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Passion is Life-Changingly Contagious
Posted 3/21/10

DomFortress wrote:


_Wasenshi_ wrote:


DomFortress wrote:


_Wasenshi_ wrote:


DomFortress wrote:


_Wasenshi_ wrote:


DomFortress wrote:


_Wasenshi_ wrote:

Passion can be extremely powerful but extremely dangerous as well, If great people like Martin Luther King Jr. had never had passion where would the Civil Rights movement had gone? Everything has been bulit on the back of passion (and other factors) wether it's passion to create a great society, passion to liberate, passion to drive oursleves further. Without passion we would go through life never ascending to anything beyond what we are now because what would be the point? Why try to push oursleves harder? We need that fire in our eyes to burn and move us forward. However passion can be used for bad purposes too, obviously. Look at Hitler's passion in his views against jews and anyone not of the ayran race. People can have ignorant and evil views and combined with the passion to impact the world events such as the Holocaust, Rwanda, and various other genocides will contiune to happen. Of course passion is only one of many factors that plays a role in such events. So to conclude my ramblings, we need passion we just need to know where the limit is or else that passion will consume us and we could become ignorant to anything else but our burning passions. Those are my views on passion feel free to disagree.
Then don't mind that I do.

There's a difference between individuals willingly did what's hard, as to those who were blindly obeying the social norms. When there's no passion in one doing what's easy.


Even if what you are trying to acomplish is easy to grasp it does not mean you have no passion for that, passion is a strong fondness, emthusiasm, or desire for something. So just because something is easy to accoplish does not mean you would have no passion to see it become reality. Passion can posion people just like any strong force, like religion, greed, etc. If you let a passion consume you to the point it is all you think about it is easy to overlook anyone that may get hurt by that passion. So passion is a great thing to have It just need to be handled with great care because it is a rather easy concept to abuse.
That's the irrationality! When the nature of human desire is for them to prefer the easy task, while there's no doubt about the passion of those individuals with the will to do the hard task.

It's therefore easy to conquer the world with superior firepower and high tech weaponry. But the madness that is the desire for power over the collective, is totally different than the passion that is the will to empower the individuals. For the former is an individual's entitlement/desire for irresponsibility and irrationality, while the latter is the individual's will/choice of a responsibly and rationally altruistic self. (citation).


That is using passion responsibly and for a good cause, but are you implying that passion is always used for only good? The way you are talking makes it seem like you fail to see the danger that can exist in passion. You would agree passion is a powerful force no? Well any powerful force comes with it's own danger, and I never said passion alone can be used as a weapon but mixed with other factors it can become a dangerous mix, it all depends on how and for what it is being used.
I'm saying there's no passion in only obeying what an individual desires. For freedom is the vehicle to dignify humanity from human desire; the individual human will to end the enslaving of originality, creativity, and individuality, from the many wasteful and unnecessary addictions of the society's unnatural pull and desire.


Please don't think I'm disagreeing with you, I agree with what you said and I see truth in both our arguements, I would never just stick blindly to my own belifes, I perfer to incorpertae them with concepts gathered from every person I debate with, while you may not agree with me you should not just throw aside my arguements without giving them some consideration first.
I'm saying that science can analyze human behavioral patterns to the point that I can quantify what's passion from addiction, what's freedom from madness, and what's altruism from entitlement.


Well since I undertand that concept as well I guess there is nothing left for us to debate, unless you have something more you'd like to discuss on passion.
Posted 3/21/10

_Wasenshi_ wrote:


DomFortress wrote:


_Wasenshi_ wrote:


DomFortress wrote:


_Wasenshi_ wrote:


DomFortress wrote:


_Wasenshi_ wrote:


DomFortress wrote:


_Wasenshi_ wrote:

Passion can be extremely powerful but extremely dangerous as well, If great people like Martin Luther King Jr. had never had passion where would the Civil Rights movement had gone? Everything has been bulit on the back of passion (and other factors) wether it's passion to create a great society, passion to liberate, passion to drive oursleves further. Without passion we would go through life never ascending to anything beyond what we are now because what would be the point? Why try to push oursleves harder? We need that fire in our eyes to burn and move us forward. However passion can be used for bad purposes too, obviously. Look at Hitler's passion in his views against jews and anyone not of the ayran race. People can have ignorant and evil views and combined with the passion to impact the world events such as the Holocaust, Rwanda, and various other genocides will contiune to happen. Of course passion is only one of many factors that plays a role in such events. So to conclude my ramblings, we need passion we just need to know where the limit is or else that passion will consume us and we could become ignorant to anything else but our burning passions. Those are my views on passion feel free to disagree.
Then don't mind that I do.

There's a difference between individuals willingly did what's hard, as to those who were blindly obeying the social norms. When there's no passion in one doing what's easy.


Even if what you are trying to acomplish is easy to grasp it does not mean you have no passion for that, passion is a strong fondness, emthusiasm, or desire for something. So just because something is easy to accoplish does not mean you would have no passion to see it become reality. Passion can posion people just like any strong force, like religion, greed, etc. If you let a passion consume you to the point it is all you think about it is easy to overlook anyone that may get hurt by that passion. So passion is a great thing to have It just need to be handled with great care because it is a rather easy concept to abuse.
That's the irrationality! When the nature of human desire is for them to prefer the easy task, while there's no doubt about the passion of those individuals with the will to do the hard task.

It's therefore easy to conquer the world with superior firepower and high tech weaponry. But the madness that is the desire for power over the collective, is totally different than the passion that is the will to empower the individuals. For the former is an individual's entitlement/desire for irresponsibility and irrationality, while the latter is the individual's will/choice of a responsibly and rationally altruistic self. (citation).


That is using passion responsibly and for a good cause, but are you implying that passion is always used for only good? The way you are talking makes it seem like you fail to see the danger that can exist in passion. You would agree passion is a powerful force no? Well any powerful force comes with it's own danger, and I never said passion alone can be used as a weapon but mixed with other factors it can become a dangerous mix, it all depends on how and for what it is being used.
I'm saying there's no passion in only obeying what an individual desires. For freedom is the vehicle to dignify humanity from human desire; the individual human will to end the enslaving of originality, creativity, and individuality, from the many wasteful and unnecessary addictions of the society's unnatural pull and desire.


Please don't think I'm disagreeing with you, I agree with what you said and I see truth in both our arguements, I would never just stick blindly to my own belifes, I perfer to incorpertae them with concepts gathered from every person I debate with, while you may not agree with me you should not just throw aside my arguements without giving them some consideration first.
I'm saying that science can analyze human behavioral patterns to the point that I can quantify what's passion from addiction, what's freedom from madness, and what's altruism from entitlement.


Well since I undertand that concept as well I guess there is nothing left for us to debate, unless you have something more you'd like to discuss on passion.
Only that science itself isn't that easy of a discipline as one might think, when even now the scientific society has to convince and confront the social norms. While being aware of the public backlash as its consequences.
Posted 3/21/10

DomFortress wrote:


_Wasenshi_ wrote:


DomFortress wrote:


_Wasenshi_ wrote:


DomFortress wrote:


_Wasenshi_ wrote:


DomFortress wrote:


_Wasenshi_ wrote:


DomFortress wrote:


_Wasenshi_ wrote:

Passion can be extremely powerful but extremely dangerous as well, If great people like Martin Luther King Jr. had never had passion where would the Civil Rights movement had gone? Everything has been bulit on the back of passion (and other factors) wether it's passion to create a great society, passion to liberate, passion to drive oursleves further. Without passion we would go through life never ascending to anything beyond what we are now because what would be the point? Why try to push oursleves harder? We need that fire in our eyes to burn and move us forward. However passion can be used for bad purposes too, obviously. Look at Hitler's passion in his views against jews and anyone not of the ayran race. People can have ignorant and evil views and combined with the passion to impact the world events such as the Holocaust, Rwanda, and various other genocides will contiune to happen. Of course passion is only one of many factors that plays a role in such events. So to conclude my ramblings, we need passion we just need to know where the limit is or else that passion will consume us and we could become ignorant to anything else but our burning passions. Those are my views on passion feel free to disagree.
Then don't mind that I do.

There's a difference between individuals willingly did what's hard, as to those who were blindly obeying the social norms. When there's no passion in one doing what's easy.


Even if what you are trying to acomplish is easy to grasp it does not mean you have no passion for that, passion is a strong fondness, emthusiasm, or desire for something. So just because something is easy to accoplish does not mean you would have no passion to see it become reality. Passion can posion people just like any strong force, like religion, greed, etc. If you let a passion consume you to the point it is all you think about it is easy to overlook anyone that may get hurt by that passion. So passion is a great thing to have It just need to be handled with great care because it is a rather easy concept to abuse.
That's the irrationality! When the nature of human desire is for them to prefer the easy task, while there's no doubt about the passion of those individuals with the will to do the hard task.

It's therefore easy to conquer the world with superior firepower and high tech weaponry. But the madness that is the desire for power over the collective, is totally different than the passion that is the will to empower the individuals. For the former is an individual's entitlement/desire for irresponsibility and irrationality, while the latter is the individual's will/choice of a responsibly and rationally altruistic self. (citation).


That is using passion responsibly and for a good cause, but are you implying that passion is always used for only good? The way you are talking makes it seem like you fail to see the danger that can exist in passion. You would agree passion is a powerful force no? Well any powerful force comes with it's own danger, and I never said passion alone can be used as a weapon but mixed with other factors it can become a dangerous mix, it all depends on how and for what it is being used.
I'm saying there's no passion in only obeying what an individual desires. For freedom is the vehicle to dignify humanity from human desire; the individual human will to end the enslaving of originality, creativity, and individuality, from the many wasteful and unnecessary addictions of the society's unnatural pull and desire.


Please don't think I'm disagreeing with you, I agree with what you said and I see truth in both our arguements, I would never just stick blindly to my own belifes, I perfer to incorpertae them with concepts gathered from every person I debate with, while you may not agree with me you should not just throw aside my arguements without giving them some consideration first.
I'm saying that science can analyze human behavioral patterns to the point that I can quantify what's passion from addiction, what's freedom from madness, and what's altruism from entitlement.


Well since I undertand that concept as well I guess there is nothing left for us to debate, unless you have something more you'd like to discuss on passion.
Only that science itself isn't that easy of a discipline as one might think, when even now the scientific society has to convince and confront the social norms. While being aware of the public backlash as its consequences.


I never said science was easy, that was quite the random topic change.
Posted 3/21/10

_Wasenshi_ wrote:


DomFortress wrote:


_Wasenshi_ wrote:


DomFortress wrote:
I'm saying that science can analyze human behavioral patterns to the point that I can quantify what's passion from addiction, what's freedom from madness, and what's altruism from entitlement.


Well since I undertand that concept as well I guess there is nothing left for us to debate, unless you have something more you'd like to discuss on passion.
Only that science itself isn't that easy of a discipline as one might think, when even now the scientific society has to convince and confront the social norms. While being aware of the public backlash as its consequences.


I never said science was easy, that was quite the random topic change.
Everything is relative when you keep things in perspective with one to another. Therefore this isn't a change of topic, when I was clearly stating how natural science must based its theories on natural facts observable in nature.

Therefore while you tried to convince and confront me with your subjective view on passion, you forgot that it had always been the nature of humanity itself that's ultimately what's at stake. When human passion is only a part of human will, just like how human madness is a part of human desire.
Posted 3/21/10

DomFortress wrote:


_Wasenshi_ wrote:


DomFortress wrote:


_Wasenshi_ wrote:


DomFortress wrote:
I'm saying that science can analyze human behavioral patterns to the point that I can quantify what's passion from addiction, what's freedom from madness, and what's altruism from entitlement.


Well since I undertand that concept as well I guess there is nothing left for us to debate, unless you have something more you'd like to discuss on passion.
Only that science itself isn't that easy of a discipline as one might think, when even now the scientific society has to convince and confront the social norms. While being aware of the public backlash as its consequences.


I never said science was easy, that was quite the random topic change.
Everything is relative when you keep things in perspective with one to another. Therefore this isn't a change of topic, when I was clearly stating how natural science must based its theories on natural facts observable in nature.

Therefore while you tried to convince and confront me with your subjective view on passion, you forgot that it had always been the nature of humanity itself that's ultimately what's at stake. When human passion is only a part of human will, just like how human madness is a part of human desire.


Who says I forgot that? and I never tried to convince you, I could care less about doing that I was simply stating my opinion, I will continue to believe what I believe no matter how many people come along and attempt to force their views down my throat. I don't even think you understood what I was saying to begin with, you put a lot of words into my mouth and seemed to convince yourself that I was taking a certain stand against what you were saying. Oh well if that is what you choose to believe about me then so be it.
Posted 3/21/10

_Wasenshi_ wrote:


DomFortress wrote:


_Wasenshi_ wrote:


DomFortress wrote:


_Wasenshi_ wrote:


DomFortress wrote:
I'm saying that science can analyze human behavioral patterns to the point that I can quantify what's passion from addiction, what's freedom from madness, and what's altruism from entitlement.


Well since I undertand that concept as well I guess there is nothing left for us to debate, unless you have something more you'd like to discuss on passion.
Only that science itself isn't that easy of a discipline as one might think, when even now the scientific society has to convince and confront the social norms. While being aware of the public backlash as its consequences.


I never said science was easy, that was quite the random topic change.
Everything is relative when you keep things in perspective with one to another. Therefore this isn't a change of topic, when I was clearly stating how natural science must based its theories on natural facts observable in nature.

Therefore while you tried to convince and confront me with your subjective view on passion, you forgot that it had always been the nature of humanity itself that's ultimately what's at stake. When human passion is only a part of human will, just like how human madness is a part of human desire.


Who says I forgot that? and I never tried to convince you, I could care less about doing that I was simply stating my opinion, I will continue to believe what I believe no matter how many people come along and attempt to force their views down my throat. I don't even think you understood what I was saying to begin with, you put a lot of words into my mouth and seemed to convince yourself that I was taking a certain stand against what you were saying. Oh well if that is what you choose to believe about me then so be it.
It's a simple observation on someone's opinion towards the nature of humanity; that are we as a specie capable to change our mind?

If you're right, then we as humans are a collective group mind with no independent thought process nor free will. That as long as we believe in something, there's no way to change our mind based on what we believe in. Even though that something is but a lie.
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Posted 3/21/10 , edited 3/21/10

DomFortress wrote:


_Wasenshi_ wrote:


DomFortress wrote:


_Wasenshi_ wrote:


DomFortress wrote:


_Wasenshi_ wrote:


DomFortress wrote:
I'm saying that science can analyze human behavioral patterns to the point that I can quantify what's passion from addiction, what's freedom from madness, and what's altruism from entitlement.


Well since I undertand that concept as well I guess there is nothing left for us to debate, unless you have something more you'd like to discuss on passion.
Only that science itself isn't that easy of a discipline as one might think, when even now the scientific society has to convince and confront the social norms. While being aware of the public backlash as its consequences.


I never said science was easy, that was quite the random topic change.
Everything is relative when you keep things in perspective with one to another. Therefore this isn't a change of topic, when I was clearly stating how natural science must based its theories on natural facts observable in nature.

Therefore while you tried to convince and confront me with your subjective view on passion, you forgot that it had always been the nature of humanity itself that's ultimately what's at stake. When human passion is only a part of human will, just like how human madness is a part of human desire.


Who says I forgot that? and I never tried to convince you, I could care less about doing that I was simply stating my opinion, I will continue to believe what I believe no matter how many people come along and attempt to force their views down my throat. I don't even think you understood what I was saying to begin with, you put a lot of words into my mouth and seemed to convince yourself that I was taking a certain stand against what you were saying. Oh well if that is what you choose to believe about me then so be it.
It's a simple observation on someone's opinion towards the nature of humanity; that are we as a specie capable to change our mind?

If you're right, then we as humans are a collective group mind with no independent thought process nor free will. That as long as we believe in something, there's no way to change our mind based on what we believe in. Even though that something is but a lie.




Dr. House "Its not about whats fun, Its about the truth!"

Posted 3/22/10 , edited 3/22/10

DomFortress wrote:


_Wasenshi_ wrote:


DomFortress wrote:


_Wasenshi_ wrote:


DomFortress wrote:


_Wasenshi_ wrote:


DomFortress wrote:
I'm saying that science can analyze human behavioral patterns to the point that I can quantify what's passion from addiction, what's freedom from madness, and what's altruism from entitlement.


Well since I undertand that concept as well I guess there is nothing left for us to debate, unless you have something more you'd like to discuss on passion.
Only that science itself isn't that easy of a discipline as one might think, when even now the scientific society has to convince and confront the social norms. While being aware of the public backlash as its consequences.


I never said science was easy, that was quite the random topic change.
Everything is relative when you keep things in perspective with one to another. Therefore this isn't a change of topic, when I was clearly stating how natural science must based its theories on natural facts observable in nature.

Therefore while you tried to convince and confront me with your subjective view on passion, you forgot that it had always been the nature of humanity itself that's ultimately what's at stake. When human passion is only a part of human will, just like how human madness is a part of human desire.


Who says I forgot that? and I never tried to convince you, I could care less about doing that I was simply stating my opinion, I will continue to believe what I believe no matter how many people come along and attempt to force their views down my throat. I don't even think you understood what I was saying to begin with, you put a lot of words into my mouth and seemed to convince yourself that I was taking a certain stand against what you were saying. Oh well if that is what you choose to believe about me then so be it.
It's a simple observation on someone's opinion towards the nature of humanity; that are we as a specie capable to change our mind?

If you're right, then we as humans are a collective group mind with no independent thought process nor free will. That as long as we believe in something, there's no way to change our mind based on what we believe in. Even though that something is but a lie.


Did I ever say I thought like that? You need to stop lying to yourself about how I think. "a collective group mind with no independent thought process nor free will"??? That concept disgust me do you really think that is how I view humanity? If that was the reality of humanity we'd be nothing but nations of slaves. If humanity ever becomes like that I would just give up on our pathetic species right then. I value independent thought and free will more then most anything, if we didn't have people that broke away form social norms and thought independently of those around them where would we be today, we'd still think the world was flat and the center of the universe, that's where.
Posted 3/22/10

_Wasenshi_ wrote:


DomFortress wrote:


_Wasenshi_ wrote:


DomFortress wrote:


_Wasenshi_ wrote:


DomFortress wrote:


_Wasenshi_ wrote:


DomFortress wrote:
I'm saying that science can analyze human behavioral patterns to the point that I can quantify what's passion from addiction, what's freedom from madness, and what's altruism from entitlement.


Well since I undertand that concept as well I guess there is nothing left for us to debate, unless you have something more you'd like to discuss on passion.
Only that science itself isn't that easy of a discipline as one might think, when even now the scientific society has to convince and confront the social norms. While being aware of the public backlash as its consequences.


I never said science was easy, that was quite the random topic change.
Everything is relative when you keep things in perspective with one to another. Therefore this isn't a change of topic, when I was clearly stating how natural science must based its theories on natural facts observable in nature.

Therefore while you tried to convince and confront me with your subjective view on passion, you forgot that it had always been the nature of humanity itself that's ultimately what's at stake. When human passion is only a part of human will, just like how human madness is a part of human desire.


Who says I forgot that? and I never tried to convince you, I could care less about doing that I was simply stating my opinion, I will continue to believe what I believe no matter how many people come along and attempt to force their views down my throat. I don't even think you understood what I was saying to begin with, you put a lot of words into my mouth and seemed to convince yourself that I was taking a certain stand against what you were saying. Oh well if that is what you choose to believe about me then so be it.
It's a simple observation on someone's opinion towards the nature of humanity; that are we as a specie capable to change our mind?

If you're right, then we as humans are a collective group mind with no independent thought process nor free will. That as long as we believe in something, there's no way to change our mind based on what we believe in. Even though that something is but a lie.


Did I ever say I thought like that? You need to stop lying to yourself about how I think. "a collective group mind with no independent thought process nor free will"??? That concept disgust me do you really think that is how I view humanity? If that was the reality of humanity we'd be nothing but nations of slaves. If humanity ever becomes like that I would just give up on our pathetic species right then. I value independent thought and free will more then most anything, if we didn't have people that broke away form social norms and thought independently of those around them where would we be today, we'd still think the world was flat and the center of the universe, that's where.
However, your claim of "I will continue to believe what I believe no matter how many people come along and attempt to force their views down my throat" gave grounds to those who will base their belief system on a lie. With a mentality and an attitude for them to cement their claims. That's all I want for you to realize.
Posted 3/22/10

DomFortress wrote:


_Wasenshi_ wrote:


DomFortress wrote:


_Wasenshi_ wrote:


DomFortress wrote:


_Wasenshi_ wrote:


DomFortress wrote:


_Wasenshi_ wrote:


DomFortress wrote:
I'm saying that science can analyze human behavioral patterns to the point that I can quantify what's passion from addiction, what's freedom from madness, and what's altruism from entitlement.


Well since I undertand that concept as well I guess there is nothing left for us to debate, unless you have something more you'd like to discuss on passion.
Only that science itself isn't that easy of a discipline as one might think, when even now the scientific society has to convince and confront the social norms. While being aware of the public backlash as its consequences.


I never said science was easy, that was quite the random topic change.
Everything is relative when you keep things in perspective with one to another. Therefore this isn't a change of topic, when I was clearly stating how natural science must based its theories on natural facts observable in nature.

Therefore while you tried to convince and confront me with your subjective view on passion, you forgot that it had always been the nature of humanity itself that's ultimately what's at stake. When human passion is only a part of human will, just like how human madness is a part of human desire.


Who says I forgot that? and I never tried to convince you, I could care less about doing that I was simply stating my opinion, I will continue to believe what I believe no matter how many people come along and attempt to force their views down my throat. I don't even think you understood what I was saying to begin with, you put a lot of words into my mouth and seemed to convince yourself that I was taking a certain stand against what you were saying. Oh well if that is what you choose to believe about me then so be it.
It's a simple observation on someone's opinion towards the nature of humanity; that are we as a specie capable to change our mind?

If you're right, then we as humans are a collective group mind with no independent thought process nor free will. That as long as we believe in something, there's no way to change our mind based on what we believe in. Even though that something is but a lie.


Did I ever say I thought like that? You need to stop lying to yourself about how I think. "a collective group mind with no independent thought process nor free will"??? That concept disgust me do you really think that is how I view humanity? If that was the reality of humanity we'd be nothing but nations of slaves. If humanity ever becomes like that I would just give up on our pathetic species right then. I value independent thought and free will more then most anything, if we didn't have people that broke away form social norms and thought independently of those around them where would we be today, we'd still think the world was flat and the center of the universe, that's where.
However, your claim of "I will continue to believe what I believe no matter how many people come along and attempt to force their views down my throat" gave grounds to those who will base their belief system on a lie. With a mentality and an attitude for them to cement their claims. That's all I want for you to realize.


If someone wants to sit down with me and debate or discuss something with me I will do so happily and try to draw from what they are saying and, if they have a strong enough argument I might just be swayed to there side of thinking (though they'd have to work hard to convince me to their argument) however when someone comes along and attempts to force me to see things there way I am naturally going to resist them, that is human nature to resist any force attempting to control us and force us into any course action or thought. If someone came and tried to force you to live a certain way that you did not agree with would you not fight against them? That is all I meant by that quote.
Posted 3/22/10

_Wasenshi_ wrote:


DomFortress wrote:


_Wasenshi_ wrote:


DomFortress wrote:


_Wasenshi_ wrote:


DomFortress wrote:


_Wasenshi_ wrote:


DomFortress wrote:


_Wasenshi_ wrote:


DomFortress wrote:
I'm saying that science can analyze human behavioral patterns to the point that I can quantify what's passion from addiction, what's freedom from madness, and what's altruism from entitlement.


Well since I undertand that concept as well I guess there is nothing left for us to debate, unless you have something more you'd like to discuss on passion.
Only that science itself isn't that easy of a discipline as one might think, when even now the scientific society has to convince and confront the social norms. While being aware of the public backlash as its consequences.


I never said science was easy, that was quite the random topic change.
Everything is relative when you keep things in perspective with one to another. Therefore this isn't a change of topic, when I was clearly stating how natural science must based its theories on natural facts observable in nature.

Therefore while you tried to convince and confront me with your subjective view on passion, you forgot that it had always been the nature of humanity itself that's ultimately what's at stake. When human passion is only a part of human will, just like how human madness is a part of human desire.


Who says I forgot that? and I never tried to convince you, I could care less about doing that I was simply stating my opinion, I will continue to believe what I believe no matter how many people come along and attempt to force their views down my throat. I don't even think you understood what I was saying to begin with, you put a lot of words into my mouth and seemed to convince yourself that I was taking a certain stand against what you were saying. Oh well if that is what you choose to believe about me then so be it.
It's a simple observation on someone's opinion towards the nature of humanity; that are we as a specie capable to change our mind?

If you're right, then we as humans are a collective group mind with no independent thought process nor free will. That as long as we believe in something, there's no way to change our mind based on what we believe in. Even though that something is but a lie.


Did I ever say I thought like that? You need to stop lying to yourself about how I think. "a collective group mind with no independent thought process nor free will"??? That concept disgust me do you really think that is how I view humanity? If that was the reality of humanity we'd be nothing but nations of slaves. If humanity ever becomes like that I would just give up on our pathetic species right then. I value independent thought and free will more then most anything, if we didn't have people that broke away form social norms and thought independently of those around them where would we be today, we'd still think the world was flat and the center of the universe, that's where.
However, your claim of "I will continue to believe what I believe no matter how many people come along and attempt to force their views down my throat" gave grounds to those who will base their belief system on a lie. With a mentality and an attitude for them to cement their claims. That's all I want for you to realize.


If someone wants to sit down with me and debate or discuss something with me I will do so happily and try to draw from what they are saying and, if they have a strong enough argument I might just be swayed to there side of thinking (though they'd have to work hard to convince me to their argument) however when someone comes along and attempts to force me to see things there way I am naturally going to resist them, that is human nature to resist any force attempting to control us and force us into any course action or thought. If someone came and tried to force you to live a certain way that you did not agree with would you not fight against them? That is all I meant by that quote.
So you're OK as long as the ground for debate is on an equal stance of from one individual to another? Thereby eliminating the possibility of being swayed by the masses. Fair enough.

Just keep in mind that there are individuals who can do so on an inverted scale proportion, and that's because they have a stronger will that's fit to adapt and adopt, AKA to change.
Posted 3/22/10

DomFortress wrote:


_Wasenshi_ wrote:


DomFortress wrote:


_Wasenshi_ wrote:


DomFortress wrote:


_Wasenshi_ wrote:


DomFortress wrote:


_Wasenshi_ wrote:


DomFortress wrote:


_Wasenshi_ wrote:


DomFortress wrote:
I'm saying that science can analyze human behavioral patterns to the point that I can quantify what's passion from addiction, what's freedom from madness, and what's altruism from entitlement.


Well since I undertand that concept as well I guess there is nothing left for us to debate, unless you have something more you'd like to discuss on passion.
Only that science itself isn't that easy of a discipline as one might think, when even now the scientific society has to convince and confront the social norms. While being aware of the public backlash as its consequences.


I never said science was easy, that was quite the random topic change.
Everything is relative when you keep things in perspective with one to another. Therefore this isn't a change of topic, when I was clearly stating how natural science must based its theories on natural facts observable in nature.

Therefore while you tried to convince and confront me with your subjective view on passion, you forgot that it had always been the nature of humanity itself that's ultimately what's at stake. When human passion is only a part of human will, just like how human madness is a part of human desire.


Who says I forgot that? and I never tried to convince you, I could care less about doing that I was simply stating my opinion, I will continue to believe what I believe no matter how many people come along and attempt to force their views down my throat. I don't even think you understood what I was saying to begin with, you put a lot of words into my mouth and seemed to convince yourself that I was taking a certain stand against what you were saying. Oh well if that is what you choose to believe about me then so be it.
It's a simple observation on someone's opinion towards the nature of humanity; that are we as a specie capable to change our mind?

If you're right, then we as humans are a collective group mind with no independent thought process nor free will. That as long as we believe in something, there's no way to change our mind based on what we believe in. Even though that something is but a lie.


Did I ever say I thought like that? You need to stop lying to yourself about how I think. "a collective group mind with no independent thought process nor free will"??? That concept disgust me do you really think that is how I view humanity? If that was the reality of humanity we'd be nothing but nations of slaves. If humanity ever becomes like that I would just give up on our pathetic species right then. I value independent thought and free will more then most anything, if we didn't have people that broke away form social norms and thought independently of those around them where would we be today, we'd still think the world was flat and the center of the universe, that's where.
However, your claim of "I will continue to believe what I believe no matter how many people come along and attempt to force their views down my throat" gave grounds to those who will base their belief system on a lie. With a mentality and an attitude for them to cement their claims. That's all I want for you to realize.


If someone wants to sit down with me and debate or discuss something with me I will do so happily and try to draw from what they are saying and, if they have a strong enough argument I might just be swayed to there side of thinking (though they'd have to work hard to convince me to their argument) however when someone comes along and attempts to force me to see things there way I am naturally going to resist them, that is human nature to resist any force attempting to control us and force us into any course action or thought. If someone came and tried to force you to live a certain way that you did not agree with would you not fight against them? That is all I meant by that quote.
So you're OK as long as the ground for debate is on an equal stance of from one individual to another? Thereby eliminating the possibility of being swayed by the masses. Fair enough.

Just keep in mind that there are individuals who can do so on an inverted scale proportion, and that's because they have a stronger will that's fit to adapt and adopt, AKA to change.


Basically yes, being swayed by the masses rarely ever ends in a positive way after all. I just abhor the idea of anyone forcing others to see things their way or live according to their rules, to me it is the ultimate rape of our freedom. However then again I suppose that raises the question that if by doing the aforementioned it leads to a better quality of life for those people is it ok then? If your forcing people for their own sake does that make it ok? I apoligize if I am continuing the coversation and you want it to end, I just don't like only looking at one side of any argument, and I like to question the world around me.
Posted 3/22/10

_Wasenshi_ wrote:


Basically yes, being swayed by the masses rarely ever ends in a positive way after all. I just abhor the idea of anyone forcing others to see things their way or live according to their rules, to me it is the ultimate rape of our freedom. However then again I suppose that raises the question that if by doing the aforementioned it leads to a better quality of life for those people is it ok then? If your forcing people for their own sake does that make it ok? I apoligize if I am continuing the coversation and you want it to end, I just don't like only looking at one side of any argument, and I like to question the world around me.
None sense! I love questioning the authority! And when the authority is the masses themselves, I'm basically in what I would refer to as a target-rich environment and a kill-box all-in-one. Where accuracy is no longer an issue for my sledgehammer simple approach to problem solving.

And when natural science can explain moral and ethic values scientifically with natural facts. I think wellness lifestyle can very well be the moral choice that will have universal value, and it's a value that's quantifiable. By natural and experimental science with its method of observing and experimenting human nature. As a biological mechanism with measurable cause and consequence.

Furthermore, this knowledge can very well be the blueprint for designing a new society, based on what naturally humanity is as human positivity. This subsequently means religions are loosing their value worth to the natural science's method of questioning dogmatic religious practices.
Posted 3/23/10

DomFortress wrote:


_Wasenshi_ wrote:


Basically yes, being swayed by the masses rarely ever ends in a positive way after all. I just abhor the idea of anyone forcing others to see things their way or live according to their rules, to me it is the ultimate rape of our freedom. However then again I suppose that raises the question that if by doing the aforementioned it leads to a better quality of life for those people is it ok then? If your forcing people for their own sake does that make it ok? I apoligize if I am continuing the coversation and you want it to end, I just don't like only looking at one side of any argument, and I like to question the world around me.
None sense! I love questioning the authority! And when the authority is the masses themselves, I'm basically in what I would refer to as a target-rich environment and a kill-box all-in-one. Where accuracy is no longer an issue for my sledgehammer simple approach to problem solving.

And when natural science can explain moral and ethic values scientifically with natural facts. I think wellness lifestyle can very well be the moral choice that will have universal value, and it's a value that's quantifiable. By natural and experimental science with its method of observing and experimenting human nature. As a biological mechanism with measurable cause and consequence.

Furthermore, this knowledge can very well be the blueprint for designing a new society, based on what naturally humanity is as human positivity. This subsequently means religions are loosing their value worth to the natural science's method of questioning dogmatic religious practices.


Music to my ears!

I always look for scientific, rational, or logical ways to explain things, however I am, to a certain degree, open-minded toward religious ideas, I am an atheist so I don't believe in any of it but I always have that "There is a possibilty I'm wrong" thought in the back of my head. I would love to see more people turning towards rationality in their thoughts and actions but I'll never criticise someone for sticking to their religious beliefs, after all I'm only one small human amonst amongst 7 billion, what right do I have to say what is the truth of the world I can only, like everyone else, speculate towards what is the truth. However when you look at all the science proving evolution and other non-religious idea there is certainly a stronger arguement for that side.
Posted 3/23/10

_Wasenshi_ wrote:


DomFortress wrote:


_Wasenshi_ wrote:


Basically yes, being swayed by the masses rarely ever ends in a positive way after all. I just abhor the idea of anyone forcing others to see things their way or live according to their rules, to me it is the ultimate rape of our freedom. However then again I suppose that raises the question that if by doing the aforementioned it leads to a better quality of life for those people is it ok then? If your forcing people for their own sake does that make it ok? I apoligize if I am continuing the coversation and you want it to end, I just don't like only looking at one side of any argument, and I like to question the world around me.
None sense! I love questioning the authority! And when the authority is the masses themselves, I'm basically in what I would refer to as a target-rich environment and a kill-box all-in-one. Where accuracy is no longer an issue for my sledgehammer simple approach to problem solving.

And when natural science can explain moral and ethic values scientifically with natural facts. I think wellness lifestyle can very well be the moral choice that will have universal value, and it's a value that's quantifiable. By natural and experimental science with its method of observing and experimenting human nature. As a biological mechanism with measurable cause and consequence.

Furthermore, this knowledge can very well be the blueprint for designing a new society, based on what naturally humanity is as human positivity. This subsequently means religions are loosing their value worth to the natural science's method of questioning dogmatic religious practices.


Music to my ears!

I always look for scientific, rational, or logical ways to explain things, however I am, to a certain degree, open-minded toward religious ideas, I am an atheist so I don't believe in any of it but I always have that "There is a possibilty I'm wrong" thought in the back of my head. I would love to see more people turning towards rationality in their thoughts and actions but I'll never criticise someone for sticking to their religious beliefs, after all I'm only one small human amonst amongst 7 billion, what right do I have to say what is the truth of the world I can only, like everyone else, speculate towards what is the truth. However when you look at all the science proving evolution and other non-religious idea there is certainly a stronger arguement for that side.
So conquer your own fear, and you can learn anything. When failure is an option, while fear of failure is an excuse of not doing anything, which kills curiosity.
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