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Two Biggest Lies Told By Internet Fansb Groups: "This Is A Free Fansub, Please Support This Anime Once It Gets Licensed"
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27 / M / Hell
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Posted 11/12/08
Watching licensed anime costs money, a resource that people here in our country lacks.
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25 / M / USA
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Posted 11/12/08
Hahaha... maybe you should stop complaining to teens about fansubbing on a site that promotes watching anime on the internet(and is fueled by fansubbers). Go do something in real life if its such a crime. Don't forget, no matter how frusterated you get, for every one person agreeing with you, there are ten more against you. You can't win this agrument vs people on this site. I'm tired of seeing your same laments over and over. Do everyone a favor and take this squabble to a more private diary. Go grief to yourself via paper and pen. WOW.
Posted 11/12/08 , edited 11/12/08
Also, this guy seems to debate the meaning of the word free.
Free in the sense of goods at no monetary cost to the person obtaining them, is still free in my book.
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M / In Memphis, with...
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Posted 11/12/08
No, actually this person has some good points. The problem is that he focuses on the wrong people. It seems his points are valid in his paradoxically perfect world where law is absolute according to his own beliefs. It also seems that since such points wouldn't be valid in a world-wide law, he tosses his frustration on the users of CR with the facade of 'inform the people.'

I apologize for giving my explicit opinion of myself, which might be wrong since it's just what seems like. But some users here might be wondering if you are in the wrong place, misunderstood or simply your attitude is wrong, since you are a mature man and most users here, I include myself, are teens or immature people.

For a 30 year old man ranting on most children and teens here that sure is something to be proud of. In topic now, I just have one question about licensing. Because even if something is licensed by the t.v. stations in Japan they don't have dominion over the entire world, outside Japan that is. Is anime licensed by the t.v. stations also licensed outside Japan? It is clear that raw material is licensed in Japan, but isn't it unlicensed once that raw material is outside Japan?

Just like law applies to one side it likewise applies to the other side as well, Japan vs the world. For all I know once something is over international territory it is outside the law of a certain country in specific. Well I don't know much about laws like yourself.
Posted 11/12/08 , edited 11/12/08
I respected and was interested in your first thread about this... but now it's time to really give it a rest -__-


BlazingRb wrote:
seriously. . .
you are worst than proudasian


psst... it's 'worse' >.>
Just a bashing tip, if you want to give this guy hell (again) :\


kirafiq wrote:


Your immaturity is worse then the op's persistence.
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25 / M / This Dying World
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Posted 11/12/08 , edited 11/12/08

DomFortress wrote:

For you flamers, trolls, and internet bullies, a disclaimer from yours truly:


By disclaiming this message "This Is A Free Fansub, Please Support This Anime Once It Gets Licensed" every time on their illegitimate fansubs, the internet fansub groups lied to us every time about their illegitimate practice.

The fact is, their fansubs aren't free. They were stolen from the anime studios at the moment when the internet fansub groups downloaded illegal duplicated digital files(aka raw files) of licensed anime series, that are hosted on any Japanese P2P file sharing site. Such site as Tokyo Toshokan/東京 図書館, that's like your one-stop-shopping for same-time release raw files, with no advertising and paid strictly by donations(http://www.tokyotosho.com/index.php?cat=7_).

Another fact, their fansubs was already licensed to the corresponding medias and/or Japanese TV broadcasting stations before the illegal duplicated digital files(raw files) got hosted on any Japanese P2P file sharing site. Under the BERNE CONVENTION FOR THE PROTECTION OF LITERARY AND ARTISTIC WORKS (Paris Text 1971), the anime studios are the original creators of their works, the anime series, thereby they automatically gain the copyright for their works(http://www.law.cornell.edu/treaties/berne/2.html). The anime studios can then license their works to the Japanese TV stations, to be broadcast only on Japanese TV networks. Or they can license their work to the Japanese publishers, to be distribute only on anime related medias. Both of these are the original sources of the illegal duplicated digital files, aka raw files.

Remember to state your claim with facts or sound reasoning, and respect others by responding to their claim likewise.

And now I open the topic for discussions.


What exactly are you trying to "prove"?

Are saying that fansubbers should stop fansubbing?

Are you implying that fansubbers are doing wrongs to the Japanese companies?

~~~~
Every time some sort of complaint that happens in anime, is an "american" company or any other country with dubbing/licensing rights aside from japan. So my point is why are you questioning Japans licensing on anime, while the main problem lies elsewhere? It doesn't make sense.

You're saying fansubbing hurts Japanese licensing which in fact it hurts american *other countries* licensing.

Its not like a Japanese guy is going to get a subbed version of that anime where as he/she understands Japanese and can understand the language.

Where is you're logic? Are you stirring up an argument to you can get into Law school?

I suggest you find something else to "argue" or "defend" on, I assure you that 98% of the people who read your first post and previous threads dislike you, the other 1% is pro and the other 1 is just lacking of intelligenent way to say anything.
Posted 11/12/08 , edited 11/12/08

HayatellAyasaki wrote:

No, actually this person has some good points. The problem is that he focuses on the wrong people. It seems his points are valid in his paradoxically perfect world where law is absolute according to his own beliefs. It also seems that since such points wouldn't be valid in a world-wide law, he tosses his frustration on the users of CR with the facade of 'inform the people.'

I apologize for giving my explicit opinion of myself, which might be wrong since it's just what seems like. But some users here might be wondering if you are in the wrong place, misunderstood or simply your attitude is wrong, since you are a mature man and most users here, I include myself, are teens or immature people.

For a 30 year old man ranting on most children and teens here that sure is something to be proud of. In topic now, I just have one question about licensing. Because even if something is licensed by the t.v. stations in Japan they don't have dominion over the entire world, outside Japan that is. Is anime licensed by the t.v. stations also licensed outside Japan? It is clear that raw material is licensed in Japan, but isn't it unlicensed once that raw material is outside Japan?

Just like law applies to one side it likewise applies to the other side as well, Japan vs the world. For all I know once something is over international territory it is outside the law of a certain country in specific. Well I don't know much about laws like yourself.


Well, if you knowingly receive stolen goods in the mail, and hand them out on a street corner, you'd still be responsible for receiving stolen goods.

If you're handing them out under the guise that they're "free", I don't see how the people receiving the handouts would be responsible for receiving stolen goods.
Maybe this is what he's trying to inform us of.

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M / Earth
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Posted 11/12/08

BloodySocks wrote:

I don't think he's "flaming" subbers. I think he's trying to get other people's opinions on the statement to compare to his own. If this was a flaming thread he would simply call them liars. Here he states a reasonable argument and is asking for a second opinion. As for you Maou, you just came in to tell him no to write such threads, that sounds more like mild flaming to me orz.


Um...

His first thread that's like this one got locked.
His second thread that's like this got locked.
Hmm... How about the third?

Actually, his opinion has a point. Yet, there are questions by his 'so-called flamers' that he avoids to answer (he answered some but his not getting to the main idea of the question).
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Posted 11/12/08

DomFortress wrote:

For you flamers, trolls, and internet bullies, a disclaimer from yours truly:


By disclaiming this message "This Is A Free Fansub, Please Support This Anime Once It Gets Licensed" every time on their illegitimate fansubs, the internet fansub groups lied to us every time about their illegitimate practice.

The fact is, their fansubs aren't free. They were stolen from the anime studios at the moment when the internet fansub groups downloaded illegal duplicated digital files(aka raw files) of licensed anime series, that are hosted on any Japanese P2P file sharing site. Such site as Tokyo Toshokan/東京 図書館, that's like your one-stop-shopping for same-time release raw files, with no advertising and paid strictly by donations(http://www.tokyotosho.com/index.php?cat=7_).

Another fact, their fansubs was already licensed to the corresponding medias and/or Japanese TV broadcasting stations before the illegal duplicated digital files(raw files) got hosted on any Japanese P2P file sharing site. Under the BERNE CONVENTION FOR THE PROTECTION OF LITERARY AND ARTISTIC WORKS (Paris Text 1971), the anime studios are the original creators of their works, the anime series, thereby they automatically gain the copyright for their works(http://www.law.cornell.edu/treaties/berne/2.html). The anime studios can then license their works to the Japanese TV stations, to be broadcast only on Japanese TV networks. Or they can license their work to the Japanese publishers, to be distribute only on anime related medias. Both of these are the original sources of the illegal duplicated digital files, aka raw files.

Remember to state your claim with facts or sound reasoning, and respect others by responding to their claim likewise.

And now I open the topic for discussions.


LOL! you are very mature for a 30 year old i see. did puberty go wrong for you? And if i remember right, you are the one who does not address our valid arguments and instead turn to challenging the weak.

you can go on and on about the same thing, but that does not change the fact that you fail in the following ways.

1. You were a fansubber yourself so you don't have the right to bad mouth them because the nature of what you did was the same as what they do now. Back then you just had inferior skills and technology.

2. You still watch fan subs or as you said to me in another thread that you watch raw.... but how is that different from what u call STEALING from anime studios? Did the distributor have the permission of license holder? Did you pay for the raws?

3. you still fail to prove that more releases and productions equals NO PROFIT....

I could go on, but i am afraid i might be going too fast for your level. so do reply to these VALID and on topic points if you can without embarrassing yourself.

BTW. just curios, what was your point of bring up the internet laws? you gonna have people arrested now? people all around the world? thats as likely as you losing weight.
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Posted 11/12/08

BrylleNoGotoku wrote:


BloodySocks wrote:

I don't think he's "flaming" subbers. I think he's trying to get other people's opinions on the statement to compare to his own. If this was a flaming thread he would simply call them liars. Here he states a reasonable argument and is asking for a second opinion. As for you Maou, you just came in to tell him no to write such threads, that sounds more like mild flaming to me orz.


Um...

His first thread that's like this one got locked.
His second thread that's like this got locked.
Hmm... How about the third?

Actually, his opinion has a point. Yet, there are questions by his 'so-called flamers' that he avoids to answer (he answered some but his not getting to the main idea of the question).


But does it justify him starting all these threads?

This is called being a poor-sport or a sore-loser.

True that he wants to get his point across but, it does not give him justification by making repeated threads which are going to get closed after 3 pages or so.
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Posted 11/12/08 , edited 11/12/08

HayatellAyasaki wrote:



For a 30 year old man ranting on most children and teens here that sure is something to be proud of. In topic now, I just have one question about licensing. Because even if something is licensed by the t.v. stations in Japan they don't have dominion over the entire world, outside Japan that is. Is anime licensed by the t.v. stations also licensed outside Japan? It is clear that raw material is licensed in Japan, but isn't it unlicensed once that raw material is outside Japan?


Isn't 'Berne Convention' created for this one?
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M / In Memphis, with...
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Posted 11/12/08

MisterH wrote:


HayatellAyasaki wrote:

No, actually this person has some good points. The problem is that he focuses on the wrong people. It seems his points are valid in his paradoxically perfect world where law is absolute according to his own beliefs. It also seems that since such points wouldn't be valid in a world-wide law, he tosses his frustration on the users of CR with the facade of 'inform the people.'

I apologize for giving my explicit opinion of myself, which might be wrong since it's just what seems like. But some users here might be wondering if you are in the wrong place, misunderstood or simply your attitude is wrong, since you are a mature man and most users here, I include myself, are teens or immature people.

For a 30 year old man ranting on most children and teens here that sure is something to be proud of. In topic now, I just have one question about licensing. Because even if something is licensed by the t.v. stations in Japan they don't have dominion over the entire world, outside Japan that is. Is anime licensed by the t.v. stations also licensed outside Japan? It is clear that raw material is licensed in Japan, but isn't it unlicensed once that raw material is outside Japan?

Just like law applies to one side it likewise applies to the other side as well, Japan vs the world. For all I know once something is over international territory it is outside the law of a certain country in specific. Well I don't know much about laws like yourself.


Well, if you knowingly receive stolen goods in the mail, and hand them out on a street corner, you'd still be responsible for receiving stolen goods.

If you're handing them out under the guise that they're "free", I don't see how the people receiving the handouts would be responsible for receiving stolen goods.
Maybe this is what he's trying to inform us of.



I do believe he informed us well enough in the first thread, which was long and became reluctant enough if I may add. But after many many threads 'informing us' the same thing over and over again, I believe this is just becoming a way to put his frustration over the users of CR, or simply a way to flood his 'information' into the forums.
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24 / M / Chicago
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Posted 11/12/08 , edited 11/12/08
Hey man, you need to just go and make a fansub petitioning website if you really care enough to make so many threads on it. But to tell you the truth, all I see in you doing that is just a big waste of time leading up to a huge failure. So just shut up on the matter and keep your complaints to yourself. Hearing them once is good enough.
Posted 11/12/08

BloodySocks wrote:

I don't think fansubbers are saying the anime is free as in it's publicly accessible. I'm pretty sure they just mean that they are not SELLING their fan subbed anime and warning people that if they are buying it, they are being scammed. And as for licensing, I believe that is English dub or sub licensing. The idea is that because we non-japanese speaking folk cannot understand anime and are forced to wait till it's released dubbed or miraculously english subbed, we are given the privilege to see it at the same time the Japanese people do at home on their TiVo =/. It's not a matter of the anime being licensed, it's a matter of it being accessible to us, English-speaking people.

Edit, ehem, back to the point, we aren't being lied to, we are just being comforted so we don't feel so bad about seeing it. If the message said "YOU ARE STEALING FROM JAPAN YOU *******" I'm sure a lot of people would be reluctant to watch anime.


But without properly acknowledging what they're doing with fansubs to their fans, just how many of the anime fans you see out there with misconceptions on licensing, free anime, and with the rest of the anime subculture?


MisterH wrote:

Why isn't crunchyroll being sued, they're a big company commiting crime en masse by distributing pirated works according to your logic.

You know why ?
Licensing laws aren't that simple.

<3 the law.
The end.


crunchyroll only played host for their CR users as an internet podcast site, thereby being neutral. And they will take down North American licensed anime series when they received a C & D/cease and desist notice from the licensing company. It's just like the Japanese P2P file sharing site is a neutral third company, but the users who uploaded the illegal raw files are the ones that are violating the copyright act. It's the users who uploaded the illegal files that are the criminals.
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M / In Memphis, with...
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Posted 11/12/08

BrylleNoGotoku wrote:


HayatellAyasaki wrote:



For a 30 year old man ranting on most children and teens here that sure is something to be proud of. In topic now, I just have one question about licensing. Because even if something is licensed by the t.v. stations in Japan they don't have dominion over the entire world, outside Japan that is. Is anime licensed by the t.v. stations also licensed outside Japan? It is clear that raw material is licensed in Japan, but isn't it unlicensed once that raw material is outside Japan?


Isn't 'Berne Convention'[url label=''Berne Convention'']http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Berne_Convention_for_the_Protection_of_Literary_and_Artistic_Works
created for this one?

I see, thank you.
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25 / M / This Dying World
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Posted 11/12/08

DomFortress wrote:


BloodySocks wrote:

I don't think fansubbers are saying the anime is free as in it's publicly accessible. I'm pretty sure they just mean that they are not SELLING their fan subbed anime and warning people that if they are buying it, they are being scammed. And as for licensing, I believe that is English dub or sub licensing. The idea is that because we non-japanese speaking folk cannot understand anime and are forced to wait till it's released dubbed or miraculously english subbed, we are given the privilege to see it at the same time the Japanese people do at home on their TiVo =/. It's not a matter of the anime being licensed, it's a matter of it being accessible to us, English-speaking people.

Edit, ehem, back to the point, we aren't being lied to, we are just being comforted so we don't feel so bad about seeing it. If the message said "YOU ARE STEALING FROM JAPAN YOU *******" I'm sure a lot of people would be reluctant to watch anime.


But without properly acknowledging what they're doing with fansubs to their fans, just how many of the anime fans you see out there with misconceptions on licensing, free anime, and with the rest of the anime subculture?


MisterH wrote:

Why isn't crunchyroll being sued, they're a big company commiting crime en masse by distributing pirated works according to your logic.

You know why ?
Licensing laws aren't that simple.

<3 the law.
The end.


crunchyroll only played host for their CR users as an internet podcast site, thereby being neutral. And they will take down North American licensed anime series when they received a C & D/cease and desist notice from the licensing company. It's just like the Japanese P2P file sharing site is a neutral third company, but the users who uploaded the illegal raw files are the ones that are violating the copyright act. It's the users who uploaded the illegal files that are the criminals.


most retarded thing you've said.

cr has to sign some sort of agreement to use the licensed animes, therefore they can't be "neutral" they've done the necessary proceedures to play those animes.

aside from that FACT no anime company is going to track down 1 individual and sue their ass off for uploading one raw, it isn't worth it for them.

THIS IS MORE THAN FACT

WASTE OF BANDWIDTH 5 DOLLARS, WASTE OF SPERM AND EGG 10 DOLLARS, WASTE OF MY TIME... PRICELESS. FOR EVERY THREAD YOU MAKE YOU JUST SUCK.
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