremist. Why? Cause we allow it to be so.
We can't just take these extremist down because they're most likley protected by your country's
freedom of religion, it's legal too do a lot of stuff as long as you do it in the name of religion.
Like revoking the right to freedom of speech: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jyllands-Posten_Muhammad_cartoons_controversy

We don't really need these things that was mostly made up to stop the people to rise up in arms against their own in the old ages. If you really wanna be religous however, make up your own religion. You could probaly make a better one between commercials. One that is actually adapted to our time, and doesn't require us to overlook some parts like... well heres a bunch any ways: http://www.evilbible.com/Evil%20Bible%20Quotes.htm.





Not all wars can but all too many can.
Sure it's true that sometimes it's a pure scapegoat to hide the real reason behind the war.
But! What if they didn't have that scapegoat? What if they suddenly couldn't unite their people by saying:
"Deus le volt!" (God Wants it). Theres a chance of course that they could just brainwahs their people in some other way but...

Religion is intolerance, and to all that say different...

According to a Time/CNN poll from 2002, 59 percent of Americans believe the events in the
book of Revelation will take place.

Whats in that thing then? The rapture is in there, meaning that 59 percent of the americans think that all non-christians will be left behind to burn and live through torture on the earth while they themself are up in heaven laughing their asses off.

THATS BEING TOLERANT?!
.


im srry, but that kind of logic is seriously flawed when dealing with the Christian religion.Christianity has hundreds of denominations each with very different beliefs. Even people within a denomination will think differently on certain issues.

59% of Americans may believe what the Bible has to say, but that doesnt mean thier christians.and doesnt prove that they r. And for those that call themselves Christians doesnt make them one either.

about 75% of americans call them selves Christians, about 50 go to church regularly. and none of them have the exact same views.
its one thing to call your self a Christian and its another thing to actually practice the religion or even practice the morals of the religion.

and so, saying that all 59% of the americans think exactly alike is pure bull. there is a better website that gives u a clearer picture of the statistics of Christianity in America.

and thinking everyone is going to hell is not intolerant in of its self. Tolerance means...my internet is messing up, but u can look it up.

now u can argue that the belief leads to intolerance, which it can, but u cant prove 59% of americans r intolerant with that type of flawed logic.

Not all Christians share the same belief, and some dont share any belief at all (ku klux klan).


Second of all Religion is a safe place for these extremist. Why? Cause we allow it to be so.
We can't just take these extremist down because they're most likley protected by your country's
freedom of religion, it's legal too do a lot of stuff as long as you do it in the name of religion.
Like revoking the right to freedom of speech


so now u want to argue the US constitution? you speak of tolerance, then u show intolerance by saying we need to be intolerant of thier views as well. The USA is a lot older then u r. and the supreme courts have argued all of the quesions you are asking. we have found that tolerance of all people (even the unpopular ones) tends to be the best solution. Not just protecting the people who think like u.This gives the majority and the minority some form of fairness that does stretch out to the race issues as well. And no, in the USA we dont have unlimited freedom of religion. We cant commit crime in the name of religion and get away with it.

We don't really need these things that was mostly made up to stop the people to rise up in arms against their own in the old ages. If you really wanna be religous however, make up your own religion. You could probaly make a better one between commercials. One that is actually adapted to our time, and doesn't require us to overlook some parts like... well heres a bunch any ways: http://www.evilbible.com/Evil%20Bible%20Quotes.htm

religion also has purposes dealing with giving people hope and helping them through hard times and teaching morals. People do make up their own religion. and a lot of those newer religions have adapted to our time.But im pretty sure those of us who follows these old religions arnt gonna follow some religion that was obviously made up out of thin air.

And, as i have stated b4, christians r not the same, they hold very different beliefs.Some dont believe in ignoring the old testiment at all. Jesus said he came here to fulfill the old testament, not to change it. Some believe God is not subjected to its "own" moral laws it created, especially against "its" children "it" created. If God gives, he can take away for whatever purpose he wants.If it gave life, it can also take it away.And morals r subjective any way. and some christians believe that what ever God says/does is right and just, and what is against god is evil.and back in the time these events were happening, they were perfectly legal.so criminal wouldnt be the right word to describe them.

too many people beleive all religions r 100% pure lies. but there is truth in everything. Even if only on a philosophical stand point.And if God is like a government, which creates laws, in a non-democratic systems with no constitution, then God will have the characteristics of that government.That means its not all fun, games, love, and peace. God is a jelous God, and a God of war. Peace and love is great and all that, but Jesus didnt come to bring world peace, he came to bring a sword.

because we all know peace cant come without busting some skulls up. and we all know it is impossible to love everything- and for humans- everybody.Its all about balance. Preaching constantly about love and peace is pointless if u arnt doing any thing to promote them. And as soon as u start the process of promoting, u will get in fights with those who r against peace. And u will enevidtably start to hate them. peace over war
1092 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
114 / F / Somewhere
Offline
Posted 3/17/09
Religion a cause for World ills?
What a bunch of ignorants!
3066 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
74 / M
Offline
Posted 3/17/09
For all of world's ills? I wouldn't take it to that extreme. A generous portion of world's ills? Yes.
4294 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
forgot where
Offline
Posted 3/18/09

makix wrote:

For all of world's ills? I wouldn't take it to that extreme. A generous portion of world's ills? Yes.


how do u define world ills? very few problems exists world wide.i understand the down side to religions and all of that. But on a world wide scale is tough to argue.i have yet to argue with any one on this entire website who can actually argue world wide issues religion causes. Because stem cell research, wars, and a few exetremist do not constitute as world ills.bad sides? maybe.

a more sensible arguement would be to argue that religion perhaps holds a country back.That becomes a much more intelligent stand point because you can actually make correlations between certain countries to attempt to prove it. But world wide issues tend to always be focused around world wars and economics. peace over war
4294 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
forgot where
Offline
Posted 3/18/09

xeereex wrote:

Religion a cause for World ills?
What a bunch of ignorants!


religion is just being used as a scape goat so everyone can aggree on who to blame. Hitler did the same tactic for Germany in WW2. He blamed all of the Germans problems on Jews.So now everyone wants to blame all the worlds issues on Christians. "History never repeats itself, but it does tend to ryme"-Mark Twain

peace over war
3066 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
74 / M
Offline
Posted 3/18/09

JJT2 wrote:


makix wrote:

For all of world's ills? I wouldn't take it to that extreme. A generous portion of world's ills? Yes.


how do u define world ills? very few problems exists world wide.i understand the down side to religions and all of that. But on a world wide scale is tough to argue.i have yet to argue with any one on this entire website who can actually argue world wide issues religion causes. Because stem cell research, wars, and a few exetremist do not constitute as world ills.bad sides? maybe.

a more sensible arguement would be to argue that religion perhaps holds a country back.That becomes a much more intelligent stand point because you can actually make correlations between certain countries to attempt to prove it. But world wide issues tend to always be focused around world wars and economics. peace over war


Are you in denial that bad that I would have to explain to you how religion attributes to some of our world's ills?
2633 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
24 / M / New York City, NY
Offline
Posted 3/18/09
Religion adds to the world's ills.

So does the economy.

And social divisions.

And racism.

And history.

And governments.

And technology.

So it's one out of a hundred different things.
3066 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
74 / M
Offline
Posted 3/18/09 , edited 3/18/09

leviathan343 wrote:

Religion adds to the world's ills.

So does the economy.

And social divisions.

And racism.

And history.

And governments.

And technology.

So it's one out of a hundred different things.



Religion is an ideology that penetrates multiple fields of influence, such as Government, technology, racism, etc.
History is the study of the past that involves studying facts and events through several social institutions which involve activist groups, government, etc.

Your point is inaccurate. But I'll give you a B+ for effort.
2633 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
24 / M / New York City, NY
Offline
Posted 3/18/09

makix wrote:


leviathan343 wrote:

Religion adds to the world's ills.

So does the economy.

And social divisions.

And racism.

And history.

And governments.

And technology.

So it's one out of a hundred different things.



Religion is an ideology that penetrates multiple fields of influence, such as Government, technology, racism, etc.
History is the study of the past that involves studying facts and events through several social institutions which involve activist groups, government, etc.

Your point is inaccurate. But I'll give you a B+ for effort.


And I can claim (with accuracy) that religion influences and is influenced by standards of race, class divisions, economic models, and various other systems. History is not necessary the study of the past; that is a relatively new idea originating from Western thought.

Did you miss my original point, as crudely as it was put?
3066 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
74 / M
Offline
Posted 3/18/09

leviathan343 wrote:


makix wrote:


leviathan343 wrote:

Religion adds to the world's ills.

So does the economy.

And social divisions.

And racism.

And history.

And governments.

And technology.

So it's one out of a hundred different things.



Religion is an ideology that penetrates multiple fields of influence, such as Government, technology, racism, etc.
History is the study of the past that involves studying facts and events through several social institutions which involve activist groups, government, etc.

Your point is inaccurate. But I'll give you a B+ for effort.


And I can claim (with accuracy) that religion influences and is influenced by standards of race, class divisions, economic models, and various other systems. History is not necessary the study of the past; that is a relatively new idea originating from Western thought.

Did you miss my original point, as crudely as it was put?


/facepalm
4294 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
forgot where
Offline
Posted 3/18/09

makix wrote:


JJT2 wrote:


makix wrote:

For all of world's ills? I wouldn't take it to that extreme. A generous portion of world's ills? Yes.


how do u define world ills? very few problems exists world wide.i understand the down side to religions and all of that. But on a world wide scale is tough to argue.i have yet to argue with any one on this entire website who can actually argue world wide issues religion causes. Because stem cell research, wars, and a few exetremist do not constitute as world ills.bad sides? maybe.

a more sensible arguement would be to argue that religion perhaps holds a country back.That becomes a much more intelligent stand point because you can actually make correlations between certain countries to attempt to prove it. But world wide issues tend to always be focused around world wars and economics. peace over war


Are you in denial that bad that I would have to explain to you how religion attributes to some of our world's ills?


maybe im just ignorant, but plz do enlighten me...peace over war
2633 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
24 / M / New York City, NY
Offline
Posted 3/18/09

makix wrote:


leviathan343 wrote:


makix wrote:


leviathan343 wrote:

Religion adds to the world's ills.

So does the economy.

And social divisions.

And racism.

And history.

And governments.

And technology.

So it's one out of a hundred different things.



Religion is an ideology that penetrates multiple fields of influence, such as Government, technology, racism, etc.
History is the study of the past that involves studying facts and events through several social institutions which involve activist groups, government, etc.

Your point is inaccurate. But I'll give you a B+ for effort.


And I can claim (with accuracy) that religion influences and is influenced by standards of race, class divisions, economic models, and various other systems. History is not necessary the study of the past; that is a relatively new idea originating from Western thought.

Did you miss my original point, as crudely as it was put?


/facepalm


Boy, I'm too dumb to see why I deserved that.
3066 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
74 / M
Offline
Posted 3/18/09 , edited 3/18/09

JJT2 wrote:


makix wrote:


JJT2 wrote:


makix wrote:

For all of world's ills? I wouldn't take it to that extreme. A generous portion of world's ills? Yes.


how do u define world ills? very few problems exists world wide.i understand the down side to religions and all of that. But on a world wide scale is tough to argue.i have yet to argue with any one on this entire website who can actually argue world wide issues religion causes. Because stem cell research, wars, and a few exetremist do not constitute as world ills.bad sides? maybe.

a more sensible arguement would be to argue that religion perhaps holds a country back.That becomes a much more intelligent stand point because you can actually make correlations between certain countries to attempt to prove it. But world wide issues tend to always be focused around world wars and economics. peace over war


Are you in denial that bad that I would have to explain to you how religion attributes to some of our world's ills?


maybe im just ignorant, but plz do enlighten me...peace over war


I'd rather not waste my time doing so, because here's what's going to happen:

1. I'm going to link and explain a bunch of things with links to specific analysis and statistics. And to be honest, unless I'm sure there's a clear desirable outcome, I'd rather not do such a thing considering I've written about 4 research papers within the last week and I'm tired of doing research.

2. Once I do step #1, you're going to dismiss everything as the following:
a) Just because a "few corrupt" people do such things, it shouldn't be labeled to the whole.
b) You'll dismiss it, related to a, as other reasons when these reasons do not add up.

3. You'll link either a bunch of bible phrases or religious phrases and then end it with your obnoxious "peace over war" statement.

Don't you see? You, and others who refuse to close their eyes against such truths, are entirely predictable. If you're really eager to hear what I have to say, go do the research on your own. It's not difficult at all considering this is a fairly open subject.
4294 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
forgot where
Offline
Posted 3/18/09 , edited 3/18/09

makix wrote:


JJT2 wrote:


makix wrote:


JJT2 wrote:


makix wrote:

For all of world's ills? I wouldn't take it to that extreme. A generous portion of world's ills? Yes.


how do u define world ills? very few problems exists world wide.i understand the down side to religions and all of that. But on a world wide scale is tough to argue.i have yet to argue with any one on this entire website who can actually argue world wide issues religion causes. Because stem cell research, wars, and a few exetremist do not constitute as world ills.bad sides? maybe.

a more sensible arguement would be to argue that religion perhaps holds a country back.That becomes a much more intelligent stand point because you can actually make correlations between certain countries to attempt to prove it. But world wide issues tend to always be focused around world wars and economics. peace over war


Are you in denial that bad that I would have to explain to you how religion attributes to some of our world's ills?


maybe im just ignorant, but plz do enlighten me...peace over war


I'd rather not waste my time doing so, because here's what's going to happen:

1. I'm going to link and explain a bunch of things with links to specific analysis and statistics. And to be honest, unless I'm sure there's a clear desirable outcome, I'd rather not do such a thing considering I've written about 4 research papers within the last week and I'm tired of doing research.

2. Once I do step #1, you're going to dismiss everything as the following:
a) Just because a "few corrupt" people do such things, it shouldn't be labeled to the whole.
b) You'll dismiss it, related to a, as other reasons when these reasons do not add up.

3. You'll link either a bunch of bible phrases or religious phrases and then end it with your obnoxious "peace over war" statement.

Don't you see? You, and others who refuse to close their eyes against such truths, are entirely predictable. If you're really eager to hear what I have to say, go do the research on your own. It's not difficult at all considering this is a fairly open subject.


wow, your pretty good thats exactly what i was going to say to

a) Just because a "few corrupt" people do such things, it shouldn't be labeled to the whole.
b) You'll dismiss it, related to a, as other reasons when these reasons do not add up.

and dont forget about
c) those events happened 1500 years ago, f) people were just as cruel with or without religion
d) they dont count as world wide problems
e)correlation does not immply causesation

and by the way, i have done my research. extensivly on european and american history, the bible, and philosophy and martial arts.
Edit: ok i think i may have gotten a bit confused...what is a world ill? is it a world wide issue or a bad side?

peace over war
First  Prev  1  2  3  4  5  6  7  8  9  10  11  Next  Last
You must be logged in to post.