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huckdiane wrote:
Well I don't mind these so-called Mary Sues. I dislike much more female characters like Kallen, and Yoko, who are just as much as clichè even if totally different. Maybe it's because I can identify myself more with someone like Euphy than Kallen, well if I really had to choose JUST BETWEEN those 2.
Also if you talk about being naive and stupid, Kallen enters that category in full. At least Euphemia didn't really know much about how politics work because she lived a very pampered life, and she could had just carried on like that, but she tried to do something she thought was right and even if in the end didn't work for whatever reason, she had the best intentions.
Kallen on the other hand had a lot of experience, even before the black knights with her brother resistance group, but still couldn't figure many things out and appeared to be a few too many times annoyingly clueless and rather dumb. She's also hypocrate as she would have thrown down the toilet within the blink of an eye everything she always fought for, all she believed in, her loyalty to Japan and the promise she made to her dead brother just to run away with Lelouch if he'd accepted her feelings, and be killed with him like a brainless dog, without even being sure if he REALLY DID had the same feeling for her, not to mention knowing his real plan or intentions.
Going totally bonkers during the last episodes was all because she was absolutely pissed off that Lelouch turned her down, and was very evident that he preferred CC at her, so she became this crazed bunny-boiler stalker who was deeply disliked even by her own fans.
But you're right she's just there for cheap fanservice.
As for Nina I still don't mind her. AT ALL.
And what brought Light Yagami up???
true. but look on the other side, I am quite surprised my self euphemia was so hated. kallen is there for fanservice, and she can fight(hotness + fighting abilities = liked?) kallen pissed me off during the end of r2, but she still has alot of fans because she stayed awesome almost throughout the whole series. also the fact that if you look at it, there are SOOO many hateable characters in code geass, and yet my most loved characters are in there, plus the plot was amazing. in contrast, kallen was liked and she OWNED suzaku.
I question your taste on nina, WHAT is there to like about her?
her sick anti-japanese, it's gets sooo annoying, 11! 11! ...... I'm chinese
her ugliness?
her obessiveness over someone she barely knew?
that fact that she begged suzaku to kill milliones of people?
her yuri ness? which is a terrible factor associating with what she has.
overall, there is really not much to like about her, with ALOT to hate about her.
euphemia on the other hand, her death was pretty important to the series. also she just in case you didn't know, mary sues are VERY disliked. I can name 2 right off the bat, tohru honda and yuki cross.
it's your taste, be it. but you are not going to convince anyone to like euphemia or nina(hell more like 0.001% of people like her probably)
oh and light is to associate with lelouch, meaning that he is actually GOOD
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Tamaki bothered me a lot, since all he seemed to really do was just mooch off others and just goes with where 'it's happening'.
Euphy I actually liked her, even from what people have been saying. True, she was a bit too perfect, but at least she had good intentions, and tried to make Area 11 better, even just a little bit. Too bad she got killed off in the end, making Suzaku going all primal rage. I had to admit, I teared up a bit at her death.
I hate Nina. HATE her. She was clueless, fell in love with some girl she doesn't even know at all in the first place, extremely racist (And I dislike racism with a burning passion might I add), and joined Suzaku in the primal rage category after Euphy died. Except she was 10x worse than Suzaku in that whole category.
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Not really, I'm not trying to convince anyone to like Euphy or Nina.
To be honest I'm not a particular fan of Euphemia myself, I mean she's alright but personally I think the saddest thing about her death is that she left Suzaku heartbroken. I love him to bits and was very upsetting to see him go through all that ordeal, being completely misunderstood by everybody. Who cares if he went against Lelouch? Everyone would had done that. The guy not only killed the love of his life for his own mistake, unintentional as you want but still his own mistake, but also took advantage of the situation and badmouthed her saying that the she was the perfect example of how corrupt (or whatever he said) Britannia is, adding insult to injury. That was very disappointing of Lelouch, I never really looked at him the same way after that incident. He could have easily dealt with the whole situation very differently.
As for Nina I DO NOT like her. But I don't hate her either. She is very indifferent to me although is a bit too easy to pick her as your least favourite with all the great range of villains in Code Geass.
Kallen owned Suzaku because he let her. Both when she punched him while kept prisoner (if he responded even just at minimum level she would have been mutilated or something, considering how strong he is) and during the knightmare battle (it was part of the plan to make everybody think Suzaku died as well) and anyway she's a minger! Fuck her!
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huckdiane wrote:
Not really, I'm not trying to convince anyone to like Euphy or Nina.
To be honest I'm not a particular fan of Euphemia myself, I mean she's alright but personally I think the saddest thing about her death is that she left Suzaku heartbroken. I love him to bits and was very upsetting to see him go through all that ordeal, being completely misunderstood by everybody. Who cares if he went against Lelouch? Everyone would had done that. The guy not only killed the love of his life for his own mistake, unintentional as you want but still his own mistake, but also took advantage of the situation and badmouthed her saying that the she was the perfect example of how corrupt (or whatever he said) Britannia is, adding insult to injury. That was very disappointing of Lelouch, I never really looked at him the same way after that incident. He could have easily dealt with the whole situation very differently.
As for Nina I DO NOT like her. But I don't hate her either. She is very indifferent to me although is a bit too easy to pick her as your least favourite with all the great range of villains in Code Geass.
Kallen owned Suzaku because he let her. Both when she punched him while kept prisoner (if he responded even just at minimum level she would have been mutilated or something, considering how strong he is) and during the knightmare battle (it was part of the plan to make everybody think Suzaku died as well) and anyway she's a minger! Fuck her!
Well I don't love kallen either. But I kinda liked her. Also lelouch knew that if he dealt with the situation differently then he would lose even more than he already has. He knew at that point if he did not kill her the Japanese would lose faith or at least suspicious of him. And the fact that Charles obvious did not care for his kids(especially one as useless as her, he did even mind schneizel or lulu) so take her as a hostage would be unrealistic. And the fact that his geass command was at that time cannot be overridden, people are dying at the rate of seconds, if he did not stop her soon, then it will be even more terrible. This massacre is very public, covering it up would be virtually impossible. He had many of his route of actions cut off. This may be the only option at that time(I dunno why didn't cc do anything).
Kallen just pissed me off during the end, also you DO know why people hate Nina right?
And suzaku too, he only thought he was right, and he further angers me by his stubborn naive ways to try to change it within. It will not solve anything as the emperor cam move him down any moment or simply prevent him from getting higher than knight of 2. His method was ineffective as japan would still be BRITANNIA, it will never be true independence
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Euphemia isn't useless. You might not like her but you must admit she's an essential character to the story. Most of the events in the series wouldn't have happened without her, and her legacy will always live on with many important characters.
Yes I DO know why people hate Nina. Because it's cool to. I'm actually glad she didn't die in the end, pissing everyone off. Nice one Sunrise!
The reason why Suzaku is hated is because he didn't join Lelouch from the start. Everyone suddenly supported him and thought he wasn't so bad after all during the last episodes when he went on his side, forgetting why they disliked him to begin with. All his flaws became qualities. The reasons why people hated him are exactly the same they should have hated Kallen instead, and not just because in the end she was pissed off with Lelouch and tried to kill him.
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huckdiane wrote:
Euphemia isn't useless. You might not like her but you must admit she's an essential character to the story. Most of the events in the series wouldn't have happened without her, and her legacy will always live on with many important characters.
Yes I DO know why people hate Nina. Because it's cool to. I'm actually glad she didn't die in the end, pissing everyone off. Nice one Sunrise!
The reason why Suzaku is hated is because he didn't join Lelouch from the start. Everyone suddenly supported him and thought he wasn't so bad after all during the last episodes when he went on his side, forgetting why they disliked him to begin with. All his flaws became qualities. The reasons why people hated him are exactly the same they should have hated Kallen instead, and not just because in the end she was pissed off with Lelouch and tried to kill him.
you are wrong, I do kinda like euphemia. it's just that she is inable to do much on her own, and that she is a mary sue.
also I don't think sunrise saw nina as nicessary to die, unlike most of the deathes(think about it, marianne was the most important as it was the reason this series even exist. euphemia second for the plot to move on. and shriley third for lelouch to destroy thefacility and meet his father again)
and the reason suzaku is STILL hated because he was a douch for almost the whole series, and of course he was trying to correct lelouch. while kallen only pissed us off during the end. you never forget a first impression so that's why she STILL has more fanbase than suzaku, the third largest I believe.
also code geass focusing on the main character is an excellent thing, some series like naruto introduces shitload of characters that we don;t care about while not focusing on the important ones. and this is why lelouch is such a amazing main character, we fully understand him and his intentions.
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LelouchKyonConan wrote:
Also lelouch knew that if he dealt with the situation differently then he would lose even more than he already has. He knew at that point if he did not kill her the Japanese would lose faith or at least suspicious of him. And the fact that Charles obvious did not care for his kids(especially one as useless as her, he did even mind schneizel or lulu) so take her as a hostage would be unrealistic. And the fact that his geass command was at that time cannot be overridden, people are dying at the rate of seconds, if he did not stop her soon, then it will be even more terrible. This massacre is very public, covering it up would be virtually impossible. He had many of his route of actions cut off. This may be the only option at that time(I dunno why didn't cc do anything).
Your arguments have been refuted in my five topics with titles beginning with "kill Euphie...".
They show that there was no reason for Lelouch to kill Euphemia and many reasons not to.
You say that it would be impossible to use Euphemia as a hostage because Charles didn't love his children? I don't think that would be a problem.
I think that Charles was the kind of evil bastard who would have let the rebels kill Euphemia rather than stop a massacre which HE had ordered and wanted carried out (which was not the case here) but who also would have executed for disrespect to the imperial family all Brtannian soldiers and officers who did not stop a massacre to save the life of a Britannian prince or princess.
But why would Charles be involved with the situation? Lelouch would have contacted the Britannian officers on the spot, or Cornelia in Tokyo, to get them to surrender, or retreat, or at least stop the massacre. At the end of "Island of the Gods" when Kallen was shooting a machine gun at Euphemia the Britannian solders formed a human shield around her. If they would do that for her they would stop killing for her. And I think that Cornelia would have stopped a massacre she hadn't authorized anyway to save her beloved sister's life.
It doesn't matter if the geass command cannot be overwritten at that time. Most of the killing was being doing by the soldiers obeying Euphemia's order and shooting down Japanese. They were killing people tens and hundreds and maybe thousands of times as fast as Euphemia was killing them herself. And once Euphemia's knightmare was destroyed killing her was obviously unnecessary to stop her from personally killing any more people.
That is what I have been saying for two years, that is what I am angry and horrified by. It was totally obvious that there was no need to kill Euphemia to stop her.
And capturing her alive and using her as a hostage would be the best way to stop the soldiers who were killing people tens or hundreds or thousands of times as fast as Euphemia. it was tens, or hundreds, or thousands of times as important to stop all the Britannian soldiers soon than it was to stop Euphemia soon. And Euphemia could have been stopped just as easy, just a safely, and just as soon by capturing her as by killing her.
At that time killing Euphemia was not a good, or humane, or rational option. But Lelouch killed her anyway.
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infinitycubed wrote:
LelouchKyonConan wrote:
Also lelouch knew that if he dealt with the situation differently then he would lose even more than he already has. He knew at that point if he did not kill her the Japanese would lose faith or at least suspicious of him. And the fact that Charles obvious did not care for his kids(especially one as useless as her, he did even mind schneizel or lulu) so take her as a hostage would be unrealistic. And the fact that his geass command was at that time cannot be overridden, people are dying at the rate of seconds, if he did not stop her soon, then it will be even more terrible. This massacre is very public, covering it up would be virtually impossible. He had many of his route of actions cut off. This may be the only option at that time(I dunno why didn't cc do anything).
Your arguments have been refuted in my five topics with titles beginning with "kill Euphie...".
They show that there was no reason for Lelouch to kill Euphemia and many reasons not to.
You say that it would be impossible to use Euphemia as a hostage because Charles didn't love his children? I don't think that would be a problem.
I think that Charles was the kind of evil bastard who would have let the rebels kill Euphemia rather than stop a massacre which HE had ordered and wanted carried out (which was not the case here) but who also would have executed for disrespect to the imperial family all Brtannian soldiers and officers who did not stop a massacre to save the life of a Britannian prince or princess.
But why would Charles be involved with the situation? Lelouch would have contacted the Britannian officers on the spot, or Cornelia in Tokyo, to get them to surrender, or retreat, or at least stop the massacre. At the end of "Island of the Gods" when Kallen was shooting a machine gun at Euphemia the Britannian solders formed a human shield around her. If they would do that for her they would stop killing for her. And I think that Cornelia would have stopped a massacre she hadn't authorized anyway to save her beloved sister's life.
It doesn't matter if the geass command cannot be overwritten at that time. Most of the killing was being doing by the soldiers obeying Euphemia's order and shooting down Japanese. They were killing people tens and hundreds and maybe thousands of times as fast as Euphemia was killing them herself. And once Euphemia's knightmare was destroyed killing her was obviously unnecessary to stop her from personally killing any more people.
That is what I have been saying for two years, that is what I am angry and horrified by. It was totally obvious that there was no need to kill Euphemia to stop her.
And capturing her alive and using her as a hostage would be the best way to stop the soldiers who were killing people tens or hundreds or thousands of times as fast as Euphemia. it was tens, or hundreds, or thousands of times as important to stop all the Britannian soldiers soon than it was to stop Euphemia soon. And Euphemia could have been stopped just as easy, just a safely, and just as soon by capturing her as by killing her.
At that time killing Euphemia was not a good, or humane, or rational option. But Lelouch killed her anyway.
yeah euphie was good. but euphie under geass is a slave to it. nothing more really. the last time I checked cc didn't say anything(possible vv kept it secret from her or it would be an impossible suggestion). actually show me the url for the topic. I will try my best to read it and if I disagree, to make it seem false
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Who cares about this mary sue crap you keep bugging me about?! You said it yourself that without her there wouldn't had been R2, not to mention the influence she had on most of the MAIN CAST, making her very relevant.
Like it or not Suzaku will always be the most important character besides Lelouch, and I don't think you're aware of how many fans he has, and not just yaoi fangirls. But of course he's hated by people like you (who only take account of first impression without really getting to know the character) just because he didn't agree with Lelouch and had his own plans... Oh why didn't you say so! But then again Kallen is liked because she blindly followed a masked man who could have been anyone, without a shadow of a clue about his real intentions. As if someone's not supposed to have a mind of his own!
Even other Black Knights had doubts about him from time to time, and that was very understandable, but she really turned into a brainless groupie who took every Zero's word for gold. And all her fans are mainly Kalulu shippers, but we all know she endep up alone and back at school while still dreaming about Lelouch who, for all she knows, is dead, so that was a waste of time.
Lelouch always wanted desperately Suzaku on his side, while with Kallen she was already part of the package in the Black Knights. Suzaku is absolutely unreplaceable, while Kallen is very replaceable. In terms of relevance she's just a side character like Shirley. I can't imagine any massive changes in the story if Kallen wouldn't be there, well exept for a few interruptions during some Lelouch x CC moments.
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huckdiane wrote:
Who cares about this mary sue crap you keep bugging me about?! You said it yourself that without her there wouldn't had been R2, not to mention the influence she had on most of the MAIN CAST, making her very relevant.
Actually, being a mary sue is a very bad thing. it's a quality to dislike. but that's not why I dis like her though.
Like it or not Suzaku will always be the most important character besides Lelouch, and I don't think you're aware of how many fans he has, and not just yaoi fangirls. But of course he's hated by people like you (who only take account of first impression without really getting to know the character) just because he didn't agree with Lelouch and had his own plans... Oh why didn't you say so! But then again Kallen is liked because she blindly followed a masked man who could have been anyone, without a shadow of a clue about his real intentions. As if someone's not supposed to have a mind of his own!
Even other Black Knights had doubts about him from time to time, and that was very understandable, but she really turned into a brainless groupie who took every Zero's word for gold. And all her fans are mainly Kalulu shippers, but we all know she endep up alone and back at school while still dreaming about Lelouch who, for all she knows, is dead, so that was a waste of time.
I do not favor her over anything. but I am perfectly aware on suzaku's fan base. cod geass is a popular anime afterall. HOWEVER, I am also perfectly aware of lelouch's fanbase also. and suzaku's fanbase is no where near his level. also when did I mention yoai fangirls? I can see you really dislike kallen, I am not here to convince you to like her. but I am just saying, she was kickass in knightmares and had fanservice, but however she was far better in season 1. and also suzaku is not the 2nd most important character. the most important is obviously lelouch. well depends on what you mean important. I could argue that it's marieanne actually. without her lelouch couldn't have exist OR if she didn't die suzaku and lelouch would have never met.
but I dislike suzaku for his hypocritic acts. also due to the fact that he is a traitor to his own country and had killed his own father for the stupidest reason. the way he think is why euphie and him is a couple, they both wanted to change from the inside, but obviously it can never last forever. japanese would never gain freedom from euphie's idea as outside the are they are still elevens and the area is pretty small. besides the emperor can destroys anyways. also that even becomign knight of 1, he can only have 1 area. only way to change from the inside is to become the emperor which would be impossible. beside he could be removed anytime or simply not let to be knight or 1. and for that fact that he always thought lelouch was wrong even associated his father WITH him. dissing someone you killed like that in their grave? also lelouch is right most of the time even though I thought he was evil for a bit of time. then I realized, ZOMG he is GOOD! I am a big fan!
Lelouch always wanted desperately Suzaku on his side, while with Kallen she was already part of the package in the Black Knights. Suzaku is absolutely unreplaceable, while Kallen is very replaceable. In terms of relevance she's just a side character like Shirley. I can't imagine any massive changes in the story if Kallen wouldn't be there, well exept for a few interruptions during some Lelouch x CC moments.
I love lelouchxCC. and I bitterly regreted that she interrupted the last one. that dropped her to my 4th fav maybe. also the kind of women that always think the main character is right is very common. I frank is kind of pissed at them too. like ren from detective conan. URGH I dislike her so much only genericly good looking. and Ai is so much of a better heroine!
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Here are the URLS for my topics, which are right there on the first page of the Code Geass forum in Crunchyroll anyway:.
http://www.crunchyroll.com/code-geass#s=/code-geass/forum%3Fextra_param%3D670782%26page%3D0
http://www.crunchyroll.com/code-geass#s=/code-geass/forum%3Fextra_param%3D670785%26page%3D0
http://www.crunchyroll.com/code-geass#s=/code-geass/forum%3Fextra_param%3D670802%26page%3D0
http://www.crunchyroll.com/code-geass#s=/code-geass/forum%3Fextra_param%3D671081%26page%3D0
http://www.crunchyroll.com/code-geass#s=/code-geass/forum%3Fextra_param%3D670798%26page%3D0
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Euphemia:
whatever, she's still the reason R2 happened as we know it. Suzaku, Cornelia and Nina all acted to avenge her, even Lelouch did lots of evil stuff to make people forget about the massacre princess label and somehow clear her name, not to mention Nunnally. When she became vice-roy she picked up where Euphy left, going ahead with the special zone for japanese people who wanted to join in. She always was an inspiration to Nunnally, and when she became emperess she probably took Euphy as a main role model on how to act and what to do. So in the end another Mary Sue rules!
Suzaku and Lelouch:
somehow you got the idea that I dislike Lelouch, which I don't. But I prefer Suzaku. Might be because I tend not to cheer for main characters when I think they're doing wrong, or because I adore the cute baby-faced underdogs misunderstood by everyone, or because I prefer boys with curly brown hair than straight anb black, or for whatever other reason that is you won't change my mind. Who gives a toss about Suzaku's fan base not being as strong as Lelouch's. I'm not gonna side with the most popular character but for the one I like! And yes, he is second most important character alongside CC. BEAR WITH IT! Marianne is not that important, I mean just because she gave birth to Lelouch? Then the emperor as well and like three quarter of the cast who are siblings of Lelouch...
Also Suzaku's father was scum as far as I could see. If I remember right he accepted to marry Nunnally or something along that line, when Britannia first invaded Japan, who at the time was like 4 or 5 and already blind and crippled. My love for him grew even stronger after he killed that bastard! And becoming emperor never crossed his mind. Ok, maybe he was wrong about being able to change things from the inside, burt still big points for him for trying.
As for being hypocrate and and a traitor to his own country, well I already wrote what Kallen was ready to do just for a taste of Lelouch's **** !!!
Another example: on the picture of Ohgi and Villeta wedding the guests are clearly divided in two: the japanese on the left by Ohgi's side, and the britannians on the right by Villeta's side. Now, where's Kallen? Between Gino and Anya in the middle of the right side and very close to Cornelia, who up until not long before she hated the guts of. Did her Statfield part suddenly took over her Kozuki one? Is not as if she was ever friend with Villeta, not to mention that Ohgi was like family to her and on the left were other fellow black knights, so she really should have been on that side. What you think of that. It's just a photo but is really symbolic.
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huckdiane wrote:
Euphemia:
whatever, she's still the reason R2 happened as we know it. Suzaku, Cornelia and Nina all acted to avenge her, even Lelouch did lots of evil stuff to make people forget about the massacre princess label and somehow clear her name, not to mention Nunnally. When she became vice-roy she picked up where Euphy left, going ahead with the special zone for japanese people who wanted to join in. She always was an inspiration to Nunnally, and when she became emperess she probably took Euphy as a main role model on how to act and what to do. So in the end another Mary Sue rules!
Suzaku and Lelouch:
somehow you got the idea that I dislike Lelouch, which I don't. But I prefer Suzaku. Might be because I tend not to cheer for main characters when I think they're doing wrong, or because I adore the cute baby-faced underdogs misunderstood by everyone, or because I prefer boys with curly brown hair than straight anb black, or for whatever other reason that is you won't change my mind. Who gives a toss about Suzaku's fan base not being as strong as Lelouch's. I'm not gonna side with the most popular character but for the one I like! And yes, he is second most important character alongside CC. BEAR WITH IT! Marianne is not that important, I mean just because she gave birth to Lelouch? Then the emperor as well and like three quarter of the cast who are siblings of Lelouch...
Also Suzaku's father was scum as far as I could see. If I remember right he accepted to marry Nunnally or something along that line, when Britannia first invaded Japan, who at the time was like 4 or 5 and already blind and crippled. My love for him grew even stronger after he killed that bastard! And becoming emperor never crossed his mind. Ok, maybe he was wrong about being able to change things from the inside, burt still big points for him for trying.
As for being hypocrate and and a traitor to his own country, well I already wrote what Kallen was ready to do just for a taste of Lelouch's **** !!!
Another example: on the picture of Ohgi and Villeta wedding the guests are clearly divided in two: the japanese on the left by Ohgi's side, and the britannians on the right by Villeta's side. Now, where's Kallen? Between Gino and Anya in the middle of the right side and very close to Cornelia, who up until not long before she hated the guts of. Did her Statfield part suddenly took over her Kozuki one? Is not as if she was ever friend with Villeta, not to mention that Ohgi was like family to her and on the left were other fellow black knights, so she really should have been on that side. What you think of that. It's just a photo but is really symbolic.
hmm. I guess you have your point. however, if you conside how awesome euphemia is, then you should consider how marianne is awesome too. her being the series it self exists. IT IS THE REASON WHY LELOUCH WANTED TO REBEL IN THE FIRST PLACE! TO MAKE A PLACE WHERE NUNALLY CAN LIVE SAFELY AND AVENGE HIS MOTHER also I don't believe they EVER mention something what you say suzaku's dad said. He just killed him BECAUSE he was going to sent troops, and he didn't want conflict! that was probably the worst reason to kill someone in the series, worse then the reason to kill euphie.
also I frankly think charles was 100 times the worse father than suzaku's, you really misunderstood suzaku's dad.
you seem to misunderstand me also, I don't like kallen that much. infact I somewhat dislike her. but I still like her a little.
also there reallhy isn't alot to LIKE about euphemia. I kinda feel sorry for her though. but the 2 people who love her are some of the worst characters I have seen. suzaku was just...... a dick for most of the series, I basically only liked him in episode 1 and during the end. he is so self righteous. really, his whole motive for even joining with britainnia was wrong. he can't do much shit EVEN IF he become knight of 1. also that the reason why he became even important is because of lelouch. other wise he would just be discarded by the brits
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Again with this alleged importance of Marianne... of course if it wasn't for her Lelouch wouldn't exist, she's his mum! Then every parent of every main character of every anime or manga is important. What kind of reason is that??? SERIOUSLY!
And Suzaku dad, oh yeah poor guy... but let's diss Suzaku because he didn't want war and didn't agree with the hero of the story.
You know what, you stopped making sense a few posts ago. You always repeating the same things, and to be honest I'm still replying just to get CR points!
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huckdiane wrote:
Who cares about this mary sue crap you keep bugging me about?! You said it yourself that without her there wouldn't had been R2, not to mention the influence she had on most of the MAIN CAST, making her very relevant.
Like it or not Suzaku will always be the most important character besides Lelouch, and I don't think you're aware of how many fans he has, and not just yaoi fangirls. But of course he's hated by people like you (who only take account of first impression without really getting to know the character) just because he didn't agree with Lelouch and had his own plans... Oh why didn't you say so! But then again Kallen is liked because she blindly followed a masked man who could have been anyone, without a shadow of a clue about his real intentions. As if someone's not supposed to have a mind of his own!
Even other Black Knights had doubts about him from time to time, and that was very understandable, but she really turned into a brainless groupie who took every Zero's word for gold. And all her fans are mainly Kalulu shippers, but we all know she endep up alone and back at school while still dreaming about Lelouch who, for all she knows, is dead, so that was a waste of time.
Lelouch always wanted desperately Suzaku on his side, while with Kallen she was already part of the package in the Black Knights. Suzaku is absolutely unreplaceable, while Kallen is very replaceable. In terms of relevance she's just a side character like Shirley. I can't imagine any massive changes in the story if Kallen wouldn't be there, well exept for a few interruptions during some Lelouch x CC moments.
Code Geass: Lelouch of the Rebelion Episode 2
Rewatch it and see if Kallen is replaceable or not
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