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The Universe, god can't have created it
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23 / M / Brisbane, Australia
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Posted 5/20/09 , edited 5/30/09


This is what a galaxy looks like. Our sun, doesnt even measure up to a pixel

only a mere little GALAXY!!! and our sun isnt even a pixel in the photo

our solar system is near the edge
do you think that if god made this galaxy, he would make the edge first??
it would make more sense to create the inner, more larger stars first



These are SOME of our solar system's planets
the distance inbetween the planets can not be shown
because if it were shown, you would not be able to see earth AT ALL

we are on the 3rd planet closest to the sun
do you think that if god made this solar system, he would make 3rd planet first??
would it not make sense if he made the sun first


Now imagine the size of our solar system
if a earth was a tennis ball
our solar system would be the size of a small country

Now Imagine the size of our galaxy
it takes light over 12000years to travel the diameter of our galaxy
(this means the galaxy is over 12000years old for us to beable to see light from the stars)

Now knowing how large and enormous one galaxy is
know that it has been calculated that there are over 500 BILLION GLAXIES in the universe
if there was a god, he would have long forgotten us, because we are so insignificant, that we have no impact on the continual changes and progess of the galaxy or our universe
We can never effect our galaxy or the universe, we mean nothing
We do not need to be created by someone, because that someone would have needed to be created



Finaly, imagine how many planets there are
and how many can support life
what are the other planets?? failed projects to build a habitat??
NO they are not, if there are billions of planets, atleast one of them would be able to support life





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22 / M / Sweden
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Posted 5/20/09
...at one point the universe was this big ||
It expanded after big bang and still is; good argument >.>
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23 / M / Somewhere.... per...
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Posted 5/20/09 , edited 5/20/09

Daniel9878 wrote:



This is what a galaxy looks like. Our sun, doesnt even measure up to a pixel

only a mere little GALAXY!!! and our sun isnt even a pixel in the photo

our solar system is near the edge
do you think that if god made this galaxy, he would make the edge first??
it would make more sense to create the inner, more larger stars first


.... Maybe... there is many god... coming together to make this galaxy...
and our god is in charge of completing our solar system which happen to be at the edge as you pointed out...
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25 / F / Georgia
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Posted 5/20/09
you remind me of Darkphoenix3450 lol
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M / Canada
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Posted 5/20/09
You aren't a pixel in that picture either. In fact more people believe in a god than directly in you therefore by that thread of logic you barely exist whereas god is a widely confirmed phenomenon.

Only fools think science and god are at odds as most intelligent scientists agree that the workings of the universe are so complex that even the most brilliant human beings are only capable of a mean understanding rather than the perfection of understanding that some people think modern science represents.

As for your other points you present your own assertions beside random pseudo scientific facts without any kind of logical support Ex:

"we are on the 3rd planet closest to the sun
do you think that if god made this solar system, he would make 3rd planet first??
would it not make sense if he made the sun first"

Which is equivalent in logical reasoning to saying:

Brown bread is the #3 Grain Product sold in the USA!
Do you think that if god made brown bread it would be first because Brown is before the white bread in the alphabet?!
Would it not make sense if he made Eggo Waffles first?

And by this I mean that rambling on about one creation myth passed down in an oral tradition can hardly be proof of the existence or lack of a godlike being.

Or

"Now knowing how large and enormous one galaxy is
know that it has been calculated that there are over 500 BILLION GLAXIES in the universe
if there was a god, he would have long forgotten us, because we are so insignificant, that we have no impact on the continual changes and progess of the galaxy or our universe
We can never effect our galaxy or the universe, we mean nothing
We do not need to be created by someone, because that someone would have needed to be created"

Equates to:

When something is large and there are a large number of details,
nobody could possibly remember all of them, definitely not god or a computer.
We are tiny, we don't matter. Things beyond my simplistic understanding can not exist.

And yet:

Atoms are tiny, but they did quite a number on hiroshima/nagasaki. So clearly things that are small can effect things that are far larger.

Well done on your illogical rant about how god cant exist because you read a book about basic astronomy, but frankly if Albert Einstein himself believes in some incarnation of a god then I am loathe to take the assertions of some novice as fact.

"I believe in Spinoza's God who reveals himself in the orderly harmony of what exists, not in a God who concerns himself with the fates and actions of human beings." (Albert Einstein)
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digs 
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24 / M
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Posted 5/20/09
And how does the OP prove that God couldn't have created the universe? Just because it's big and vast doesn't mean God didn't do it, on the contrary it supports that God did it. The earth is in the perfect spot for life, and many other things in our solar system effect that (like the moon with tides and Jupiter conveniently taking hits from asteroids for us). Our solar system is set up perfectly for life, and that is due to how the rest of the universe was created. God is not constrained by space and time as He is not bound by them. God created space and time so that the laws of the physical universe He created might be able to function in an orderly way. You judge God as if He has the mind of a human child, getting bored with things and then leaving because He is lost in the vastness of the universe. God is greater than the universe and is omnipresent. Here is a scientific article that shows how the universe and it's laws were intelligently designed so that matter and life can exist. http://creation.com/the-universe-is-finely-tuned-for-life
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23 / M / Brisbane, Australia
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Posted 5/20/09

digs wrote:

And how does the OP prove that God couldn't have created the universe? Just because it's big and vast doesn't mean God didn't do it, on the contrary it supports that God did it. The earth is in the perfect spot for life, and many other things in our solar system effect that (like the moon with tides and Jupiter conveniently taking hits from asteroids for us). Our solar system is set up perfectly for life, and that is due to how the rest of the universe was created. God is not constrained by space and time as He is not bound by them. God created space and time so that the laws of the physical universe He created might be able to function in an orderly way. You judge God as if He has the mind of a human child, getting bored with things and then leaving because He is lost in the vastness of the universe. God is greater than the universe and is omnipresent. Here is a scientific article that shows how the universe and it's laws were intelligently designed so that matter and life can exist. http://creation.com/the-universe-is-finely-tuned-for-life


i have to admit that what you have said is realy intelligent, and it has made me think about what you have said, a great deal
and you definately understand the universe better than most people

but you can only say what you have said because your views are different and apart from other religions
are you part of any religion? i would like to know
your views on the universe are well thought and are not without reason, i respect them

my post still stands as a valid argument to other religions and beliefs


the only explenation i have for what you said is the same as evolution
life: only on the planets most fit for life, will you find it, and therefore all the surrounding enviroments are perfect
particles: only stable particles exist, others would be destroyed







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21 / M / Örebro, Sweden.
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Posted 5/20/09 , edited 5/20/09
You know we had this incredibly intresting lesson a few days back. My teacher was talking about the scientific chance of materia being created from nothing, the chance was so small that in reality, it's impossible. Thus, the chance of big bang being something possible, is impossible. I usually just tell myself that God is beyond my understanding. He is something so far superior that I'll never be able to comprehend the mere fact.

This is one out of many reasons why I am a Christian, I believe that God created the universe because he is the only one capable of doing something impossible. Sometimes we just got to stop thinking about it, and stop arguing what created us.
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digs 
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24 / M
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Posted 5/20/09

Daniel9878 wrote:


digs wrote:

And how does the OP prove that God couldn't have created the universe? Just because it's big and vast doesn't mean God didn't do it, on the contrary it supports that God did it. The earth is in the perfect spot for life, and many other things in our solar system effect that (like the moon with tides and Jupiter conveniently taking hits from asteroids for us). Our solar system is set up perfectly for life, and that is due to how the rest of the universe was created. God is not constrained by space and time as He is not bound by them. God created space and time so that the laws of the physical universe He created might be able to function in an orderly way. You judge God as if He has the mind of a human child, getting bored with things and then leaving because He is lost in the vastness of the universe. God is greater than the universe and is omnipresent. Here is a scientific article that shows how the universe and it's laws were intelligently designed so that matter and life can exist. http://creation.com/the-universe-is-finely-tuned-for-life


i have to admit that what you have said is realy intelligent, and it has made me think about what you have said, a great deal
and you definately understand the universe better than most people

but you can only say what you have said because your views are different and apart from other religions
are you part of any religion? i would like to know
your views on the universe are well thought and are not without reason, i respect them

my post still stands as a valid argument to other religions and beliefs


the only explenation i have for what you said is the same as evolution
life: only on the planets most fit for life, will you find it, and therefore all the surrounding enviroments are perfect
particles: only stable particles exist, others would be destroyed



Thanks, I respect your views as well. You seem intelligent and informed. And I do have religious beliefs, I am a Christian.

And your explanation makes sense as according to evolution life adapts to its surroundings, but what is arguable is that there may not be another planet suited for life as million of factors play into that. The earth is situated perfectly for life, and many of the factors lie within our solar system like our suns energy output, size, temperature, and even color are just right for life (the sun's color would affect photosynthesis). The earth's magnetic field is also just right to curve the harmful solar effects from the earth and provide the right ionization in the atmosphere. The earth is truly unique, and figured estimate that the chance of finding another earth-like planet with the right conitions outweigh the chances of one randomly replicating in the universe.

And your second argument is intelligent and makes sense. However, we don't know if the other particles would be destroyed. Which also brings us to a sub-atomic level. It isn't proven, but theories say that atoms are made up of up quarks and down quarks which comprise electrons, neutrons, and protons. These sub-atomic particles also would have to be the perfect size as well because they comprise the atom's structure. We don't know what makes up atoms or whether or not they are truly mater or a form of energy being expressed in a unique way. The article's argument for the atomic structure being perfect is valid, but it isn't very strong due to our lack of understanding in the atomic realm.

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M / Canada
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Posted 5/20/09 , edited 5/20/09
my post still stands as a valid argument to other religions and beliefs


"the only explenation i have for what you said is the same as evolution
life: only on the planets most fit for life, will you find it, and therefore all the surrounding enviroments are perfect
particles: only stable particles exist, others would be destroyed"


Rather than form a rebuttal I am just going to go out and slam you for your horrible sentence structure, grammar and spelling. If you want to be taken seriously you might try to gain a better command of the language.

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21 / F / Wonderland
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Posted 5/20/09


Ohhhhh, you again!!! I hope you still know me ^-°

"do you think that if god made this galaxy, he would make the edge first??
it would make more sense to create the inner, more larger stars first
"


Yes, I think that if God made this galaxy, he would make the edge first. Why not?

I mean, you said:

"if there was a god, he would have long forgotten us, because we are so insignificant, that we have no impact on the continual changes and progess of the galaxy or our universe
We can never effect our galaxy or the universe, we mean nothing"

And now, get to think of it!! Maybe the reason why God made the edge first, is because we were supposed to live there. If you think that way,we can't be "nothing", because God created our solar system first.
And in addition, God doesn't need any reasons. I mean, He is God,right?? He can do anything!! He doesn't need any reasons.
You can't search for the sense of the universe and because you can't find this sense, you say it is a proof that God doesn't exist.
We humans simply don't know anything about the universe and only because we simply dont know, it doesn't make any sense?
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25 / M / California
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Posted 5/20/09 , edited 5/20/09
If there is a God then he had created everything to move perfectly. There's no explanation why everything moves so perfectly. That's why people made religions so that it teaches us that there's someone who created this whole thing. DDDDUH

well, if I was a God, why would i make something with edges? I would make something infinite
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24 / M
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Posted 5/20/09

johnkx wrote:

If there is a God then he had created everything to move perfectly. There's no explanation why everything moves so perfectly. That's why people made religions so that it teaches us that there's someone who created this whole thing. DDDDUH

well, if I was a God, why would i make something with edges? I would make something infinite


The universe is infinite, but that doesn’t mean it doesn’t have an edge. Imagine an infinitely long bridge. You can walk the length of this bridge and never find an end. There’s an infinite number of steps on this bridge…but it’s finite, because if you turn to your left you can take a few paces and find that edge.
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25 / M / Bermuda Triangle
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Posted 5/20/09
The Bible does not say anything too specific on how the universe was made. The pope even says it's fine if you believe the earth was made in 7 days or 7 periods. God can probably do a lot more than we think he can do.
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30 / M / Michigan
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Posted 5/20/09 , edited 5/20/09
A valid argument of this type would have to run as follows.

(1)"Assume God created the universe"

(2)blah, blah, blah, contradiction

(3) God could not have created the universe.

Does the argument made in the opening post come anywhere close to that form?

I know this doesn't get said a lot on the internet, but valid arguments are those which conform to the rules of logic. Yes, there are actual rules, and logic is a real academic discipline. If you don't know the rules, it's worth it to start studying now.
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