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What is the difference between a religion and a cult?
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29 / M / Usa
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Posted 10/27/09
That's a good point religion/cults both brain-wash people, its quite amusing that people who have been brain-washed refuse to acknowledge it. I figured this out a long time ago that religion is nothing more that a tool used to brain-wash the masses, i say it all the time surprisingly cults do the same thing interesting comparison Darkphoenix.
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Posted 10/28/09

digs wrote:


Swedie wrote:


digs wrote:

I cult usually revolves around one leader, they tend to be very extreme and highly extortional. Cults brainwash and usually (not all, but many) are directly against Christianity and in favor of satanic principals. Most cults have some form of magic or spiritual meditation.

And not all religion brainwashes children or uses threats of violence :\ I really don't see how hating of religion adds to the discussion of how they are different from cults. We could say all things try to brainwash children and all parents do. Kids aren't wise enough or mature enough to understand metaphysics and spiritual things, so their parents teach them what they believe. Kids are too young and naive (usually) to understand what religion and God really are, and to not instruct them on anything will only confuse them when they hear about God and other beliefs.


We can switch this all around you know
So you say a cult usually revolves around one leader
Well Christianity revolves around God
Christianity is a monotheistic, meaning one leader who is worship
Christians are brainwashed into thinking that anyone whose practice that does not follow their doctrine will all go to "hell".

Every religion brainwashes children, it's the level of brainwashing that is important. If you grew up in a strong Christian household then you are most likely to be religious at one point or another and have your values defined by what you have been taught. Values that God will be pleased with.

Personally I think children would be less confused if they didn't hear about God and other beliefs until they are older and want to belong to a religion. They won't be confused by whether or not they please this being that does or does not exist. The Bible is confusing enough with all the contradiction it has. Kids will just eat anything up if that pleases their parents, they just want the acceptance.


Christians aren't brainwashed. I am a Christian because I choose to be one, in fact before I was Christian I was atheist. Parent's raise their children with the knowledge of the Bible, just like how atheist parents tell their children there is no God. It's not brainwashing, it's education. And we aren't brainwashed into thinking anyone who isn't Christian goes to hell, we choose to believe it because it's in the Bible. This isn't intolerance, but truth for us, which is why we are to show Christ's love to the world. So they may see Christ in us and choose to be saved from hell and sin. The Bible teaches that we choose to go to hell, and that every provision has been made so that we can be forgiven from sin and go to heaven.

What is your definition of brainwashing? People do tend to have values based on how they are raised, is that wrong? Christians, Muslims, atheists, they all raise their kids with the values that they hold to be true. That isn't brainwashing, it's parenting.

I think kids should learn about God as children. If they have no instruction or beliefs then anyone can take control of them and give them impressions of God that either aren't true, or dangerous. Kids have questions like how the universe was created, if God exists, and so on. Parents should answer their questions with what is right. Kids aren't intellectuals, they go for what appeals to them. They aren't going to make rational decisions on their own, which is why parents parent.


You say you were an atheist, I'm curious how and why you decided to change, was it because you were lonely and needed a friend, an imaginary friend? Obviously you weren't much of an atheist. Since you so easily succumbed to the brain-washing of religion, the transition is utterly baffling. i used to identify myself as a christian as well, i hated church but my mother forced me to go to church when i was younger she tried to force her beliefs on her children. Even though i claimed to be a christian in the back of my mind i had doubts of the so called word of god; those doubts grew stronger and stronger each passing day and it followed me threw my journey to adulthood. And my hate for religion has grown so strong that now i fight the oppression of religion at ever chance i get. i do what i can to protect the eyes, the mind, and hearts of those who have already been corrupted by religion; i guess you can look at me as an heretical hero. Much to my dismay some would rather be slaves bound to the propaganda of a book for all eternity. I don't doubt that you're not smart Diggs but you don't need this, what did they do to you to make you fall like this why forfeit your freedom? Your acquiescence confuses me i cannot fathom what went through your mind when you decided to become a christian warrior. Brain-washing means intensive forcible indoctrination aimed at replacing a persons basic convictions with an alternative set of beliefs. Or the application of a concentrated means of persuasion in order to develop a specific belief or motivation; exactly what religion is based upon. The fact your religion states that either you believe or die does not bother you ? Your argument is completely invalid because using nothing more than circular reasoning. For example, you keep saying, " it says in the bible", which raises the question of why you believe the bible is true.

As far as your concepts of cults, brain-washing and parenting go, they are really one and the same. In the case of parenting the brain-washing that takes place is simple culturally accepted but nonetheless brain-washing by way of constant propagandizing...based on a cultural premise that children are "owned" as property by the parents. There is no rational reason to assume that is the way it should be.
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digs 
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Posted 10/28/09 , edited 10/28/09

GrandX wrote:


digs wrote:


Swedie wrote:


digs wrote:

I cult usually revolves around one leader, they tend to be very extreme and highly extortional. Cults brainwash and usually (not all, but many) are directly against Christianity and in favor of satanic principals. Most cults have some form of magic or spiritual meditation.

And not all religion brainwashes children or uses threats of violence :\ I really don't see how hating of religion adds to the discussion of how they are different from cults. We could say all things try to brainwash children and all parents do. Kids aren't wise enough or mature enough to understand metaphysics and spiritual things, so their parents teach them what they believe. Kids are too young and naive (usually) to understand what religion and God really are, and to not instruct them on anything will only confuse them when they hear about God and other beliefs.


We can switch this all around you know
So you say a cult usually revolves around one leader
Well Christianity revolves around God
Christianity is a monotheistic, meaning one leader who is worship
Christians are brainwashed into thinking that anyone whose practice that does not follow their doctrine will all go to "hell".

Every religion brainwashes children, it's the level of brainwashing that is important. If you grew up in a strong Christian household then you are most likely to be religious at one point or another and have your values defined by what you have been taught. Values that God will be pleased with.

Personally I think children would be less confused if they didn't hear about God and other beliefs until they are older and want to belong to a religion. They won't be confused by whether or not they please this being that does or does not exist. The Bible is confusing enough with all the contradiction it has. Kids will just eat anything up if that pleases their parents, they just want the acceptance.


Christians aren't brainwashed. I am a Christian because I choose to be one, in fact before I was Christian I was atheist. Parent's raise their children with the knowledge of the Bible, just like how atheist parents tell their children there is no God. It's not brainwashing, it's education. And we aren't brainwashed into thinking anyone who isn't Christian goes to hell, we choose to believe it because it's in the Bible. This isn't intolerance, but truth for us, which is why we are to show Christ's love to the world. So they may see Christ in us and choose to be saved from hell and sin. The Bible teaches that we choose to go to hell, and that every provision has been made so that we can be forgiven from sin and go to heaven.

What is your definition of brainwashing? People do tend to have values based on how they are raised, is that wrong? Christians, Muslims, atheists, they all raise their kids with the values that they hold to be true. That isn't brainwashing, it's parenting.

I think kids should learn about God as children. If they have no instruction or beliefs then anyone can take control of them and give them impressions of God that either aren't true, or dangerous. Kids have questions like how the universe was created, if God exists, and so on. Parents should answer their questions with what is right. Kids aren't intellectuals, they go for what appeals to them. They aren't going to make rational decisions on their own, which is why parents parent.


You say you were an atheist, I'm curious how and why you decided to change, was it because you were lonely and needed a friend, an imaginary friend? Obviously you weren't much of an atheist. Since you so easily succumbed to the brain-washing of religion, the transition is utterly baffling. i used to identify myself as a christian as well, i hated church but my mother forced me to go to church when i was younger she tried to force her beliefs on her children. Even though i claimed to be a christian in the back of my mind i had doubts of the so called word of god; those doubts grew stronger and stronger each passing day and it followed me threw my journey to adulthood. And my hate for religion has grown so strong that now i fight the oppression of religion at ever chance i get. i do what i can to protect the eyes, the mind, and hearts of those who have already been corrupted by religion; i guess you can look at me as an heretical hero. Much to my dismay some would rather be slaves bound to the propaganda of a book for all eternity. I don't doubt that you're not smart Diggs but you don't need this, what did they do to you to make you fall like this why forfeit your freedom? Your acquiescence confuses me i cannot fathom what went through your mind when you decided to become a christian warrior. Brain-washing means intensive forcible indoctrination aimed at replacing a persons basic convictions with an alternative set of beliefs. Or the application of a concentrated means of persuasion in order to develop a specific belief or motivation; exactly what religion is based upon. The fact your religion states that either you believe or die does not bother you ? Your argument is completely invalid because using nothing more than circular reasoning. For example, you keep saying, " it says in the bible", which raises the question of why you believe the bible is true.

As far as your concepts of cults, brain-washing and parenting go, they are really one and the same. In the case of parenting the brain-washing that takes place is simple culturally accepted but nonetheless brain-washing by way of constant propagandizing...based on a cultural premise that children are "owned" as property by the parents. There is no rational reason to assume that is the way it should be.


My story is somewhat similar to yours. I was born into a Christian home, my dad has always been in the ministry. He has been a pastor, jail chaplain, youth pastor, and other things. I went to church and hated it. When I was younger I was fine with it all, but as I grew up anger towards God build up and I began to doubt the Bible and wonder if God existed. I became bitter and angry at God because my family has been poor. Because of my dad's job, we have been treated like garbage by church people and I have seen the evil side of corrupt churches and Christians who are just plain mean. On top of that I was short, asthmatic, and had terrible allergies (I still do) so I blamed God for my physical problems and hated Him more. By the time I was 15 I was Christian on the outside at church, and atheist on the inside and outside when I was with friends. When people prayed I would tell them to stop, saying that prayers do nothing and there is no God to pray to. I would constantly flick off churches when I drove past them. I treated Christians as ignorant fools who knew no science and knew no suffering in their lives. I can't put everything in one post, but this is some of the reasons why I became an atheist. I also believed that secular philosophy was wise and that atheistic reasoning was correct.

My change took place when I was 17. As an atheist I was questioning the atheistic philosophies and realized that there are holes and flaws in the arguments. I was always angry, very bitter at religion and religious people, and inside I was tired of being that way. To be honest I remembered the Biblical prophecies in the Bible that had come true (all of them) like the ones in Daniel, Isaiah, and the other books of the prophets. There was no counter argument to these things that could refute it. I met another Christian who had gone through some of the same things (being poor and such) because his family is in the ministry. My mind was opened to the holes in atheism, to the truths in the Bible (prophecy and logic), and the conviction of the Holy Spirit on my heart. My conversion actually took place on my bathroom floor when I doubled over in tears and turned to God. I believe in the Bible 100% now as all of it being true and the Word of God. I believe in the proofs of it and I can tell you that God has been working in my life in ways that leave me speechless. Christianity is about relationship with God, and when we are serious about having that relationship, God will work in our lives and draw close to us. The Bible has never failed me so I have no reason to doubt it. I understand that my physical diseases, my families poverty, and the depressing things that happened in my life were not acts of malevolence or hatred from God, and that God can use those things for good and His Glory. I believe that I did not forfeit freedom when I became a Christian, I believe that I gained it. I was a slave to sin, a slave to hate, a slave to hollow philosophy that held no real answers. My sins are forgiven and I am free from them, I am free from the hate, I am free from the hurt and depression, and I have embraced a philosophy that does have answers and contains truth. There comes a point when faith must be my own instead of just living by what my parents taught me or what I heard in church. It doesn't make me angry that to believe that only Christians go to heaven, because not all "Christians" will be there. Jesus even says that many will claim to be but will be sent to judgement. The statement of "everyone else goes to hell" isn't accurate with what the Bible says. Instead of this, the true context is "all mankind is bound to hell and death because of sin, but in God's Love and Mercy He opened up a way for us to be forgiven and enter heaven." God provided one way to forgiveness that anyone can take, it isn't a statement of pride but a statement of love.
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Posted 10/28/09
Whatever hallucination works for you.
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Posted 2/18/10

SeraphAlford wrote:


Allhailodin wrote:
Well i don't think religion should be shoved upon a kid until their old enough to decide if they wanna believe in it or not. But yeah I had heard religion was declining, Seems like more and more people are starting to get smart and realizing all the flaws with religion if you ask me.


Teaching a child to believe something and shoving it down the child’s throat are two different things, and it doesn’t hurt anybody in any way shape or form to tell a child that God exists. You'd be completely okay, for example if a child pointed at the clouds and said, “what are those made of?” and I replied, ‘water vapors.” Because you regard that as a fact in the ultimate truth of reality. So, it’s okay to educate a child with what you agree on, just not what you disagree on?

As far as people getting smart, I don’t think so. I don’t think belief or lack there of has much anything to do with intellectual prowess. I just think that atheism is a sort of chic fashion trend. That’s why mediocre and recycled books like “The God Delusion,” are treated like relics. Don’t get me wrong. I love “A Brief History of Time,” which scientifically refutes God. I also love Richard Dawking’s as an evolutionary scientist, but his theological arguments only make it clear that he doesn’t understand religion-Christianity and Judaism most of all-and that his opinions are inherited not original.


Well, I don't really have anything left to say. If someone has read all your posts and still insists that teaching a child religious morals is brainwashing then they weren't paying attention. I may not agree with you on every point, but HUGELY appreciate the level-headed opinion given.
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Posted 2/18/10

meezermex wrote:


Well, I don't really have anything left to say. If someone has read all your posts and still insists that teaching a child religious morals is brainwashing then they weren't paying attention. I may not agree with you on every point, but HUGELY appreciate the level-headed opinion given.


Well, I’m very glad you enjoyed my post, but I suppose I should thank you for listening to what I have to say.

On another note, I may be making a bit of a return to Crunchy Roll, so keep an eye out for that if you do enjoy my “level headed” opinions. Thanks again.
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