Remove this ad
First  Prev  1  2  3  4  5  6  7  8  9  Next  Last
Unit 731 - Worse than the Holocaust?
Posted 3/21/09

LemonyPanda wrote:


CecilTheDarkKnight_234 wrote:

Meh that's messed up but lets face all countries that are in war or have been at war like now have down horrible to POW ( prisoners of war), look at what the united states did to the gitmo captives. It's just the way things are but to categorize a whole people by the horrible actions of there government is not a way to judge some one personally and it never will be.


ARE YOU SERIOUS

POW's are treated like prisoners but they don't make fucking test subjects out of them

In fact, Americans treated the german POW's better than the their African American soldiers


yeah I really am it's no surprise to me that this happened at all the Germans did the same thing to to the Jews at the camps man. Also this happened over 60 years ago and well my policy on life is shit happens. As much as it sickens me to say there discoverers helped further medicine that we use to day. Also German Pow's where white and there was no racial grudge against them so yeah they where going to be treated better. The last thing I am going to say is a lot of the people in Japan that did do this are either dead or 70-80 years old now and will die eventually so they will get what the deserve in hell, also to hold them responsible now is no good because they youth is kept in dark about this. Also who really knows what goes on during war expect what where are told from history books or film footage and i go to say that does not show the whole pic.
Posted 3/21/09

o0James0o wrote:

...heck, im chinese, but i have to say, this is very humane action during wartime and only wartime could such thing be accomplished without any opposition. nothing is wrong with it. the winner is always righteous...


You should probably understand the term "humane" before you use it so willingly in your post.

hu·mane (hy-mn)
adj.
1. Characterized by kindness, mercy, or compassion

I see no kindness, mercy or compassion in the actions of the scientists of Unit731, can you honestly say you can?


o0James0o wrote:

without the contributions of japanese and germans on the human experiments, our science would be decades below what we have now.


Alot of the data was produced from weapons testing and germ warfare testing on the prisoners. From 1945 to present day, we have had no need for any data of the sort and these experimentations have just simply been a massive waste of life, innocent or not.


o0James0o wrote:

if your argument is that theyre killing "innocent civilians", i must say, theyre not innocent at all. in a total war, or any war, civilians helps the army. hence, civilians are not innocent at any sense. also, by the saying "innocent civilians", that means all the other "non-innocent war combatants" are free to experiment and kill on?


Of course! All the women and children were obviously aiding the enemy military, so therefore they deserve to be unwillingly impregnated and disected; used as human targets to test grenades; limbs removed and reattached elsewhere on the body; etc.

Combatant or civilian, no one deserves to be tortured to death under the false clause "in the name of science".

Yes, you may argue that other atrocities where countless more lives were exhausted have been over-looked and that it is within "human nature" to MFKR, but this doesn't make it any better.

And finally...


o0James0o wrote:

really? and what might be called human beings? you do know that your ancestors might be cannibals, correct? hmm, whats better? eating humans to survive or experimenting on humans to survive? pick one...


Humanity as a whole has evolved to become a more civilised and ethical species (apart from the obvious exceptions: the holocaust, etc), what used to be acceptable is no longer acceptable through social taboos.

"eating humans to survive or experimenting on humans to survive? pick one..." Hahaha. Neither? Experimentation on humans is not required for the survival of the human race; animal vivisection exists for a purpose. Did you know that chimpanzees share 99% of our DNA with us? I'm not saying I condone animal vivisection, but if forced to choose between that or human experimentation, so be it.

In conclusion, your arguement is whack. Share whatever it is that you are smoking, if you would be so kind.
13118 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
24 / M / United States
Offline
Posted 3/21/09
You can't compare which was worse. I'd say that they're about equal in terms of crimes against humanity.
13262 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
21 / M / O.C. So.Cal
Offline
Posted 3/21/09

CecilTheDarkKnight_234 wrote:


LemonyPanda wrote:


CecilTheDarkKnight_234 wrote:

Meh that's messed up but lets face all countries that are in war or have been at war like now have down horrible to POW ( prisoners of war), look at what the united states did to the gitmo captives. It's just the way things are but to categorize a whole people by the horrible actions of there government is not a way to judge some one personally and it never will be.


ARE YOU SERIOUS

POW's are treated like prisoners but they don't make fucking test subjects out of them

In fact, Americans treated the german POW's better than the their African American soldiers


yeah I really am it's no surprise to me that this happened at all the Germans did the same thing to to the Jews at the camps man. Also this happened over 60 years ago and well my policy on life is shit happens. As much as it sickens me to say there discoverers helped further medicine that we use to day. Also German Pow's where white and there was no racial grudge against them so yeah they where going to be treated better. The last thing I am going to say is a lot of the people in Japan that did do this are either dead or 70-80 years old now and will die eventually so they will get what the deserve in hell, also to hold them responsible now is no good because they youth is kept in dark about this. Also who really knows what goes on during war expect what where are told from history books or film footage and i go to say that does not show the whole pic.



THe holocaust was more in number but this was worse in torture. The holocaust was made just for killing not torturing. In fact this wasn't even about torturing, it was using them as TEST SUBJECTS. There was a quote in that documentary saying how they thought of the dead bodies just as logs when burning them.

no, there were no discoveries being made for medicine, it was figuring out the best methods of killing. They tested out flamethrowers, threw grenades in rooms with people in it to see which angle the explosion hit the best, cut off limbs of people to see how long they could survive by bleeding to death, testing biological weapons on people and cutting up the corpse to see how exactly it affected them, purposely injecting ghonorrhea and syphilis to see what would happen, and some pointless expermints such as injecting horse urine into their kidneys, injecting salt water into their blood stream, cutting off limbs and re arranging them to see what would happen. and trust me there were WAY more experminents, too much for me to list. I don't see how this would help medicine in any way...

Yes I know the younger generation has nothing to do with this but their parents fully supported hirohito, the one behind all of this. SOME (not saying all) of those parents still instill those values in their children, as we can see how Japan still thinks they own Dokdo island, but thats a whole different debate
13328 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
21 / M / Terra
Offline
Posted 3/21/09 , edited 3/21/09

Junglizm wrote:




o0James0o wrote:

...heck, im chinese, but i have to say, this is very humane action during wartime and only wartime could such thing be accomplished without any opposition. nothing is wrong with it. the winner is always righteous...


You should probably understand the term "humane" before you use it so willingly in your post.

hu·mane (hy-mn)
adj.
1. Characterized by kindness, mercy, or compassion

I see no kindness, mercy or compassion in the actions of the scientists of Unit731, can you honestly say you can?

hmm, i believe youre definition is incorrect. to me, humane means "having qualities befitting human beings"


o0James0o wrote:

without the contributions of japanese and germans on the human experiments, our science would be decades below what we have now.


Alot of the data was produced from weapons testing and germ warfare testing on the prisoners. From 1945 to present day, we have had no need for any data of the sort and these experimentations have just simply been a massive waste of life, innocent or not.

hmm, so youre saying that it is better to test on the "outcasts" instead of the "majority"? sir, i do think that this was done in WWII, and that is before 1945. also, it is not a waste of life, for life is easy to replenish itself and it is for the good of humanity. also, it helps decrease the population -- for a while, that is.



o0James0o wrote:

if your argument is that theyre killing "innocent civilians", i must say, theyre not innocent at all. in a total war, or any war, civilians helps the army. hence, civilians are not innocent at any sense. also, by the saying "innocent civilians", that means all the other "non-innocent war combatants" are free to experiment and kill on?


Of course! All the women and children were obviously aiding the enemy military, so therefore they deserve to be unwillingly impregnated and disected; used as human targets to test grenades; limbs removed and reattached elsewhere on the body; etc.

Combatant or civilian, no one deserves to be tortured to death under the false clause "in the name of science".

Yes, you may argue that other atrocities where countless more lives were exhausted have been over-looked and that it is within "human nature" to MFKR, but this doesn't make it any better.

And finally...

spoils of war sir, spoils of war.
rape helps one's soldiers relax their sexual desires. hence, they would listen to orders better.
dissections helps the scientists study the human body better, hence, saving more people in the long run --- after the war, and during the war , on one's own army, that is, unless the data is leaked.
aye sir, using live human as guinea pigs would give the best results in any human related experiments.

so youre saying that you ought waste a bullet and shot the person one the head for a quick death? heck, we can accomplish much more with other methods and theyre going to die anyways. so whats the difference?

and it doesnt make it any worse, or does it?


o0James0o wrote:

really? and what might be called human beings? you do know that your ancestors might be cannibals, correct? hmm, whats better? eating humans to survive or experimenting on humans to survive? pick one...


Humanity as a whole has evolved to become a more civilised and ethical species (apart from the obvious exceptions: the holocaust, etc), what used to be acceptable is no longer acceptable through social taboos.


"eating humans to survive or experimenting on humans to survive? pick one..." Hahaha. Neither? Experimentation on humans is not required for the survival of the human race; animal vivisection exists for a purpose. Did you know that chimpanzees share 99% of our DNA with us? I'm not saying I condone animal vivisection, but if forced to choose between that or human experimentation, so be it.

In conclusion, your arguement is whack. Share whatever it is that you are smoking, if you would be so kind.

and that is the reason why our brain size is smaller than those of cro magnon's.

neither is not a choice, sir. experimenting on human helps the race survive... really, what gives better results? humans or animals that are somewhat like humans?
10521 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
24 / M / In your room stea...
Offline
Posted 3/21/09 , edited 3/21/09

LemonyPanda wrote:


CecilTheDarkKnight_234 wrote:


LemonyPanda wrote:


CecilTheDarkKnight_234 wrote:

Meh that's messed up but lets face all countries that are in war or have been at war like now have down horrible to POW ( prisoners of war), look at what the united states did to the gitmo captives. It's just the way things are but to categorize a whole people by the horrible actions of there government is not a way to judge some one personally and it never will be.


ARE YOU SERIOUS

POW's are treated like prisoners but they don't make fucking test subjects out of them

In fact, Americans treated the german POW's better than the their African American soldiers


yeah I really am it's no surprise to me that this happened at all the Germans did the same thing to to the Jews at the camps man. Also this happened over 60 years ago and well my policy on life is shit happens. As much as it sickens me to say there discoverers helped further medicine that we use to day. Also German Pow's where white and there was no racial grudge against them so yeah they where going to be treated better. The last thing I am going to say is a lot of the people in Japan that did do this are either dead or 70-80 years old now and will die eventually so they will get what the deserve in hell, also to hold them responsible now is no good because they youth is kept in dark about this. Also who really knows what goes on during war expect what where are told from history books or film footage and i go to say that does not show the whole pic.



THe holocaust was more in number but this was worse in torture. The holocaust was made just for killing not torturing. In fact this wasn't even about torturing, it was using them as TEST SUBJECTS. There was a quote in that documentary saying how they thought of the dead bodies just as logs when burning them.

no, there were no discoveries being made for medicine, it was figuring out the best methods of killing. They tested out flamethrowers, threw grenades in rooms with people in it to see which angle the explosion hit the best, cut off limbs of people to see how long they could survive by bleeding to death, testing biological weapons on people and cutting up the corpse to see how exactly it affected them, purposely injecting ghonorrhea and syphilis to see what would happen, and some pointless expermints such as injecting horse urine into their kidneys, injecting salt water into their blood stream, cutting off limbs and re arranging them to see what would happen. and trust me there were WAY more experminents, too much for me to list. I don't see how this would help medicine in any way...

Yes I know the younger generation has nothing to do with this but their parents fully supported hirohito, the one behind all of this. SOME (not saying all) of those parents still instill those values in their children, as we can see how Japan still thinks they own Dokdo island, but thats a whole different debate


Progress can't be made without experimenting dude.
Yei
9137 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
114
Offline
Posted 3/21/09

Allhailodin wrote:

Progress can't be made without experimenting dude.


I really hope you're not implying that this was okay....
10521 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
24 / M / In your room stea...
Offline
Posted 3/21/09 , edited 3/21/09

Yei wrote:


Allhailodin wrote:

Progress can't be made without experimenting dude.


I really hope you're not implying that this was okay....


Well it was useful, the data they gathered from their experiments was rather useful I'd say. Useful for a number of reasons, medical science for one.
Yei
9137 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
114
Offline
Posted 3/21/09

Allhailodin wrote:


Yei wrote:


Allhailodin wrote:

Progress can't be made without experimenting dude.


I really hope you're not implying that this was okay....


Well it was useful, the data they gathered from their experiments was rather useful I'd say. Useful for a number of reasons, medical science for one.


Okay, even though they were trying to figure out biological warfare, I guess some of it is useful, but that doesn't make what was done okay.
10521 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
24 / M / In your room stea...
Offline
Posted 3/21/09 , edited 3/21/09

Yei wrote:


Allhailodin wrote:


Yei wrote:


Allhailodin wrote:

Progress can't be made without experimenting dude.


I really hope you're not implying that this was okay....


Well it was useful, the data they gathered from their experiments was rather useful I'd say. Useful for a number of reasons, medical science for one.


Okay, even though they were trying to figure out biological warfare, I guess some of it is useful, but that doesn't make what was done okay.



Well it wasn't exactly wrong either, progress can't be made without sacrifice.
Posted 3/21/09

Allhailodin wrote:

Well it was useful, the data they gathered from their experiments was rather useful I'd say. Useful for a number of reasons, medical science for one.


Okay, tell me one useful thing we could pick out from those experiments. Just one will do. "Medical sciences" is a broad term, too broad to indicate what positive effects injecting horse piss in someone's blood had in this field.
10521 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
24 / M / In your room stea...
Offline
Posted 3/21/09

ShroomInferno wrote:


Allhailodin wrote:

Well it was useful, the data they gathered from their experiments was rather useful I'd say. Useful for a number of reasons, medical science for one.


Okay, tell me one useful thing we could pick out from those experiments. Just one will do. "Medical sciences" is a broad term, too broad to indicate what positive effects injecting horse piss in someone's blood had in this field.


1.) the info from the shrapnel wound experiments are useful because it shows 1, what happens if gone untreated, and 2 how to treat them in the future.
Yei
9137 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
114
Offline
Posted 3/21/09

Allhailodin wrote:


Yei wrote:


Allhailodin wrote:


Yei wrote:


Allhailodin wrote:

Progress can't be made without experimenting dude.


I really hope you're not implying that this was okay....


Well it was useful, the data they gathered from their experiments was rather useful I'd say. Useful for a number of reasons, medical science for one.


Okay, even though they were trying to figure out biological warfare, I guess some of it is useful, but that doesn't make what was done okay.



Well it wasn't exactly wrong either, progress can't be made without sacrifice.


Oh yeah, it wasn't exactly wrong... And what do you think about the Holocaust and slavery? Were they okay as well?
Posted 3/21/09 , edited 3/21/09

o0James0o wrote:

hmm, i believe youre definition is incorrect. to me, humane means "having qualities befitting human beings"


Well, yes; but this would mean you are contradicting yourself:

humane definition

hu·mane (hyo̵̅o̅ mān′, yo̵̅o̅-)

adjective

1. having what are considered the best qualities of human beings; kind, tender, merciful, sympathetic, etc.

All definitions of the word relate the qualities to being kind, compassionate, etc.. The experiments done on the prisoners were none of these things.


o0James0o wrote:

hmm, so youre saying that it is better to test on the "outcasts" instead of the "majority"? sir, i do think that this was done in WWII, and that is before 1945. also, it is not a waste of life, for life is easy to replenish itself and it is for the good of humanity. also, it helps decrease the population -- for a while, that is.


The date used, (1945) was the year the research ended and data collection ceased due to the unit closing. Since the closing of the facility, upto the current date, none of the germ-warfare and weapons testing experiments have aided us in what can be called our current technological age.

Mass murder is good for humanity? Please explain that point. Nature has its own ways of dealing with population growth, man does not need to get involved.

I don't understand what you mean when you talk about outcasts/majority. If you would mind explaining?


o0James0o wrote:

spoils of war sir, spoils of war.
rape helps one's soldiers relax their sexual desires. hence, they would listen to orders better.
dissections helps the scientists study the human body better, hence, saving more people in the long run --- after the war, and during the war , on one's own army, that is, unless the data is leaked.
aye sir, using live human as genuine pigs would give the best results in any human related experiments.


Soldiers that participate in rape are not soldiers you want in your army. They are likely to disobey orders and simply follow a path they choose, to achieve what they want.

The dissections could have been carried out post-mortem, without causing suffering and death; on corpses that were donated to science, not murdered in cold blood. I do understand that human dissections are indeed the best way to study the human body, but refuse to believe in live-dissections. Saving more lives in the long-run? Explain to me how amputating an arm and reattching it elsewhere will save a life, why these vivisections were carried out without even the use of anesthesia, why stomachs were removed when the scientists fully understood the consequences already, etc.


o0James0o wrote:

so youre saying that you ought waste a bullet and shot the person one the head for a quick death? heck, we can accomplish much more with other methods and theyre going to die anyways. so whats the difference?

and it doesnt make it any worse, or does it?


No... These are prisoners of war. Had the thought of letting them live ever cross your mind?


o0James0o wrote:

and that is the reason why our brain size is smaller than those of cro magnon's.

neither is not a choice, sir. experimenting on human helps the race survive... really, what gives better results? humans or animals that are somewhat like humans?


Experimenting on humans may help the race survive; but most of the experiements carried out by Unit731 are of no use to human survival at all: the injection of horse urine into kidneys, for example.

Once again, this all comes down to ethical reasoning. This is all highly unethical and condemned globally, and rightly so.


10521 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
24 / M / In your room stea...
Offline
Posted 3/21/09 , edited 3/21/09

Yei wrote:


Look you simply can't avoid human experimentation, without experimenting on humans, virtually nothing would be known about viruses and bacteria, and how they effect humans, and about how to prevent them, so if an outbreak occured, your utterly screwed, If you get sick your screwed as no cures or vaccines would exist. Human experimentation is unavoidable, well i guess you could just use chimps, as their our closest genetic reletaive, but some things might simply not effect chimps the same way they effect humans. Medical science wouldn't be anywhere near what it is today without human experimentation.

But the holocaust was just a mass murder.
First  Prev  1  2  3  4  5  6  7  8  9  Next  Last
You must be logged in to post.