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There's No Nature VS Nurture
Posted 11/28/09


This is a subject that is highly overlooked. It is intensely challenging, so that would be the reason for it being overlooked. Not everything is worth the efforts of a great mind. There are people so ready to give up on intellectual matters that it is disturbing.
Posted 11/28/09

NovembersDoom wrote:



Benevolence is hard to come by, anymore. The greatest people of history were those of a truly good nature. They nurtured primarily what helps themselves and others, the best raison d'être anyone can have.

I think my "reason of being" started from my physical wellness through my fitness leadership training. While my physical wellness shares a strong bond with my spiritual and emotional wellness. That's why I'm volunteering through my local community youths recreation and sport programs, so I can empower the youths in my community with my individual strengths and passion as a fitness leader.

And I combined my interest in wellness with my other hobbies and interests, because I wasn't contempt with me just being a volunteer fitness leader. That's why I took on challenging topics for my own individual interests and hobbies, and that includes my passion for anime subculture.
Posted 11/28/09

DomFortress wrote:


Dajjal_AD wrote:

Okay, nature and nurture are not really at odds with each other as we've gone over here. So now I "wonder" about each person's nature and nurture and the best way to study it given that we are all different. My answer to that is quite naturally; social interaction. If one has the nature to not interact with others like itself, it is cut off from everything truly beneficiary. No forward progress is attainable when the only thing a mind is concerned with is what happens inside it. Such a condition is called introversion. We do best to stay out of our shells.

Introversion can still be beneficial, when it offers the possibility of contemplation and meditation; a rare opportunity of pure individuality. The difference is that while an individual with antisocial behaviors could be introverted, not all individuals who's good at introversion are antisocial, myself included.

Personally, I find time slows down during my moments of introversion. And when I am in a different timezone than the rest of people, I have more "free time" for my self-discipline.


There are times when we go back and forth between introversion and extroversion based on what we are dealing with. Indeed, there are times when we need to be alone to contemplate without an outside disturbance. The greatest times when we can study are attributed to being alone without distractions. But, if a person is always shuts away within themselves, they are destined to deprive themselves of the healing touch of another person's emotional support for them. Introverts have ways of going about things their own way and it helps since there are those who understand them and there are others like them entirely, so they know they are not truly alone.
Posted 11/28/09


Excellent. Our wellness comes from numerous sources. As we give, we must also receive in return not just by another person's appreciation, but from ourselves. The anime subculture is a triumph of artistic expression in how it has so much to say about life placed in the framework of animation. I have learned much from anime thus far and will continue doing so until the end of my days. It is in my nature to nurture what deserves growth and praise.
Posted 11/28/09 , edited 11/28/09

NovembersDoom wrote:



This is a subject that is highly overlooked. It is intensely challenging, so that would be the reason for it being overlooked. Not everything is worth the efforts of a great mind. There are people so ready to give up on intellectual matters that it is disturbing.

I think it's not being just overlooked, when it's also being overgeneralized by others perceived it as "common sense".

My provincial government is cutting back 92% of public school funding on art programs(citation). As a Literary Darwinism activist, I simply cannot allow our government to eliminate our children capacity to express their thoughts and feelings in the public education system. Which is also why I want the youths in my local community to be able to express themselves physically through martial arts; a discipline of motion and stillness that can only be artistic in nature.

I always experience moments of awe by the sheer beauty of artworks, performed by true artists in their own rights.


Dajjal_AD wrote:


DomFortress wrote:


Dajjal_AD wrote:

Okay, nature and nurture are not really at odds with each other as we've gone over here. So now I "wonder" about each person's nature and nurture and the best way to study it given that we are all different. My answer to that is quite naturally; social interaction. If one has the nature to not interact with others like itself, it is cut off from everything truly beneficiary. No forward progress is attainable when the only thing a mind is concerned with is what happens inside it. Such a condition is called introversion. We do best to stay out of our shells.

Introversion can still be beneficial, when it offers the possibility of contemplation and meditation; a rare opportunity of pure individuality. The difference is that while an individual with antisocial behaviors could be introverted, not all individuals who's good at introversion are antisocial, myself included.

Personally, I find time slows down during my moments of introversion. And when I am in a different timezone than the rest of people, I have more "free time" for my self-discipline.


There are times when we go back and forth between introversion and extroversion based on what we are dealing with. Indeed, there are times when we need to be alone to contemplate without an outside disturbance. The greatest times when we can study are attributed to being alone without distractions. But, if a person is always shuts away within themselves, they are destined to deprive themselves of the healing touch of another person's emotional support for them. Introverts have ways of going about things their own way and it helps since there are those who understand them and there are others like them entirely, so they know they are not truly alone.

My support will always be from my girlfriend of 4 years, now that she's more than my closest friend or a member of my family. When I see her as my equal.
Posted 11/28/09


A beautiful thing to have. I have no significant other, yet at least my dear friends and family are always there. I have found much in my years of being a loner (self-reliance) and always acknowledge the fact that no one has to be alone and can always, if they should chose, find that special someone. There seemingly can't be one without the other.
Posted 11/28/09 , edited 11/28/09


That is very sad. What will the children have to express themselves artistically with such pitiful funding? Given the current economical situation, some think that it is logical to cut funding away from art. It isn't. The mind stales and weakens without the gift of art.
Posted 11/28/09 , edited 11/28/09

Dajjal_AD wrote:



A beautiful thing to have. I have no significant other, yet at least my dear friends and family are always there. I have found much in my years of being a loner (self-reliance) and always acknowledge the fact that no one has to be alone and can always, if they should chose, find that special someone. There seemingly can't be one without the other.

It wasn't easy to begin with, I had to work real hard to show my girlfriend how she can become self-reliance. Simply by her being truly happy for who she is, and love herself because of it. She's making progress, and as long she doesn't give up herself I'll see her as my equal.


NovembersDoom wrote:



That is very sad. What will the children have to express themselves artistically with such pitiful funding? Given the current economical situation, some think that it is logical to cut funding away from art. It isn't. The mind stales and weakens without the gift of art.

Like I said before, it's logical to serve as "the end to a means", but that's not good enough for my standard of "possibility that leads to opportunity".

The politicians of my province only think that arts and crafts are man-made and thereby unnatural resources of no real values, because they obviously are not educators of thoughts and feelings. When it's natural for humans to express their thoughts and feelings, and when their expressions carry an universal truth, they become works of art. Our human creativity is nurtured through awe inspiring arts!
Posted 11/28/09


True. A means to an end is what it is. Often times the means are very cold, making the the justification of them very hard. What I would hope to see is an end come about after all of that transpires where things return to a state where they were before. Art has been a part of humanity since prehistoric times and should never be diminished by those who obviously have no artistic ability themselves. Some would call art a waste of time, they are always so very wrong.
Posted 11/28/09


Dedication is the necessary mode for anything you strive to obtain or would like anyone else to obtain. When a gift is given to another, they might not see at first if that gift is truly valuable. A unison of hearts, minds and souls seems to happen when everything works out in a love relationship. Love is mistaken by some as being nothing more than pain leading to a tragic separation. If so, then the consideration of how deeply dedicated one or both people in the relationship happens. It is at minimum found that one of the two was not so dedicated if the relationship falters. If both had no real dedication to each other and never wished to be together, then it was certainly wrong for them to have crossed paths. Nothing in a relationship, as far as I know, just happens perfectly from the beginning and remains constant and everlasting. A truly healthy and prospering relationship between two people I'd say is always built. People talk of ''love at first sight'' when it seems to always be just a strong carnal attraction. Love at first sight would more be an instantaneous desire to nurture someone and not just use their body for your own desires. Nature and nurture in a relationship certainly must be a tremendously powerful and nigh impossible thing to define with words, calculations or any sort of quantification. Love in a relationship is only understood by the people within it and is a sacred territory which no one should dare intrude unless they are foolish enough to deal with the consequences. I keep myself out of other people's business because I have the one thing for that which so many don't: respect.
Posted 11/28/09

NovembersDoom wrote:



True. A means to an end is what it is. Often times the means are very cold, making the the justification of them very hard. What I would hope to see is an end come about after all of that transpires where things return to a state where they were before. Art has been a part of humanity since prehistoric times and should never be diminished by those who obviously have no artistic ability themselves. Some would call art a waste of time, they are always so very wrong.

I personally despise the straw-man method of proposal, because it takes away the benefit of the doubt by forming rejection based on only focusing flaws. However, I can't seem to see any humanitarian benefit in this plan of my provincial government dramatically cutting back art funding in the public sector. I mean, what will happen to the children in poverty who can't afford private art institute? When my province has been Number 1 in Child Poverty for 6 years on a roll. Is my provincial government telling me that they lack the passion for tackling child poverty in our province, because these children couldn't afford public expressions?

Not to mention is the fact that my provincial government knew that their lack of humanitarianism is hurting their popularity, so am I to assume that my provincial government thinks that their humanitarian action is just a charitable donation for the sake of them being popular? While cutting back on charitable donations is the only good they can produce for the benefit of them overspent on the 2010 Winter Olympic.

Big time popularity spenders making small time public savings. That's the economic stance of my provincial government's lack of humanity. While I am angry because I think their stance was wrong, not unpopular. When anger is a natural emotional respond towards something wrong; a tool that we can use to improve our lives when we know how to utilize it.


Dajjal_AD wrote:



Dedication is the necessary mode for anything you strive to obtain or would like anyone else to obtain. When a gift is given to another, they might not see at first if that gift is truly valuable. A unison of hearts, minds and souls seems to happen when everything works out in a love relationship. Love is mistaken by some as being nothing more than pain leading to a tragic separation. If so, then the consideration of how deeply dedicated one or both people in the relationship happens. It is at minimum found that one of the two was not so dedicated if the relationship falters. If both had no real dedication to each other and never wished to be together, then it was certainly wrong for them to have crossed paths. Nothing in a relationship, as far as I know, just happens perfectly from the beginning and remains constant and everlasting. A truly healthy and prospering relationship between two people I'd say is always built. People talk of ''love at first sight'' when it seems to always be just a strong carnal attraction. Love at first sight would more be an instantaneous desire to nurture someone and not just use their body for your own desires. Nature and nurture in a relationship certainly must be a tremendously powerful and nigh impossible thing to define with words, calculations or any sort of quantification. Love in a relationship is only understood by the people within it and is a sacred territory which no one should dare intrude unless they are foolish enough to deal with the consequences. I keep myself out of other people's business because I have the one thing for that which so many don't: respect.

And by the time you learned how to respect your equals, that's when you can love them as much as you love yourself. That's the principle of how I build my romantic relationship with my girlfriend. It took me five tries in order to get that principle right though, mind you.
Posted 11/28/09

DomFortress wrote:


NovembersDoom wrote:



True. A means to an end is what it is. Often times the means are very cold, making the the justification of them very hard. What I would hope to see is an end come about after all of that transpires where things return to a state where they were before. Art has been a part of humanity since prehistoric times and should never be diminished by those who obviously have no artistic ability themselves. Some would call art a waste of time, they are always so very wrong.

I personally despise the straw-man method of proposal, because it takes away the benefit of the doubt by forming rejection based on only focusing flaws. However, I can't seem to see any humanitarian benefit in this plan of my provincial government dramatically cutting back art funding in the public sector. I mean, what will happen to the children in poverty who can't afford private art institute? When my province has been Number 1 in Child Poverty for 6 years on a roll. Is my provincial government telling me that they lack the passion for tackling child poverty in our province, because these children couldn't afford public expressions?

Not to mention is the fact that my provincial government knew that their lack of humanitarianism is hurting their popularity, so am I to assume that my provincial government thinks that their humanitarian action is just a charitable donation for the sake of them being popular? While cutting back on charitable donations is the only good they can produce for the benefit of them overspent on the 2010 Winter Olympic.

Big time popularity spenders making small time public savings. That's the economic stance of my provincial government's lack of humanity. While I am angry because I think their stance was wrong, not unpopular. When anger is a natural emotional respond towards something wrong; a tool that we can use to improve our lives when we know how to utilize it.


Dajjal_AD wrote:



Dedication is the necessary mode for anything you strive to obtain or would like anyone else to obtain. When a gift is given to another, they might not see at first if that gift is truly valuable. A unison of hearts, minds and souls seems to happen when everything works out in a love relationship. Love is mistaken by some as being nothing more than pain leading to a tragic separation. If so, then the consideration of how deeply dedicated one or both people in the relationship happens. It is at minimum found that one of the two was not so dedicated if the relationship falters. If both had no real dedication to each other and never wished to be together, then it was certainly wrong for them to have crossed paths. Nothing in a relationship, as far as I know, just happens perfectly from the beginning and remains constant and everlasting. A truly healthy and prospering relationship between two people I'd say is always built. People talk of ''love at first sight'' when it seems to always be just a strong carnal attraction. Love at first sight would more be an instantaneous desire to nurture someone and not just use their body for your own desires. Nature and nurture in a relationship certainly must be a tremendously powerful and nigh impossible thing to define with words, calculations or any sort of quantification. Love in a relationship is only understood by the people within it and is a sacred territory which no one should dare intrude unless they are foolish enough to deal with the consequences. I keep myself out of other people's business because I have the one thing for that which so many don't: respect.

And by the time you learned how to respect your equals, that's when you can love them as much as you love yourself. That's the principle of how I build my romantic relationship with my girlfriend. It took me five tries in order to get that principle right though, mind you.


Some people I have witnessed, as a point of fact, would be lucky to have a relationship work out in five tries. Often people treat each other like some disposable commodity. They may very well be truly disposable if they have no room in their hearts for another's compassion. But like always, people can change. It is one of the most crucial facts that we will ever come to realize is that if you do not love yourself, then you cannot love anyone else hence they will not love you. A negative mind wants to swallow up everything around it then perish or just simply perish. Everyone needs love and it is no easy thing to find since it can be so rare and precious, like a diamond in the rough.
Posted 11/28/09


Straw-man is a term I've never heard before and upon reading about it, I experienced chills. Such a lousy way to go about things. It makes no sense and just goes to show how low people sink when they don't have the common decency to consider what their actions do down the line. Children are the future, but when we have those in control of things only being concerned with their own welfare it hurts the possibilities for tomorrow. Art is in every application of design and higher learning. A blueprint for a building is art just as any schematic for the human body is. A child's drawing with some crayons can and will ultimately lead to some of the greatest works of art ever known if that talent is nurtured encouraging it to grow.
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Posted 11/28/09
Hey Dom !
I've been following this very interesting thread. I have nothing new to add, & many new things to contemplate.

There is a familiar feeling to this discussion though, a sort of nagging suspicion behind the possible purpose or intent of
this topic------

Could this nature/nurture theme in any way relate to your concepts for A I ? Seems to me a lot of the thots & ideas here almost
parallel those explored in that thread of yours.
http://www.crunchyroll.com/forumtopic-554432/the-three-laws-of-robotics-and-artificial-intelligence/?pg=0

I just wish I could put my finger on the specifics of each to explain what I mean-but they are eluding me.
Like I mentioned, I didn't really have anything to contribute, oh well.
Posted 11/28/09 , edited 11/28/09

farmbird wrote:

Hey Dom !
I've been following this very interesting thread. I have nothing new to add, & many new things to contemplate.

There is a familiar feeling to this discussion though, a sort of nagging suspicion behind the possible purpose or intent of
this topic------

Could this nature/nurture theme in any way relate to your concepts for A I ? Seems to me a lot of the thots & ideas here almost
parallel those explored in that thread of yours.
http://www.crunchyroll.com/forumtopic-554432/the-three-laws-of-robotics-and-artificial-intelligence/?pg=0

I just wish I could put my finger on the specifics of each to explain what I mean-but they are eluding me.
Like I mentioned, I didn't really have anything to contribute, oh well.

Ah yes, my old hypothesis of Artificial Intelligent.

In a sense, I think it's right for you to say that I was coming up a hypothesis of how humanity naturally gained their creativity with this discussion. So that I can reapply the process of creativity towards my A I thesis. The possibility has set into motion by your proposal.
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