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Capitalism VS Communism
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23 / F / demon world/spiri...
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Posted 9/30/09
capitalism
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24 / M / California, US
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Posted 10/1/09

dark_dude wrote:

communism its a good thing but people thinks it bad cuz of the leaders who ran the country


Not true, at least not entirely. Communism is a good idea and concept, but it simply does not work because of the nature of the people. Communism would be great in a perfect world, but people are greedy. This is also the reason for the "bad" leaders you mention. Greed is not the only problem either. Since communism pays everyone "equally," there is lack of motivation for the people to work and compete with others. People would just think, "O, I'm just going to be paid the same as everyone else anyway, so why should I work harder?" On the other hand, in capitalism, people can own their own businesses and are more willing to work harder to earn more. Communism can definitely produce a high quantity in products, but capitalism certainly produces the better quality in products. I can go on about the flaws, but I think I'll stop.
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22 / F
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Posted 10/2/09
politics? >.>

capitalism i guess.
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22 / F / shitty england
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Posted 1/18/10
Capitalism!
Posted 1/18/10
I think most people will choose capitalism
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38 / M / Los Angeles Calif...
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Posted 3/3/10
Capitalism
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F / California
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Posted 3/3/10
Capitalism!!!!!! x]
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Posted 1/28/11
capitalism..
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22 / M
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Posted 1/28/11
capitalism
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F
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Posted 3/18/11
Capitalism
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28 / M / Philippines
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Posted 3/19/11
Capitalism!


Its because of capitalism crunchyroll exists
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34 / M / Daejeon, Korea
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Posted 4/13/11

doublezer0aym wrote:


dark_dude wrote:

communism its a good thing but people thinks it bad cuz of the leaders who ran the country


Not true, at least not entirely. Communism is a good idea and concept, but it simply does not work because of the nature of the people. Communism would be great in a perfect world, but people are greedy. This is also the reason for the "bad" leaders you mention. Greed is not the only problem either. Since communism pays everyone "equally," there is lack of motivation for the people to work and compete with others. People would just think, "O, I'm just going to be paid the same as everyone else anyway, so why should I work harder?" On the other hand, in capitalism, people can own their own businesses and are more willing to work harder to earn more. Communism can definitely produce a high quantity in products, but capitalism certainly produces the better quality in products. I can go on about the flaws, but I think I'll stop.



You obviously know nothing about human nature. Many of the really creative people in our society are not paid that much, such as researchers at universities or even professors, are not paid an awful lot of money. A good example is Sir Alexander Fleming, the scientist who invented penicillin, he could have gotten rich by the patent but he chose not to patent the product because he believed that the benefits of society should be shared to all.

A further example can be seen in the Linux and free software movement. Many top notch computer programs are now being developed by unpaid programmers who do it solely for the love, in fact Linux has been so successful that the internet now pretty much runs on a Linux based system.

"O, I'm just going to be paid the same as everyone else anyway, so why should I work harder?" Research has shown that countries with higher rates of income equality perform much better than countries with lower levels of income equality. People will work harder under communism because their workplace and society will be democratically controlled and run by the community. In capitalism most people need to be supervised 24/7 to make sure they work because the work is alienating- the profits go to the boss and workers have no control over their society or workplace.

Repeat: Communism is not about people being paid "equal", it is about democratic self management of society at a grassroots level.

Your argument about quantity is also flawed, democratically run grassroots workers owned co-operatives have proven to produce goods at the same quality or even better than capitalist goods.

Capitalism has massive problems. Firstly, those who own the business do not always care about the interests of the business. Sometimes shareholders care more about short term dividends and floating the company than long lasting investments in the firm, as they know that their plan is to sell the stocks in the short term. Another good example is the case of Ssangyong motors in South Korea and its Chinese owners completely ran the company down by doing nothing to improve it, and instead just transferred all the technology to the plants of their other companies in China. They were the owners so they had a legal right to do this, yet their actions caused the suffering of many workers and their families. They bought the company with no intention of running it, instead they just wanted it as a way to shift all the technological know how to their main operations in China.

Secondly, it is capitalisms drive to increase efficiency that pushes down the rate of profits. This is because competing capitalists look for labour saving technology in order to get a short term competitive edge over their rivals. In the long term this enters into all branches of the given industry and pushes down the rate of profit because of over production and the higher amount of constant capital needed to run the industry (that is higher investment over returns) and the lower amount of actual value produced by the economy as a whole.

Capital over accumulates, monopolies form, and profits decline. The only thing that can save capitalism from this long term stagnation is the massive destruction of capital itself. Capitalism has an internal contradiction: the more it tries to be efficient, the more it pushes itself into stagnation and crisis.

The the last 40 years capitalism has pretty much stagnated, growth in the advanced countries have been low or propped up by debt or exploitation of people.

Capitalism is a terrible, terrible system. It has brought 500 years of imperialist destruction, murder of indiginous peoples, exploitation, wars, starvation and killings. In India alone the capitalist British Empire killed over 100 million people in its insane drive for profits.

Posted 4/14/11 , edited 4/14/11

Clive_r wrote:


doublezer0aym wrote:


dark_dude wrote:

communism its a good thing but people thinks it bad cuz of the leaders who ran the country


Not true, at least not entirely. Communism is a good idea and concept, but it simply does not work because of the nature of the people. Communism would be great in a perfect world, but people are greedy. This is also the reason for the "bad" leaders you mention. Greed is not the only problem either. Since communism pays everyone "equally," there is lack of motivation for the people to work and compete with others. People would just think, "O, I'm just going to be paid the same as everyone else anyway, so why should I work harder?" On the other hand, in capitalism, people can own their own businesses and are more willing to work harder to earn more. Communism can definitely produce a high quantity in products, but capitalism certainly produces the better quality in products. I can go on about the flaws, but I think I'll stop.



You obviously know nothing about human nature. Many of the really creative people in our society are not paid that much, such as researchers at universities or even professors, are not paid an awful lot of money. A good example is Sir Alexander Fleming, the scientist who invented penicillin, he could have gotten rich by the patent but he chose not to patent the product because he believed that the benefits of society should be shared to all.

A further example can be seen in the Linux and free software movement. Many top notch computer programs are now being developed by unpaid programmers who do it solely for the love, in fact Linux has been so successful that the internet now pretty much runs on a Linux based system.

"O, I'm just going to be paid the same as everyone else anyway, so why should I work harder?" Research has shown that countries with higher rates of income equality perform much better than countries with lower levels of income equality. People will work harder under communism because their workplace and society will be democratically controlled and run by the community. In capitalism most people need to be supervised 24/7 to make sure they work because the work is alienating- the profits go to the boss and workers have no control over their society or workplace.

Repeat: Communism is not about people being paid "equal", it is about democratic self management of society at a grassroots level.

Your argument about quantity is also flawed, democratically run grassroots workers owned co-operatives have proven to produce goods at the same quality or even better than capitalist goods.

Capitalism has massive problems. Firstly, those who own the business do not always care about the interests of the business. Sometimes shareholders care more about short term dividends and floating the company than long lasting investments in the firm, as they know that their plan is to sell the stocks in the short term. Another good example is the case of Ssangyong motors in South Korea and its Chinese owners completely ran the company down by doing nothing to improve it, and instead just transferred all the technology to the plants of their other companies in China. They were the owners so they had a legal right to do this, yet their actions caused the suffering of many workers and their families. They bought the company with no intention of running it, instead they just wanted it as a way to shift all the technological know how to their main operations in China.

Secondly, it is capitalisms drive to increase efficiency that pushes down the rate of profits. This is because competing capitalists look for labour saving technology in order to get a short term competitive edge over their rivals. In the long term this enters into all branches of the given industry and pushes down the rate of profit because of over production and the higher amount of constant capital needed to run the industry (that is higher investment over returns) and the lower amount of actual value produced by the economy as a whole.

Capital over accumulates, monopolies form, and profits decline. The only thing that can save capitalism from this long term stagnation is the massive destruction of capital itself. Capitalism has an internal contradiction: the more it tries to be efficient, the more it pushes itself into stagnation and crisis.

The the last 40 years capitalism has pretty much stagnated, growth in the advanced countries have been low or propped up by debt or exploitation of people.

Capitalism is a terrible, terrible system. It has brought 500 years of imperialist destruction, murder of indiginous peoples, exploitation, wars, starvation and killings. In India alone the capitalist British Empire killed over 100 million people in its insane drive for profits.



Star Trek Economy
"The economics of the future is somewhat different. You see, money doesn't exist in the 24th century. The acquisition of wealth is no longer the driving force in our lives. We work to better ourselves and the rest of humanity."
Live Long and Prosper.

The Venus Project

Introduction to Human Behavioral Biology by professor Robert Sapolsky

What are your thoughts on The Venus Project Clive...

P.S. Open Source FTW.
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21 / F / United States
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Posted 4/14/11
capitalism
Posted 4/14/11
Communism.
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