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Post Reply Tatcis in playing Japanese mahjong
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Posted 4/18/09

lirg123 wrote:


BlargTheCat wrote:
Why do you think I put "(for noobs)" at the end of the sentence. I'm not an idiot ya know? I don't follow most of what I put down. You shoudn't run before you can walk. Don't ya think it's overwhelming when a beginner tries to figure out when to chi, pon, or kang while they remember the rules as they watch risky tiles? Some players, like me get pretty piss when somebody takes too long regardless of there level. When I first started playing, I only won with low fan wins. I say it's better to build up slowly, first get the idea of pon, chi, and kang AND THEN move on to more critical thinking. If they pon, chi, or kan, they won't have to worry 'bout it cos it's not removable. I am not giving advice to experienced (6 months at least) mah -jong players.


You really won with low fan? Do you mean the round or the entire game? Because i see it's going to be a long game, by simply earning small points. Could you explain what happen and the skill level of the other player?


I can't remember every single game I played using that system but what I do remember that it made the entire games more quickly to end for me and that I distinctly remember people swearing at me. As I believe, we both and many other players dislike playing with beginners because they make really low and embarrasing wins and we don't like that cos its fast and not savouring the game. The level of opponents don't really matter in this case not unless they are really really good so they know how to counter it.
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Posted 4/18/09

BlargTheCat wrote:

I can't remember every single game I played using that system but what I do remember that it made the entire games more quickly to end for me and that I distinctly remember people swearing at me. As I believe, we both and many other players dislike playing with beginners because they make really low and embarrasing wins and we don't like that cos its fast and not savouring the game. The level of opponents don't really matter in this case not unless they are really really good so they know how to counter it.


................... shocking, i would have never thought that playing for low points could really win the game.
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Posted 4/19/09

lirg123 wrote:


BlargTheCat wrote:

I can't remember every single game I played using that system but what I do remember that it made the entire games more quickly to end for me and that I distinctly remember people swearing at me. As I believe, we both and many other players dislike playing with beginners because they make really low and embarrasing wins and we don't like that cos its fast and not savouring the game. The level of opponents don't really matter in this case not unless they are really really good so they know how to counter it.


................... shocking, i would have never thought that playing for low points could really win the game.


Usually people think that the point of the game is to get as many point as possible. True. But one needs to remember there is a time limit and that every round, you restart. When you win, you stop people who could have potential in their hand to win. Most of the time, wins with higher points takes more longer to put to together. With a simpler win, you are most likely to get it together quickly and so stopping big potential hands from coming out. Since it usually takes less time to gather the tiles for a simple win, and if it is done continuously according to the plan, then the entire game would last less time. And even if someone gets lucky and makes a good win, you still got previous amounts of small win to neutralize it. This whole idea is based on chances.
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Posted 5/5/09


Usually people think that the point of the game is to get as many point as possible. True. But one needs to remember there is a time limit and that every round, you restart. When you win, you stop people who could have potential in their hand to win. Most of the time, wins with higher points takes more longer to put to together. With a simpler win, you are most likely to get it together quickly and so stopping big potential hands from coming out. Since it usually takes less time to gather the tiles for a simple win, and if it is done continuously according to the plan, then the entire game would last less time. And even if someone gets lucky and makes a good win, you still got previous amounts of small win to neutralize it. This whole idea is based on chances.


I dont agree that going for small wins, win the game! Sometimes it can be okay for stopping someone with a big hand but your missing the most important thing of the game DEFENCE. If your going for small wins its most likely to throw the winner to somebody else and you lose pionts instead of winning them. So its safer to play only big hands and for the rest of the game, play it safe.

Like i said before sometimes its okay to play it fast, e.g. when you are oya (dealer/eastwind) to stay dealer or destroy the big hand of somebody else, but in my opinion its better to play safe and then go for the big ones!!!
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Posted 5/5/09
And for beginners its better to keep their hands concealed unless they knew all the yaku (handpoints) cuz if they pon, chi, kan they might not get a handpoint and have lesser tiles to throw when somebody riichi!
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Posted 5/6/09

fujiwarabunta wrote:



Usually people think that the point of the game is to get as many point as possible. True. But one needs to remember there is a time limit and that every round, you restart. When you win, you stop people who could have potential in their hand to win. Most of the time, wins with higher points takes more longer to put to together. With a simpler win, you are most likely to get it together quickly and so stopping big potential hands from coming out. Since it usually takes less time to gather the tiles for a simple win, and if it is done continuously according to the plan, then the entire game would last less time. And even if someone gets lucky and makes a good win, you still got previous amounts of small win to neutralize it. This whole idea is based on chances.



I dont agree that going for small wins, win the game! Sometimes it can be okay for stopping someone with a big hand but your missing the most important thing of the game DEFENCE. If your going for small wins its most likely to throw the winner to somebody else and you lose pionts instead of winning them. So its safer to play only big hands and for the rest of the game, play it safe.

Like i said before sometimes its okay to play it fast, e.g. when you are oya (dealer/eastwind) to stay dealer or destroy the big hand of somebody else, but in my opinion its better to play safe and then go for the big ones!!!

There is no fully detailed to defence, it all comes down to what you have in your hand and what you know about your opponent's. This whole idea plays on the idea of percentage of chances. This method has the chances tipped in the user. Sure, if your opponents' are throwing the tiles that you can use, then there is more than a natural chance that the tiles you throw are tiles they want, but if they are going for a big hands, the harder it'll be to create the situation for them to win once you throw the tiles. Also, you might have more tiles they don't want because with easy wins, the requirements are less so you have more of a range to throw tiles while with big hands, the situations are more strict, so the range of tiles that aren't needed are less. As for a good defence, a good offence is a good defence. If you always win quickly, there won't be any need from stopping your opponent. You are not trying to survive by just not letting your opponent win, you're trying to win.
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Posted 5/20/09
I pretty much agree with what blarg said about playing defence and not just going for small hands. Especially if someone reached early and your hand is still a mess, there is no reason you shouldn't fold your hand because he will most likely win before you do. The only time you should go for a cheap hand is if you got a big lead on everyone else or if you know someone got a big hand and you wanna stop them by winning first. You would most likely want to do this only when you are east so you can keep your dealer, and because if the guy that reached gets a tsumo, you will lose double the amount of everyone anyways. As for detailed defensive strategies, there are actually a lot of them. Most written in here. http://www.osamuko.com/index.php/2009/02/18/umaikeiki-defense-guide-betaori-and-suji/
Basically it teaches you how to read your opponents waiting tiles and know what tiles are safe for you to discard, not only his furiten tiles. A example is, your opponent discards a 4 sou, you can assume the 1 sou and 7 sou is safe unless he's in a single wait or hell wait or shanpon which is unlikely.
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Posted 6/28/09
I've got a question to ask you guys. Who can say that their game has improved because of Saki.
I can say that thanks to Saki, I've gotten back into real Mahjong and I can safely say that I've actually staring to get the gist of it.
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Posted 8/2/09
On that game I keep getting Ron but it says No Multiplier don't really get what thats supposed to mean :S
anyone know?
don't worry i get what it meant now
my hand didn't make any Yaku
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Posted 8/13/09 , edited 8/13/09

Netstryke wrote:

I've got a question to ask you guys. Who can say that their game has improved because of Saki.
I can say that thanks to Saki, I've gotten back into real Mahjong and I can safely say that I've actually staring to get the gist of it.


....................................
What world do you live in? Saki teaches nothing about how to play or improve one skills. Just simply a group of people, that have special powers, going to the nationals in a very flashy way. Their is not teaching what's so ever.
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Posted 8/13/09
Well, I've played mahjong online (using the posted link and other places) for about 2 days (don't make any assumptions), and I think the thing that watching Saki does is motivate you to get those monster hands. Right after I finished watching the series, I skimmed the basic rules and list of hands in about an hour, then started playing. All it really does is get you excited about the game, so whenever you actually get something rare, you feel like you've achieved something.

In fact, I actually managed to get a Thirteen Orphans once (the one Kana got in the prequals) in the flash version. Great feeling
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Posted 8/13/09 , edited 8/13/09

morrownight wrote:

Well, I've played mahjong online (using the posted link and other places) for about 2 days (don't make any assumptions), and I think the thing that watching Saki does is motivate you to get those monster hands. Right after I finished watching the series, I skimmed the basic rules and list of hands in about an hour, then started playing. All it really does is get you excited about the game, so whenever you actually get something rare, you feel like you've achieved something.

In fact, I actually managed to get a Thirteen Orphans once (the one Kana got in the prequals) in the flash version. Great feeling :)


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Could you explain it in symble and characters?
Well if you are going for large numbers or something i had a few of these.


Dai-San-Gen (yakuman)
Three triplets of dragons

Chuu-Ren (yakuman)
1112345678999 and any tile

Suu-Kan-Tsu (yakuman)
Four Kans

Suu-An-Kou (yakuman)
Four consealed triplets

Well to sums it up, once i got a whole lot at once and became victorus. It's all based on luck and knowledge. It's difficult to have 4 pons on the 4 winds, which i did one time, it's all based on luck.
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Posted 8/14/09 , edited 8/14/09
Thirteen Orphans is where you have one of each terminal tile and one of each honor tile. The fourteenth tile can be paired with any of the thirteen. So it looks like this: 1 9 1 9 1 9 red d, green d, white d, east south west north + any terminal/honor tile.

I agree with you, it takes quite a bit of luck, and I know that hands like these are much more rarely seen in real life. But you increase your chances of getting a large hand the more you know which possible combinations there are. So the more familiar you are, the more accurately you can calculate the chances of getting a certain hand over another.

However, after I derived this I remembered in Saki that there are players like Nodoka who calculate their chances and play like machines, always going for the perfect balance between high scoring hands with risky waits and safer, lower-scoring hands. There are also people who purposely go for risky waits, no matter the situation. And yet there are the ones who always play it fast, going for small hands to end the game before others get a chance to accumulate a high-scorer, like mentioned above somewhere. Although there is a definite number of supernatural themes present in the anime, I believe Saki was able to convey all these general player-types, and is overall a very enjoyable and informative anime.
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Posted 8/29/09
From a Westerner's point of view, it seems very similar to the card game Rummy (especially Gin Rummy), except you're dealing with 13 tiles instead of 7 cards. But the strategies for getting sets, not revealing your hand and so on are pretty much the same.

And I can easily see a strategy for winning the game with little hands. If you get out to an early lead, you increase the pressure on your opponents to wait for bigger hands, which creates more opportunity for quick wins.
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Posted 9/6/09
tip for people that i've learnt while playing mahjong for nearly 2 months.

1st tip. If you have pair dragons of any kind keep them and make a pung/kong out of them. Which will give you 1 yaku allowing you to make a legal hand.

2nd tip. Don't chow and pung randomly or you will end up trapping urself. Either make a pung hand or a simple chow hand with no honours or terminals (no winds, no dragons and no 1 & 9s)

3rd tip. Always try for a richi unless they throw away tiles u need and u end up messing up ur hand. Easiest way of getting richi is doing sequence tiles(chow) such as 1,2,3 of the same type. Don't declare anything if you want a richi as well since it all has to be concealed.
also its good to keep a pair tile to finish off the richi quick.

4th tip. If you richi and your waiting for the last piece. Make sure its not a piece you have discarded before. This would mean ur furiten and you are totally doomed.

Also check up wiki on japanese mahjong hands for special hands like big dragon, all terminal, all honours, all green, 13 orphan.
Play the flash game first to get a quick grip of the game and if you want to play online, you can play on mahjongtime.com which i play on.
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