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The Zeitgeist Discussion
Posted 7/18/09 , edited 7/25/09
The object of this disscusion is to over analyze what has been said in ZEITGEIST. Given that, It takes an incredible amount of research of the topics that are listed within the movies so if you are not prepared for it, you may not be taken seriously. All in all, for all it's worth, I hope for us as a whole to find the real truth behind all the accusations described within these documentaries.


The links:

ZEITGEIST: ADDENDUM: (Newest)

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=7065205277695921912

"ZEITGEIST: THE MOVIE (Watch first)

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-594683847743189197

The Main Site:

http://www.zeitgeistmovie.com/


Rules of the discussion:

Pick a section and either debunk it or support it.

Stay neutral in terms of not instigating a fight amongst one another.

Thoroughly scrutinize your research before posting.

*listing respected resources is a PLUS!!!


List of Resources:

www.wikipedia.org
http://www.michaeljournal.org
http://www.cracked.com
http://www.popularmechanics.com
http://www.scientificamerican.com
http://www.conspiracyscience.com
http://skepdic.com
http://www.debunking911.com
http://www.patriotsquestion911.com
http://911myths.com
http://loosechange911.com
http://screwloosechange.blogspot.com
http://www.post-gazette.com
http://www.controlled-demolition.com
http://mp3.rbnlive.com
http://www.salon.com
http://www.rumormillnews.com
http://www.timesonline.co.uk
http://www.usatoday.com
http://www.newyorker.com
http://www.foxnews.com
http://www.usnews.com
http://news.bbc.co.uk
http://www.washingtonpost.com
http://www.guardian.co.uk
http://www.democracynow.org
http://librivox.org
http://www.thepeoplesvoice.org
http://republicbroadcasting.org/
http://www.jcpa.org
http://web.archive.org

Videos:
JFK - Secrecy is Repugnant (1961 Speech):
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gpmi7dBet0c

911 Conspiracy Theory Myths:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mHy5uWeViho

19 Questions for Muslim Scholars:
http://video.google.com/videosearch?q=19+questions+for+muslim+scholars&emb=0&aq=f#q=%2219+questions+for+muslim+scholars%22&emb=0

9/11 Deniers Speak - Exposing the 9/11 "Truth" Movement and Loose Change:
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-7216643725166640147&hl=en

9/11 Debunked: World Trade Center - No Free-Fall Speed:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qLShZOvxVe4

Loose Change- rebuttal:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4SgjWGVHxW8

"Sit Down!" The Power to Silence the Truth about 9/11:
Part 1: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BuTQ6ystWrw
Part 2: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D7EB1FxENxQ

9/11 Debunked: 136 Eyewitnesses to Pentagon Attack:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t1wQ2BJsgx0



(I will try to update this list periodically)

Please PM me if you have any suggestions for improving this post.
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Posted 7/18/09
Well, the video is essentially an attack on the historical Jesus Christ. This is more of what you see in many videos like these. The Obama Deception, Sicko, and Loose Change all employ the same approach. Mood enhancing music and a bombardment of facts to confuse the viewer. Well, there’s already a thread on rather or not Jesus exists. So, I think that this one should be locked because in the end it’s the same thing.
Yei
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Posted 7/18/09

SeraphAlford wrote:

Well, the video is essentially an attack on the historical Jesus Christ. This is more of what you see in many videos like these. The Obama Deception, Sicko, and Loose Change all employ the same approach. Mood enhancing music and a bombardment of facts to confuse the viewer. Well, there’s already a thread on rather or not Jesus exists. So, I think that this one should be locked because in the end it’s the same thing.


If you continued watching, it starts talking about all your other favourite topics: 9/11, and the corruption in the government and the Federal Reserve.
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Posted 7/18/09

Yei wrote:


SeraphAlford wrote:

Well, the video is essentially an attack on the historical Jesus Christ. This is more of what you see in many videos like these. The Obama Deception, Sicko, and Loose Change all employ the same approach. Mood enhancing music and a bombardment of facts to confuse the viewer. Well, there’s already a thread on rather or not Jesus exists. So, I think that this one should be locked because in the end it’s the same thing.


If you continued watching, it starts talking about all your other favourite topics: 9/11, and the corruption in the government and the Federal Reserve.


Yeah, well I find all of these conspiracy theories to be silly and intentionally misleading. Loose Change is a prime example. But, yeah. I just don’t find these things at all convincing. Actually, I think they’re marketing tools. People make millions of dollars off of these things.
Oedi 
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Posted 7/18/09
I'm curious how this discussion goes. I watched it before and thought the Venus project was a nice idea but entirely implausible in a political perspective unless there was a revolution ala Communist revolution but then again i doubt that would last since i feel that human nature would not allow for it.

The money issue was also quite interesting since people have known about it for ages yet we it seems like it's in the best interests of everyone to continually make "virtual" money.

Stuff like Jesus, religion and what not i really don't care too much about since I'm agnostic.

the 911 stuff... I'd like to see some more sources. The ones they gave in the movie were quite sufficient yet I want to see if there is anything that disproves their claims.
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Posted 7/18/09 , edited 7/18/09
Yes thats an informative video I was shaky at the beginning when they talked about Christianity there isnt enough proof for their accusation. But when it came to the 9-11 part and brainwashing it made sense and really people just cast this off but fails to provide any refuting. I see refutes to the government claims and agenda and less towards theirs.

In reality these videos are really meant for you to open your mind to something new. Most likely people who see these videos start doing their own research to further see how these people got to this conclusion and at the same time waking themselves up to the corruption and the lies they have been fed. Well at least thats what happened with me I had to do my own research and when I found out what the FED was truly about I was shocked.
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Posted 7/18/09

SeraphAlford wrote:


Yei wrote:


SeraphAlford wrote:

Well, the video is essentially an attack on the historical Jesus Christ. This is more of what you see in many videos like these. The Obama Deception, Sicko, and Loose Change all employ the same approach. Mood enhancing music and a bombardment of facts to confuse the viewer. Well, there’s already a thread on rather or not Jesus exists. So, I think that this one should be locked because in the end it’s the same thing.


If you continued watching, it starts talking about all your other favourite topics: 9/11, and the corruption in the government and the Federal Reserve.


Yeah, well I find all of these conspiracy theories to be silly and intentionally misleading. Loose Change is a prime example. But, yeah. I just don’t find these things at all convincing. Actually, I think they’re marketing tools. People make millions of dollars off of these things.


It's because you dont open up your mind. If you free your mind, you will know whats right and whats wrong. That is the main problem of human beings in the 21st Century. They kept watching television shows, lack of interest in politics, end up they have no darn idea whats really going on in the country. The public are at fault for loosing the government. And Federal Reserve is not a conspiracy theory, its been proven that the entire system is a big fraud. Congressman Ron Paul is trying hard to get the Bill H.R. 1207 approval from the Congress to audit the Federal Reserve Corp

http://www.michaeljournal.org/fedreserve.htm
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Posted 7/18/09

drizza wrote:

Yes thats an informative video I was shaky at the beginning when they talked about Christianity there isnt enough proof for their accusation. But when it came to the 9-11 part and brainwashing it made sense and really people just cast this off but fails to provide any refuting. I see refutes to the government claims and agenda and less towards theirs.

In reality these videos are really meant for you to open your mind to something new. Most likely people who see these videos start doing their own research to further see how these people got to this conclusion and at the same time waking themselves up to the corruption and the lies they have been fed. Well at least thats what happened with me I had to do my own research and when I found out what the FED was truly about I was shocked.


I agree that the Christianity part is nonsense, but the rest of it its up to you all as viewers to decide.
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Posted 7/18/09
Yes thats problem whatever the government tells the public something is a conspiracy theory we just believe it. Why dont we research and find out why many proffessors are saying this to us? If this is a conspiracy then it should be easily refutable. My mind is open I choose which ever side makes sense but I wont dismiss anything until I see someone else dismiss it with their knowledge.
Revolver Dogelot
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Posted 7/18/09
Uh Zeitgiest is just propaganda, much like most of what the government says. In that they are very much alike. As for a global economy, a world government, a unified dollar? You do realize that anyone with common sense and a hint of intelligence can tell you those things are inevitable. Sooner or later they will happen regardless of whether or not America is involved, which it will be. The first steps toward it though had nothing to do with the US. It is the founding of the Euro and the beginnings of a European Economic Bloc.
Yei
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Posted 7/18/09
lol everything in the movie is great except the parts that conflict with my beliefs.

That's what the main consensus seems to be with this movie. The part in the beginning about the corruption in religion in general is obviously right, but the parts that directly talk about Christianity and Jesus cannot be proven or dis-proven. SeraphAlford has trouble fathoming the 9/11 and conspiracy parts for the same reasons you guys have trouble with the Christianity and religion parts.
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Posted 7/18/09
I don't see why people wouldn't believe that christianity could be an astrological concept of events, or even a rip-off from the egyptian myths. Besides, christianity stole many traditions such as easter and snowy themes from other cultures
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digs 
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Posted 7/18/09

Yei wrote:

lol everything in the movie is great except the parts that conflict with my beliefs.

That's what the main consensus seems to be with this movie. The part in the beginning about the corruption in religion in general is obviously right, but the parts that directly talk about Christianity and Jesus cannot be proven or dis-proven. SeraphAlford has trouble fathoming the 9/11 and conspiracy parts for the same reasons you guys have trouble with the Christianity and religion parts.


It can be debunked and has been. Documentaries with intents should be hardly taken as reliable sources. The production of this film had the desired outcome of hating on Christianity and trying to show it's false as well as other things. As for Christianity and their arguments.... http://www.conspiracyscience.com/articles/zeitgeist/part-one/. Here is a website that debunks the movie and historically shows the inaccuracy and the spin of words they place in order to incriminate things. The fact that they purport December 25th so much shows their lack of understanding. The Bible never states the date Jesus was born, in fact Christians don't even believe that December 25th was when He was born either. During the Roman Empire December 25th was a day to celebrate the pagan sun god, so Christian Rome decided to change the pagan holiday to celebrating instead the birth of Christ.
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Posted 7/18/09
Well I am not a Christian but to be honest I havent done much research on what the movie was talking about in order for me to believe it is true or not so I will stay neutral on it. But you do have a point Yei
Yei
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Posted 7/18/09

digs wrote:


Yei wrote:

lol everything in the movie is great except the parts that conflict with my beliefs.

That's what the main consensus seems to be with this movie. The part in the beginning about the corruption in religion in general is obviously right, but the parts that directly talk about Christianity and Jesus cannot be proven or dis-proven. SeraphAlford has trouble fathoming the 9/11 and conspiracy parts for the same reasons you guys have trouble with the Christianity and religion parts.


It can be debunked and has been. Documentaries with intents should be hardly taken as reliable sources. The production of this film had the desired outcome of hating on Christianity and trying to show it's false as well as other things. As for Christianity and their arguments.... http://www.conspiracyscience.com/articles/zeitgeist/part-one/. Here is a website that debunks the movie and historically shows the inaccuracy and the spin of words they place in order to incriminate things. The fact that they purport December 25th so much shows their lack of understanding. The Bible never states the date Jesus was born, in fact Christians don't even believe that December 25th was when He was born either. During the Roman Empire December 25th was a day to celebrate the pagan sun god, so Christian Rome decided to change the pagan holiday to celebrating instead the birth of Christ.


I meant the whole idea of Christianity and religion being made up in general. The points it makes about the way religion is used are all valid. I don't think anyone can deny that many, if not most, religious beliefs are made up and are used to manipulate people.
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