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Afterlife is pointless
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Posted 7/31/08

tweety_cool wrote:


Narc_7 wrote:

"Is that 'exactly' to me or tweety"-Zendude

Both.


what THE?????

@zendude : hmm... yeah, I get it (thought about it... long.... long.... long.... ago.....).


Wrong F*#king thread!!!!!!!!!
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How can heaven be pointless? Doesn't the idea of eternal bliss fill us with hope? The mere fact that we have something to look forward to makes this life, this painful downright horrible existence bearable. Without heaven we're downright screwed.
Reincarnation is utter rubbish, and hell isn't pointless. Death isn't punishment enough. People who cause suffering and people who consciously disobey God ought to be punished, they ought to pay for their 'crimes', death isn't enough.
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Very passionate speech. About this 'hell', I do not believe it exists. Lets hear the disagreements!
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Posted 7/31/08 , edited 8/1/08

Narc_7 wrote:

Very passionate speech. About this 'hell', I do not believe it exists. Lets hear the disagreements!
well, the argument will start if you explain why this "hell" doesn't exist. And what the hell is this "hell"?


How can heaven be pointless? Doesn't the idea of eternal bliss fill us with hope? The mere fact that we have something to look forward to makes this life, this painful downright horrible existence bearable. Without heaven we're downright screwed.
Reincarnation is utter rubbish, and hell isn't pointless. Death isn't punishment enough. People who cause suffering and people who consciously disobey God ought to be punished, they ought to pay for their 'crimes', death isn't enough.


I disagree with a lot of this :
1. Life is beautiful. The only reason why life seems not beautiful is..... because you are expecting a lot from life. You set too much of a standard for what you called a beautiful life. You can't cherish this life as it is. Respect what you have, and be happy with it
2. Reincarnation is rubbish? hohoho..... Have you understand the teaching of reincarnation? please give us your argument, and I hope you are able to present us the original teaching of reincarnation, and give a real good argument that oppose it.
3. You seem to hate sinners, and you are happy if they are punished for eternity. They might be, but its not yours to decide. However, one of the teachings in every religion is to love everybody, including the sinners. So cursing one to rot in hell is not the main point of religion.
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Alright, lets begin. The concept of hell he is apparently alluding to is 'mythical' place of eternal torture that many Christians claim to be in the bible.
I find it hard to believe that God, who is portrayed in the bible as the epitome of love can actually in being 'just' condemn is beloved creations not to death, but eternal torture.
Love and torture. They contradict.
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Posted 8/1/08

tweety_cool wrote:


Narc_7 wrote:

Very passionate speech. About this 'hell', I do not believe it exists. Lets hear the disagreements!
well, the argument will start if you explain why this "hell" doesn't exist. And what the hell is this "hell"?


How can heaven be pointless? Doesn't the idea of eternal bliss fill us with hope? The mere fact that we have something to look forward to makes this life, this painful downright horrible existence bearable. Without heaven we're downright screwed.
Reincarnation is utter rubbish, and hell isn't pointless. Death isn't punishment enough. People who cause suffering and people who consciously disobey God ought to be punished, they ought to pay for their 'crimes', death isn't enough.


I disagree with a lot of this :
1. Life is beautiful. The only reason why life seems not beautiful is..... because you are expecting a lot from life. You set too much of a standard for what you called a beautiful life. You can't cherish this life as it is. Respect what you have, and be happy with it
2. Reincarnation is rubbish? hohoho..... Have you understand the teaching of reincarnation? please give us your argument, and I hope you are able to present us the original teaching of reincarnation, and give a real good argument that oppose it.
3. You seem to hate sinners, and you are happy if they are punished for eternity. They might be, but its not yours to decide. However, one of the teachings in every religion is to love everybody, including the sinners. So cursing one to rot in hell is not the main point of religion.


'Life is beautiful?' that's a nice statement, nice but faulty, flawed and downright silly! Life can be beautiful, especially to those who shut their eyes to all the crap going on around us, so you keep thinking that life is 'what you make of it', you shut your eyes to the killings, back stabbings, stealing and other acts of evil going on.
About reincarnation, is it practical? Really, does it make any sort of logical sense? Seriously think about it, to quote the Skeptic's Dictionary "Reincarnation is the belief that when one dies, one's body decomposes, but something of oneself is reborn in another body. It is the belief that one has lived before and will live again in another body after death." The definition goes on further to talk about the fact that reincarnation includes the concept that the form one comes back in doesn't have to be human. Now personally this would make living even worse. The very idea that if I live a good life and die, that I can come back to face the same problems is terrifying, but if one adds to this the possibility that I don't have to be a human that makes it downright unbearable!
Finally I don't condemn sinners, I'm not happy that they are going to be punished for rejecting God, so I don't have the ability to say who's going to heaven or not, that's not up to me. I agree that cursing people (sinners) to hell is not the main point of a religion, but we simply can't ignore the fact that people who reject God will be punished.
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Narc_7 wrote:

Alright, lets begin. The concept of hell he is apparently alluding to is 'mythical' place of eternal torture that many Christians claim to be in the bible.
I find it hard to believe that God, who is portrayed in the bible as the epitome of love can actually in being 'just' condemn is beloved creations not to death, but eternal torture.
Love and torture. They contradict.


'Mythical place', I think not, Jesus said at the end of St. Matt 5:22 that sinners (he even specified what type) "shall be in danger of HELL fire". I hate to tell you this Narc but God is just. John 3:17 says that if we don't believe then we're condemned! Matt 5:29 says that sinners' (once again Jesus specified what type) bodies will be cast into HELL! So hell is real, Jesus said it Himself, do you therefore reject the authority of Jesus? Answer this first and then I'll talk to you about why the same loving God is capable of punishing those who refuse to obey Him.
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Posted 8/1/08 , edited 8/1/08

Jcorp wrote:


tweety_cool wrote:


Narc_7 wrote:

Very passionate speech. About this 'hell', I do not believe it exists. Lets hear the disagreements!
well, the argument will start if you explain why this "hell" doesn't exist. And what the hell is this "hell"?


How can heaven be pointless? Doesn't the idea of eternal bliss fill us with hope? The mere fact that we have something to look forward to makes this life, this painful downright horrible existence bearable. Without heaven we're downright screwed.
Reincarnation is utter rubbish, and hell isn't pointless. Death isn't punishment enough. People who cause suffering and people who consciously disobey God ought to be punished, they ought to pay for their 'crimes', death isn't enough.


I disagree with a lot of this :
1. Life is beautiful. The only reason why life seems not beautiful is..... because you are expecting a lot from life. You set too much of a standard for what you called a beautiful life. You can't cherish this life as it is. Respect what you have, and be happy with it
2. Reincarnation is rubbish? hohoho..... Have you understand the teaching of reincarnation? please give us your argument, and I hope you are able to present us the original teaching of reincarnation, and give a real good argument that oppose it.
3. You seem to hate sinners, and you are happy if they are punished for eternity. They might be, but its not yours to decide. However, one of the teachings in every religion is to love everybody, including the sinners. So cursing one to rot in hell is not the main point of religion.


'Life is beautiful?' that's a nice statement, nice but faulty, flawed and downright silly! Life can be beautiful, especially to those who shut their eyes to all the crap going on around us, so you keep thinking that life is 'what you make of it', you shut your eyes to the killings, back stabbings, stealing and other acts of evil going on.
About reincarnation, is it practical? Really, does it make any sort of logical sense? Seriously think about it, to quote the Skeptic's Dictionary "Reincarnation is the belief that when one dies, one's body decomposes, but something of oneself is reborn in another body. It is the belief that one has lived before and will live again in another body after death." The definition goes on further to talk about the fact that reincarnation includes the concept that the form one comes back in doesn't have to be human. Now personally this would make living even worse. The very idea that if I live a good life and die, that I can come back to face the same problems is terrifying, but if one adds to this the possibility that I don't have to be a human that makes it downright unbearable!
Finally I don't condemn sinners, I'm not happy that they are going to be punished for rejecting God, so I don't have the ability to say who's going to heaven or not, that's not up to me. I agree that cursing people (sinners) to hell is not the main point of a religion, but we simply can't ignore the fact that people who reject God will be punished.


hahaha.... ok
1. ok, you just dislike reincarnation. You can't make a good argument opposing it. (plus you hate life, sad)
2. I am shutting my eyes from those things? no. I am just accepting that those things are part of life, that they are inseparable. However, if you don't shut your eyes from the fact that the "evil" things might actually "necessary" for life, you'll see how beautiful it is. One's evil might be blessing to the other, one's death might be life to the other, one might do evil to save the others. That's just life. Btw I am saying beautiful, not good or bad. I'll leave good or bad to God.
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Posted 8/1/08

tweety_cool wrote:


Jcorp wrote:


tweety_cool wrote:


Narc_7 wrote:

Very passionate speech. About this 'hell', I do not believe it exists. Lets hear the disagreements!
well, the argument will start if you explain why this "hell" doesn't exist. And what the hell is this "hell"?


How can heaven be pointless? Doesn't the idea of eternal bliss fill us with hope? The mere fact that we have something to look forward to makes this life, this painful downright horrible existence bearable. Without heaven we're downright screwed.
Reincarnation is utter rubbish, and hell isn't pointless. Death isn't punishment enough. People who cause suffering and people who consciously disobey God ought to be punished, they ought to pay for their 'crimes', death isn't enough.


I disagree with a lot of this :
1. Life is beautiful. The only reason why life seems not beautiful is..... because you are expecting a lot from life. You set too much of a standard for what you called a beautiful life. You can't cherish this life as it is. Respect what you have, and be happy with it
2. Reincarnation is rubbish? hohoho..... Have you understand the teaching of reincarnation? please give us your argument, and I hope you are able to present us the original teaching of reincarnation, and give a real good argument that oppose it.
3. You seem to hate sinners, and you are happy if they are punished for eternity. They might be, but its not yours to decide. However, one of the teachings in every religion is to love everybody, including the sinners. So cursing one to rot in hell is not the main point of religion.


'Life is beautiful?' that's a nice statement, nice but faulty, flawed and downright silly! Life can be beautiful, especially to those who shut their eyes to all the crap going on around us, so you keep thinking that life is 'what you make of it', you shut your eyes to the killings, back stabbings, stealing and other acts of evil going on.
About reincarnation, is it practical? Really, does it make any sort of logical sense? Seriously think about it, to quote the Skeptic's Dictionary "Reincarnation is the belief that when one dies, one's body decomposes, but something of oneself is reborn in another body. It is the belief that one has lived before and will live again in another body after death." The definition goes on further to talk about the fact that reincarnation includes the concept that the form one comes back in doesn't have to be human. Now personally this would make living even worse. The very idea that if I live a good life and die, that I can come back to face the same problems is terrifying, but if one adds to this the possibility that I don't have to be a human that makes it downright unbearable!
Finally I don't condemn sinners, I'm not happy that they are going to be punished for rejecting God, so I don't have the ability to say who's going to heaven or not, that's not up to me. I agree that cursing people (sinners) to hell is not the main point of a religion, but we simply can't ignore the fact that people who reject God will be punished.


hahaha.... ok
1. ok, you just dislike reincarnation. You can't make a good argument opposing it. (plus you hate life, sad)
2. I am shutting my eyes from those things? no. I am just accepting that those things are part of life, that they are inseparable. However, if you don't shut your eyes from the fact that the "evil" things might actually "necessary" for life, you'll see how beautiful it is. One's evil might be blessing to the other, one's death might be life to the other, one might do evil to save the others. That's just life. Btw I am saying beautiful, not good or bad. I'll leave good or bad to God.


I'll concede to the reincarnation argument, I really don't see the point in arguing about something that makes no logical sense at all.
Secondly I don't hate life, I see life for what it is, you, on the other hand, are woefully optimistic, it's endearing but distressing. And if you just accept the fact that death and disease and disasters are just 'a part of life' how can you arrive at the general conclusion that life is beautiful? And I just have to say that evil is never necessary. Cruel or hurt people say this in order to justify their actions and to quell their pain. If I do an evil deed, no matter the reason it doesn't change the fact that the deed is evil and once it's evil then I have done a bad thing and it doesn't change the fact that I inflicted pain upon another life and once I do that, life for that person ceases to be 'beautiful'. Life is life, it's messed up, it can be enjoyable, but beautiful is one word that should never be used to describe this flawed and cruel existence we lead.

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Posted 8/1/08 , edited 8/1/08

Jcorp wrote:


tweety_cool wrote:


Jcorp wrote:


tweety_cool wrote:


Narc_7 wrote:

Very passionate speech. About this 'hell', I do not believe it exists. Lets hear the disagreements!
well, the argument will start if you explain why this "hell" doesn't exist. And what the hell is this "hell"?


How can heaven be pointless? Doesn't the idea of eternal bliss fill us with hope? The mere fact that we have something to look forward to makes this life, this painful downright horrible existence bearable. Without heaven we're downright screwed.
Reincarnation is utter rubbish, and hell isn't pointless. Death isn't punishment enough. People who cause suffering and people who consciously disobey God ought to be punished, they ought to pay for their 'crimes', death isn't enough.


I disagree with a lot of this :
1. Life is beautiful. The only reason why life seems not beautiful is..... because you are expecting a lot from life. You set too much of a standard for what you called a beautiful life. You can't cherish this life as it is. Respect what you have, and be happy with it
2. Reincarnation is rubbish? hohoho..... Have you understand the teaching of reincarnation? please give us your argument, and I hope you are able to present us the original teaching of reincarnation, and give a real good argument that oppose it.
3. You seem to hate sinners, and you are happy if they are punished for eternity. They might be, but its not yours to decide. However, one of the teachings in every religion is to love everybody, including the sinners. So cursing one to rot in hell is not the main point of religion.


'Life is beautiful?' that's a nice statement, nice but faulty, flawed and downright silly! Life can be beautiful, especially to those who shut their eyes to all the crap going on around us, so you keep thinking that life is 'what you make of it', you shut your eyes to the killings, back stabbings, stealing and other acts of evil going on.
About reincarnation, is it practical? Really, does it make any sort of logical sense? Seriously think about it, to quote the Skeptic's Dictionary "Reincarnation is the belief that when one dies, one's body decomposes, but something of oneself is reborn in another body. It is the belief that one has lived before and will live again in another body after death." The definition goes on further to talk about the fact that reincarnation includes the concept that the form one comes back in doesn't have to be human. Now personally this would make living even worse. The very idea that if I live a good life and die, that I can come back to face the same problems is terrifying, but if one adds to this the possibility that I don't have to be a human that makes it downright unbearable!
Finally I don't condemn sinners, I'm not happy that they are going to be punished for rejecting God, so I don't have the ability to say who's going to heaven or not, that's not up to me. I agree that cursing people (sinners) to hell is not the main point of a religion, but we simply can't ignore the fact that people who reject God will be punished.


hahaha.... ok
1. ok, you just dislike reincarnation. You can't make a good argument opposing it. (plus you hate life, sad)
2. I am shutting my eyes from those things? no. I am just accepting that those things are part of life, that they are inseparable. However, if you don't shut your eyes from the fact that the "evil" things might actually "necessary" for life, you'll see how beautiful it is. One's evil might be blessing to the other, one's death might be life to the other, one might do evil to save the others. That's just life. Btw I am saying beautiful, not good or bad. I'll leave good or bad to God.


I'll concede to the reincarnation argument, I really don't see the point in arguing about something that makes no logical sense at all.
Secondly I don't hate life, I see life for what it is, you, on the other hand, are woefully optimistic, it's endearing but distressing. And if you just accept the fact that death and disease and disasters are just 'a part of life' how can you arrive at the general conclusion that life is beautiful? And I just have to say that evil is never necessary. Cruel or hurt people say this in order to justify their actions and to quell their pain. If I do an evil deed, no matter the reason it doesn't change the fact that the deed is evil and once it's evil then I have done a bad thing and it doesn't change the fact that I inflicted pain upon another life and once I do that, life for that person ceases to be 'beautiful'. Life is life, it's messed up, it can be enjoyable, but beautiful is one word that should never be used to describe this flawed and cruel existence we lead.



are death, disease, and disasters bad? If you believe in heaven, then death should be a moment of happiness. even If you don't you will be able to accept death just as part of life, if you cherish your life, then death is nothing compared to what you already have experienced. Is disease bad? what makes it bad is that you are afraid to lose something, your ego. disease might bring life to bacteria that spreads it, see? another life, is it bad then? disasters? How can you say it is bad while it itself have no conscience? Did anyone cast disasters? your God maybe(if it is, is it bad?). If it is part of nature, the so be it. We are one with nature, if it takes what is belong to it, why do you complain about it? I am simply amazed by how it works, its beautiful. And do you think you never take life of others? LOL, are you eating sand and dust? that's convenient, teach me how. I agree that no matter what the reason, doing something bad is bad. Killing is bad for me, so I do bad things three times a day. Yet, no one can avoid doing it. Why? because the instinct to survive. It is natural. Cruel maybe, but that's the way it is. You have to be happy to be alive, as you are living with the sacrifice of other's life. You are lucky, you have to cherish on it,it is beautiful.
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Posted 8/1/08
I hope there is a afterlife!@
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Posted 8/1/08

Jcorp wrote:


Narc_7 wrote:

Alright, lets begin. The concept of hell he is apparently alluding to is 'mythical' place of eternal torture that many Christians claim to be in the bible.
I find it hard to believe that God, who is portrayed in the bible as the epitome of love can actually in being 'just' condemn is beloved creations not to death, but eternal torture.
Love and torture. They contradict.


'Mythical place', I think not, Jesus said at the end of St. Matt 5:22 that sinners (he even specified what type) "shall be in danger of HELL fire". I hate to tell you this Narc but God is just. John 3:17 says that if we don't believe then we're condemned! Matt 5:29 says that sinners' (once again Jesus specified what type) bodies will be cast into HELL! So hell is real, Jesus said it Himself, do you therefore reject the authority of Jesus? Answer this first and then I'll talk to you about why the same loving God is capable of punishing those who refuse to obey Him.


Hell is not a mythical place, I said the concept of hell you are ignorantly alluding as a place of eternal torture.
Do you know, from where the term the term 'hell' arrived? Its the English derivative from the Greek word 'Hades'
which original meaning death, the common resting place of men. Not a place of eternal of torture.

Furthermore , the bible clearly states that the wages of sin is death Rom. 6:23. Not eternal torture (which essentially Gods nature one who reasons logically could see fundamentally contradicts) but death

Come again.
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Posted 8/1/08

SlyHooper wrote:


Jcorp wrote:


Narc_7 wrote:

Alright, lets begin. The concept of hell he is apparently alluding to is 'mythical' place of eternal torture that many Christians claim to be in the bible.
I find it hard to believe that God, who is portrayed in the bible as the epitome of love can actually in being 'just' condemn is beloved creations not to death, but eternal torture.
Love and torture. They contradict.


'Mythical place', I think not, Jesus said at the end of St. Matt 5:22 that sinners (he even specified what type) "shall be in danger of HELL fire". I hate to tell you this Narc but God is just. John 3:17 says that if we don't believe then we're condemned! Matt 5:29 says that sinners' (once again Jesus specified what type) bodies will be cast into HELL! So hell is real, Jesus said it Himself, do you therefore reject the authority of Jesus? Answer this first and then I'll talk to you about why the same loving God is capable of punishing those who refuse to obey Him.


Hell is not a mythical place, I said the concept of hell you are ignorantly alluding as a place of eternal torture.
Do you know, from where the term the term 'hell' arrived? Its the English derivative from the Greek word 'Hades'
which original meaning death, the common resting place of men. Not a place of eternal of torture.

Furthermore , the bible clearly states that the wages of sin is death Rom. 6:23. Not eternal torture (which essentially Gods nature one who reasons logically could see fundamentally contradicts) but death




Come again.


Exactly. I couldn't have said it better myself.
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Posted 8/1/08

Narc_7 wrote:

Alright, lets begin. The concept of hell he is apparently alluding to is 'mythical' place of eternal torture that many Christians claim to be in the bible.
I find it hard to believe that God, who is portrayed in the bible as the epitome of love can actually in being 'just' condemn is beloved creations not to death, but eternal torture.
Love and torture. They contradict.


Hell is the epitome of unnecessary suffering, which also goes under the synonym of "evil".

Not to mention, Hell is never originally mentioned in the Bible at all. The Jews themselves did not believe in such a concept. Greek translations place 'Hades' in place of 'Sheol', but there is no such concept as heaven in Greek mythology either. Most of the early religions were notable in the absence of separate afterlifes for the good and evil.
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leviathan343 wrote:


Narc_7 wrote:

Alright, lets begin. The concept of hell he is apparently alluding to is 'mythical' place of eternal torture that many Christians claim to be in the bible.
I find it hard to believe that God, who is portrayed in the bible as the epitome of love can actually in being 'just' condemn is beloved creations not to death, but eternal torture.
Love and torture. They contradict.


Hell is the epitome of unnecessary suffering, which also goes under the synonym of "evil".

Not to mention, Hell is never originally mentioned in the Bible at all. The Jews themselves did not believe in such a concept. Greek translations place 'Hades' in place of 'Sheol', but there is no such concept as heaven in Greek mythology either. Most of the early religions were notable in the absence of separate afterlifes for the good and evil.


Interesting. Not completely accurate. Hell is mentioned on numerous occasions on the bible.
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Posted 8/2/08 , edited 8/2/08

Narc_7 wrote:


leviathan343 wrote:


Narc_7 wrote:

Alright, lets begin. The concept of hell he is apparently alluding to is 'mythical' place of eternal torture that many Christians claim to be in the bible.
I find it hard to believe that God, who is portrayed in the bible as the epitome of love can actually in being 'just' condemn is beloved creations not to death, but eternal torture.
Love and torture. They contradict.


Hell is the epitome of unnecessary suffering, which also goes under the synonym of "evil".

Not to mention, Hell is never originally mentioned in the Bible at all. The Jews themselves did not believe in such a concept. Greek translations place 'Hades' in place of 'Sheol', but there is no such concept as heaven in Greek mythology either. Most of the early religions were notable in the absence of separate afterlifes for the good and evil.


Interesting. Not completely accurate. Hell is mentioned on numerous occasions on the bible.


Old or New Testament? And Hel is also the goddess of death and the underworld in Norse mythology. Copious amounts of fire in that version.
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