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expelling the palestinians out?
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Posted 9/17/10
so this is the case of a simple case that in the process became complicated, so complicated that their is no way to untangle the situation. Well, if they give love a chance, may things may work out.
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Posted 9/17/10

jandarujora wrote:


alupihan45 wrote:

is it true that america and europe supported the creation of a jewish state in palestinian soil? If so, why?
Is this the cause of hate today in the international community?


This is no secret. Jewish power has ridiculously overwhelming representation and dominating voice in America and Europe enough to continuously persuade those governments to support and throw money into Israel and next to nothing for anyone else. It's pretty much the root cause behind the hatred towards Israel and Western foreign policy in general.


yes yes. "VE are ALL branch offices of Jerusalem" Just like in the thirties Nazi propaganda film.


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Posted 9/17/10

alupihan45 wrote:

so this is the case of a simple case that in the process became complicated, so complicated that their is no way to untangle the situation. Well, if they give love a chance, may things may work out.


We it's a case that is more complicated that those who would make it simple to suit their own ends can tolerate.

The divisive Issue get's town to 'right of return' There are Palestinians alive today who remember being driven from a specific house or business and want that piece of land, that specific building, back.

Of course it's been over 60 years now, and in the meant time there's been explosions and development and no matter how unfairly a property has been acquire it has probably since changed hands in an above board and expensive for the owner, manner

Think about how much your city/town has changed in 60 years and imagine several someone's coming back and saying 'My house was here, in the middle of this new road. It looked like this, I want it back".

There's also the issue of Israeli settlers. Every time Israel expanded it's borders. First into the regions it was attacked from during the first Arab Israeli war, then The Gaza, taken from the Egyptians during the Suez Crisis. the Sinai Peninsula (including the tiny strip known as Gaza) was critical to securing Israel's southern border. From now on, Any attacks from Egypt (and there were at least two more wars) had to come from across the Nile River or the Gulf of Suez.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:1956_Suez_war_-_conquest_of_Sinai.jpg

From Syria during one of the later wars of Arab aggression they Took the Golan Heights, the only high ground between Jerusalem and Damascus, Critical to defending Israel from Syria. The west bank Similarly, when taken back from Trans-Jordan (which never returned the west bank to the Palestinians due to it's own ambitions in the region) put the Jordan river between Israel and the new Country of Jordan.

It's interesting to note that once these strategic defense points were held, Israel never expanded further. Never took any further land from say ... Lebanon (which it invaded twice over the actions of Hezbollah)

Unfortunately, what the Israeli's also did is treat the land much like the US did the Oklahoma territory in the 'wild west' era. They treated it as empty land and encouraged settlers to move and colonize it.

These Settlers have often been the most daring, nationalistic, militant and passionate Israelis (think about it, building your house in the middle of hostile territory and on the border with an enemy you KNOW is going to attack you someday) There have been Israeli governments who have tried to constrain and/or even evict their settlers from these newer lands. This has never gone well for the Israeli government.

These two problems, Israeli Settlers, and Right of Return are the most difficult ones to resolve. Although the Israeli government and the Palestinian Authority are negotiating right now on these issues with great endurance.

I would like to note that while Israel administers The Golan Heights under Israeli civil law as if it is part of Israel, the UN calls it occupied territory and has passed repeated resolutions telling Israel not to fortify, settle or otherwise "change the character" of the region.

Israel and Syria had the Golan heights many times on the table during various peace negotiations. These fall apart over the Syrian arming of Hezbollah. Or disputes over the exact shape of the post withdrawl border. The fact that the Golan Heights are easy places from which Artillery can bombard large portions of Israel in relative safety and conversely allow the IDF a commanding view of any Syrian approaches if held by Israel. And the fact that Syria has been in every war against Israel including and especially the Yom Kippur war as well as arming Hezbollah in Lebanon ... Just really makes it unlikely that Israel will EVER feel safe enough to abandon the Golan Heights.


Map of Israel
http://www.google.ca/imgres?imgurl=http://www.ontheissues.org/images/Israel_Map.gif&imgrefurl=http://www.ontheissues.org/Background_War_%2B_Peace.htm&h=414&w
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Posted 9/21/10

alupihan45 wrote:

is it true that america and europe supported the creation of a jewish state in palestinian soil? If so, why?
Is this the cause of hate today in the international community?


So now, that you're back. Did my previous posts on this subject help?


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Posted 9/21/10

jandarujora wrote:


alupihan45 wrote:

is it true that america and europe supported the creation of a jewish state in palestinian soil? If so, why?
Is this the cause of hate today in the international community?


This is no secret. Jewish power has ridiculously overwhelming representation and dominating voice in America and Europe enough to continuously persuade those governments to support and throw money into Israel and next to nothing for anyone else. It's pretty much the root cause behind the hatred towards Israel and Western foreign policy in general.


The foolish Goyim will never understand.
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Posted 9/21/10

jandarujora wrote:


alupihan45 wrote:

is it true that america and europe supported the creation of a jewish state in palestinian soil? If so, why?
Is this the cause of hate today in the international community?


This is no secret. Jewish power has ridiculously overwhelming representation and dominating voice in America and Europe enough to continuously persuade those governments to support and throw money into Israel and next to nothing for anyone else. It's pretty much the root cause behind the hatred towards Israel and Western foreign policy in general.


Grow up on this one most people of Jewish heritage have extremely liberal views and most do not even practice judaism any more. From my point the only thing Jewish people may be guilty of is get a good education. I have also met my fair share poor Jewish people it your kind of logic that lead up to Hitlers using the Jews as scape goats, and the same with Stallion. Blaming the Jews for Christ death is so silly you want to try all the Jewish people in the world on a action of a few 2000 years ago. What is with people today have you ever even met or had contact with jewish people? Or is some trash your read.
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Posted 9/22/10

drizza wrote:


jandarujora wrote:


alupihan45 wrote:

is it true that america and europe supported the creation of a jewish state in palestinian soil? If so, why?
Is this the cause of hate today in the international community?


This is no secret. Jewish power has ridiculously overwhelming representation and dominating voice in America and Europe enough to continuously persuade those governments to support and throw money into Israel and next to nothing for anyone else. It's pretty much the root cause behind the hatred towards Israel and Western foreign policy in general.


The foolish Goyim will never understand.


Ah YES! VE are ALL branch offices of Jerusalem Mwuahahhahhaha!"

RIIIIIIGHT.

This sort of attitude discredits anything else you have to say right out of the gate.


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Posted 9/22/10

tarakelly wrote:


Grow up on this one most people of Jewish heritage have extremely liberal views and most do not even practice judaism any more. From my point the only thing Jewish people may be guilty of is get a good education. I have also met my fair share poor Jewish people it your kind of logic that lead up to Hitlers using the Jews as scape goats, and the same with Stallion. Blaming the Jews for Christ death is so silly you want to try all the Jewish people in the world on a action of a few 2000 years ago. What is with people today have you ever even met or had contact with jewish people? Or is some trash your read.


Given your extreme statements about Islam Tara, don't you feel a tad hypocritical going on about how great and unfairly treated the Jews are? Don't you realize that is why after some of your posts other posters allude to you being Hitler? It's because you're using similar logic against Islam that others are using against Jews.


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Posted 9/22/10
It was brought to my attention that the United States was very instrumental in De-Colonisation after WW II

A key point of the Marshall Plan which pumped a huge amount of dollars into rebuilding Eurpean economies was that you couldn't participate if you held on to your Colonies. Which why the Belgians and the Dutch and pretty much everyone but the British and the French let go of all the overseas holdings they had previously held in subjugation. It was re-subdue an armed an revolting colony without an army or economy of one's own at the cost of losing major funding in rebuilding said economy. OR just write the colony off "Liberate" it, and at least rebuild at home. Everyone who had been conquered by Germany prior or during WWII (except the French) took the latter route.

And it was the Americans who were the agent of this change.
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Posted 9/22/10
Well I was getting the point across that Jews have been the scape goat for way to many people. The majority of the friends I have had in my life that were Jewish never, talked about hating other people. Many thought moving to israel would be crazy most wanted to get into good colleges, And many were of Jewish heritage but followed that faith loosely. It like here in America many hate the rich but I never been employed by a poor person. If you want to get people to follow you with hatred pick on some group you can blame there problems on. I have yet to see anyone defend the Jewish people. My being and atheist put me at a disadvantage because I really do not like religion and to kill by mass slaughter ticks me off.------------------------------------------------------------------Why are most people poor generally they spend more then they bring in, and pay the credit card game. Look if Muslim were in most the conflicts and they left US out of the war it would be like the Congo were million have been slaughter most people do not like it but are not doing any thing about it. I compare Islam to Hitler and Stallion, and there hatred of the Jewish people. Many europeans tried to hide their Jewish friend form the Nazis. Why should I have any like like for a people that uses terrorist tactics.--------------------------------------------------From my point of view I want to snap the back of Islam as a religion Killing Muslim just to kill that would be over the kill. But destroying the faith that can be done. I see Islam for what it is a religion of Zero tolerance toward others. Help them out and they will bite you.
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Posted 9/22/10

tarakelly wrote:

Well I was getting the point across that Jews have been the scape goat for way to many people. The majority of the friends I have had in my life that were Jewish never, talked about hating other people. Many thought moving to israel would be crazy most wanted to get into good colleges, And many were of Jewish heritage but followed that faith loosely. It like here in America many hate the rich but I never been employed by a poor person. If you want to get people to follow you with hatred pick on some group you can blame there problems on. I have yet to see anyone defend the Jewish people. My being and atheist put me at a disadvantage because I really do not like religion and to kill by mass slaughter ticks me off.------------------------------------------------------------------Why are most people poor generally they spend more then they bring in, and pay the credit card game. Look if Muslim were in most the conflicts and they left US out of the war it would be like the Congo were million have been slaughter most people do not like it but are not doing any thing about it. I compare Islam to Hitler and Stallion, and there hatred of the Jewish people. Many europeans tried to hide their Jewish friend form the Nazis. Why should I have any like like for a people that uses terrorist tactics.--------------------------------------------------From my point of view I want to snap the back of Islam as a religion Killing Muslim just to kill that would be over the kill. But destroying the faith that can be done. I see Islam for what it is a religion of Zero tolerance toward others. Help them out and they will bite you.


Most of what you said is reasonable. I wonder why you cannot apply that reason to other groups. The part in bold is the point on which we truly have to disagree. Islam as a whole is not as you say. There are a sufficient number of followers of Islam who ARE as you say to give the rest a bad name but that is NOT the same thing as your statement.

I recall, however, you posting things such as "Just drive them (palestinians) all to the sea" or "Nuke them(Muslims) all and let Allah sort them out." Perhaps this was hyperbole but your insistent stance that all Islam is composed of intolerant terrorists and that you wish to 'break it's back' could lead one to think you meant the above. Which in turn makes you guilty of wishing upon Islamics what Hitler achieved against the Jews. How can you not get this?

Really I've come to believe you are a better person than this. You need to let go of your irrational hate. Expressing it here simply discredits you as someone whose posts are worth reading. I have no doubt that many here have already written you off.


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Posted 9/22/10
Look you and I were both around when the Marine barrack got blasted in the 80 the 70 were hijackings. Were at war with Muslim that hide behind women and children and do not us the geneva convention. When Islam bring in it dogs of war. My attitude will change but in war with people and only faith can separate the two groups, it a fine line which is radical and which is peaceful. My belief system may be fouled up in many people eyes but you pound down any religion that the people think it above the law. I want to save the soldiers lives way more then saving the lives of people that follow some silly religious belief. Right now we have a nut case in Iran trying to build nukes and has all ready stated he use them on Israel. Sitting with are thumb up are ass will start WW3 and the Muslim are going to say the same thing it's the radicals well the joint force slap down the slaughter of innocent Muslim by Christan's after the fall o the Soviet Union.-------------------------------------Has any one even given thought the main reason I do not believe in god is because of this silly stuff Killing in the name of religion should have die over a hundred years ago. If I see a KKK clown I will get into his face so fast it's not funny, and I hope the jerk put a hand on me. I am Burt out on playing games with people. Do you think make friends with the people that what to fly the rebel flag. I tell them Sherman's march and burn everything-was a good strategy. And South Carolina really got there teeth kicked. Wars that go half way will be fought again. That how I see it and history show it as well. I do not want us to go back to these same place and fight the same fight over again.
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Posted 9/22/10
On a personnel note I find muslim male to be sexes and condescending, They would give me a hard time at work and when feed up with them I would have them removed. They should have realized the sight engineer was not just for show. crawling around getting dirty with the people all males gained me respect and never asked any one to do something I would not do. I would have the same problem with American males as well. Most time the workers knew me and would take care of mechanic or electrician that gave me a hard time. Firing another EE was not a problem for me. Most belonged to the manufacture and I walked into a Regional manger office and tell them to get who ever off the sight or the Plant manger. Having to deal with this so called men always a pain in the tail. Now after learning more about the Quran I really have very little respect for them. Most of these men thought getting down and dirty was beneath them my team or the leader of the team we did not play that game. One thing the owner made sure of lead by example sad part it killed him in the end.
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