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Religion: The misconceptions of some geniuses in CR
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27 / M / In your room stea...
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Posted 1/3/09

amersfoort wrote:

well if there is a god, then there probably is also a place that is boring (heaven) and painfull (hell) so if we assume, like we just did that there is a god and 2 afterlifeworlds, then id rather go to heaven


Eh, well you simply rot in the ground. So I doubt there is some kinda afterlife.
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26 / M / The Netherlands
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Posted 1/3/09
same here, dead is dead, no human soul or shit, its over, no consious anymore
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Posted 1/3/09 , edited 1/3/09

amersfoort wrote:

same here, dead is dead, no human soul or shit, its over, no consious anymore


Yup, although I do see a good outcome from death, You dont suffer from boredom.
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26 / M / The Netherlands
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Posted 1/3/09
hmmm, this thread kinda turned into a...... 1 on 1 conversation
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Posted 1/3/09

Allhailodin wrote:
Its utterly useless to try to logically argue with a christian, anything you point out with facts, "God created it so" so logically arguing with them is useless, they have absolutely no sense of logic. To them "god created everything".


I take offense to that. I'm Catholic, but I'm open to your point of view, because I'm struggling myself. Stop stereotyping Catholics.

As you said earlier, many things in science are unknown, like what caused the bang that caused the big bang. God is an answer, but it also makes no sense because there's always the question of what caused God?

If there's no answer, we all have to search for our own. People who believe in God and people who don't are all still looking for an answer to their questions. It's all just a sense of perspective.

In history, there have been different times where things have happened to support God, such as the story of Fatima or Guatemala. There's also evidence to disprove God, like wars and death of children. You can't fully prove God with logic or concrete evidence, but you can't disprove him with logic or concrete evidence either.

In my opinion, people who believe in God do great things. Priests and nuns give people hope and calm their fears. Missionaries try to help the poor and the suffering. Religion is not all bad.
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Posted 1/3/09

amersfoort wrote:

okay, why is god uncaused and the universe not? why are u placing ur god above our universe?
and how is god uncaused?
its funny how are you putting ur god above the universe, while we have proof for the one and no proof for the other one

don't talk like that. you have no physical proof that you have a brain also peace

anyway, the universe is not infinite then? that out of nowhere it just existed?

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Posted 1/3/09

Allhailodin wrote:



LOL. peace, bro.

are we that low that you equalize us with a monkey, who has no sense of dignity? if monkey are that intelligent, why haven't they started their own civilization then like in Planet of the Apes?

seeing the world us fucked up is subjective. its your personal perception. By that, it means it varies from one person to another.

I myself thinks that the world is fucked up but I blame human doings since we are all the reason why the world is fucked up. Its a wrong thing to do that when something bad happens you blame it to god. Maybe it wasn't bad at all.

If you really think beyond results, you should know better but then again, i think you are young and yet to experience more in life to understand more.

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Posted 1/3/09 , edited 1/3/09
To Thread Starter:
Yay, we have somebody who isn't stupid and can defend religious people (of all religions, I'm hoping).
Note to atheist:
Physical evidence is not the only evidence that exists out there. Actual a purely materialist world would be impossible because you would have to explain how gravity and other forces exist. And even if you can see them at a microscopic level doesn't mean you can explain their behaviors. Don't even get me started with consciousness either.

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Posted 1/3/09

alupihan45 wrote:


Allhailodin wrote:



LOL. peace, bro.

are we that low that you equalize us with a monkey, who has no sense of dignity? if monkey are that intelligent, why haven't they started their own civilization then like in Planet of the Apes?

seeing the world us fucked up is subjective. its your personal perception. By that, it means it varies from one person to another.

I myself thinks that the world is fucked up but I blame human doings since we are all the reason why the world is fucked up. Its a wrong thing to do that when something bad happens you blame it to god. Maybe it wasn't bad at all.

If you really think beyond results, you should know better but then again, i think you are young and yet to experience more in life to understand more.



Hehe

are we that low that you equalize us with a monkey, who has no sense of dignity? if monkey are that intelligent, why haven't they started their own civilization then like in Planet of the Apes?


Human beings are animals, just as monkeys are animals, we are just an animal with a higher form of intelligence. But the fact is the gene difference between human and monkeys is only 2%. And yes, monkeys are intelligent, but just not at the same level as us. Dignity means nothing.


seeing the world us fucked up is subjective. its your personal perception. By that, it means it varies from one person to another.


That is true, same applies to right and wrong, and good and evil, there is no definite right and wrong, as it's all personal opinion, which varies from person to person. Same with good and evil, its all personal opinion.


I myself thinks that the world is fucked up but I blame human doings since we are all the reason why the world is fucked up. Its a wrong thing to do that when something bad happens you blame it to god. Maybe it wasn't bad at all.


Your right, It is the fault of human beings, and since I don't believe in that magical man, i'm not putting any blame on it.
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Posted 1/3/09

XxRabidFangirlxX wrote:


Allhailodin wrote:
Its utterly useless to try to logically argue with a christian, anything you point out with facts, "God created it so" so logically arguing with them is useless, they have absolutely no sense of logic. To them "god created everything".


I take offense to that. I'm Catholic, but I'm open to your point of view, because I'm struggling myself. Stop stereotyping Catholics.

As you said earlier, many things in science are unknown, like what caused the bang that caused the big bang. God is an answer, but it also makes no sense because there's always the question of what caused God?

If there's no answer, we all have to search for our own. People who believe in God and people who don't are all still looking for an answer to their questions. It's all just a sense of perspective.

In history, there have been different times where things have happened to support God, such as the story of Fatima or Guatemala. There's also evidence to disprove God, like wars and death of children. You can't fully prove God with logic or concrete evidence, but you can't disprove him with logic or concrete evidence either.

In my opinion, people who believe in God do great things. Priests and nuns give people hope and calm their fears. Missionaries try to help the poor and the suffering. Religion is not all bad.



I take offense to that. I'm Catholic, but I'm open to your point of view, because I'm struggling myself. Stop stereotyping Catholics.


I don't really care if I offended you. That's 100% your problem if you get offended. And I'm not singling out catholics, it was a general term that would apply to prodastant as well.


If there's no answer, we all have to search for our own. People who believe in God and people who don't are all still looking for an answer to their questions. It's all just a sense of perspective.


Any answer to any question was found out somehow by someone in some mannor. Answers do not simply appear, so yes they need to be found.


In history, there have been different times where things have happened to support God, such as the story of Fatima or Guatemala. There's also evidence to disprove God, like wars and death of children. You can't fully prove God with logic or concrete evidence, but you can't disprove him with logic or concrete evidence either.


While that is true,that raises a question "why believe in something that might not exist" ? If it can't be proved nor disproved, why worship it and spend your life praying and doing all that stuff, if the possibility exists that it's all for nothing ?


In my opinion, people who believe in God do great things. Priests and nuns give people hope and calm their fears. Missionaries try to help the poor and the suffering. Religion is not all bad.


Sure, but religion is also the cause for mass suffering and deaths, lots of wars have been started over religion, thus lots of people have died because of it as well, It has caused lots off suffering too. So its not purely a good thing now is it ?
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Posted 1/3/09

Allhailodin wrote:


Human beings are animals, just as monkeys are animals, we are just an animal with a higher form of intelligence. But the fact is the gene difference between human and monkeys is only 2%. And yes, monkeys are intelligent, but just not at the same level as us. Dignity means nothing.


okay. let me rephrase. Are we that simple that you equalize humans to monkeys? lets drop this. it would lead to topics like " if a monkey intelligent?"

however, i would like to go against "Dignity means nothing". If you read Giovanni Pico della Mirandolla's Oration on the Dignity of Man, you will find out that this very dignity makes us human. With dignity, you will know what self actualization is. But then again, let's drop this. It would be off topic.


Allhailodin

That is true, same applies to right and wrong, and good and evil, there is no definite right and wrong, as it's all personal opinion, which varies from person to person. Same with good and evil, its all personal opinion.


couldn't agree more. However, our conducts should be good in a way that we don't violate/offend someone.


Allhailodin
Your right, It is the fault of human beings, and since I don't believe in that magical man, i'm not putting any blame on it.

i agree with not blaming "the magical man". By this let me take this opportunity to inform you then that God didn't make this world screwed out of amusement or whatever reason regardless if you believe in God or not. People just tend to project as a defense mechanism when they screwed up.

example, a girl got pregnant early and her future was screwed up. She should not blame God because it was her decision that made her future screwed up. It is not God who allowed it to happen but herself. But then again, she can't accept the fact it was her fault so she finds fault on others and God, i think is a convenient scapegoat.

so, if you encounter a religious person doing that, just ignore him/her. His/her ignorance causes him/her to be that. With a sound mind, you know what is right.

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Posted 1/3/09

crunchypibb wrote:

To Thread Starter:
Yay, we have somebody who isn't stupid and can defend religious people (of all religions, I'm hoping).
Note to atheist:
Physical evidence is not the only evidence that exists out there. Actual a purely materialist world would be impossible because you would have to explain how gravity and other forces exist. And even if you can see them at a microscopic level doesn't mean you can explain their behaviors. Don't even get me started with consciousness either.

Pic unrelated

LoL. Don't praise me like that. In some aspect, I am stupid like math and love.

Everyone can defend his/her religion. Just don't be too emotional and start attacking someone.
Note: Do not force your religion, however, correct their misconceptions about your religion. I noticed a lot of people have severe misconceptions when it comes to religion.

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Posted 1/3/09

alupihan45 wrote:


crunchypibb wrote:

To Thread Starter:
Yay, we have somebody who isn't stupid and can defend religious people (of all religions, I'm hoping).
Note to atheist:
Physical evidence is not the only evidence that exists out there. Actual a purely materialist world would be impossible because you would have to explain how gravity and other forces exist. And even if you can see them at a microscopic level doesn't mean you can explain their behaviors. Don't even get me started with consciousness either.

Pic unrelated

LoL. Don't praise me like that. In some aspect, I am stupid like math and love.

Everyone can defend his/her religion. Just don't be too emotional and start attacking someone.
Note: Do not force your religion, however, correct their misconceptions about your religion. I noticed a lot of people have severe misconceptions when it comes to religion.



yes...people tend to have misconceptions on religions...and some 'religious people' tend to be a little too narrow minded sometimes too...which gets irritating XD...

i agree with ur first post, some people tend to think that we aren't really that logical.
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Posted 1/3/09

Allhailodin wrote:


comparing urself to a god would not prove much
because we percieve god as some being similar to humans....
but what god really is we cannot know.
comparing urself to god would be trying to comparing urself to the air around you.
that's how different god and us can be
so saying that god can be bored like us, though he is a more intelligent being, how would u know?
its just like trying to find out whether a ghost or spirit can get bored.
we don't know what god is made of. he could be completely different from us.
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Posted 1/3/09

Allhailodin wrote:


In history, there have been different times where things have happened to support God, such as the story of Fatima or Guatemala. There's also evidence to disprove God, like wars and death of children. You can't fully prove God with logic or concrete evidence, but you can't disprove him with logic or concrete evidence either.


While that is true,that raises a question "why believe in something that might not exist" ? If it can't be proved nor disproved, why worship it and spend your life praying and doing all that stuff, if the possibility exists that it's all for nothing ?


In my opinion, people who believe in God do great things. Priests and nuns give people hope and calm their fears. Missionaries try to help the poor and the suffering. Religion is not all bad.


Sure, but religion is also the cause for mass suffering and deaths, lots of wars have been started over religion, thus lots of people have died because of it as well, It has caused lots off suffering too. So its not purely a good thing now is it ?


people belive in something that might not exist that is because they need something to believe, they need something or someone to place their hopes on.
people long ago worshipped trees and animal spirits....

thats why people spend their effort, their life their energy worshipping, praying....even though it might be all for nothing.

the main cause of the war was the people...their perceptions, their attitudes on the religions. religion never started the war...
and if u would like to say that if there wasn't religion then it wouldn't have happened....

there will always be religion
because humans will be humans.

religion was never a good thing. it was just something for people to believe, though the believers of course will say its good.
but a belief can never be good. the belief can make people good or bad....but religion itself is neutral
it is words on a paper, it is something that influences people's minds....it is not a being in itself which can be judged as good or evil.
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