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Post Reply What IS Martial Arts?
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Posted 8/27/08

silverfizz wrote:

"The field of martial arts is particularly rife with flamboyant swordsmanship, with commercial popularization and profiteering on the part of both those who teach the science and those who study it. The result of this must be, as someone said, that 'amateuristic martial arts are a source of serious wounds."
Miyamoto Musashi (1584?-1645)

"A man who has thoroughly mastered the art does not use the sword, and the opponent kills himself; when a man uses the sword, he makes it serve to give life to others. When killing is the order, it kills; when giving life is the order, it gives life. While killing there is no thought of killing, while giving life there is no thought of giving life; for in the killing or in the giving life, no Self is asserted. The man does not see 'this' or 'that'; he makes no discrimination and yet knows well what is what. He walks on water as if it were earth; he walks on the earth as if it were water. One who has attained this freedom cannot be interfered with by anybody on earth. He stands absolutely by himself."
Takuan

These are some of the things my Grandfather made me learn when I was little, it was apart of my training I thought some might like.



you bet somebody would like that. the quote from Takuan that you gave is beautiful and courageous (and by the way is the first time i have heard of Takuan. i'm not an expert on Japanese culture or something, my knowledge are just common so hearing this for the first time well u bet i'll damm love it)
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Posted 8/27/08

marjan007 wrote:


silverfizz wrote:

"The field of martial arts is particularly rife with flamboyant swordsmanship, with commercial popularization and profiteering on the part of both those who teach the science and those who study it. The result of this must be, as someone said, that 'amateuristic martial arts are a source of serious wounds."
Miyamoto Musashi (1584?-1645)

"A man who has thoroughly mastered the art does not use the sword, and the opponent kills himself; when a man uses the sword, he makes it serve to give life to others. When killing is the order, it kills; when giving life is the order, it gives life. While killing there is no thought of killing, while giving life there is no thought of giving life; for in the killing or in the giving life, no Self is asserted. The man does not see 'this' or 'that'; he makes no discrimination and yet knows well what is what. He walks on water as if it were earth; he walks on the earth as if it were water. One who has attained this freedom cannot be interfered with by anybody on earth. He stands absolutely by himself."
Takuan

These are some of the things my Grandfather made me learn when I was little, it was apart of my training I thought some might like.



you bet somebody would like that. the quote from Takuan that you gave is beautiful and courageous (and by the way is the first time i have heard of Takuan. i'm not an expert on Japanese culture or something, my knowledge are just common so hearing this for the first time well u bet i'll damm love it)


I should have put his name was Takuan Soho, He was a prominent figure in the Zen Buddhist faith as well a a friend to Miyamoto Musashi.
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Posted 8/27/08

silverfizz wrote:


marjan007 wrote:


silverfizz wrote:

"The field of martial arts is particularly rife with flamboyant swordsmanship, with commercial popularization and profiteering on the part of both those who teach the science and those who study it. The result of this must be, as someone said, that 'amateuristic martial arts are a source of serious wounds."
Miyamoto Musashi (1584?-1645)

"A man who has thoroughly mastered the art does not use the sword, and the opponent kills himself; when a man uses the sword, he makes it serve to give life to others. When killing is the order, it kills; when giving life is the order, it gives life. While killing there is no thought of killing, while giving life there is no thought of giving life; for in the killing or in the giving life, no Self is asserted. The man does not see 'this' or 'that'; he makes no discrimination and yet knows well what is what. He walks on water as if it were earth; he walks on the earth as if it were water. One who has attained this freedom cannot be interfered with by anybody on earth. He stands absolutely by himself."
Takuan

These are some of the things my Grandfather made me learn when I was little, it was apart of my training I thought some might like.



you bet somebody would like that. the quote from Takuan that you gave is beautiful and courageous (and by the way is the first time i have heard of Takuan. i'm not an expert on Japanese culture or something, my knowledge are just common so hearing this for the first time well u bet i'll damm love it)


I should have put his name was Takuan Soho, He was a prominent figure in the Zen Buddhist faith as well a a friend to Miyamoto Musashi.



thanks silver is good to know that
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Posted 8/28/08
umm...I've got a question about Sumo wrestling. I'm not sure if this is the right thread so l apologize in advance.

I was just wondering, Sumo wrestling, it's grappling martial arts right? So when did this start? Was it evolved from any other form of martial arts like some of the other ones like in swordsmanship. (I hope my question make sense :sweatingbullets:)

Hopefully i didn't miss any posts on this topic previously and not asking something redundant. >.<
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Posted 8/28/08

kokomousey wrote:

umm...I've got a question about Sumo wrestling. I'm not sure if this is the right thread so l apologize in advance.

I was just wondering, Sumo wrestling, it's grappling martial arts right? So when did this start? Was it evolved from any other form of martial arts like some of the other ones like in swordsmanship. (I hope my question make sense :sweatingbullets:)

Hopefully i didn't miss any posts on this topic previously and not asking something redundant. >.<


Yes it is a martial art, although it is considered a modern martial art. I don't know why it is classified as a modern martial art it has been around for a very very long time (from around the 8th century but it was called sumari). It is thought (put not proven) to be based on a Shinto ritual of a man wrestling a Kami. Sumo through time has changed very little from what I understand, most of the changes have been slight, at one time you could not push your opponent out of the ring you HAD to throw them.
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Posted 8/28/08

silverfizz wrote:


kokomousey wrote:

umm...I've got a question about Sumo wrestling. I'm not sure if this is the right thread so l apologize in advance.

I was just wondering, Sumo wrestling, it's grappling martial arts right? So when did this start? Was it evolved from any other form of martial arts like some of the other ones like in swordsmanship. (I hope my question make sense :sweatingbullets:)

Hopefully i didn't miss any posts on this topic previously and not asking something redundant. >.<


Yes it is a martial art, although it is considered a modern martial art. I don't know why it is classified as a modern martial art it has been around for a very very long time (from around the 8th century but it was called sumari). It is thought (put not proven) to be based on a Shinto ritual of a man wrestling a Kami. Sumo through time has changed very little from what I understand, most of the changes have been slight, at one time you could not push your opponent out of the ring you HAD to throw them.


Sumo is not a martial art.
A martial art is defined as an art [in this context meaning "Skill"] employed in combat [Of Martial meaning Warring or Military.]

Sumo is a sport, not a martial art.
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Posted 8/28/08 , edited 8/28/08

Ice_Blue_Eyes wrote:


silverfizz wrote:


kokomousey wrote:

umm...I've got a question about Sumo wrestling. I'm not sure if this is the right thread so l apologize in advance.

I was just wondering, Sumo wrestling, it's grappling martial arts right? So when did this start? Was it evolved from any other form of martial arts like some of the other ones like in swordsmanship. (I hope my question make sense :sweatingbullets:)

Hopefully i didn't miss any posts on this topic previously and not asking something redundant. >.<


Yes it is a martial art, although it is considered a modern martial art. I don't know why it is classified as a modern martial art it has been around for a very very long time (from around the 8th century but it was called sumari). It is thought (put not proven) to be based on a Shinto ritual of a man wrestling a Kami. Sumo through time has changed very little from what I understand, most of the changes have been slight, at one time you could not push your opponent out of the ring you HAD to throw them.


Sumo is not a martial art.
A martial art is defined as an art [in this context meaning "Skill"] employed in combat [Of Martial meaning Warring or Military.]

Sumo is a sport, not a martial art.


In it's earliest form it was an unarmed fight to the death. It was changed into a sport during the Edo period.
With that reasoning Kendo would not be a martial art either.
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Posted 8/28/08

silverfizz wrote:


Ice_Blue_Eyes wrote:


silverfizz wrote:


kokomousey wrote:

umm...I've got a question about Sumo wrestling. I'm not sure if this is the right thread so l apologize in advance.

I was just wondering, Sumo wrestling, it's grappling martial arts right? So when did this start? Was it evolved from any other form of martial arts like some of the other ones like in swordsmanship. (I hope my question make sense :sweatingbullets:)

Hopefully i didn't miss any posts on this topic previously and not asking something redundant. >.<


Yes it is a martial art, although it is considered a modern martial art. I don't know why it is classified as a modern martial art it has been around for a very very long time (from around the 8th century but it was called sumari). It is thought (put not proven) to be based on a Shinto ritual of a man wrestling a Kami. Sumo through time has changed very little from what I understand, most of the changes have been slight, at one time you could not push your opponent out of the ring you HAD to throw them.


Sumo is not a martial art.
A martial art is defined as an art [in this context meaning "Skill"] employed in combat [Of Martial meaning Warring or Military.]

Sumo is a sport, not a martial art.


In it's earliest form it was an unarmed fight to the death. It was changed into a sport during the Edo period.
With that reasoning Kendo would not be a martial art either.


I have never heard of such a thing.
Martial arts similar to sumo have existed long before [which are more like Pankration] but Sumo in itself was a sport which was created in the Edo period.
And by definition, Kendo is not a martial art either. It is a sport.

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Posted 8/28/08

Ice_Blue_Eyes wrote:



I have never heard of such a thing.
Martial arts similar to sumo have existed long before [which are more like Pankration] but Sumo in itself was a sport which was created in the Edo period.
And by definition, Kendo is not a martial art either. It is a sport.



Yeah, i was thinking about how it would fit into combat...So back in the day, it was considered as a form or sport and entertainment and not combat? Sorry if i made it sound crude.
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Posted 8/28/08

kokomousey wrote:


Ice_Blue_Eyes wrote:



I have never heard of such a thing.
Martial arts similar to sumo have existed long before [which are more like Pankration] but Sumo in itself was a sport which was created in the Edo period.
And by definition, Kendo is not a martial art either. It is a sport.



Yeah, i was thinking about how it would fit into combat...So back in the day, it was considered as a form or sport and entertainment and not combat? Sorry if i made it sound crude.


As Fizzy said; Sumo was derived from a martial art called Sumai [and other arts]. However Sumo as it is was an Edo-era sport.
It can be confusing.


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Posted 8/28/08

Ice_Blue_Eyes wrote:


kokomousey wrote:


Ice_Blue_Eyes wrote:



I have never heard of such a thing.
Martial arts similar to sumo have existed long before [which are more like Pankration] but Sumo in itself was a sport which was created in the Edo period.
And by definition, Kendo is not a martial art either. It is a sport.



Yeah, i was thinking about how it would fit into combat...So back in the day, it was considered as a form or sport and entertainment and not combat? Sorry if i made it sound crude.


As Fizzy said; Sumo was derived from a martial art called Sumai [and other arts]. However Sumo as it is was an Edo-era sport.
It can be confusing.




hmm, i see. I'll go look up more info on it.. Things aren't always straigh forward like maths...hahaha thanks guys!
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Posted 8/29/08

kokomousey wrote:


Ice_Blue_Eyes wrote:


kokomousey wrote:


Ice_Blue_Eyes wrote:



I have never heard of such a thing.
Martial arts similar to sumo have existed long before [which are more like Pankration] but Sumo in itself was a sport which was created in the Edo period.
And by definition, Kendo is not a martial art either. It is a sport.



Yeah, i was thinking about how it would fit into combat...So back in the day, it was considered as a form or sport and entertainment and not combat? Sorry if i made it sound crude.


As Fizzy said; Sumo was derived from a martial art called Sumai [and other arts]. However Sumo as it is was an Edo-era sport.
It can be confusing.




hmm, i see. I'll go look up more info on it.. Things aren't always straigh forward like maths...hahaha thanks guys!


sumo was always considered a sport (because regarding sumo some of the rules that apply for martial arts are not to be found here ), later in time, in moden Japan this sport it was defined as martial art or you can see it as an peculiar aspect of martial arts. sumo can be considered more as a "court battle" or "ritual battle" destined to a certain caste. just compare sumo to western K - One competitions and maybe you'll have the answear, hope i am not redundant!
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Posted 8/29/08

marjan007 wrote:



sumo was always considered a sport (because regarding sumo some of the rules that apply for martial arts are not to be found here ), later in time, in moden Japan this sport it was defined as martial art or you can see it as an peculiar aspect of martial arts. sumo can be considered more as a "court battle" or "ritual battle" destined to a certain caste. just compare sumo to western K - One competitions and maybe you'll have the answear, hope i am not redundant!


Hahaha, i like your analogy of sumo to western K-1 ... I know zilch on wrestling or sumo that's why i'm glad to take up on any ideas, definitions, history that has to do with it. I guess its time for me to start looking through some info! thanks for the advice!
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Posted 9/24/08 , edited 9/25/08
Martial Arts as said by bruce lee "martial arts broken down is simply expretion of ones self". this is martial arts to me. to express my self through ation.
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Posted 9/25/08

zad08 wrote:

Martial Arts as said by bruce lee "martial arts broken down is simply expretion of ones self". this is martial arts to me. to express my self through ation.


ooo, that really brings out the "arts" part of it. do you learn any martial arts yourself?
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