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Creation
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Posted 4/18/07
Lets' just say that Godzilla and King Kong had the first human baby.
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27 / M
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Posted 4/18/07
*Scratches his head at Ktito* Flippant…
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Posted 4/18/07
Dude, it's not like there's anything left to say here. You might as well make the best of it, dontchu agree?
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Posted 4/18/07
Allow me to make a few points even if they have already been said or seem obvious before this thread dies like every other interesting topic because I'm tired of just typing:
"this thread is a duplicate", "locked", etc, etc.

Like Eros already said, The most successful description of the origin of the universe comes from the big bang theory.
So according to astronomers at some point the entire universe was contracted down to a single point or singularity. It began from a state of infinite density. Space and time were created in that event and so was all the matter in the universe.

Let's consider this statement just for kicks:

* It is not meaningful to ask what happened before that, any more than it is meaningful to ask what is the north of the north pole. Asking where/when the big bang took place is not sensible. The point-universe was not an object isolated in space or somewhere. It was the entire universe, which means the only answer can be that the big bang happened everywhere.

What caused it? who knows, some say that God, some philosophers believe these are not appropriate questions because we have no basis for answering them. Sometimes I think is a valid question but we simply do not yet know how to answer it.
The religious person answers to this question with the existence of a creator, but this answer requires a huge leap in logic, which I'm not a fan of.

Now to those who like the idea of multiverses, well it is still a hypothesis, and it just adds another level to the problem, some say there is an infinite number of universes....meh I don't buy that, maybe there are other universes but that just means we just need to ask the question on another level, that is, what/how created the universe(s)? etc.
Also, trying to explain how this universe came to existence by incorporating other hypothetical universes.....why? this just seems like a violation of Occam's razor, and we have no standard of comparison.

This was a rushed post so please expect some vagueness and mistakes........-_- another modreport to take care of sigh

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27 / M
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Posted 4/18/07
Yes it does destroy Occam's razor. Well, that was very enlightening, though terse...

The Big Bang happened everywhere huh? Well, there’s one I’ve never heard before.
I like that theory!

Srry if this is already a topic..
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Posted 4/18/07
well as to where everything came from in the first place, i doubt anybody will ever know
what created the universe as we know it: an endless cycle of big bangs and big crunches, where the big bang happens and everything starts expanding, then once its expanded as far as it can you get the big crunch where everything gets compacted down and when it reaches a certain point another big bang and so on...
ok for life: as earth started cooling oceans formed from the volcanoes (brought to the planet first by comets) then certain elements brought by meteors react as they burn in the atmosphere to create basic proteins (its been proven possible using a hydrogen gun/cannon or whatever its called, i cant remember) then the bit where the proteins become living, i havnt got a clue, mabye they collected then natural elctricity passed through them and they maintained it and started other reactions and multipying or something
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Posted 4/18/07
Seeing that much of the scientific basis has already been explained, I'll loop it with perspectives from Christianity in the hopes to point out that the Bible shouldn't be taken literally. The 6 days of creation for example is more likely related to the different time frames when the Universe is just taking form.

And from what Mauz is saying about simply not knowing how to answer the question behind it, it's basically pointing out that we are unable to do so because our senses and perception is limited, even though modern equipment allows us to observe more, they can only do so much. Besides, we're even confined to 3-dimensional space and 1 dimensional time. I don't think much can be answered about creation if our understanding and tools for observing remain confined within those dimensions.
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26 / M / Jersey
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Posted 4/18/07

AtlantianTokRa wrote:

well as to where everything came from in the first place, i doubt anybody will ever know
what created the universe as we know it: an endless cycle of big bangs and big crunches, where the big bang happens and everything starts expanding, then once its expanded as far as it can you get the big crunch where everything gets compacted down and when it reaches a certain point another big bang and so on...
ok for life: as earth started cooling oceans formed from the volcanoes (brought to the planet first by comets) then certain elements brought by meteors react as they burn in the atmosphere to create basic proteins (its been proven possible using a hydrogen gun/cannon or whatever its called, i cant remember) then the bit where the proteins become living, i havnt got a clue, mabye they collected then natural elctricity passed through them and they maintained it and started other reactions and multipying or something


I basically summed up everything about the origin of life on the first page that has been described with biology. Please read it before you post comments like "proteins become living", "natural electricity" and other derivatives of that.
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26 / M / Body in NY Mind i...
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Posted 4/18/07
hmmm I thought that this topic was made before. What do you mean by creation?? are you suggesting general universe or human formation???
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25 / New York
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Posted 4/18/07
uh...big bang? who knows.
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21 / F / SDF-1
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Posted 4/18/07
Silence infidels! We all know God created the universe when he tried to light his fart on fire.
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27 / M
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Posted 4/18/07

Seeing that much of the scientific basis has already been explained, I'll loop it with perspectives from Christianity in the hopes to point out that the Bible shouldn't be taken literally. The 6 days of creation for example is more likely related to the different time frames when the Universe is just taking form.


YES! That's right. The bible says that a thousand years is but a day to God! This being said it does not mean that it really took 6 days. Also, this being said, the bible does not contradict evolution! When it says God created the organism that evolved to be the thing that evolved to be the thing ext that evolved to become Adam.

I believe that evolution is the tool God used to make mankind.



Silence infidels! We all know God created the universe when he tried to light his fart on fire.
You watch too much Family Guy...



Posted 4/19/07

mauz15 wrote:
Also, trying to explain how this universe came to existence by incorporating other hypothetical universes.....why? this just seems like a violation of Occam's razor, and we have no standard of comparison.

It need not violate Occam's Razor, some of the current "M-Theories" (Theories of Everything) floating about out there contain about 11 Dimensions... that may seem like an excessive number, but it would not be adequate without that number of dimensions. I have had no experience of the maths of the Multiverse theory, and definitely wouldn't understand it if I did, however it may be a more adequate mathematical construct than the idea of 1 universe either appearing out of nothing or expanding and contracting within "nothing" - if there are other universes there it allows us to conceptualise the "outside" of the universe. Additionally using them to descripe "probabilities" and occurences is a very neat way to explain "what happens to the other possibility once it's gone".

In the end there has as yet been no "lay man's" evidence for the Multiverse theory, therefore I believe in the Big Bang as the origin of our current universe... there's nice evidence for it.

Asking what came before the Big Bang is important, it is in human nature to be inquisitive, and we can't decide there's nothing until we have ruled out the possibility that there is something there.

As for life, The Miller Urey Experiment (as previously stated by jamehze ) is the best evidence for "life" having come into existence sponaneously on primordial Earth... The resulting organic compounds will then have possibly had function, maybe a prion or something was created randomly. Then through evolution these structures would have become more complex and better at obtaining materials to remake themselves... etc. etc.

God is a very nice way to explain "Why" - just then we have to explain God...

*wonders whether aliens believe in Deities*
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Posted 4/19/07
i think.. life would have started that primordial soup... like i saw in cow and chicken...
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Posted 4/19/07

henz_lan wrote:

It need not violate Occam's Razor, some of the current "M-Theories" (Theories of Everything) floating about out there contain about 11 Dimensions... that may seem like an excessive number, but it would not be adequate without that number of dimensions. I have had no experience of the maths of the Multiverse theory, and definitely wouldn't understand it if I did


yeah I realized today that it does not necessarily violates it


however it may be a more adequate mathematical construct than the idea of 1 universe either appearing out of nothing or expanding and contracting within "nothing" - if there are other universes there it allows us to conceptualise the "outside" of the universe. Additionally using them to descripe "probabilities" and occurences is a very neat way to explain "what happens to the other possibility once it's gone".



Ok I think you misunderstood, of course I agree with your statement, but this is where I say that it only raises the question up to another level, I was talking about not only this universe, I was talking about everything; the whole (multiverses included)
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