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Ki or qui or chi energy
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Posted 9/21/08 , edited 9/21/08

Intranetusa wrote:


JJT2 wrote:


Intranetusa wrote:

There is no such thing as chi/ki/qi - as in it is not some mystical force or energy.

Breaking boards or concrete is made possible by 'hard body training' and 'Wolf's Law.'

At best, chi/qi/ki is a mental state that helps a person relax, concentrate, train, etc


but what about chi as an internal energy? its not mystical, and scientist have even documented it- i would show u a wikipedia document, but people dont think wikipedia tells the truth...meditation is a mental state...and most martial artist have some basic understanding of it...they claim they can use it. plus i have seen demonstrations of it...and the discovery channel showed it as well, would u at leasts consider those scientist test as valid? the video was on youtube, but i cant seem to find it ne more. People spent years meditating to achieve it, r u saying they r all liers? Have u ever sat down and tried to undertsand your body through pure silence and an empty mind?People in eastern cultures have been doing it for thousands of years. And most board breaks r fake to begin with...if i even can find the scientific documents, i will post them up here...peace over war


Scientists have documented it? I'd like to see some scientific sources that claim that this internal energy/force have been documented. Even the wikipedia article doesn't say chi is some supernatural internal energy.

The discovery channel did not say chi was some mystical force that gives you super powers. They were doing documentaries on martial arts, and only lightly brushed on the topic of chi.

"People spent years meditating to achieve it, r u saying they r all liers?"

Achieve what? I already said chi is a mental state. Chi is not some energy that gives you super powers or allows you to shoot fireballs. Understanding yourself through meditation is not the same as saying you have a magical force running through your body.
u misunderstand what ki is, its not some mystical force, fireballs, non of that dbz crap...all im saying is that it is energy, the energy that we store in our bodies...the same energy our cells use to function...all im saying is that we use THAT force to channel it all through our bodies...and some claim they can channel ki through people's bodies..and meditation is a mental state....not chi....chi is gained through medidtation...so no, its not some mystical force...its the same energy u use to type with...the same energy u use to breath...all im saying is that energy can also be channeled to flow out of the body, and transfered...like kineticet and potienial energy.. and i cant find those documents...
peace over war
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Posted 9/21/08 , edited 9/21/08

Intranetusa wrote:

By the way, I'd like to point out the
http://www.chidvd.com/lipton.htm website is a bit ridiculous.

For example:
" During the past 30 years, the Chinese concept of "Chi" -- life force -- has become accepted by the western world. The most notable indicator of Chi's acceptance is the widespread acknowledgment that acupuncture -- whose purpose is to release blockages to the flow of Chi in the human body -- is an effective means of treating a host of illnesses and injuries."

Wrong. It is not accepted by the western world as life force. Acupuncture is viewed as the gate control theory and other theories dealing with pain and nervous systems.

"Modern (Western) medicine now believes that Chi (pronounced "chee" whether spelled chi, qi, or ki) is a form of electricity -- bioelectricity -- that circulates through the body. Chi is present in every cell and must exist at a sufficient level, circulating properly, to avoid cellular and organ malfunction."

Again, wrong. Bioelectricity is generated through areas such as sodium ion channels in the nervous system, and through stimulation of muscles. Bioelectricity doesn't "circulate" like some fluid either.
Bioelectricity has nothing to do with chi - it's not the cause of diseases, injuries, depression, etc like the article says.

This Lipton fellow is just cherry picking similarities between chi with any scientific ideas, despite the glaring differences.

And the rest discussing chi imbalance are a bit ridiculous.

He is creating the false impression that chi/ki/qi is some mystical force supported by science. Also, I'd like to know why he has a website selling "chi-machines"
http://www.chimachine4u.com/lipton.html


ok i see your point...ill look for other documents....but couldnt the gate theory and other theories have some connection with ki? (dont u guys just hate and love a critic? always got something to say to prove you wrong and opens your eyes to new hidden possibilies at the same time) i certainly do enjoy your input in things peace over war
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Posted 9/21/08
i also heard something like that,my attitude is:"if u don't enough about something u better not judge it until u have the whole pic",so,i can't deny it or confirm it!!!after all:humain are still a big mystery!!
Posted 9/21/08

Ki or qui or chi energy?



I go for a Wii.
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Posted 9/21/08

JJT2 wrote:

Some people r specticle about this... but i saw on the discovery channel these monks being tied up to machines that record thier body functions. They had no shirts on, so the scientist threw icy cold water on them. They made the water steam by doing simple breathing exercises.They increased thier body temperature by will alone. they called this energy Ki. Scientist have documented it, so it has been scienticficly proven to exist.I dont know ne reliable links to show for it, so u will have to research your self.



I also saw my master knock down a small piece (slightly thick) of cardboard over by point at it after touching his cheeks. He said he was gathering ki from his cheeks and using it to knock over the cardboard. We put tape over his nose and mouth to make sure he wasnt blowing it down...it didnt always go down on the 1st try, but it did wiggle.U could tell a "force" was hitting it.

(chi is gained through years of meditations) since americans dont medidtate, they may be speticle...peace over war


heres a document that i hope is valid...http://www.chidvd.com/lipton.htm


heres a website showing everybody's opinion of chi http://www.martialdevelopment.com/blog/chi-kung-skeptic-to-iron-shirt-master/

one guy on that website brought up a very good point- our cells have energy, so wouldny it be normal to use it?


here is another website showing chi being used.. http://www.chi-spinner.com/

peace over war


You must be smoking some pretty good crack there.
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Posted 9/21/08

Allhailodin wrote:


JJT2 wrote:

Some people r specticle about this... but i saw on the discovery channel these monks being tied up to machines that record thier body functions. They had no shirts on, so the scientist threw icy cold water on them. They made the water steam by doing simple breathing exercises.They increased thier body temperature by will alone. they called this energy Ki. Scientist have documented it, so it has been scienticficly proven to exist.I dont know ne reliable links to show for it, so u will have to research your self.



I also saw my master knock down a small piece (slightly thick) of cardboard over by point at it after touching his cheeks. He said he was gathering ki from his cheeks and using it to knock over the cardboard. We put tape over his nose and mouth to make sure he wasnt blowing it down...it didnt always go down on the 1st try, but it did wiggle.U could tell a "force" was hitting it.

(chi is gained through years of meditations) since americans dont medidtate, they may be speticle...peace over war


heres a document that i hope is valid...http://www.chidvd.com/lipton.htm


heres a website showing everybody's opinion of chi http://www.martialdevelopment.com/blog/chi-kung-skeptic-to-iron-shirt-master/

one guy on that website brought up a very good point- our cells have energy, so wouldny it be normal to use it?


here is another website showing chi being used.. http://www.chi-spinner.com/

peace over war


You must be smoking some pretty good crack there.
i only smoke herbal tea...peace over war

Posted 9/21/08

Allhailodin wrote:


JJT2 wrote:

Some people r specticle about this... but i saw on the discovery channel these monks being tied up to machines that record thier body functions. They had no shirts on, so the scientist threw icy cold water on them. They made the water steam by doing simple breathing exercises.They increased thier body temperature by will alone. they called this energy Ki. Scientist have documented it, so it has been scienticficly proven to exist.I dont know ne reliable links to show for it, so u will have to research your self.



I also saw my master knock down a small piece (slightly thick) of cardboard over by point at it after touching his cheeks. He said he was gathering ki from his cheeks and using it to knock over the cardboard. We put tape over his nose and mouth to make sure he wasnt blowing it down...it didnt always go down on the 1st try, but it did wiggle.U could tell a "force" was hitting it.

(chi is gained through years of meditations) since americans dont medidtate, they may be speticle...peace over war


heres a document that i hope is valid...http://www.chidvd.com/lipton.htm


heres a website showing everybody's opinion of chi http://www.martialdevelopment.com/blog/chi-kung-skeptic-to-iron-shirt-master/

one guy on that website brought up a very good point- our cells have energy, so wouldny it be normal to use it?


here is another website showing chi being used.. http://www.chi-spinner.com/

peace over war


You must be smoking some pretty good crack there.


That, or you just haven't seen enough things in this world, yet.
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Posted 9/21/08
I can tear a dictionary in half with my eyelid
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Posted 9/21/08

JJT2 wrote:
u misunderstand what ki is, its not some mystical force, fireballs, non of that dbz crap...all im saying is that it is energy, the energy that we store in our bodies...the same energy our cells use to function...all im saying is that we use THAT force to channel it all through our bodies...and some claim they can channel ki through people's bodies..and meditation is a mental state....not chi....chi is gained through medidtation...so no, its not some mystical force...its the same energy u use to type with...the same energy u use to breath...all im saying is that energy can also be channeled to flow out of the body, and transfered...like kineticet and potienial energy.. and i cant find those documents...


Well, the 'energy' we store in our body is energy such as calories in the form of fat, muscle, carbohydrates, etc. Food energy combines with oxygen converts into ATP energy through combustion at a cellular level.

We cannot "channel" ATP or bioelectricity around because it is an automatic process at a cellular level.

We are the sum of all of our cells - no organism on earth can control their cells individually.

So if you say chi is some type of energy we can channel, then no...it does not exist.
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Posted 9/21/08

Intranetusa wrote:


JJT2 wrote:
u misunderstand what ki is, its not some mystical force, fireballs, non of that dbz crap...all im saying is that it is energy, the energy that we store in our bodies...the same energy our cells use to function...all im saying is that we use THAT force to channel it all through our bodies...and some claim they can channel ki through people's bodies..and meditation is a mental state....not chi....chi is gained through medidtation...so no, its not some mystical force...its the same energy u use to type with...the same energy u use to breath...all im saying is that energy can also be channeled to flow out of the body, and transfered...like kineticet and potienial energy.. and i cant find those documents...


Well, the 'energy' we store in our body is energy such as calories in the form of fat, muscle, carbohydrates, etc. Food energy combines with oxygen converts into ATP energy through combustion at a cellular level.

We cannot "channel" ATP or bioelectricity around because it is an automatic process at a cellular level.

We are the sum of all of our cells - no organism on earth can control their cells individually.

So if you say chi is some type of energy we can channel, then no...it does not exist.


how can u be so sure? have u tried to obtain it through years of medidtation?...peace over war
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Posted 9/21/08

JJT2 wrote:
ok i see your point...ill look for other documents....but couldnt the gate theory and other theories have some connection with ki? (dont u guys just hate and love a critic? always got something to say to prove you wrong and opens your eyes to new hidden possibilies at the same time) i certainly do enjoy your input in things peace over war


Well, the two may share some ideas in common, but they are still completely different.
Just like how apples and blood may both be red, both the two are completely different.

Ki (in your definition) is about channeling mystical energy around the human body that people supposedly possess.

The gate control theory states that humans can block out pain because pain can be regulated in the area where the brain meets the spinal cord.

Ki/Chi/Qi energy is what early humans used to explain things they didn't understand about the human body.

ie. Instead of saying people die of microscopic pathogens, they would say the person died of chi imbalance. Nowadays, in order to promote chi, they use circular logic by further saying that these pathogens causes the chi imbalance.
(continually adding in the complexity of the idea to explain their beliefs...and with enough complexity, you can explain anything - see Occam's Razor)

The gate control theory is a scientific idea. Ki is a supernatural/magical interpretation of natural events.
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Posted 9/21/08 , edited 9/21/08

JJT2 wrote:
how can u be so sure? have u tried to obtain it through years of medidtation?...peace over war


And if a billion people jump off a cliff, will at least one of them will be able to fly?


How exactly would meditation give humans the ability to control their cells individually?
Maybe you should explain that part first.

Meditation is a mental state used for spiritual and psychological growth - it's not going to give you magical powers.






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Posted 9/21/08

Intranetusa wrote:


JJT2 wrote:
how can u be so sure? have u tried to obtain it through years of medidtation?...peace over war


And if a billion people jump off a cliff, will at least one of them will be able to fly?


How exactly would meditation give humans the ability to control their cells individually?
Maybe you should explain that part first.

Meditation is a mental state used for spiritual and psychological growth - it's not going to give you magical powers.








Some Quontom Physics scientist claim u can walk on water if u truly believe u can...peace over war
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Posted 9/21/08 , edited 9/21/08
That shit does exist. Its been called by difrent names through out all cultures in the world before globalization.
If you want to know how to use it all you have to do is have a will of absalution behind it.
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Posted 9/21/08

HeatherHanderson wrote:

I can tear a dictionary in half with my eyelid


yea this will come in handy if you ever get into a bar fight

"see this dictionary here? see my eyelid? *CRACK* that'll be your neck in about 2 seconds."

you can also scare the shit outta some little kids, just for fun
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