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Wing Zero Custom vs. Strike Freedom
Posted 2/4/09

darkrider wrote:


caos950042 wrote:


darkrider wrote:

i gota say the strike freedom not only because of the freedoms advanced armor, combat system and weapons but also because of the pilot. the fredoms pilot is not only a coordinator but the greatest ever created, while the wing zero's pilot is a natural who practically committed suicide at the end of the endless waltz series and completley ahilated the wing zero except for its cockpit and 1/2 of one arm


Obviously extremely biased, I have a feeling you only watched Endless Waltz. Here's some comparison:

Armor: Strike Freedom's Phase Shift - Blocks any solid attack. As shown by Shinn, the Freedom's armor is paper against a beam. Wing Zero Custom's Gundarium Alloy is undamaged by practically all solid weaponry AND a good amount of beams, including its own Twin Buster Rifle.

Combat System: Strike Freedom's Multi-Lock On System is great against multiple enemies, but if there's only one person to lock on to, then it's useless. Wing Zero Custom's ZERO System actually feeds the pilot combat data and possible enemy maneuvers.

Weapons: SF has NO WEAPON THAT CAN MATCH AGAINST A TWIN BUSTER RIFLE SHOT, NOT EVEN WITH METEOR. To prove this, was there a single part during the whole series that all the beams and missiles they fired equal to something that can blow an entire colony? If they did, then why didn't they just use it against the GENESIS or even the Messiah?

Pilot: Ultimate Coordinator is just a title, and it's well proven that SEED is the maximum that his abilities can reach. Plus, Kira has no actual military training, he's as much of a pacifist as Releena, and has proven that he can't do much by himself (he's usually on the losing end of a 1vs1 except against the Providence). Heero, on the other hand, has full military training, has proven that he has superhuman reflexes and endurance, and is the only one who completely mastered the ZERO System.

I'm not being biased, I actually think that Kira's a good pilot. But in reality, he's relatively less skilled than most of the main characters in the gundam franchise, probably just better than Garrod Ran, who's better than Seabook and Loran (the latter having a cheapass gundam), and probably even Setsuna.

I'd admit though, if he stayed in the Strike Gundam for the entire Gundam Seed, as well as had a REAL officer teach him the ropes, and if he never found out that he was an Ultimate Coordinator, he'd probably be at the same level as Heero.


ud be better off keeping your comments about me to yourself, not to mention your reasoning has several flaws, and ur making asumptions to quickly. and fyi ive seen every gundam made in english and japanese, except for ms igloo, turn A, and 00.
turn A was horrible so i didnt watch after the 4th ep, ms giloo i have yet to find a good quality vid, and 00 im waiting for to come out in english.

where do u get the freedoms armor is like paper from? i guess the only reason u say that is because kira is good enough to block every shot so it never directly hits its armor. but if u remember the freedom from seed always used its shield to block beam shots without suffering any damage, and since teh sheids are normally made fromt the same material as the mobile suit it would have the same effect unless the shot hit inbetween the limbs where the armor was exposed then i supose there would do serious damage. as for the wing zero, in the endless waltz series, zero was not only being shot at by multiple targets but their MACHINE GUNS were damageing the zero! what kind of gundam gets damaged by machine guns? but ill give ya the fact that the serpents were also using cannons but they never hit, or at least u couldnt tell. dont get me wrong though i enjoyed the movie and series of gundam wing.

as for the combat situations u forget that almost every battle with both gundams involved huge armies opposing the gundams. both have also had one on one fights to. like zero VS nataku, and Freedom VS Destiny. both mobile suites faired very well in one on one combat but the freedom was the only one to ever fight that way and never take any damage. the zero's fight with nataku didnt go as well, zero not only lost the forward plating of it cockpit [green round gem] but was also forced into the earths atmostphere, where it later ran from its fight by allowing itself to plumit intot the ocean after having several sections of its armor blow out, and having several other sections or chunks torn off in combat.

now on to the gundams weapons, there's no doubt that the zero's fifle is powerful but the wing 09 was better!!!!!!!!!!! wing 09 buster rifle could destroy about 20% of a colony or colony sized battle ship [last ep of gundam wing] but in endless waltz the wing zero custom rarely ever used the buster rifle, and teh beam was only big enough to hit a manchion sized area, where it took 3 shots to get through the shelter, where wing 09 could have anhilated 1/2 the city in one shot. now heres the reason why the strike freedom is better. the strike freedom's power is vastly more powerful than anyone thinks, mainly because of kiras kind nature he chooses to decrease the freedoms power level to a point that it would still be effective but without overkill. he even seperates his shots in a way that only 1 beam hits a single mobile suit, and only enough to imobloise it. with all the shots concentrated together there would be more than enough power to blow away multiple colonies and ships[in correct alignment of coarse]. and dont forget the meteor unit, the only reason its not massively overdone is because of lacus clynes policy to rescue the people, and thats y kira only uses the meteor to shoot nukes. after anhilating the nukes both kira and athrun always send the meteors back to the ethernal and fight with their own power.

WHAT UR SAYING KIRA IS WEAK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
truely u have no idea.
ultimat coordinator is not just a title, it means that kira has physical, mental, and far greater reaction times than any other coordinator, and natural. hero only has the advanced physical skills from his training. ill give u superior intelect to naturals but not to a lot of the coordinators.
its true that kira has not miitary training, and that has proved to be very rough for him but he was able to awaken his skills as a warrior without the help of anyone during combat, he also takes on 3 gundams with = power to his own in the seed series when he is still poiliting the strike and manages to repel them all in every situation. in this manner he unintentionally awakens his coordinator/new typse sense, and gains even furthur hightened senses. while hero yuey got all his skills from military training, still makes several mistakes and often times finds himself on the loosing side of the battle,ex the first appearance of the mobile dolls, or vs Zex. oh and as for the zero system, every time he uses it, it brings him to the brink of insanity, so he could go berserk at any moment, and if u wernt paying attenion, he give the zero system to katra because he cant handle it.

i forgot to say this in one of the previous paragraphs. the only reason the freedom never shoots Genesis or Mesiah is because Genesis it equiped with a massively over done phase shift armor which also stood up to the kusanagi's lohengrin. if kira had shot at Genesis it would have been more like waisting shots, since close combat is far more effective, the only reason he didnt go in close combat with it was because Lau Crusei keept him occupied. To the Mesiah- kira also didnt go berserk on this mobile fortress because of 2 reasons. The Mesiah was generating huge beam reflective shields, which made it invunerable to most attacks, and the second reason is because in final plus kira wanted to go into Mesiah to confront Chairman Durandel, but not before doing massive damage to the mobile fortress first.


caos, you are dead wrong. the ultimate corrordinator is not a title, it means kira has more power than the average corrordinator. Kira fights with his own power.

ALL UR SAYING IS KIRA IS WEAK, CAOS!
heero's bersek is only the 0 system. it is only on the machine not by the pilot's mind. kira is strong mineded. kira owned 4 gundams! heero only beats one gundam per fight. 0's armor is useless against physical attacks while sf's armor is more stronger.
Posted 2/17/09

caos950042 wrote:


darkrider wrote:

i gota say the strike freedom not only because of the freedoms advanced armor, combat system and weapons but also because of the pilot. the fredoms pilot is not only a coordinator but the greatest ever created, while the wing zero's pilot is a natural who practically committed suicide at the end of the endless waltz series and completley ahilated the wing zero except for its cockpit and 1/2 of one arm


Obviously extremely biased, I have a feeling you only watched Endless Waltz. Here's some comparison:

Armor: Strike Freedom's Phase Shift - Blocks any solid attack. As shown by Shinn, the Freedom's armor is paper against a beam. Wing Zero Custom's Gundarium Alloy is undamaged by practically all solid weaponry AND a good amount of beams, including its own Twin Buster Rifle.

Combat System: Strike Freedom's Multi-Lock On System is great against multiple enemies, but if there's only one person to lock on to, then it's useless. Wing Zero Custom's ZERO System actually feeds the pilot combat data and possible enemy maneuvers.

Weapons: SF has NO WEAPON THAT CAN MATCH AGAINST A TWIN BUSTER RIFLE SHOT, NOT EVEN WITH METEOR. To prove this, was there a single part during the whole series that all the beams and missiles they fired equal to something that can blow an entire colony? If they did, then why didn't they just use it against the GENESIS or even the Messiah?

Pilot: Ultimate Coordinator is just a title, and it's well proven that SEED is the maximum that his abilities can reach. Plus, Kira has no actual military training, he's as much of a pacifist as Releena, and has proven that he can't do much by himself (he's usually on the losing end of a 1vs1 except against the Providence). Heero, on the other hand, has full military training, has proven that he has superhuman reflexes and endurance, and is the only one who completely mastered the ZERO System.

I'm not being biased, I actually think that Kira's a good pilot. But in reality, he's relatively less skilled than most of the main characters in the gundam franchise, probably just better than Garrod Ran, who's better than Seabook and Loran (the latter having a cheapass gundam), and probably even Setsuna.

I'd admit though, if he stayed in the Strike Gundam for the entire Gundam Seed, as well as had a REAL officer teach him the ropes, and if he never found out that he was an Ultimate Coordinator, he'd probably be at the same level as Heero.


U forgot something. a sattelite cannon can outmatch a Buster rifle. if u played gundam vs gundam, the buster rifle full shot. if it was twin buster rifle vs twin sattelite cannon, it will be still the same.
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Posted 2/17/09
Oh my...my posts disappeared.

Err...isn't this debate about the Strike Freedom and the Wing Zero Custom? If it is, how did the Satellite Cannon get involved? It's not even a CE weapon.

Again, in terms of armor, it's not about how much punishment a Gundam can take in total, it's about how much punishment it can take in ONE HIT. SF = paper against beams, WZC = survived its own TBR.

Also, read, I DIDN'T SAY THAT KIRA WAS WEAK, I only said that Heero is stronger than Kira in the sense that he has better brains. All you see in Kira's fights are the same scenes over and over again, with only slight differences. Heero's fight with Zechs in the Heavyarms proves that he can mix things up. He has better mental and emotional strength, and was able to master the Zero System, which can make a person lose their minds. Also remember that Heero has proper military training, which is always credited for.
Posted 2/17/09 , edited 2/17/09

caos950042 wrote:

Oh my...my posts disappeared.

Err...isn't this debate about the Strike Freedom and the Wing Zero Custom? If it is, how did the Satellite Cannon get involved? It's not even a CE weapon.

Again, in terms of armor, it's not about how much punishment a Gundam can take in total, it's about how much punishment it can take in ONE HIT. SF = paper against beams, WZC = survived its own TBR.

Also, read, I DIDN'T SAY THAT KIRA WAS WEAK, I only said that Heero is stronger than Kira in the sense that he has better brains. All you see in Kira's fights are the same scenes over and over again, with only slight differences. Heero's fight with Zechs in the Heavyarms proves that he can mix things up. He has better mental and emotional strength, and was able to master the Zero System, which can make a person lose their minds. Also remember that Heero has proper military training, which is always credited for.


sorry my bad.. but a logrein can beat a buster rifle or a genesis shot. and i was listening to darkrider. and heero took years to figure out on how to use a MS. Kira took only minutes or seconds in the strike. i doged wing zero's twin buster rifle shot in Freedom in Gundam vs Gundam PSP. And if u watched other series, gundamnium is vulnerable to all attacks. also in SD Gundam Advance, PS armor works but gundamnuim can still be hurt by beams.
Posted 2/17/09
and kira has skill on dodging beams in Seed Destiny. and heero has a advantage of range but kira has a advantage of meele. to ur info, heero never tries to fight hard.
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Posted 2/17/09
I wouldn't know if Heero's fighting hard or not since he's got a poker face almost constantly. That pretty much doesn't bode well for everyone else, assuming it's true and I think it is, since nobody knows what would happen if he did fight hard (and that's not considering the Zero System, either).

All the suits in mecha games are made to take damage (regardless of how tough they look in their shows) since the game would be too easy or impossible to beat (if the enemy suits were all insanely durable).

Anyone could be able to dodge a TBR shot in G vs G since it comes out relatively slow which screws it over when the target is far away. That means that the AI (or whoever was controlling the WZ) is a dumbass for not exercising proper timing.

When using DRAGOONs, you can fire them and miss since you could always just reposition and shoot again. The TBR has little to no room for error since it can't be used in the same manner but will seriously damage, if not kill, whoever it hits when fired at the proper time (usually when the enemy is unable to dodge in time).
Posted 2/17/09

marauder340 wrote:

I wouldn't know if Heero's fighting hard or not since he's got a poker face almost constantly. That pretty much doesn't bode well for everyone else, assuming it's true and I think it is, since nobody knows what would happen if he did fight hard (and that's not considering the Zero System, either).

All the suits in mecha games are made to take damage (regardless of how tough they look in their shows) since the game would be too easy or impossible to beat (if the enemy suits were all insanely durable).

Anyone could be able to dodge a TBR shot in G vs G since it comes out relatively slow which screws it over when the target is far away. That means that the AI (or whoever was controlling the WZ) is a dumbass for not exercising proper timing.

When using DRAGOONs, you can fire them and miss since you could always just reposition and shoot again. The TBR has little to no room for error since it can't be used in the same manner but will seriously damage, if not kill, whoever it hits when fired at the proper time (usually when the enemy is unable to dodge in time).


all u need to do to dodge funnels or DRAGOONS, is to look a the signals. pros use corrordination to dodge them. and if u fire the TBR at the ground, it will cause a big boom. In EW, we saw that when he was fighting wufei, he turned his thrusters off. and yet all Mecha in a game is vulnerable to all attacks. in gundam vs gundam, if u were fighting impulse with a zaku, the anti-beam attack will just bounce off and u will get pwned.
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Posted 2/18/09

Kirafan wrote:


caos950042 wrote:

Oh my...my posts disappeared.

Err...isn't this debate about the Strike Freedom and the Wing Zero Custom? If it is, how did the Satellite Cannon get involved? It's not even a CE weapon.

Again, in terms of armor, it's not about how much punishment a Gundam can take in total, it's about how much punishment it can take in ONE HIT. SF = paper against beams, WZC = survived its own TBR.

Also, read, I DIDN'T SAY THAT KIRA WAS WEAK, I only said that Heero is stronger than Kira in the sense that he has better brains. All you see in Kira's fights are the same scenes over and over again, with only slight differences. Heero's fight with Zechs in the Heavyarms proves that he can mix things up. He has better mental and emotional strength, and was able to master the Zero System, which can make a person lose their minds. Also remember that Heero has proper military training, which is always credited for.


sorry my bad.. but a logrein can beat a buster rifle or a genesis shot. and i was listening to darkrider. and heero took years to figure out on how to use a MS. Kira took only minutes or seconds in the strike. i doged wing zero's twin buster rifle shot in Freedom in Gundam vs Gundam PSP. And if u watched other series, gundamnium is vulnerable to all attacks. also in SD Gundam Advance, PS armor works but gundamnuim can still be hurt by beams.


Genesis, yes, Lohengrin Shot, no. There is no evidence to support the claim that a Lohengrin shot can punch through a colony.

I'll repeat again: The quality of armor is not about how much punishment it can take in total, it's about how much punishment it can take in ONE HIT. SF's armor is, again, paper against beams. WZC's armor can survive its own TBR. So what if it's vulnerable to all attacks when it can actually tank better quality attacks.

Also, saying that WZC's armor < SF's armor is like saying that SF's armor >>> Akatsuki's armor, which is proven as false, since the Akatsuki's armor actually tanked a Tannhauser shot. Ever seen the SF tank a Positron Cannon? No.

Lastly, I wouldn't want to delve into the issue between Heero and Kira. If they were placed in Leos, Kira would win in space but lose on earth. Reused scenes DO NOT mean effective against other people.
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Posted 2/18/09
The only reason mechs are vulnerable to all attacks in a game is because the gameplay is limited. Unlike a roleplaying game (this group) where you have total control over your actions, games like G vs G are much more limited. It would then be pointless for all of them to have the same kind of toughness they had in their respective shows.

Just so you know, I've beaten the Impulse using a ZAKU.

Btw, when I was talking about DRAGOONs and the TBR, I meant the ones in the shows, not G vs G.
Posted 2/18/09

caos950042 wrote:


Kirafan wrote:


caos950042 wrote:

Oh my...my posts disappeared.

Err...isn't this debate about the Strike Freedom and the Wing Zero Custom? If it is, how did the Satellite Cannon get involved? It's not even a CE weapon.

Again, in terms of armor, it's not about how much punishment a Gundam can take in total, it's about how much punishment it can take in ONE HIT. SF = paper against beams, WZC = survived its own TBR.

Also, read, I DIDN'T SAY THAT KIRA WAS WEAK, I only said that Heero is stronger than Kira in the sense that he has better brains. All you see in Kira's fights are the same scenes over and over again, with only slight differences. Heero's fight with Zechs in the Heavyarms proves that he can mix things up. He has better mental and emotional strength, and was able to master the Zero System, which can make a person lose their minds. Also remember that Heero has proper military training, which is always credited for.


sorry my bad.. but a logrein can beat a buster rifle or a genesis shot. and i was listening to darkrider. and heero took years to figure out on how to use a MS. Kira took only minutes or seconds in the strike. i doged wing zero's twin buster rifle shot in Freedom in Gundam vs Gundam PSP. And if u watched other series, gundamnium is vulnerable to all attacks. also in SD Gundam Advance, PS armor works but gundamnuim can still be hurt by beams.


Genesis, yes, Lohengrin Shot, no. There is no evidence to support the claim that a Lohengrin shot can punch through a colony.

I'll repeat again: The quality of armor is not about how much punishment it can take in total, it's about how much punishment it can take in ONE HIT. SF's armor is, again, paper against beams. WZC's armor can survive its own TBR. So what if it's vulnerable to all attacks when it can actually tank better quality attacks.

Also, saying that WZC's armor < SF's armor is like saying that SF's armor >>> Akatsuki's armor, which is proven as false, since the Akatsuki's armor actually tanked a Tannhauser shot. Ever seen the SF tank a Positron Cannon? No.

Lastly, I wouldn't want to delve into the issue between Heero and Kira. If they were placed in Leos, Kira would win in space but lose on earth. Reused scenes DO NOT mean effective against other people.


u make a good point. if they were in leos, it will be intresting indeed.
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