First  Prev  1  2  3  4  5  Next  Last
next gen NSX updates
70 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
42 / M / Philippines
Offline
Posted 9/4/08

e116143173 wrote:





i just found those concept models online don't know if they are accurate or not but all i know is i am sticking to the older generations since the newer ones are starting to look a bit ridiculous for my taste


Now that looks more like a proper successor to the NSX.
386 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
30 / M
Offline
Posted 9/4/08
The new NSX doesn't really look any good but if they're really going to push on with this design, then i hope they would make it perform better than its competitors. At least.
250 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
30 / M / In Ur Closet
Offline
Posted 9/6/08
hope the new NSX still maintain the MR layout or else its not the true successor....
838 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
34
Offline
Posted 9/6/08

radbasa wrote:


e116143173 wrote:





i just found those concept models online don't know if they are accurate or not but all i know is i am sticking to the older generations since the newer ones are starting to look a bit ridiculous for my taste


Now that looks more like a proper successor to the NSX.


Too bad it isn't. That concept is pretty old now, which after Honda unvieled the car a road-going prototype was never constructed.
34 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
25 / PLANT- Aprilius 7
Offline
Posted 9/7/08

But this is obviously a front-engine car. The NSX was mid-engined. Not that I think a front-engined car can't be a supercar, but if it's to be an NSX replacement, it has to be MR.


From what I have read, it is decided that the new NSX will be FR with a Honda V10 engine derived from its F1 source producing some 550hp(around). I kinda think the NSX lost the "coolness" with that V10. If you think about it, the old NSX and NSX-R produced 280 and 290hp each respectively, and yet they were able to match Ferrari F355's and the NSX-R could even match F360's in a drag race with good shifting. If any of you watch any Best Motoring Tsukuba/Suzuka Battles, the NSX-R is often pitch against M3 CSL's, Murcielagos and Gallardos and even the odd F50. The old NSX and R could hold its own on the track against cars with 2x its horsepower (Murcielago). Honda engineers were able to manufacture a light weight aluminum chassis supercar that you could drive everyday ("Since they stopped the manufacturing of NSX's in 2004, the 911 became the only supercar you could drive everyday"- Jeremy Clarkson) and be able to compete with supercars with twice its power, more than a decade worth of technology (Murcielago and Gallardo) and at least triple the cost with only <300hp. That is what i think the NSX spirit is. Like many other Japanese cars, its all about handling. The Evo 9, with "280" (actually 320) hp, was able to keep up, without loosing more that 2secs to a Murcielago (i know this is sounding bad for the bull, but that Murcielago is 1800kg afterall) on a track. The new R-35 GT-R was able to squeeze 480hp from a V6 (although twin-turbocharged) and be able to compete with the Corvette ZR1 which has a enormous 6.2L V8 supercharged producing 640 hp. Japanese cars have never used an engine bigger or equal to an V8, and yet be able to handle superbly and fly around corners. With Honda introducing a V10 in their NSX, does it mean that they are forced into submission? I certainly hope not. Japanese cars should never use anything bigger than an V8...those are for Americans and Europeans....and yet be able to seriously apply pressure on V8+ woth V6- or even rotary. A perfect example of what Japanese cars should be is the Mazda 787B. In 1991, it won the Le Mans 24 Hours Endurance race and was the only Japanese manufacturer to win to date. It used a quad rotor rotary engine (the 26B) with a displacement of 2.6L producing 700hp. Not only were the cars light, they were extremely reliable and proved so much of a threat to the huge V10 and V12s used then that Le Mans banned all use of rotary engines from 1993.

Rant rant rant.......anyway, the I want the NSX to maintain its MR layout and use a V6, (could be twin turbocharged though) light weight chassis, and be priced below the $100K USD mark and do 7:20 on the Ring.

P.S I didnt do any googling on this post so some specs or data may have minor errors, but there shouldnt be anything major. Please inform me if there so though, thnx
70 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
42 / M / Philippines
Offline
Posted 9/7/08 , edited 9/7/08

SeRyuu wrote:




Yes, I agree.

An NSX should always be MR, lightweight. They could put any engine inside it. Even the GT-R had a change of engine configuration. But a V10 would automatically negate the car being lightweight.

Well maybe as long as they don't call the new coupe an NSX, or the NSX's successor, it'll be OK.
34 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
25 / PLANT- Aprilius 7
Offline
Posted 9/7/08
0.0 Im a spoiler now? lol
838 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
34
Offline
Posted 9/8/08
I disagree with much of this post. I give you credit for a somewhat thorough post but not all of if is true as there are more things to the picture than the one you tried to create.

Honda can do whatever they want. Despite the praise of how good the NSX is, the truth is it never sold. Why stick with a formula for a halo car with all its potential that sold barely any units? Yes, Honda could have vamped up their marketing and advertising for the NSX but truth be told other manufacturers had moved on.

One has to take track performance with a grain of salt. What works for a car at one circuit may not work well for another. Tsukuba is one of those tracks that doesn't allow a proper sports car to open its legs. You look at Fuji where the 996 GT3 gapped the NSX-R by a considerable margin in the Best MOTORing Fuji Fast special. Then you watch the special with the 997 GT3, although much faster than its predecessor, lapped Tsukuba marginally slower than the NSX-R. All vehicles have their compromises in some area, which comes down to how the engineers and marketing departments want the car to be in its final form.

The GT-R and ZR-1 comparison needs to be taken with a grain of salt too. The GT-R is all down to electronics whereas the ZR-1 is very primitive in comparison. Electronics really go a long way in going faster these days. The FIA wants to slow down (and cheapen) F1 and by doing so electronic traction control is out of the window.

For example current MotoGP bikes are so much faster than bikes in 2006. The prototypes used in 2006 where the fastest of the 990cc era but the FIM moved the series into 800cc machines in 2007. Despite its smaller displacement, the top MotoGP riders where two seconds a lap faster at Qatar in 2008 than 2006 (with a smaller engine capacity? That's nuts), which is common at almost every track. Much of it is attributed to the smaller machines allow for quicker cornering speeds but that is due to more sophisticated traction control that the riders have. Before riders had to control the bike by throttle input but now riders just pin the throttle and the ECU sorts it all out.

Mazda 787B, you opened a whole can of worms right there. Yes, the 787B won the 24 Hours of Le Mans but they were never favorites to win (seems to happen a lot at Le Mans) and were also never contenders in the WSC. Anything can happen in 24 hours, which the top two cars pretty much had issues in the last two hours. Much of the WSC season races were 8 hour events, which the Jaguars and Peugeots dominated in the C1 class as did Mercedes in the C2 class. One race win (because the top cars dropped out) hardly qualifies a stellar racecar. Domination is when a car leads the whole event and wins or wins the majority of the races on the WSC calender with some amount of authority, which the 787B did not do whatsoever but the others did very well. Truthfully the Mazda was a slow car in comparison to its rivals. If you want to praise a turtle amongst hares, that's fine by me.

Back to the NSX. It is a good car but the game has moved on. I would have a little more trust in Honda. If the NSX is so devastatingly awesome, why not have a little faith in the engineers (I am sure some worked on the NSX-R) who are doing this car? Do you think Honda is willing to drop a turkey although they spent so many years designing a concept for international autoshows with the HSC and ASC cars and now with the testing of the current prototype? As for the making a big deal about what the next Honda car should be, try thinking a little bit; Honda hasn't officially called this car as the NSX. A lot of the members are calling this out as heresy and how the car should be a mid-engine vehicle. Shoot, it might be called something else and have nothing in common with the infamous NSX moniker.
34 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
25 / PLANT- Aprilius 7
Offline
Posted 9/8/08 , edited 9/8/08
When you say you dont agree to much of this post....did you mean mine?
and btw, please dont think of me as someone who understand cars, im just very passionate about them and would like to very much learn more about them.

Responding to rp997 in reverse....
Honda CEO Takeo Fukui did state in 2005 that the company was working on a new NSX replacement and the HSC concept was working in that direction (although it doesn't clearly state that the new car will be called an NSX).

In regards to the 787B, I am a bit of a rotary fan so I am biased....
I agree that the 787B won the Le Mans largely due to the top cars dropping out
Im not really sure what happened at other WSC series as i was uhh...very young then (Im born in 1991)

In response to the motorbike section.....there is none, i have no clue about them whatsoever

I have to agree with you about Tsukuba though, it doesnt quite allow a car to open up its legs, but it is still a track whatsoever and does provide a basis for analyzing cars. The Fuji course however, has a huge straight and the 996 GT3 does have 360hp and although i dont know how much it weighs, it is a GT3 so im guessing it wont weigh more than the NSX. Also, it is still a Porsche, they have made sports and super cars far far far longer and more than Honda, and I have absolutely no doubt that performance wise, the Porsche is still far superior than the NSX. I do think the NSX is however, a wonderful peace of engineering and a landmark in the Japanese automotive industry.

As for the NSX not selling, i think it is very easy to understand why. It was extraordinary expensive, and on paper it didnt look so fast. Even if you knew it was as fast as certain Ferraris, it is still a Honda- and it was too expensive for one.

btw....i agree with u 100% on the GT-R ZR-1 thing..i mean c'mon, building an engine in a dust-less place....a bit overkill perhaps...and nitrogen in tyres....
838 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
34
Offline
Posted 9/8/08
-Fair enough to the CEO stating how Honda is working on the NSX replacement. But that was three years ago and about to four coming up soon, which things can change. Change so much that the company might have reconsidered its original ideas and are working towards a new direction.

As much as I love Japanese sports cars, they hardly made a dent internationally. This is partly due because most of their models were stopped in most markets yet flourish in only Japan. The RX-7, NSX, and Supra were pulled in most if not all markets in the mid 90s. The Skyline GT-R and NSX (NSX-R included) were sold as grey imports through a handful of specialists around the world.

Small performance cars seem to be a specialty for the Japanese (although British makes are just as good) but internationally these types of cars are not exactly in demand. This is one of the reason why it has taken Japanese makes so long to produce a high performing sports car for the international market. It has been about 15 years since America seen something new from Japan that rocked the establishment until the GT-R came along. All I am saying is that as good as their cars are, they are small portion to the current vast sports car landscape. It's easier to make a sports car for a home market than it is to make it for foreign enconomies in conjunction.

This is true for US cars sold in Europe and Asia. As good as the Corvette is, it hasn't affected the European market GM wants it to be. Cadillac is still trying to get a grappel on Europe. How many Peugeots have you seen or talked about in Japanese automotive magazines?

-The 787B wasn't bad nor was good at other World Super Car events. Cool car nonetheless but it gets way too much credit than it really deserves.

-The original GT3 developed 360 horses but the MKII (2003 model year) made a healthy 381 (used in the Fuji Fast video). Porsche is one of my favorite manfacturers but I'll be the first to tell you they have gone very soft. Not looking forward to some of the facelifted 911 variants that are due in a couples years.
34 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
25 / PLANT- Aprilius 7
Offline
Posted 9/9/08
I have to agree with you on the fact that US cars have yet made too much of an impact on European market, nor has Japanese done so on American. I would say though however, that the Japs made more of an impact on the American market compared to US to Europe. If you count ALL Jap cars sold in the US, it is a significant proportion (consider the Camry and Corollas). I have never been to USA myself and Europe only twice. I live in NZ and spend alot of time in Taiwan, so Jap cars have always been my field of understanding, with European ones following up and I have barely any knowledge on US cars, so forgive me if I'm biased.

The 787B is a cool car, but yes, as you said, received more credits than it deserves. The old Porsches (im sorry i dont know the model, is it 917?) that have won Le Mans multiple times and various other LMP cars are alot more "superior" to the 787B. The only reason why i think the 787B received so much credit was because it is the first and only Japanese manufacturer and the only Rotary car to have won at Le Mans, uniqueness is what earned her the credits.

Japan, as you said, have always been focused on delivery powerful(for its engine size), nimble, small cars filled with electronics. However i do feel that they take a different approach to the British sports cars. Personally, I think that in terms of small sports cars, Japan dominates the market more that Britain.

What the Japanese did over the past few years, with the introduction of e.g the GT-R and NSX-R (2 of the greatest Japanese sports car in my view) was apply pressure on European car makers. For most of the century, European performance cars have dominated, whether its from the superb handling Lotus's, the everyday supercar 911, or the pure powerhouse Ferrari and Lamborghini's. This monopoly on the market allows car manufacturers to not work as hard in producing new supercars compared to how they did in the earlier parts of the century. With the introduction of cheap (compared to European), fast and reliable Japanese cars, the European manufacturers are finally feeling "competition" and it is this factor amongst many others that push supercar technology forward at a considerable pace. Just like all other technologies, conflict and competition is the biggest driving force for advancement, just like in WWI and WWII when human technology took several leaps.

I do feel that...say Ferrari and Porsche, are not trying that hard to make astounding cars anymore. They have such a good reputation and little (but increasing) competitors that whatever they make receives positive connotations, and are therefore being soft.

I do think that its time to put stereotypes aside, and take a good look at the cars other regions in the world are making. Personally, i still favour European cars when it comes down to performance and comfort ( and if i had no economic restraint, i will buy a RR Phantom Drophead over any car), so what I'm hoping the Japs will do is make Europe realise that their domination is over, and it's time to refine their thinking.


and yes....i am asian
Posted 9/13/08
Im happy a Japanese automaker is actually breaking out of the shell to compete. Why on earth would they choose to limit their "cute" little engines based on their past history of a success? Advancement and evolution is every companies ideal, so the bar has to be raised in order to be better than the other guy. Otherwise we would still be riding horses.

Also, theres really only so much you can do with a 6 cylinder motor and stay completly different than the current competition........ Nissan and Toyota has already worked the twin turbo 6 cylinders. Everyone and their dads Corvette can throw a big V8 around a track (BMW raised that bar with the new M3)......

so really to grab the old spotlight back.............the perfect choice for Honda is an N/A V10. Theres nothing else logical when choosing a weapon against cars like GTR, GT3, etc..

1220 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
28 / M / san diego, ca
Offline
Posted 1/22/09 , edited 1/23/09
have you guys heard of the mugen nsx rr i was looking at some mugen rr civic info then came cross the mugen nsx rr
1827 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
76 / waiha
Offline
Posted 1/23/09

kmk0228 wrote:

Im happy a Japanese automaker is actually breaking out of the shell to compete. Why on earth would they choose to limit their "cute" little engines based on their past history of a success? Advancement and evolution is every companies ideal, so the bar has to be raised in order to be better than the other guy. Otherwise we would still be riding horses.

Also, theres really only so much you can do with a 6 cylinder motor and stay completly different than the current competition........ Nissan and Toyota has already worked the twin turbo 6 cylinders. Everyone and their dads Corvette can throw a big V8 around a track (BMW raised that bar with the new M3)......

so really to grab the old spotlight back.............the perfect choice for Honda is an N/A V10. Theres nothing else logical when choosing a weapon against cars like GTR, GT3, etc..



Don't let the 6cyl. fanboys hear that!
1445 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
26 / M / SoCal
Offline
Posted 1/24/09 , edited 1/24/09

e116143173 wrote:

have you guys heard of the mugen nsx rr i was looking at some mugen rr civic info then came cross the mugen nsx rr


its just the old nsx but mugenized (and left hand drive available :D)
First  Prev  1  2  3  4  5  Next  Last
You must be logged in to post.