First  Prev  1  2  3  4  5  6  7  8  9  10  11  12  13  14  15  16  17  Next  Last
Christianity a copy cat religion?
17892 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
34 / M / Small Wooded town...
Offline
Posted 10/15/08 , edited 10/15/08

digs wrote:

This information is false as stated in the essay I posted. The Whole December 25th fact is proof of the blatant bias in someone attempting to make Christianity look bad.

Like i have already pointed out, that essay is no good, its a Christian defense web page with no backing for any of there infermation. should i post 7 sights that come with backing to show you why what I said is the facts, unlike what you got from that Christian site? If you have read what I had to say about the December 25th part you know that it does not matter, No one knows wen Jesus was born do to the fact there is no real evidence for him in the first place. So you can see the date matters not, the fact still stand in stone.
December 25th was taken from another religion to warship this Jesus because no one knows wen Jesus was born that was a fact that most Christians seem to not understand.
Posted 10/15/08

Darkphoenix3450 wrote:


digs wrote:

This information is false as stated in the essay I posted. The Whole December 25th fact is proof of the blatant bias in someone attempting to make Christianity look bad.

Like i have already pointed out, that essay is no good, its a Christian defense web page with no backing for any of there infermation. should i post 7 sights that come with backing to show you why what I said is the facts, unlike what you got from that Christian site? If you have read what I had to say about the December 25th part you know that it does not matter, No one knows wen Jesus was born do to the fact there is no real evidence for him in the first place. So you can see the date matters not, the fact still stand in stone.
December 25th was taken from another religion to warship this Jesus because no one knows wen Jesus was born that was a fact that most Christians seem to not understand.


dude, there is no point in explaining to a christian that his religion is based on a bad copy of other historical elements. i mean, hell, they believe in something they've never seen before...so if you have any proof, or backup for your theory, it doesn't matter to them..


11387 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
26 / F / Fort Hood
Offline
Posted 10/15/08

Darkphoenix3450 wrote:


digs wrote:

This information is false as stated in the essay I posted. The Whole December 25th fact is proof of the blatant bias in someone attempting to make Christianity look bad.

Like i have already pointed out, that essay is no good, its a Christian defense web page with no backing for any of there infermation. should i post 7 sights that come with backing to show you why what I said is the facts, unlike what you got from that Christian site? If you have read what I had to say about the December 25th part you know that it does not matter, No one knows wen Jesus was born do to the fact there is no real evidence for him in the first place. So you can see the date matters not, the fact still stand in stone.
December 25th was taken from another religion to warship this Jesus because no one knows wen Jesus was born that was a fact that most Christians seem to not understand.



Jesus was actually born on the 23rd, not the 25th.

The 25th was established by the early christian church (before it became known as "catholic") as a way to not celebrate his birthday as the same day as the winter solstice, a festivity celebrated by the romans.
17892 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
34 / M / Small Wooded town...
Offline
Posted 10/15/08

jay_jay26 wrote:


Darkphoenix3450 wrote:


digs wrote:

This information is false as stated in the essay I posted. The Whole December 25th fact is proof of the blatant bias in someone attempting to make Christianity look bad.

Like i have already pointed out, that essay is no good, its a Christian defense web page with no backing for any of there infermation. should i post 7 sights that come with backing to show you why what I said is the facts, unlike what you got from that Christian site? If you have read what I had to say about the December 25th part you know that it does not matter, No one knows wen Jesus was born do to the fact there is no real evidence for him in the first place. So you can see the date matters not, the fact still stand in stone.
December 25th was taken from another religion to warship this Jesus because no one knows wen Jesus was born that was a fact that most Christians seem to not understand.



Jesus was actually born on the 23rd, not the 25th.

The 25th was established by the early christian church (before it became known as "catholic") as a way to not celebrate his birthday as the same day as the winter solstice, a festivity celebrated by the romans.


While it is impossible to nail down an exact date, Jesus was likely born in June. Why? Luke 2:8 describes Jesus's birthplace as "In that region there were shepherds living in the fields, keeping watch over the flock by night." That sure doesn't sound like December, does it? Gardner writes that shepherds slept with their sheep from June to November, and that June was known as the month men traditionally fed their flocks the remains of the wheat harvest.
To this day there is still no real evidence for this person that supposable did such great things. How is such a great man that can rise from the dead not ever talked about? No evidence for him has ever been found.
17892 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
34 / M / Small Wooded town...
Offline
Posted 10/15/08
Stories of gods born of virgins are to be found in nearly every age and country. There have been many virgin mothers, and Mary with her child is but a recent version of a very old and universal myth. In China and India, in Babylonia and Egypt, in Greece and Rome, "divine" beings selected from among the daughters of men the purest and most beautiful to serve them as a means of entrance into the world of mortals. Wishing to take upon themselves the human form, while retaining at the same time their "divinity," this compromise -- of an earthly mother with a "divine" father -- was effected. In the form of a swan Jupiter approached Leda, as in the guise of a dove, or a Paracletug, Jehovah "overshadowed" Mary.
A nymph bathing in a river in China is touched by a lotus plant, and the divine Fohi is born.

In Siam, a wandering sunbeam caresses a girl in her teens, and the great and wonderful deliverer, Codom, is born. In the life of Buddha we read that he descended on his mother Maya, "in likeness as the heavenly queen, and entered her womb," and was born from her right side, to save the world." [Stories of Virgin Births. Reference: Lord Macartney. Voyage dans 'interview de la Chine et en Tartarie. Vol. I p. 48. See also Les Vierges Meres et les Naissance Miraculeuse. P. Saintyves. p. 19, etc.] In Greece, the young god Apollo visits a fair maid of Athens, and a Plato is ushered into the world.

In ancient Mexico, as well as in Babylonia, and in modern Corea, as in modern Palestine, as in the legends of all lands, virgins gave birth and became divine mothers. But the real home of virgin births is the land of the Nile. Eighteen hundred years before Christ, we find carved on one of the walls of the great temple of Luxor a picture of the annunciation, conception and birth of King Amunothph III, an almost exact copy of the annunciation, conception and birth of the Christian God. Of course no one will think of maintaining that the Egyptians borrowed the idea from the Catholics nearly two thousand years before the Christian era. "The story in the Gospel of Luke, the first and second chapters is," says Malvert, "a reproduction, 'point by point,' of the story in stone of the miraculous birth of Amunothph."


Sharpe in his Egyptian Mythology, page 19, gives the following description of the, Luxor picture, quoted by G.W. Foote in his 'Bible Romances,' page 126: "In this picture we have the annunciation, the conception, the birth and the adoration, as described in the first and second chapters of Luke's Gospel." Massey gives a more minute description of the Luxor picture. "The first scene on the left hand shows the god Taht, the divine Wolrd or Loges, in the act of hailing the virgin queen, announcing to her that she is to give birth to a son. In the second scene the god Kneph (assisted by Hathor) gives life to her. This is the Holy Ghost, or Spirit that causes conception. ... Next the mother is seated on the midwife's stool, and the child is supported in the hands of one of the nurses. The fourth scene is that of the adoration. Here the child is enthroned, receiving homage from the gods and gifts from men." [Natural Geneses. Massey, Vol. II, p. 398.] The picture on the wall of the Luxor temple, then, is one of the sources to which the anonymous writers of the Gospels went for their miraculous story. It is no wonder they suppressed their own identity as well as the source from which they borrowed their material.

Not only the idea of a virgin mother, but all the other miraculous events, such as the stable cradle, the guiding star, the massacre of the children, the flight to Egypt, and the resurrection and bodily ascension toward the clouds, have not only been borrowed, but are even scarcely altered in the New Testament story of Jesus.

That the early Christians borrowed the legend of Jesus from earthly sources is too evident to be even questioned. Gerald Massey in his great work on Egyptian origins demonstrates the identity of Mary, the mother of Jesus, with Isis, the mother of Horus. He says: "The most ancient, goldbedizened, smoke-stained Byzantine pictures of the virgin and child represent the mythical mother as Isis, and not as a human mother of Nazareth. [Vol. II, p. 487.] Science and research have made this fact so certain that, on the one hand ignorance, and on the other interest only, can continue to claim inspiration for the authors of the undated and unsigned fragmentary documents which pass for the Word of God. If, then, Jesus is stripped of all the borrowed legends and miracles of which he is the subject; and if we also take away from him all the teachings which collected from Jewish and Pagan sources have been attributed to him -- what will be left of him? That the ideas put in his mouth have been culled and compiled from other sources is as demonstrable as the Pagan origin of the legends related of him.

Nearly every one of the dogmas and ceremonies in the Christian cult were borrowed from other and older religions. The resurrection myth, the ascension, the eucharist, baptism, worship by kneeling or prostration, the folding of the hands on the breast, the ringing of bells and the burning of incense, the vestments and vessels used in church, the candles, "holy" water, -- even the word Mass, were all adopted and adapted by the Christians from the religions of the ancients. The Trinity is as much Pagan, as much Indian or Buddhist, as it is Christian. The idea of a Son of God is as old as 'the oldest cult. The sun is the son of heaven in all primitive faiths. The physical sun becomes in the course of evolution, the Son of Righteousness, or the Son of God, and heaven is personified as the Father on High. The halo around the head of Jesus, the horns of the older deities, the rays of light radiating from the heads of Hindu and Pagan gods are incontrovertible evidence that all gods were at one time -- the sun in heaven.
2633 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
23 / M / New York City, NY
Offline
Posted 10/15/08
All religions shares various archetypes in belief. Virgin births are found all the way from Sumerian mythology as well as offspring between gods and mortals, death upon a tree, spiritual transformation, 12 as a 'magic' number. Christianity was influenced by a lot of factors: earlier religions, politics, culture, social terminology too.

I do not want to get into why Jesus didn't fulfill all the Old Testament prophecies. Hell, he wasn't even descended from David (the genealogies are screwed up and conflict directly with verses from the Old Testament) so he couldn't have been the Jewish Messiah. But 'interpreting in metaphors' lets you correlate them to anything you want to believe in.
2633 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
23 / M / New York City, NY
Offline
Posted 10/15/08 , edited 10/15/08

Darkphoenix3450 wrote:

Stories of gods born of virgins are to be found in nearly every age and country. There have been many virgin mothers, and Mary with her child is but a recent version of a very old and universal myth. In China and India, in Babylonia and Egypt, in Greece and Rome, "divine" beings selected from among the daughters of men the purest and most beautiful to serve them as a means of entrance into the world of mortals. Wishing to take upon themselves the human form, while retaining at the same time their "divinity," this compromise -- of an earthly mother with a "divine" father -- was effected. In the form of a swan Jupiter approached Leda, as in the guise of a dove, or a Paracletug, Jehovah "overshadowed" Mary.
A nymph bathing in a river in China is touched by a lotus plant, and the divine Fohi is born.

In Siam, a wandering sunbeam caresses a girl in her teens, and the great and wonderful deliverer, Codom, is born. In the life of Buddha we read that he descended on his mother Maya, "in likeness as the heavenly queen, and entered her womb," and was born from her right side, to save the world." [Stories of Virgin Births. Reference: Lord Macartney. Voyage dans 'interview de la Chine et en Tartarie. Vol. I p. 48. See also Les Vierges Meres et les Naissance Miraculeuse. P. Saintyves. p. 19, etc.] In Greece, the young god Apollo visits a fair maid of Athens, and a Plato is ushered into the world.

In ancient Mexico, as well as in Babylonia, and in modern Corea, as in modern Palestine, as in the legends of all lands, virgins gave birth and became divine mothers. But the real home of virgin births is the land of the Nile. Eighteen hundred years before Christ, we find carved on one of the walls of the great temple of Luxor a picture of the annunciation, conception and birth of King Amunothph III, an almost exact copy of the annunciation, conception and birth of the Christian God. Of course no one will think of maintaining that the Egyptians borrowed the idea from the Catholics nearly two thousand years before the Christian era. "The story in the Gospel of Luke, the first and second chapters is," says Malvert, "a reproduction, 'point by point,' of the story in stone of the miraculous birth of Amunothph."


Sharpe in his Egyptian Mythology, page 19, gives the following description of the, Luxor picture, quoted by G.W. Foote in his 'Bible Romances,' page 126: "In this picture we have the annunciation, the conception, the birth and the adoration, as described in the first and second chapters of Luke's Gospel." Massey gives a more minute description of the Luxor picture. "The first scene on the left hand shows the god Taht, the divine Wolrd or Loges, in the act of hailing the virgin queen, announcing to her that she is to give birth to a son. In the second scene the god Kneph (assisted by Hathor) gives life to her. This is the Holy Ghost, or Spirit that causes conception. ... Next the mother is seated on the midwife's stool, and the child is supported in the hands of one of the nurses. The fourth scene is that of the adoration. Here the child is enthroned, receiving homage from the gods and gifts from men." [Natural Geneses. Massey, Vol. II, p. 398.] The picture on the wall of the Luxor temple, then, is one of the sources to which the anonymous writers of the Gospels went for their miraculous story. It is no wonder they suppressed their own identity as well as the source from which they borrowed their material.

Not only the idea of a virgin mother, but all the other miraculous events, such as the stable cradle, the guiding star, the massacre of the children, the flight to Egypt, and the resurrection and bodily ascension toward the clouds, have not only been borrowed, but are even scarcely altered in the New Testament story of Jesus.

That the early Christians borrowed the legend of Jesus from earthly sources is too evident to be even questioned. Gerald Massey in his great work on Egyptian origins demonstrates the identity of Mary, the mother of Jesus, with Isis, the mother of Horus. He says: "The most ancient, goldbedizened, smoke-stained Byzantine pictures of the virgin and child represent the mythical mother as Isis, and not as a human mother of Nazareth. [Vol. II, p. 487.] Science and research have made this fact so certain that, on the one hand ignorance, and on the other interest only, can continue to claim inspiration for the authors of the undated and unsigned fragmentary documents which pass for the Word of God. If, then, Jesus is stripped of all the borrowed legends and miracles of which he is the subject; and if we also take away from him all the teachings which collected from Jewish and Pagan sources have been attributed to him -- what will be left of him? That the ideas put in his mouth have been culled and compiled from other sources is as demonstrable as the Pagan origin of the legends related of him.

Nearly every one of the dogmas and ceremonies in the Christian cult were borrowed from other and older religions. The resurrection myth, the ascension, the eucharist, baptism, worship by kneeling or prostration, the folding of the hands on the breast, the ringing of bells and the burning of incense, the vestments and vessels used in church, the candles, "holy" water, -- even the word Mass, were all adopted and adapted by the Christians from the religions of the ancients. The Trinity is as much Pagan, as much Indian or Buddhist, as it is Christian. The idea of a Son of God is as old as 'the oldest cult. The sun is the son of heaven in all primitive faiths. The physical sun becomes in the course of evolution, the Son of Righteousness, or the Son of God, and heaven is personified as the Father on High. The halo around the head of Jesus, the horns of the older deities, the rays of light radiating from the heads of Hindu and Pagan gods are incontrovertible evidence that all gods were at one time -- the sun in heaven.


You sound like a fan of Joseph Campbell.
4095 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
24 / M / Los Angeles, Cali...
Offline
Posted 10/15/08
i did a research essay on pagan influences on christianity, focusing on the roman mystery cults for my senior paper in highschool. it was a pretty fun essay to write. it was 8 pages long (the requirement was only 4) and i could have gone on a lot longer if i wanted. i'll probably continue it for my anthropology of religion class that i have now.


anyways, christianity is almost totally unoriginal. i'm amazed at how they got away with it so long, and how the commoners believed the lame excuse the papacy gave them (that satan travelled through time and created those similar religions in order to confuse people and make them stray from the true path once jesus was born).
3066 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
73 / M
Offline
Posted 10/16/08
Once you can grasp around the fact that most religion has been made up in the past as a means of controlling the mass, you can accept that fact that most religions originate from beliefs and stories from the earliest civilizations. (Example, Egypt when Pharaohs and all that good stuff existed)
17892 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
34 / M / Small Wooded town...
Offline
Posted 10/16/08 , edited 10/16/08

gopherthegold wrote:

I don't get this thread. What cat religion is Christianity a copy of? I didn't even know cats had organized religion. And seriously, how the heck could a cat crucify another cat; they don't have opposable thumbs.



And for the people who don't catch my sarcasm... Yes, I am 100% serious here. 110%.



But they do have opposable claws!
4344 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
28 / M / auckland
Offline
Posted 10/16/08
yeah.. though i won't say i know for sure.. i'd say it's completely plausible.

There's those rumour about non-historicity of Jesus. Haven't finish reading all of it. Got tired of finding evidences and stuff. But it does sound odd that throughout all writers in history, only 4 wrote about Jesus (whom supposedly was the most influential figure on his era). And even within those 4 literature there is no specific mention of Jesus. Although the catholic church makes it seems so by doing a blatant mistranslation to the original copy. This made me suspicious. Very suspicious.

And then there's that suspicion that religion is just a body of political movement on ancient Europe. I haven't read the detail about the era when christianity became a widespread influence. I know Constantine had a lot to do with it. But yeah.. I haven't read that far.

In conclusion? i don't know. Academically, I wouldn't say that it's factual just yet that Christianity is just a copy of older religions. But personally, I do believe so.
Posted 10/17/08
All religions will come down to the same thing, and that is being a good person.
24695 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
21 / M / (Unknown)
Offline
Posted 10/17/08
Blasphemy! What does that exactly prove? Nothing! (I'm exaggerating...but still...what does a bunch of fibs prove?)
63894 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
29 / M / Seattle
Offline
Posted 10/17/08
Meh, it is said that the Vadican has the Dead Sea Scrolls locked away because they prove something like christinaity existed 200 years before christ.

As for the December 25th, many religions that are to the north of the equator would celebrate this. Most socities figured out that the "Shortest day of the year" generally takes place somewhere around december 25th. So they wanted to celebrate the coming extended day time... kind of a celebration or a returning to the light.

I would not be to suprised it Christianity took some of its ideas from other religions, especially Zoroastrianism. Since Christianity is Dualtheistic, not Monotheistic, and Zoroastrianism was the first recorded dualtheistic religion.

Plus we have to look at the time christianity came about. Anyone would be hard pressed to say that it is an original religion considering that Christianity came about during the roman empire. And the roman empire spanned across several different cultures. It was not like religions before it, such as the greeks or the egyptians or the babalyonians. All of those societies were fairly isolated in their early centuries.

Besides what does it matter if a religion stole the ideas from another one? At the time the religion you guys say is the base for christianity was dead. And the first time I ever heard of Zoroastrianism was back in college. No offense this was not exactly a well known religion. I mean Christianity must have changed enough of the religion to make it work for so long.
5357 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
74 / M / UK
Offline
Posted 10/17/08
all religion sucks! the end!
First  Prev  1  2  3  4  5  6  7  8  9  10  11  12  13  14  15  16  17  Next  Last
You must be logged in to post.