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Greatest American cartoon?
Jsu
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Posted 11/13/06
Reboot(I still watch the reruns on YTV lol), Beasties/Beastwars, X-men/Spider-man, Animaniacs, Hysteria, Ren and Stimpy, Dexter's Lab, The Simpsons, Bugs Bunny and Tweety Show, so much more, I just can't recall them.
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Posted 11/13/06
OMG most definately powerpuff girls
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28 / M / It be sleepy time...
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Posted 11/13/06
invader zim and boondocks are mine
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Posted 11/13/06

azrael910 wrote:


redgarnettk wrote:


azrael910 wrote:
I think there is alot of misconception with just how popular anime actually is over there. It is definitley popular and alot of it is considered mainstream, but the hardcore fans are unquestionably looked down on as they are here in the west.


Anime is hardly mainstream in Japan. It's more popular in America, but have you seen Japanese DVD sales of anime? The average Japanese person may know the latest Miyazaki release but will not know anything if you started listing off your entire favorites list.



No, anime is mainstream entertainment as that major shows are successful and shown in primetime slots on major channels. I'm talking about shows like Naruto, Bleach, and Gundam. Just as in america, most viewers for anime like this tend to be junior high to college age.

I don't think too many japanese people are interested in picking them up on DVD thanks to how ungodly expensive they are though, and why bother when you can follow them on tv just as easily? I think american's are more inclined to purchase anime on DVD since thats one of the few ways to enjoy anime uncut and in japanese, especially if you happen to enjoy shows that aren't likely to be on cartoon network. Also anime doesn't quite have the negative conotation over here as it does there. It's still a geeky thing to be into, but it's more acceptable than say Star Trek or Dungeons and Dragons.

Now I think it would be fair to say that niche animes like alot of those followed by the US anime fan culture (i.e. any harem type anime) are very similar to their japanese following. These lack the prime time slots of more popular shows, but they are still shown on TV. There is a hardcore fan culture that enjoys them but few people outside of that are interested in them, and enjoying them usually carries a negative conotation.



It would have to be widely accepted to be mainstream. Anime is mostly viewed by children and young adults. Just because some shows are given primetime slots does not make the entire group (anime) mainstream. Most of the anime shown on prime time are really directed towards a younger audience, not the college audience.
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Posted 11/13/06

redgarnettk wrote:


azrael910 wrote:


redgarnettk wrote:


azrael910 wrote:
I think there is alot of misconception with just how popular anime actually is over there. It is definitley popular and alot of it is considered mainstream, but the hardcore fans are unquestionably looked down on as they are here in the west.


Anime is hardly mainstream in Japan. It's more popular in America, but have you seen Japanese DVD sales of anime? The average Japanese person may know the latest Miyazaki release but will not know anything if you started listing off your entire favorites list.



No, anime is mainstream entertainment as that major shows are successful and shown in primetime slots on major channels. I'm talking about shows like Naruto, Bleach, and Gundam. Just as in america, most viewers for anime like this tend to be junior high to college age.

I don't think too many japanese people are interested in picking them up on DVD thanks to how ungodly expensive they are though, and why bother when you can follow them on tv just as easily? I think american's are more inclined to purchase anime on DVD since thats one of the few ways to enjoy anime uncut and in japanese, especially if you happen to enjoy shows that aren't likely to be on cartoon network. Also anime doesn't quite have the negative conotation over here as it does there. It's still a geeky thing to be into, but it's more acceptable than say Star Trek or Dungeons and Dragons.

Now I think it would be fair to say that niche animes like alot of those followed by the US anime fan culture (i.e. any harem type anime) are very similar to their japanese following. These lack the prime time slots of more popular shows, but they are still shown on TV. There is a hardcore fan culture that enjoys them but few people outside of that are interested in them, and enjoying them usually carries a negative conotation.



It would have to be widely accepted to be mainstream. Anime is mostly viewed by children and young adults. Just because some shows are given primetime slots does not make the entire group (anime) mainstream. Most of the anime shown on prime time are really directed towards a younger audience, not the college audience.



That is a very large audience ok. and there is more than one form of mainstream. There is mainstream which is viewed by all but very few shows are that (American Idol, Survivor back in the day, etc).
But there is also the mainstream of kids shows, dramas, parents, adults,
and the mainstream he is talking about would be mainstream kid shows.
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Posted 11/13/06
My favorite cartoon would be Family Guy.
Kids cartoon would have to be...... Fosters Home
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Posted 11/13/06

quater wrote:


redgarnettk wrote:


azrael910 wrote:


redgarnettk wrote:


azrael910 wrote:
I think there is alot of misconception with just how popular anime actually is over there. It is definitley popular and alot of it is considered mainstream, but the hardcore fans are unquestionably looked down on as they are here in the west.


Anime is hardly mainstream in Japan. It's more popular in America, but have you seen Japanese DVD sales of anime? The average Japanese person may know the latest Miyazaki release but will not know anything if you started listing off your entire favorites list.



No, anime is mainstream entertainment as that major shows are successful and shown in primetime slots on major channels. I'm talking about shows like Naruto, Bleach, and Gundam. Just as in america, most viewers for anime like this tend to be junior high to college age.

I don't think too many japanese people are interested in picking them up on DVD thanks to how ungodly expensive they are though, and why bother when you can follow them on tv just as easily? I think american's are more inclined to purchase anime on DVD since thats one of the few ways to enjoy anime uncut and in japanese, especially if you happen to enjoy shows that aren't likely to be on cartoon network. Also anime doesn't quite have the negative conotation over here as it does there. It's still a geeky thing to be into, but it's more acceptable than say Star Trek or Dungeons and Dragons.

Now I think it would be fair to say that niche animes like alot of those followed by the US anime fan culture (i.e. any harem type anime) are very similar to their japanese following. These lack the prime time slots of more popular shows, but they are still shown on TV. There is a hardcore fan culture that enjoys them but few people outside of that are interested in them, and enjoying them usually carries a negative conotation.



It would have to be widely accepted to be mainstream. Anime is mostly viewed by children and young adults. Just because some shows are given primetime slots does not make the entire group (anime) mainstream. Most of the anime shown on prime time are really directed towards a younger audience, not the college audience.



That is a huge audience you are talking there. That is a large part of mainstream so I would have to say mainstream is anything made big to a broad audience and you just stated one.


Anime is directed towards children and young adults, but that does mean that children and young adults all watch anime. Saying anime is mainstream in Japan is similar to saying cartoons are mainstream in America (and they aren't).
Posted 11/13/06
soo cartoons like sponge bob and rugrats arent mainstream but yet theyve made multipple full lentgh movies released in theaters? Come one give me a break


Trevor (OP)
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Posted 11/13/06
Yeah, and how popular have those movies been? Face it; Nick would not be able to produce those movies by themselves - they had to rely on the television series in order to make them. The movies probably did not make a lot of money for Nick, but the advertising was good for the series.

And of course there are some cartoons that break that mainstream boundry in America just like in Japan with Miyazaki's work. That is why they are similar.
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Posted 11/13/06

redgarnettk wrote:It would have to be widely accepted to be mainstream. Anime is mostly viewed by children and young adults. Just because some shows are given primetime slots does not make the entire group (anime) mainstream. Most of the anime shown on prime time are really directed towards a younger audience, not the college audience.


Actually being given a primetime slot DOES qualify something as being mainstream entertainment. Even though specific a demographic has been targeted it happens to be a very large demographic. Take an american example - football or (most) reality TV, also shown in primetime. Two diffenent target demographics (usually), but both are regarded as mainstream entertainment. Why? Becuase a crapton of people watch them - if they didn't, it wouldn't be on in primetime. Just because it isn't targeted at every single viewer does not mean that it isn't mainstream entertainment.
Posted 11/13/06
your argument makes no sense they made those movies because of how popular the series were. Of course they had to rely on the tv shows they were based off of that was a stupid statemen on your partt. As for how popular those movies were spongebob made over 85 million dollars @ the box office and was ranked #2 was several weeks. soo clearly they were popular among the masses.



Trevor (OP)
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Posted 11/13/06
The reason why so many people on the Internet speak out against people visiting Japan because of anime is because of this misperception that anime is mainstream. It isn't. Go check a tv guide for Japanese shows. Anime amounts to very little of what is actually shown. Like I said earlier, saying anime is mainstream in Japan is like saying cartoons are mainstream in America. Sure, there are a few cartoon shows on during primetime, but that does not make it mainstream. You said that "...a crapton of people watch them" refering to mainstream entertainment. Most people in Japan do not watch anime (wasn't that our point in the beginning?).

And kyocool, I said Nick movies in general aren't popular. I was not specifically replying to the Spongebob movie. I don't watch Spongebob, so I don't keep track of it's standing with the public. My guess though is that if you asked the vast majority of people, they wouldn't know anything about the movie. The same applies towards Nick movies such as The Thornberrys movie (the failure of this movie helped bring down Klasky Csupo which is why you don't see new Rugrat episodes on Nick), the Hey Arnold movie, etc. Just because a series is made into a movie does not make it popular. Anime is an example of this.

Also, popularity does not apply towards whether or not it is mainstream. Being mainstream refers to how the series is rated in a wide audience.
Posted 11/13/06
well i took your words as you were referring to the ones i had previously mentioned next time clarify what you mean. Even though Nick have had some bombs the ones that have done well certainly make up for it. and the idea that popularity doesnt decide if its mainstream or not is crazy! It happens with bands all the time once they gain a large enough fanbase they are reffered to as a mainstream band. Its the same with cartoons Family guy wasnt near as popular as it is now when they did the show originally on fox. Now since its became incredibly popular its a mainstream tv show on sunday nights for fox and airs on CN every night of the week except saturday.



Trevor (OP)
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Posted 11/13/06
Well I don't think it even applies to bands. Look at popular bands such as Dream Theater, Sonata Arctica, etc. They are HUGE and they certainly aren't mainstream. I don't think I've ever heard a Dream Theater song on the radio ever. I agree with you on Family Guy being mainstream however. I think Family Guy is more accepted by adults though because it is satire.

I apologize for not stating what I was referring to. That was my mistake.
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Posted 11/13/06

redgarnettk wrote:

The reason why so many people on the Internet speak out against people visiting Japan because of anime is because of this misperception that anime is mainstream. It isn't. Go check a tv guide for Japanese shows. Anime amounts to very little of what is actually shown. Like I said earlier, saying anime is mainstream in Japan is like saying cartoons are mainstream in America. Sure, there are a few cartoon shows on during primetime, but that does not make it mainstream. You said that "...a crapton of people watch them" refering to mainstream entertainment. Most people in Japan do not watch anime (wasn't that our point in the beginning?).

And kyocool, I said Nick movies in general aren't popular. I was not specifically replying to the Spongebob movie. I don't watch Spongebob, so I don't keep track of it's standing with the public. My guess though is that if you asked the vast majority of people, they wouldn't know anything about the movie. The same applies towards Nick movies such as The Thornberrys movie (the failure of this movie helped bring down Klasky Csupo which is why you don't see new Rugrat episodes on Nick), the Hey Arnold movie, etc. Just because a series is made into a movie does not make it popular. Anime is an example of this.

Also, popularity does not apply towards whether or not it is mainstream. Being mainstream refers to how the series is rated in a wide audience.


Actually, I have spent a fair amount of time in Japan and anime is to a limited extent mainstream entertainment based on what I saw. I have watched quite a bit of japanese television and although anime is not on 24/7, it is on a fair amount - far more than animation is in the west, especially in regards to peak viewing time. Do most japanese watch anime? No, but alot do. Last I heard the japanese population was about 250 million - so to be most of the population it would have to at least be over 125 million people. Does that change the fact you can have a large demographic with less than that many people? Of course not. Sadly, Newtype doesn't list the detailed japanese televesion anime programming like it used to, other wise I'd be able to give a specific figure, but popular anime are some of the top viewed shows over there.

The misconception about japan I was addressing is the american anime fan's misconception that japan is the proverbial land of milk and honey regarding anime fandom. Akibahara could be considered so, but most of japan isn't like that.

Certain things are true - manga is everywhere and dirt cheap compared to america. I've seen entire aisles in Sears-esque deparment store dedicated to nothing but Gundam models. I've seen Eva (and other more obscure shows) gashapons in grocery stores by the entrance - and adults using them with nary a child in sight. When I see those things in the US then I'll say anime is more popular over here. But the closest thing I could find to a store specializing in anime (and related merchandise) was an adult bookstore. Oddly, that was the only place I could find a Gothic Lolita Bible magazine actually on sale, but that's beside the point. I could probably write a book comparing the two fan cultures (of which I prefer the american fan culture to be honest), but that isn't necessarily the issue at hand.

Basically, the popular stuff is easier to find, the unpopular stuff is just as much a pain (if not more so) to get over there as it is here. There is a reason the guys in Genshiken have to take a train to stock up on the goods.

To sum up what I'm trying to get across is anime is popular in Japan, it's just not near as popular as most american fan's think it is.
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