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Chinese gymnast underage?
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Posted 8/29/08

tinyd0t wrote:

i hope so ;p

u going to find a job?.?


if anyone accepts me lol.

i got this IT thing for 5 months, get some qualifications then off for "a career in ICT"

when does uni start?

Posted 8/29/08
What a misinformed thread. This isn't just about how they look. There have been articles and documents that say they are fourteen, and many other forms of proof. China has cheated before and isn't afraid to cheat. I'm not going to bitch about it because it's not that serious, but I believe they cheated.
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Posted 8/30/08 , edited 8/30/08

nene817 wrote:

What a misinformed thread. This isn't just about how they look. There have been articles and documents that say they are fourteen, and many other forms of proof. China has cheated before and isn't afraid to cheat. I'm not going to bitch about it because it's not that serious, but I believe they cheated.


you should read the whole thread before you comment about whether this post is misinformed or not, we had a lot of discussions on these 'proofs' as well, i hope you're not making judgment before any solid proofs has been proved

plus i don't see how misinformed my thread is when what i was trying to proof is that not just the Chinese team who look young, but Asian gymnast in general look young too
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Posted 8/30/08

Chance16 wrote:

if anyone accepts me lol.

i got this IT thing for 5 months, get some qualifications then off for "a career in ICT"

when does uni start?



thats quite cool actually, i still gota wait a whole month before uni starts =.=

but got summer project to do tho =.=

which is fun XD
Posted 8/30/08 , edited 8/30/08

tinyd0t wrote:


nene817 wrote:

What a misinformed thread. This isn't just about how they look. There have been articles and documents that say they are fourteen, and many other forms of proof. China has cheated before and isn't afraid to cheat. I'm not going to bitch about it because it's not that serious, but I believe they cheated.


you should read the whole thread before you comment about whether this post is misinformed or not, we had a lot of discussions on these 'proofs' as well, i hope you're not making judgment before any solid proofs has been proved

plus i don't see how misinformed my thread is when what i was trying to proof is that not just the Chinese team who look young, but Asian gymnast in general look young too


No, I shouldn't have to read the whole thread. The purpose of the OP is to put your complete view on the issue. And there is pretty solid proof. There have been websites that have said these girls are 14 and a Chinese document saying that one of the girls is 14. When I find the URL to the website with pictures of those sites again, I'll be sure to post it. And like I said before, "the Americans" aren't just basing this on looks. Which you are implying by your title and OP. Posting pictures "proving that Asian gymnasts in general look young" does nothing because that's not what the speculation is about. And sorry, but being Asian doesn't mean that you're going to look years younger.


Ahhh here we go

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/david-flumenbaum/scandal-of-the-ages-docum_b_118842.html

And here's a different one
http://gatewaypundit.blogspot.com/2008/08/busted-china-caught-cheating-female.html

Pretty convincing to me
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Posted 8/31/08 , edited 8/31/08

nene817 wrote:

No, I shouldn't have to read the whole thread. The purpose of the OP is to put your complete view on the issue. And there is pretty solid proof. There have been websites that have said these girls are 14 and a Chinese document saying that one of the girls is 14. When I find the URL to the website with pictures of those sites again, I'll be sure to post it. And like I said before, "the Americans" aren't just basing this on looks. Which you are implying by your title and OP. Posting pictures "proving that Asian gymnasts in general look young" does nothing because that's not what the speculation is about. And sorry, but being Asian doesn't mean that you're going to look years younger.


Ahhh here we go

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/david-flumenbaum/scandal-of-the-ages-docum_b_118842.html

And here's a different one
http://gatewaypundit.blogspot.com/2008/08/busted-china-caught-cheating-female.html

Pretty convincing to me


Yes, you're right, being Asians doesn't mean being YEARS younger, but these Chinese gymnasts were only accused of being 2 or 3 years younger, which is very not surprising to someone with Asian heritage, I myself being 20 years old still get people questioning whether I'm over 16 yet, occasionally, I get people telling me that they thought I was 14, this could probably be because they look at how tall (being a 4foot10) first before looking at my face

and if you were to convince a 'bias' person like me (from your point of view), you really shouldn't refer to me with these biased articles that not just me, but a normal person with some sense of judgment can tell the extreme one-side view from the first website you gave me


The New York Times first looked into the age of China's gymnasts with a story on July 27 that focused primarily on He Kexin, whose birthdate on numerous online records was listed as January 1, 1994, making her 14 when the Games began and ineligible to compete.


as far as my understanding of English concern, numerous means countless, or at least more than a dozen, but adding up all the articles and 'proofs' and the lists I have read that was published on any articles, including American ones about He Kexin, were really not more than a few, and by a few I mean 4 or 5


The world's foremost expert on female gymnastics Bela Karolyi has routinely referred to the 2008 Chinese team as "half people" and in his contributions to NBC as a commentator during the Games he has railed against the Chinese for engaging in age falsification.


Ah, this article's writer David Flumenbaum probably chose the worst 'expert' to comment on the Chinese gymnasts, after all, Karolyi is always biased towards China, and no I'm not the only who says that, his bias towards China is pretty much known within America. Not to mention his wife is the US team's coordinator and his hyper emotions when watching tortoise having sex (not really related to the Olympics but I thought that was rather gross and people still believe such a.. weird? person)


China has a rich history of age falsification in Olympics competition, especially in gymnastics.


I believe Flumenbaum like to use rather amusing words to write articles, and by 'rich' I hope he doesn't mean 1, there has only been once that China had the age falsification in Olympics which was in 2000 Sydney, not to mention, the country that Karolyi was from, Romania did it 4 times, so I suppose, Flumenbaum, you really shouldn't believe a guy from a 'rich' history of age falsification and someone who get excited with animal sex


It is no coincidence that He Kexin's passport was issued on February 14, 2008, a mere 6 months before the Olympics.


You see, in China, people don't get their passports before they turn into an adult, and if He Kexin wasn't needed to enter into the Olympics, she won't really get her passport until she's 18, so what Flumenbaum's saying that issuing the passport so late seems very fishy which was in fact, earlier than what she should have, and this might not be really related, but I know some British people, who never go abroad, don't have British passport since they said they 'don't need it' or only go register before they go abroad'



So, for all of those who are still left unconvinced, I offer a collection of evidence that will demonstrate not only that the Chinese gymnast in question was born in 1994 and underage, but that Chinese officials, over the last few weeks, have systematically tried to cover it all up.


Again, I don't get why people choose to believe some falsely published D.O.B. on the Chinese websites (I thought it was the Chinese that's always lying isn't it, why trust ANYTHING that we say?) and not the proper competitions records and registrations that these girls played at international events at other countries, should I put it that way, the Chinese aren't that stupid to enter someone who hasn't even won any medals before into the biggest event in the world - the Olympics. Of course they're going to choose the elite out of elites and those who won quite a few medals and have the experience of facing thousands of audience and cameras, so check all of their competitions history, you could probably searched a few on the internet

and by the way, those screen shots could just be call 'part of the research on the underage matter', and its no where near what you call 'solid proof'

In the second link, it's pretty much a repeated post of the first one, but I found this pretty disrespectful when reading a link in the second website


Nastia Liukin, who will compete in Friday’s all-around final, said: “Martha makes little jokes about it: ‘Oh, look at the little babies!’ We’ve always had a good laugh about that.”


Liukin's comment totally shattered my respect for her, she looks graceful and elegant while performing, but her words are rather more immature than the Chinese team. I suppose it's ok if they were laughing about it with the Chinese team, since it could be a sign of friendship, but of course in reality they're not just rivals, they don't even speak the same language, so I suppose what they were 'laughing' means they were 'teasing', and oh sorry, we don't eat like animals in Amazon

Posted 8/31/08 , edited 8/31/08



Yes, I understand those articles are horribly biased, but I'm focusing on those screenshots, which are still fact. In those articles, why would the Chinese lie about the age of their own gymnasts? And one of those screenshots was a document made by the Chinese government. And the Chinese obviously put those girls in because they realized they were the best to use. Obviously it was the "right" choice, since they did win. And whether you call this solid proof or not, it's a lot more convincing than China's word. But this whole "controversy" is over now anyways, so forget it.
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Posted 8/31/08 , edited 8/31/08

nene817 wrote:

Yes, I understand those articles are horribly biased, but I'm focusing on those screenshots, which are still fact. In those articles, why would the Chinese lie about the age of their own gymnasts? And one of those screenshots was a document made by the Chinese government. And the Chinese obviously put those girls in because they realized they were the best to use. Obviously it was the "right" choice, since they did win. And whether you call this solid proof or not, it's a lot more convincing than China's word. But this whole "controversy" is over now anyways, so forget it.


Look, if the Chinese government was really to fake her age, wouldn't they be bothered to deletes these news articles in their own websites before they start the Olympics? Again, you believe a piece of screenshots that can be easily fabricated and alter by anyone who's able to use Paint. And there are also 100% guarantee that the Chinese wouldn't make one or two mistake publishing someone's D.O.B. on the internet within this large number of children. Not to mention you think there's nothing fishy about the highlighting of her names on the screenshots and her age which again can be altered by a 12 year old computer user

You see, once the falsely data was published, it get spread around and people uses the falsely published resources to their need without realising the mistakes in it. And no I'm not sure what point you were trying to make about the 'right choice', since the Chinese team didn't really expect He to win this year's game, they wanted her there to prepare for the London Olympics and gain experience from this one first, but who knows she was even this good to win a gold medal?

If the list was really government published, the US hacker didn't need to work that hard to hack into the Government's 'deleted data' system. You see, if the documents were really that reliable, why wouldn't the FIG accept it as a solid evidence rather than calling it 'suspected reports'?

And yes you're probably right about at the last bit, the controversy is pretty much over (not sure to some hackers though), to me, this controversy's not even been started in any other countries than America in the first place, I just hope the FIG's investigation finish asap to proof them innocence, but then again, there will always be people who will not be convinced and always blindly believe - China is the cheater
Posted 8/31/08

tinyd0t wrote:


nene817 wrote:

Yes, I understand those articles are horribly biased, but I'm focusing on those screenshots, which are still fact. In those articles, why would the Chinese lie about the age of their own gymnasts? And one of those screenshots was a document made by the Chinese government. And the Chinese obviously put those girls in because they realized they were the best to use. Obviously it was the "right" choice, since they did win. And whether you call this solid proof or not, it's a lot more convincing than China's word. But this whole "controversy" is over now anyways, so forget it.


Look, if the Chinese government was really to fake her age, wouldn't they be bothered to deletes these news articles in their own websites before they start the Olympics? Again, you believe a piece of screenshots that can be easily fabricated and alter by anyone who's able to use Paint. And there are also 100% guarantee that the Chinese wouldn't make one or two mistake publishing someone's D.O.B. on the internet within this large number of children. Not to mention you think there's nothing fishy about the highlighting of her names on the screenshots and her age which again can be altered by a 12 year old computer user

You see, once the falsely data was published, it get spread around and people uses the falsely published resources to their need without realising the mistakes in it. And no I'm not sure what point you were trying to make about the 'right choice', since the Chinese team didn't really expect He to win this year's game, they wanted her there to prepare for the London Olympics and gain experience from this one first, but who knows she was even this good to win a gold medal?

If the list was really government published, the US hacker didn't need to work that hard to hack into the Government's 'deleted data' system. You see, if the documents were really that reliable, why wouldn't the FIG accept it as a solid evidence rather than calling it 'suspected reports'?

And yes you're probably right about at the last bit, the controversy is pretty much over (not sure to some hackers though), to me, this controversy's not even been started in any other countries than America in the first place, I just hope the FIG's investigation finish asap to proof them innocence, but then again, there will always be people who will not be convinced and always blindly believe - China is the cheater


They did delete these news articles. But the screenshots were taken before they were deleted, so we still have the record. And these are fabricated by paint? lol okay. And that's the point, they didn't make a mistake with the age. And no, you can't change the typing on the screenshot. And of course the Chinese government would use someone that they would expect to win. What kind of BS are you throwing out here? Seriously, you're so biased about this that you're not going to think anything is possible proof. Just forget it. I'm done here.
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Posted 8/31/08

Reikilea wrote:

You are right...Perfectly right and reasonable....See there was no problem in Asian games, the real problem started right after usa olympic gymnasts got beaten..All feelings I got from that NY Times article about chinese girls being underage is - they cant admit defeat....They just lost..Admit it... Happens all the time.
Chinese gymnasts totally beaten all countries there.Both sides - men and women.....
Yeah why no one compares Japan and Chinese gymnasts...From your pictures I think they even looks 14...To think they are same age as me... ...

And Asians always looked younger.....I remember what some japanology students from my country said about judging asains age :Think some age and then add ten more years


may be u're right!!!
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Posted 8/31/08 , edited 8/31/08

nene817 wrote:

They did delete these news articles. But the screenshots were taken before they were deleted, so we still have the record. And these are fabricated by paint? lol okay. And that's the point, they didn't make a mistake with the age. And no, you can't change the typing on the screenshot. And of course the Chinese government would use someone that they would expect to win. What kind of BS are you throwing out here? Seriously, you're so biased about this that you're not going to think anything is possible proof. Just forget it. I'm done here.


Ho ho, it seems like you are the only one who're very biased toward China, you see, didn't I say there are 'suspect' and 'fishy' about these documents while you are very sure and positive that they were real. And yes you're right, you can't change the typing while screen-printing, but you can change and cover the typings afterwards, PhotoShop and Paint is the mostly available application to do so, unless you're not very convinced about these programmes' features 0.0 (not to mention the highlighting of her name and age is how you alter a screenshot/Word) Again, since I didn't visit any of these websites myself before they deleted them, thats just my point of suspecting these have the possibility of being faked

And of course they would have deleted those articles after being published by the Western and the US to stop further confusion, and my point was, these 'proofs' was deleted after it was discovered by the outside world, so if China was really going to fake her age, these 'proof's should have been deleted before being discovered (or at least before they fake her passport), and there would be no need for the bloody hacker to hack into the government's system to find 'solid proof' if a piece of this
is convinced enough to strip her medals. Again, this list could have been the real Government's published record, but I'm not saying I'm 100% right like you, am I?

Ah, I also forgot that you're telling me to shut up, and sorry for not being able to do so
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Posted 9/15/08
will if the rules aren't being followed then of course they should be disqualified. i think the whole situation is stupid because asian people don't look like their age to begin with. i don't know who started the accusation of them being underage but it's stupid to keep talking when it's already proven that they are of age.
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Posted 11/2/08
um the North korean team look like men SORRY!
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Posted 12/23/08
I've tried to google stuff about this. I can hardly find anything on it. XP
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Posted 12/24/08
The irony on this topic is if its true, a bunch of 14 year olds were able to beat established world gymnast stars from 16 years and above. If it was a case of people who are much older but cheating to enter a younger restricted group, it is one thing but here we have 14 year olds who BEAT other older more experienced world gymnasts. Even if the Olympic committee do lower the age restriction and the rest of the world placed their 14 years old in the competition, the Gold still would have gone to China, (long shot US may win)
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