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Liberalism
6268 cr points
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24 / M / The Netherlands
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Posted 9/27/10
What's your concept of liberalism or liberalists?
What is Liberalism?

Is Liberalism good or bad?

These questions rose up on me, since I see the term Liberals being used as something bad, it's almost used like it's a curse word.
In my History classes (I studied History) everytime I read about Liberalism, it was about freedom (hence the wroth libera, wich is freedom in Latin), and other things I completely agreed with.
So... when did being a liberal become a bad, no almost evil thing?


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47 / F / Center of the Uni...
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Posted 9/27/10 , edited 9/27/10
You're listening to too many Americans. To many of them, yes, liberal (pronounced as a contemptuous 'Leeeeeberrral") is indeed a dirty word. It is the first step on the slippery slope, down through socialism, and into communism. Don't let their loud voices confuse you. In other countries the it's not necessarily a dirty word nor a bankrupt political position.

Liberal, The Liberal Party of Canada actually, is the proper name of the national political party in Canada that's had the most majority governments and the most governments period by a twofold factor since Confederation.

The New Democratic Party (formerly the Co operative Commonwealth Federation) has been a major voice for socialist policies in Canada since the Great Depression. And while it's never formed a federal government, it has been the ruling party in many provincial governments over the decades and done no better nor worse than any other party at meeting its province's need while balancing the budget. For every fiasco on the left there's been incompetent governments on the right as well.

One thing that has been giving the powers that be, the strength to shift to the right over the last generation had been the fall of the Soviets and the switch of the Chinese to a de facto capitalism (without losing their authoritarian ideology)

There's no competing interest anymore that is pointing out the contradictions in our societies. No alternate ideology that business owners and politicians feel they have to bribe their underlings to turn their backs on. If anything the economic collapse of the soviets 'proves' that communism and hence all socialist thinking to be failed in their eyes and they feel less need to even pay lip service to a sense of obligation or fairplay to those who are not 'elect' ( in the Calvinist sense of the word). I actually fear there's even been some creeping fascism showing up over the last 20 years.

Anyhow that's my opinion on Liberalism as a 'dirty' word. It's an American thing. and Americans are loud and prolific. Also as the current (if fading) superpower what they think matter to all of us in the world much more than say what the Dutch, or the Canadians think.
Posted 9/27/10
Liberty is freedom through your own responsibility and will. Yet it can be easily abused, as we've all seen. The lowest dregs of society think that freedom means doing whatever you wish regardless of the consequences or how other people might feel about it. Such is called arrogance, and amounts to precisely nothing, since those on the outskirts of social normalcy are merely sociopathic degenerates.
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Posted 9/27/10

Northerner wrote:

Liberty is freedom through your own responsibility and will. Yet it can be easily abused, as we've all seen. The lowest dregs of society think that freedom means doing whatever you wish regardless of the consequences or how other people might feel about it. Such is called arrogance, and amounts to precisely nothing, since those on the outskirts of social normalcy are merely sociopathic degenerates.


But how does this relate to 'liberal' being a dirty word in the united states. Even those politicians who would be unashamedly addressed as liberals in other countries (well... luke-warm liberals) run for cover and backpedal like crazy with the 'L' word is brought up. The panic on their faces makes it clear that 'liberal' is synonymous with political suicide.


Posted 9/27/10

papagolfwhiskey wrote:


Northerner wrote:

Liberty is freedom through your own responsibility and will. Yet it can be easily abused, as we've all seen. The lowest dregs of society think that freedom means doing whatever you wish regardless of the consequences or how other people might feel about it. Such is called arrogance, and amounts to precisely nothing, since those on the outskirts of social normalcy are merely sociopathic degenerates.


But how does this relate to 'liberal' being a dirty word in the united states. Even those politicians who would be unashamedly addressed as liberals in other countries (well... luke-warm liberals) run for cover and backpedal like crazy with the 'L' word is brought up. The panic on their faces makes it clear that 'liberal' is synonymous with political suicide.




Many people cannot breath the sweet air of freedom since they are so used to being under the foot of totalitarian rule. Liberty can be taken to far, but is highly necessary in certain situations.
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Posted 9/27/10
am I speaking Jabberwocky? What does Liberty and it's sweet call, have to do with liberal being a dirty word in american culture and politics.
What makes 'liberal' a word so habitually spoken with contempt that it's one of the axioms of almost all american accents to pronounce it with a sneer?
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52 / F / Atlanta GA
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Posted 9/28/10
Here is the real problem with liberalism in America it all the sub groups that it get tag with. Environmental groups, socialist agenda, your lifestyle, Basically far left thinking. My being a Libertarian I could care less what you do as long as your not hurting or taking away from others for your life style. Environmentalist groups have a all or nothing think process which hurts the people and half the time are wrong.Many wild fires that have destroyed peoples property on the west cost by not using controlled burn or to at least do something about the under brush. New Orleans Many projects to change and modify the way water was to be channelled out of the area were blocked. The socialist a agenda is not wanted by more than 60% of the people but that Democrats putting there hands deeper into your pocket.
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Posted 9/28/10 , edited 9/28/10
The problem is that modern liberalism is the exact opposite of old liberalism.

Modern liberalism mean no freedoms and no rights and absolute undenyable government control of every aspect of your life.

Modern liberalism

No economic freedoms or rights
~ They want to tell you how much money your allowed to have and what you can spend it on.

No property rights
~ Modern liberals think private property is theft

No personal rights or freedoms
~ No right to own or operate a business
~ No right to choose the car / truck of your choice ~ they demand that everybody drives ungody hybrids / electric cars with no towing capacity
~ Want to tell you how much energy your allowed to use and if you use to much you gets no more
~ so on

so forth.

That's why everybody hates it

It also means ungodly high taxes(70+%) on everybody.
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52 / F / Atlanta GA
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Posted 9/28/10
Dam, I like the way you put that. Then again is there really any difference in socialism and liberalism, in America?
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Posted 9/29/10

Allhailodin wrote:

The problem is that modern liberalism is the exact opposite of old liberalism.

Modern liberalism mean no freedoms and no rights and absolute undenyable government control of every aspect of your life.

Modern liberalism

No economic freedoms or rights
~ They want to tell you how much money your allowed to have and what you can spend it on.

No property rights
~ Modern liberals think private property is theft

No personal rights or freedoms
~ No right to own or operate a business
~ No right to choose the car / truck of your choice ~ they demand that everybody drives ungody hybrids / electric cars with no towing capacity
~ Want to tell you how much energy your allowed to use and if you use to much you gets no more
~ so on

so forth.

That's why everybody hates it

It also means ungodly high taxes(70+%) on everybody.


Well if that's what Liberalism is, who WOULD like it? but I think your definition is incorrect and biased. I think you're listening to what people like Anne Coulter and Rush Limbaugh tell you what liberals are.
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24 / M / The Netherlands
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Posted 9/29/10 , edited 9/29/10

Allhailodin wrote:

The problem is that modern liberalism is the exact opposite of old liberalism.

Modern liberalism mean no freedoms and no rights and absolute undenyable government control of every aspect of your life.

Modern liberalism

No economic freedoms or rights
~ They want to tell you how much money your allowed to have and what you can spend it on.

No property rights
~ Modern liberals think private property is theft

No personal rights or freedoms
~ No right to own or operate a business
~ No right to choose the car / truck of your choice ~ they demand that everybody drives ungody hybrids / electric cars with no towing capacity
~ Want to tell you how much energy your allowed to use and if you use to much you gets no more
~ so on

so forth.

That's why everybody hates it

It also means ungodly high taxes(70+%) on everybody.


Exactely how is that Liberlism? Isn't that communism/facism (since people are forced to choose things they do not want).
Please a real Liberal goes for progressive freedom, not for progressive communism.

Why would a real Liberal not allow you to open a buisness? Actually let me change my question, what kind of Liberal are you talking about?
Not one point you showed me was the point of a real liberal.

Infact a real Liberal wants very litlle Gouverment interference with their lives/economy.
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Posted 9/29/10 , edited 9/29/10

amersfoort wrote:

Exactely how is that Liberlism? Isn't that communism/facism (since people are forced to choose things they do not want).
Please a real Liberal goes for progressive freedom, not for progressive communism.

Why would a real Liberal not allow you to open a buisness? Actually let me change my question, what kind of Liberal are you talking about?
Not one point you showed me was the point of a real liberal.

Infact a real Liberal wants very litlle Gouverment interference with their lives/economy.


Bullshit, if a real liberal wants freedom, why are they always taking away our freedoms and imposing government regulations on us ?

Banning or trying to ban foods like luther burgers, hamdogs, and bacon explosions., They banned transfats. ~ taking away freedom of choice

They regulate businesses to the point where they cannot operate. ~ deny the right to own a business

They want to impose a maxium wage onto people ~ Thus they want to tell you how much money your allowed to make and have ~ no economic freedom

They want energy rationing ~ telling us how much energy we are allowed to have ~ in support of this they tell always us we use too much energy and we must use less

Liberals tell us we shouldn't spend money on things like iPods and HDTV's but we should spend our money on things like charities instead. ~ telling us what we are allowed to spend our money on ~ no economic freedom.

Also they demand that we stop buying trucks and suv's, they demand that we all buy ungodly tiny hybrids / all electric cars instead. ~ no freedom of choice

The list continues.
6268 cr points
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24 / M / The Netherlands
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Posted 9/29/10

Allhailodin wrote:


amersfoort wrote:

Exactely how is that Liberlism? Isn't that communism/facism (since people are forced to choose things they do not want).
Please a real Liberal goes for progressive freedom, not for progressive communism.

Why would a real Liberal not allow you to open a buisness? Actually let me change my question, what kind of Liberal are you talking about?
Not one point you showed me was the point of a real liberal.

Infact a real Liberal wants very litlle Gouverment interference with their lives/economy.


Bullshit, if a real liberal wants freedom, why are they always taking away our freedoms and imposing government regulations on us ?

Banning or trying to ban foods like luther burgers, hamdogs, and bacon explosions., They banned transfats. ~ taking away freedom of choice

They regulate businesses to the point where they cannot operate. ~ deny the right to own a business

They want to impose a maxium wage onto people ~ Thus they want to tell you how much money your allowed to make and have ~ no economic freedom

They want energy rationing ~ telling us how much energy we are allowed to have ~ in support of this they tell always us we use too much energy and we must use less

Liberals tell us we shouldn't spend money on things like iPods and HDTV's but we should spend our money on things like charities instead. ~ telling us what we are allowed to spend our money on ~ no economic freedom.

Also they demand that we stop buying trucks and suv's, they demand that we all buy ungodly tiny hybrids / all electric cars instead. ~ no freedom of choice

The list continues.


I rather not have you calling my arguments/posts Bullshit.

And you still have not awnser my question, what kind of liberal are you talking about? What kind of trick did you Americans pull off with the word freedom (since libera is latin for freedom)?
A liberal in my country is someone who wants less goverment influence on the economy etc, this is a fact go search it up please.

A liberal in your country sounds like the opposite of what a liberal is.
Again please awnser my question: What kind of Liberal are you talking about?
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Posted 9/29/10

amersfoort wrote:


Allhailodin wrote:


amersfoort wrote:

Exactely how is that Liberlism? Isn't that communism/facism (since people are forced to choose things they do not want).
Please a real Liberal goes for progressive freedom, not for progressive communism.

Why would a real Liberal not allow you to open a buisness? Actually let me change my question, what kind of Liberal are you talking about?
Not one point you showed me was the point of a real liberal.

Infact a real Liberal wants very litlle Gouverment interference with their lives/economy.


Bullshit, if a real liberal wants freedom, why are they always taking away our freedoms and imposing government regulations on us ?

Banning or trying to ban foods like luther burgers, hamdogs, and bacon explosions., They banned transfats. ~ taking away freedom of choice

They regulate businesses to the point where they cannot operate. ~ deny the right to own a business

They want to impose a maxium wage onto people ~ Thus they want to tell you how much money your allowed to make and have ~ no economic freedom

They want energy rationing ~ telling us how much energy we are allowed to have ~ in support of this they tell always us we use too much energy and we must use less

Liberals tell us we shouldn't spend money on things like iPods and HDTV's but we should spend our money on things like charities instead. ~ telling us what we are allowed to spend our money on ~ no economic freedom.

Also they demand that we stop buying trucks and suv's, they demand that we all buy ungodly tiny hybrids / all electric cars instead. ~ no freedom of choice

The list continues.


I rather not have you calling my arguments/posts Bullshit.

And you still have not awnser my question, what kind of liberal are you talking about? What kind of trick did you Americans pull off with the word freedom (since libera is latin for freedom)?
A liberal in my country is someone who wants less goverment influence on the economy etc, this is a fact go search it up please.

A liberal in your country sounds like the opposite of what a liberal is.
Again please awnser my question: What kind of Liberal are you talking about?


A liberal in my country. I pay no heed to politics in other nations since it generally doesn't effect me, so I have no idea what a liberal is in Russia or Hong Kong, I just know what defines a liberal in my country.
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Posted 9/29/10

Allhailodin wrote:


A liberal in my country. I pay no heed to politics in other nations since it generally doesn't effect me, so I have no idea what a liberal is in Russia or Hong Kong, I just know what defines a liberal in my country.


I'll try one last time, don't you actually mean that, the above is how YOU and those who think like you, define liberal in your country? It's your definition. and you have clearly declared yourself not to be a liberal.

Isn't that a little like me saying that oh I don't know: "A Jew is defined by miserliness, mercenary outlook and great wealth?" or perhaps it would be more palatable if I say "An Islamic is defined by intolerance and violence and a tendency to blow himself up."

How are your statements any better than the example assertions I have pretended to make above?


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