First  Prev  1  2  3  Next  Last
discovering religion and disccusion on the "newer" religions
4294 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
forgot where
Offline
Posted 2/23/09
I want to know how and why a religion comes to be. Does it start out from a philosophical point of view? what exatcly is a religion?Why do people join a religion?Why and how do they "discover" one?

All of these quesions are connected. to answer one is to answer them all.But i will make a point that this disccusion is geared toward the "unpopular""new" religions. The ones you have most likly never heard about.

Such as those guys who commit poligomy for religious reasons in a sec of Christianity.The guys who believe in the golden tablets found in the USA and Native Americans being lost Jews (i think they call them selves mormins).
The guys who stand out in funerals and spit on the coffins of soldiers during a funeral becuase they believe America is going to hell or whatever and i think they blame US soldiers for it.The guys who sit down and think of a purpose of life, and "discover" a religion and start discussing guidelines and rules. Guys who combine religion.ect. (all from secs of Christianity)

I am trying to be as non-bias and non-offensive as possible.I know this subject is extremely sensitive to some of you anti-theist, anthiest, and some religious people. If i need to reword some of my statements, then let me know.I tried to only pick on my on religion as to try and limit as many possible people i may have offended.

But i am only asking these questions out of ignorance and a willingness to learn. So enlighten me.Im basicially asking "why". your thoughts.

(btw, this isnt meant to be some religious or athiest bashing thread like 99.5% of the religious threads, im just here to clear my own ignorance through your knowledge. So since i dont have a filter for idiots, ignore them, most tend to be illogical ne way, so argueing with them is pointless)

peace over war
Scientist Moderator
digs 
48142 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
26 / M
Offline
Posted 2/23/09
Power... I think most world religions are based on someone wanting to gain power. Either they create their own beliefs (like suicide cults) or they abuse current ones (Like what Constantine did to Christianity and the Crusades). I believe that religion is only as evil as the individuals who abuse it. Some people formulate a personal "religion" based on their philosophical principals that they find as true or a morality code that they hold as acceptable for them. I believe that there is only One Truth and one True "Religion" (A personal relationship and following the teachings of Jesus the Christ).
15764 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
B.C., Canada
Offline
Posted 2/23/09
If you think about the Protestant split, its all because someone wanted something done differently, and they wanted it done "legitametly". That king (what's his name again?) just wanted a divorce, but the Catholic church wouldn't let him. So he went about creating his own branch of Christianity to have his way. I can't say for certain, but I imagine all these new religions that i haven't heard of operate in the same kind of way. People are just so desperate to be able to do whatever crazy things they want (like those suicide cults, for example) under the disguise of a religion. They want to make it more acceptable, is what I'm trying to say.

As for the "discovering a new religion part," that's probably because people are born into religions, and once they realize what they truly believe, they convert. Or just to be able to marry someone who is very religious, and unwilling to convert or abandon their religion.
4557 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
27 / M / Bermuda Triangle
Offline
Posted 2/23/09

Joe_003 wrote:

If you think about the Protestant split, its all because someone wanted something done differently, and they wanted it done "legitametly". That king (what's his name again?) just wanted a divorce, but the Catholic church wouldn't let him. So he went about creating his own branch of Christianity to have his way. I can't say for certain, but I imagine all these new religions that i haven't heard of operate in the same kind of way. People are just so desperate to be able to do whatever crazy things they want (like those suicide cults, for example) under the disguise of a religion. They want to make it more acceptable, is what I'm trying to say.

As for the "discovering a new religion part," that's probably because people are born into religions, and once they realize what they truly believe, they convert. Or just to be able to marry someone who is very religious, and unwilling to convert or abandon their religion.


You think there's a lot of christian branches of religion, just look into Hinduism.
15764 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
B.C., Canada
Offline
Posted 2/23/09

crunchypibb wrote:


Joe_003 wrote:

If you think about the Protestant split, its all because someone wanted something done differently, and they wanted it done "legitametly". That king (what's his name again?) just wanted a divorce, but the Catholic church wouldn't let him. So he went about creating his own branch of Christianity to have his way. I can't say for certain, but I imagine all these new religions that i haven't heard of operate in the same kind of way. People are just so desperate to be able to do whatever crazy things they want (like those suicide cults, for example) under the disguise of a religion. They want to make it more acceptable, is what I'm trying to say.

As for the "discovering a new religion part," that's probably because people are born into religions, and once they realize what they truly believe, they convert. Or just to be able to marry someone who is very religious, and unwilling to convert or abandon their religion.


You think there's a lot of christian branches of religion, just look into Hinduism.


I can't say much about Hinduism, I don't know very much. Hell, I don't know anything about Hinduism. Can you tell me something about it?
4557 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
27 / M / Bermuda Triangle
Offline
Posted 2/23/09

Joe_003 wrote:


crunchypibb wrote:


Joe_003 wrote:

If you think about the Protestant split, its all because someone wanted something done differently, and they wanted it done "legitametly". That king (what's his name again?) just wanted a divorce, but the Catholic church wouldn't let him. So he went about creating his own branch of Christianity to have his way. I can't say for certain, but I imagine all these new religions that i haven't heard of operate in the same kind of way. People are just so desperate to be able to do whatever crazy things they want (like those suicide cults, for example) under the disguise of a religion. They want to make it more acceptable, is what I'm trying to say.

As for the "discovering a new religion part," that's probably because people are born into religions, and once they realize what they truly believe, they convert. Or just to be able to marry someone who is very religious, and unwilling to convert or abandon their religion.


You think there's a lot of christian branches of religion, just look into Hinduism.


I can't say much about Hinduism, I don't know very much. Hell, I don't know anything about Hinduism. Can you tell me something about it?


Well I learned a little about it from this white guy wearing an orange monk outfit. It's similar to Buddism in the sense that there is reincarnation and that if everyone had their inner peace and all life their spiritual life would florish, but instead of going into nirvana they go to heaven. That's what I've learned from one school of Hinduism. Apparently there are many, many, schools of hinduism. Plus there are many avatars out there who tell us how we should live, Jesus being one of them (from the guy I talked to concerning his school). Some believing in a god, gods, or no god. The belief system between the different sects of hinduism is in my opinion way more broader than the christian sects.
15764 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
B.C., Canada
Offline
Posted 2/23/09


What? It's not even decided if there is one god, multiple gods, or on god? That's pretty... open ended. I've always though tof the Christian divisions as the same thing with some tweaks, such as whether or not the Eucharist is a symbol of Jesus or if it is literaly Jesus' body.
4557 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
27 / M / Bermuda Triangle
Offline
Posted 2/23/09

Joe_003 wrote:



What? It's not even decided if there is one god, multiple gods, or on god? That's pretty... open ended. I've always though tof the Christian divisions as the same thing with some tweaks, such as whether or not the Eucharist is a symbol of Jesus or if it is literaly Jesus' body.


There dispute about that kind of stuff about the Eucharist and stuff. It's just Hinduism is more broad, basically you just find a way to make inner peace so you don't get screwed in reincarnation. That's what I know.
Posted 2/23/09

crunchypibb wrote:


Joe_003 wrote:

If you think about the Protestant split, its all because someone wanted something done differently, and they wanted it done "legitametly". That king (what's his name again?) just wanted a divorce, but the Catholic church wouldn't let him. So he went about creating his own branch of Christianity to have his way. I can't say for certain, but I imagine all these new religions that i haven't heard of operate in the same kind of way. People are just so desperate to be able to do whatever crazy things they want (like those suicide cults, for example) under the disguise of a religion. They want to make it more acceptable, is what I'm trying to say.

As for the "discovering a new religion part," that's probably because people are born into religions, and once they realize what they truly believe, they convert. Or just to be able to marry someone who is very religious, and unwilling to convert or abandon their religion.


You think there's a lot of christian branches of religion, just look into Hinduism.


The whole idea of religion itself comes from one single root, Jesus was not the first mythical figure to go through the whole life-death-rebirth thing, there were a few others that existed before Christ and Christianity came about, and they all seem to have similar themes in regards to having most of the staples of what is written in the bible. (Virgin birth, son of god, his death and then resurrection, and of course an eventual apocalypse). I view religion and all its branches as intellectual bondage, holding humanity back and creating a more dangerous world. If anything should be worshiped or praised it is the sun,moon and stars which truly gave us life. I know I will not see a world free of "bad religion" in my lifetime and believe it will take a self fulfilled prophecy to bring us back onto a more level plane in terms of what we consider to be fact and fiction and how fickle certain beliefs are.
4557 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
27 / M / Bermuda Triangle
Offline
Posted 2/24/09 , edited 2/24/09

superninjaboy wrote:


crunchypibb wrote:


Joe_003 wrote:

If you think about the Protestant split, its all because someone wanted something done differently, and they wanted it done "legitametly". That king (what's his name again?) just wanted a divorce, but the Catholic church wouldn't let him. So he went about creating his own branch of Christianity to have his way. I can't say for certain, but I imagine all these new religions that i haven't heard of operate in the same kind of way. People are just so desperate to be able to do whatever crazy things they want (like those suicide cults, for example) under the disguise of a religion. They want to make it more acceptable, is what I'm trying to say.

As for the "discovering a new religion part," that's probably because people are born into religions, and once they realize what they truly believe, they convert. Or just to be able to marry someone who is very religious, and unwilling to convert or abandon their religion.


You think there's a lot of christian branches of religion, just look into Hinduism.


The whole idea of religion itself comes from one single root, Jesus was not the first mythical figure to go through the whole life-death-rebirth thing, there were a few others that existed before Christ and Christianity came about, and they all seem to have similar themes in regards to having most of the staples of what is written in the bible. (Virgin birth, son of god, his death and then resurrection, and of course an eventual apocalypse). I view religion and all its branches as intellectual bondage, holding humanity back and creating a more dangerous world. If anything should be worshiped or praised it is the sun,moon and stars which truly gave us life. I know I will not see a world free of "bad religion" in my lifetime and believe it will take a self fulfilled prophecy to bring us back onto a more level plane in terms of what we consider to be fact and fiction and how fickle certain beliefs are.


-I suppose that's an easy reason to doubt religion. But you seem to be so very general in the first part of you statement, I have heard of stuff like that in other religions but you can point out which ones?
-Exactly how is religion holding people back? Be more specific.
-We don't worship the sun, the moon, or the stars because they're not recognized as conscious metaphysical beings. Although you can do that on your own time for all I care.
-What exactly is bad religion, you've been so blantent in this whole response and what kind of evidence makes you think that we'd be going backwards? I mean if you're going to bash all the religions at once at least be specific. I can give a response on why an atheistic belief overall doesn't help people in the longrun much better than what you just gave me.
4557 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
27 / M / Bermuda Triangle
Offline
Posted 2/24/09

digs wrote:

Power... I think most world religions are based on someone wanting to gain power. Either they create their own beliefs (like suicide cults) or they abuse current ones (Like what Constantine did to Christianity and the Crusades). I believe that religion is only as evil as the individuals who abuse it. Some people formulate a personal "religion" based on their philosophical principals that they find as true or a morality code that they hold as acceptable for them. I believe that there is only One Truth and one True "Religion" (A personal relationship and following the teachings of Jesus the Christ).


-personal religion? Do you know the difference between a religion and a philosophy? Buddhism is often mistaken for a religion when in reality it's just a philosophy towards life.
-One true religion, hmm and i'm guessing that's christianity right? Okay if so, which one?
-As far as "evil" religions go, rule #15 of the internet is so true believe it or not and anything that can be corrupted you can also purify it as well, at least for the base foundations of what it was founded upon so long it didn't have an evil intent in the beginning in my opinion.
Scientist Moderator
digs 
48142 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
26 / M
Offline
Posted 2/24/09

crunchypibb wrote:


digs wrote:

Power... I think most world religions are based on someone wanting to gain power. Either they create their own beliefs (like suicide cults) or they abuse current ones (Like what Constantine did to Christianity and the Crusades). I believe that religion is only as evil as the individuals who abuse it. Some people formulate a personal "religion" based on their philosophical principals that they find as true or a morality code that they hold as acceptable for them. I believe that there is only One Truth and one True "Religion" (A personal relationship and following the teachings of Jesus the Christ).


-personal religion? Do you know the difference between a religion and a philosophy? Buddhism is often mistaken for a religion when in reality it's just a philosophy towards life.
-One true religion, hmm and i'm guessing that's christianity right? Okay if so, which one?
-As far as "evil" religions go, rule #15 of the internet is so true believe it or not and anything that can be corrupted you can also purify it as well, at least for the base foundations of what it was founded upon so long it didn't have an evil intent in the beginning in my opinion.


By personal religion I mean people who take their philosophies and moral code and use that as their guidelines for life. This can be atheism or agnosticism. Not necessarily a religious sect. And Buddhism is a religion in some sects because they believe in spirits and gods (I think its called Theravada, I may be wrong though). Buddhism apart from the deities is a form of philosophy though.

And yes, by that I do mean Christianity, but I don't adhere to a specific denomination (I am non-denominational and I form my beliefs about God only on what is in the Bible). Of course I believe all who repent in Jesus Name are forgiven and thus become Christians (I do not believe that all denominations are going to hell or that everyone is wrong but me).

And I agree with your last point.
18663 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
36 / M / Small Wooded town...
Offline
Posted 2/24/09

Joe_003 wrote:

If you think about the Protestant split, its all because someone wanted something done differently, and they wanted it done "legitametly". That king (what's his name again?) just wanted a divorce, but the Catholic church wouldn't let him. So he went about creating his own branch of Christianity to have his way. I can't say for certain, but I imagine all these new religions that i haven't heard of operate in the same kind of way. People are just so desperate to be able to do whatever crazy things they want (like those suicide cults, for example) under the disguise of a religion. They want to make it more acceptable, is what I'm trying to say.

As for the "discovering a new religion part," that's probably because people are born into religions, and once they realize what they truly believe, they convert. Or just to be able to marry someone who is very religious, and unwilling to convert or abandon their religion.


Did you know Christianity it self Derived from many Pagan Religoins put together. AT that Christianity could be counted as a cult/bastard Child of the pagan religions, that over time got bigger than its pops.



4557 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
27 / M / Bermuda Triangle
Offline
Posted 2/24/09

digs wrote:


crunchypibb wrote:


digs wrote:

Power... I think most world religions are based on someone wanting to gain power. Either they create their own beliefs (like suicide cults) or they abuse current ones (Like what Constantine did to Christianity and the Crusades). I believe that religion is only as evil as the individuals who abuse it. Some people formulate a personal "religion" based on their philosophical principals that they find as true or a morality code that they hold as acceptable for them. I believe that there is only One Truth and one True "Religion" (A personal relationship and following the teachings of Jesus the Christ).


-personal religion? Do you know the difference between a religion and a philosophy? Buddhism is often mistaken for a religion when in reality it's just a philosophy towards life.
-One true religion, hmm and i'm guessing that's christianity right? Okay if so, which one?
-As far as "evil" religions go, rule #15 of the internet is so true believe it or not and anything that can be corrupted you can also purify it as well, at least for the base foundations of what it was founded upon so long it didn't have an evil intent in the beginning in my opinion.


By personal religion I mean people who take their philosophies and moral code and use that as their guidelines for life. This can be atheism or agnosticism. Not necessarily a religious sect. And Buddhism is a religion in some sects because they believe in spirits and gods (I think its called Theravada, I may be wrong though). Buddhism apart from the deities is a form of philosophy though.

And yes, by that I do mean Christianity, but I don't adhere to a specific denomination (I am non-denominational and I form my beliefs about God only on what is in the Bible). Of course I believe all who repent in Jesus Name are forgiven and thus become Christians (I do not believe that all denominations are going to hell or that everyone is wrong but me).

And I agree with your last point.


But atheism and agnosticism don't involve a god. By using the term personal religion you imply that there is a god involved. Therefore you are flawed in your own explaination. But ya, it's true that Buddism, depending on what sect you're part of, can either be a religion or philosophy.

Well, every christian sect refers to the bible, so that brings you no where. So if I'm an atheist and ask for Jesus to forgive me on my death bed even if I never believed in anything in the bible, I can still be christian? If you believe in every christian sect than that would mean you believe every explain from each christian sect is correct, even if they contradict themselves. But that would never make sense. Explain to me how this paradox can exist.
Scientist Moderator
digs 
48142 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
26 / M
Offline
Posted 2/24/09

crunchypibb wrote:


digs wrote:


crunchypibb wrote:


digs wrote:

Power... I think most world religions are based on someone wanting to gain power. Either they create their own beliefs (like suicide cults) or they abuse current ones (Like what Constantine did to Christianity and the Crusades). I believe that religion is only as evil as the individuals who abuse it. Some people formulate a personal "religion" based on their philosophical principals that they find as true or a morality code that they hold as acceptable for them. I believe that there is only One Truth and one True "Religion" (A personal relationship and following the teachings of Jesus the Christ).


-personal religion? Do you know the difference between a religion and a philosophy? Buddhism is often mistaken for a religion when in reality it's just a philosophy towards life.
-One true religion, hmm and i'm guessing that's christianity right? Okay if so, which one?
-As far as "evil" religions go, rule #15 of the internet is so true believe it or not and anything that can be corrupted you can also purify it as well, at least for the base foundations of what it was founded upon so long it didn't have an evil intent in the beginning in my opinion.


By personal religion I mean people who take their philosophies and moral code and use that as their guidelines for life. This can be atheism or agnosticism. Not necessarily a religious sect. And Buddhism is a religion in some sects because they believe in spirits and gods (I think its called Theravada, I may be wrong though). Buddhism apart from the deities is a form of philosophy though.

And yes, by that I do mean Christianity, but I don't adhere to a specific denomination (I am non-denominational and I form my beliefs about God only on what is in the Bible). Of course I believe all who repent in Jesus Name are forgiven and thus become Christians (I do not believe that all denominations are going to hell or that everyone is wrong but me).

And I agree with your last point.


But atheism and agnosticism don't involve a god. By using the term personal religion you imply that there is a god involved. Therefore you are flawed in your own explaination. But ya, it's true that Buddism, depending on what sect you're part of, can either be a religion or philosophy.

Well, every christian sect refers to the bible, so that brings you no where. So if I'm an atheist and ask for Jesus to forgive me on my death bed even if I never believed in anything in the bible, I can still be christian? If you believe in every christian sect than that would mean you believe every explain from each christian sect is correct, even if they contradict themselves. But that would never make sense. Explain to me how this paradox can exist.


By personal religion I am not implying God, I am implying that that is their beliefs. And agnostics can believe in a god, I know a few who hold a deistic agnostic view.

Not every Christian sect refers to the Bible, some believe in new prophets (Like in Mormonism) and some believe in the deification of men (like Catholicism and the Pope/Papacy). Most sects refer to the Bible, but they interpret the messages and verses differently. I personally do not adhere to the teachings of any set denomination and I don't claim to know everything about God (I am still learning an God is still teaching me). Christianity has become an event and not a way of life, I believe that the message of Jesus is not about rituals or churches but about a personal relationship with God through Jesus Christ. Some Christian sects will hold to certain parts of the Bible and ignore others, and some are manipulated by the pride of men. Denominations are things that man makes and tries to apply with the Bible. Where I don't believe that denominations are evil, I do believe that they can be flawed because they are dependent on how a select few people interpret the Bible. Humans are flawed and can interpret an unflawed source fraudulently. The Bible is the direct words of God, denominations are the direct works of theologians (men who apply their theology to church congregations).
First  Prev  1  2  3  Next  Last
You must be logged in to post.