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Spreading The Gospel
1557 cr points
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M / SoCal
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Posted 6/18/08

Regulus133 wrote:
There's a difference between arguing opinions and actually critiquing the arguments. In fact, I'm finding it difficult to identify the "opinions" in the post to which you're responding. This doesn't need to be a fight, but you two haven't even reached the point where it's all just about what each person believes.

Well, it gets hard to not argue about such a delicate topic. The things I said are what I believe in, but I'm just saying that I don't want to force what I believe onto others by continually defending my beliefs.
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Posted 6/18/08 , edited 6/18/08

Regulus133 wrote:


YouAreDumb wrote:

The elect will follow the commandments because they believe in the word of god. The bible is meant for the elect so they can learn about god. That is why it exists. It was not meant for the unelect and some even claim that no unelect person could understand it. The traditional view is that one must hear the gospel before becoming saved (though you would have been elect at birth). What saves you is faith in Christ-but you can only have that faith if god grants it to you. Obviously, you must know of Christ before you can be saved by faith in him. Your faith in the bible and Jesus is what shows you to be elect.


I think this just puts the problem off another step. If being elect itself requires no effort, then there is no reason for anyone to submit to the rules in the Bible. In other words: if one who is elect cannot undo his being so, he is bound and therefore can do as he pleases (even if that is, by virtue of his being elect, simply the "good"); similarly, one who is not elect can do as he pleases, as his fate, too, is sealed.


Correct. Calvinism denies free will. The elect woo conform to biblical standards-this is one of the signs of being elect. They think your fate is sealed and always was. This does not bother them in the slightest.
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27 / M / new zealand
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Posted 6/18/08
young children are innocent and will go to heaven. it is unfair to believe that a child will be judged before they have a chance to grow and learn. it is the same thing with mentally disabled, they are innocent too. they have done no wrong as they do not understand the difference between right and wrong. it is not possible for them to sin unless they have a understanding about what they are doing.
those who have not heard his word but are still good people do not go to hell. however they will be judged by their acts and if they have sinned then they will be judged on those sins
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Posted 6/18/08 , edited 6/18/08

sorenku wrote:


Regulus133 wrote:
There's a difference between arguing opinions and actually critiquing the arguments. In fact, I'm finding it difficult to identify the "opinions" in the post to which you're responding. This doesn't need to be a fight, but you two haven't even reached the point where it's all just about what each person believes.

Well, it gets hard to not argue about such a delicate topic. The things I said are what I believe in, but I'm just saying that I don't want to force what I believe onto others by continually defending my beliefs.


If you think we are going to hell if you had any compassion you would do whatever it takes to convince us.
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digs 
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Posted 6/18/08
We try to, but people have hard hearts. People are going to reject the message, we can't force anyone. What we can do is serve, teach, and live like Christians and be witnesses for Christ.
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M / SoCal
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Posted 6/19/08

digs wrote:

We try to, but people have hard hearts. People are going to reject the message, we can't force anyone. What we can do is serve, teach, and live like Christians and be witnesses for Christ.


Yup. I think constant preaching and persuading would serve as more of an annoyance than anything else.
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M / Los Angeles
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Posted 6/19/08
Not Genocide, Kill with one or two chances to convert. The Church did not just kill them outright.
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Posted 6/19/08

Sulla wrote:

Not Genocide, Kill with one or two chances to convert. The Church did not just kill them outright.


Killing someone because they do not convert to your religion is still evil. And what the Catholic Church did to the Cathars wasn't even that, they chased them up a mountain and massacred them, leaving no survivors. I can't believe I have to explain why massacreing women and children, and torturing people into false confessions and then burning them alive at the stake is bad.
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M / Los Angeles
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Posted 6/19/08

hyenas wrote:


Sulla wrote:

Not Genocide, Kill with one or two chances to convert. The Church did not just kill them outright.


Killing someone because they do not convert to your religion is still evil. And what the Catholic Church did to the Cathars wasn't even that, they chased them up a mountain and massacred them, leaving no survivors. I can't believe I have to explain why massacreing women and children, and torturing people into false confessions and then burning them alive at the stake is bad.


A lot more good was done by The Church than what evil was ascribed to it. I accept the Evil that My Church has done but a lot more Good was done than evil.
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Posted 6/19/08

Sulla wrote:


hyenas wrote:


Sulla wrote:

Not Genocide, Kill with one or two chances to convert. The Church did not just kill them outright.


Killing someone because they do not convert to your religion is still evil. And what the Catholic Church did to the Cathars wasn't even that, they chased them up a mountain and massacred them, leaving no survivors. I can't believe I have to explain why massacreing women and children, and torturing people into false confessions and then burning them alive at the stake is bad.


A lot more good was done by The Church than what evil was ascribed to it. I accept the Evil that My Church has done but a lot more Good was done than evil.


I think I'll just leave it at this. You have already proven yourself to be the worst kind of scum, you've praised the bloodiest atrocities of the Roman Catholic Church, while viciously condemning the pre-Christian religions for completely idiotic reasons, and it has been made perfectly clear that you are an idiot. No further proof is required.
5463 cr points
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M / Los Angeles
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Posted 6/19/08

hyenas wrote:


Sulla wrote:


hyenas wrote:


Sulla wrote:

Not Genocide, Kill with one or two chances to convert. The Church did not just kill them outright.


Killing someone because they do not convert to your religion is still evil. And what the Catholic Church did to the Cathars wasn't even that, they chased them up a mountain and massacred them, leaving no survivors. I can't believe I have to explain why massacreing women and children, and torturing people into false confessions and then burning them alive at the stake is bad.


A lot more good was done by The Church than what evil was ascribed to it. I accept the Evil that My Church has done but a lot more Good was done than evil.


I think I'll just leave it at this. You have already proven yourself to be the worst kind of scum, you've praised the bloodiest atrocities of the Roman Catholic Church, while viciously condemning the pre-Christian religions for completely idiotic reasons, and it has been made perfectly clear that you are an idiot. No further proof is required.


No need to name call asshole, Come again sometime.
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23 / F / CALIFORNIA!!!!
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Posted 6/19/08
i think by accepting Jesus isn't necessarily synonymous with believing him. I think it just means to accept his message: love one another. You don't have to believe that God exists and Jesu is his son or any of that, just love one another and you'll be okay.
And i don't think anyones born already hating the world, so unborn babies are safe too.
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digs 
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26 / M
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Posted 6/19/08
No, accepting Jesus is not only loving one another, but the main thing is repentance and forgiveness of sin. You do have to believe that Jesus was the son of God.
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