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Our new Earth?
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30 / M / Japan
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Posted 6/6/07
^ well, when you put it that way, I guess it kinda makes sense...
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29 / M / Home of SeaBiscuit
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Posted 6/6/07

sheighton wrote:


yb1j3 wrote:

Have anyone of u heard about the new galaxy that has been found lately?It is 20 light years away. This galaxy also have sun and other planets like our galaxy. The interesting one is one of the planets have similarities with our earth(got same climate, water, nice temperature, and gravity). This planet discovered by European astronomers and they called it, Gliese 581c. However, we still don't know what kind of live or environment there, It may have aliens or may not. For more info you guys can read this article:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/articles/technology/technology.html?in_page_id=1965&in_article_id=450467

So, tell me what do u guys think?Is it possible for us to migrate there someday or maybe we should just believe that Mars is better?Well,all I can say that our earth is dying and I believe nobody wants that, right..?! We just do some prevention here.


You mean solar system, not galaxy...The closest galaxy is the Andromeda galaxy (I believe) and it is several hundred thousand light years away.

Now, I will say this about space travel...It is very possible, even with our current technology level to travel 20 light years to settle a new planet that is similar to Earth. "How so?" some might wonder...Well it is quite simple actually. It is called a generation ship. Generation ships are not just things of mid-20th century science fiction novels, but also things that have been seriously looked at by NASA and other space agencies. Simply put, it is a massive ship that is propelled at sub-light speeds by "conventional" means. It would be the home for generations of humans (the children and grandchildren of the original 500-1000 passengers) and would be a self-sustaining ecosphere. Likely it would be powered by a very efficient large-scale fission reactor and propelled by either ion engines or maybe even solar sails...Namely something that could gradually get the ship to achieve a velocity that would achieve speeds that are only eclipsed by that of light...All of this and more is possible now and the future will only make such an endeavor even more possible. But there is one little problem. The technology to achieve such a goal is a reality, but the will to pay the immense amount of money that would be required to undertake such an endeavor is far from reality. Simply, as of now and probably the next 50-100 years it is just to costly of a project for the level of desire...


Name anything that massive can be projected at even a significant amount of the speed of light. There is no scientific way to doing so.
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30 / M / Aboard the Hyperion
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Posted 6/6/07

edsamac wrote:


yb1j3 wrote:

20 light years... we can never go as fast as light. So to get there...we will waste most of our lives... whats the point again?



What's the point u said?..hmm i guess u don't read the article. I know that it takes a long time to go there but it doesn't mean that it's impossible, right?if 60-70 years ago, we said it is impossiblle to go the moon or even mars, why now we shld say that it is impossible to go to this planet. just some thoughts here.


I agree with happyxix... you're underestimating what a light year is. That's the distance travelled by light in a vacuum in a year... and light travels at around 3,000,000 metres/second... even if we could fabricate a ship that could withstain such tremendous speed, our bodies probably couldn't...


Best be working on those inertia cancellers lol.
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Posted 6/6/07
whoops pressed wrong button
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Posted 6/6/07
the planet won't die before the race of men, so there's no need to move
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Posted 6/6/07

happyxix wrote:

Name anything that massive can be projected at even a significant amount of the speed of light. There is no scientific way to doing so.


Sure there is...You just cannot do it through conventional means...We know of no form of propulsion that could instantaneously accelerate anything to the speed of light, but using a pulse detonation system or ion engine or a solar sail allow for a gradual acceleration. Think of it this way...Put a heavy weight on a wheeled cart and begin pulling with a light but steady force, just enough to get it moving, and then continue pulling the cart with the same amount of force. You would notice that the cart continues to accelerate. Essentially it is the same concept. Physicists have shown that such a propulsion system would get far closer to light speed than we could using any other known means, but it still would fall far short (essentially we would be capable of moving at the speed of a comet, would be my guess).
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Posted 6/6/07
When the big bang happened I'm pretty sure clumps of extremely huge mass were traveling at or near the speed of light.
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Posted 6/6/07

sheighton wrote:


happyxix wrote:

Name anything that massive can be projected at even a significant amount of the speed of light. There is no scientific way to doing so.


Sure there is...You just cannot do it through conventional means...We know of no form of propulsion that could instantaneously accelerate anything to the speed of light, but using a pulse detonation system or ion engine or a solar sail allow for a gradual acceleration. Think of it this way...Put a heavy weight on a wheeled cart and begin pulling with a light but steady force, just enough to get it moving, and then continue pulling the cart with the same amount of force. You would notice that the cart continues to accelerate. Essentially it is the same concept. Physicists have shown that such a propulsion system would get far closer to light speed than we could using any other known means, but it still would fall far short (essentially we would be capable of moving at the speed of a comet, would be my guess).


No the cart won't continue to accelerate cause theres friction pulling it back. You are asking to push something the size of a small school into space. Even if we have enough power just to get to out of our atmosphere, We would never be able to move that much mass at such high speeds. And comets are dam slow compared to light. Even If we move at the speed of a comet it'll take 10 to 100s of generations (rough guess it could be even more) to move 20 light years.

^ big bang is a theory... not proven.
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Posted 6/6/07

happyxix wrote:

No the cart won't continue to accelerate cause theres friction pulling it back. You are asking to push something the size of a small school into space. Even if we have enough power just to get to out of our atmosphere, We would never be able to move that much mass at such high speeds. And comets are dam slow compared to light. Even If we move at the speed of a comet it'll take 10 to 100s of generations (rough guess it could be even more) to move 20 light years.

^ big bang is a theory... not proven.


Yes it will accelerate as long as that small force is greater than the friction, and assuming it is a frictionless environment (like space) or close to it (a wheeled cart with wheels turning on ball bearings). As for moving something the size of a school into space...Think that through a bit...Wouldn't it just be built in space? I mean that is the more logical course of action...A generation ship is designed to travel for generations, and anyways my guess at the speed might be unrealistically slow...I don't know. I'll go find some links about these forms of propulsion.
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Posted 6/6/07
Here is a paper I found on advanced forms of spacecraft propulsion ---> http://www.dartmouth.edu/~humbio01/s_papers/2002/D'Andrea.pdf ...Do enjoy reading it...
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29 / M / Home of SeaBiscuit
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Posted 6/6/07

sheighton wrote:


happyxix wrote:

No the cart won't continue to accelerate cause theres friction pulling it back. You are asking to push something the size of a small school into space. Even if we have enough power just to get to out of our atmosphere, We would never be able to move that much mass at such high speeds. And comets are dam slow compared to light. Even If we move at the speed of a comet it'll take 10 to 100s of generations (rough guess it could be even more) to move 20 light years.

^ big bang is a theory... not proven.


Yes it will accelerate as long as that small force is greater than the friction, and assuming it is a frictionless environment (like space) or close to it (a wheeled cart with wheels turning on ball bearings). As for moving something the size of a school into space...Think that through a bit...Wouldn't it just be built in space? I mean that is the more logical course of action...A generation ship is designed to travel for generations, and anyways my guess at the speed might be unrealistically slow...I don't know. I'll go find some links about these forms of propulsion.


Thats like building the shell of the airplane while you are flying it. (Theres a commercial on something like this on YouTube.. I found it funny). Oh unless you mean like the space stations... which takes forever to build.... The point is with the acceleration, there will always be gravitational forces affecting the ship, causing it to move in one way or another. And there is no way of getting away from those. (My mind is on chem right now so its hard for me to think physics right now lol....) I'll explain better when I'm out of my chem mode.

^ the site you gave has forbidden access
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30 / M / Japan
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Posted 6/6/07
^ You could use the slingshot mechanism that most orbiting crafts use to propell themselves into the universe. This cuts down the need to continuously combust fuel (and save it for redirecting the course of travel), and there is no need to sustain speed in space since it's a frictionless environment.
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Posted 6/6/07

happyxix wrote:

Thats like building the shell of the airplane while you are flying it. (Theres a commercial on something like this on YouTube.. I found it funny). Oh unless you mean like the space stations... which takes forever to build.... The point is with the acceleration, there will always be gravitational forces affecting the ship, causing it to move in one way or another. And there is no way of getting away from those. (My mind is on chem right now so its hard for me to think physics right now lol....) I'll explain better when I'm out of my chem mode.

^ the site you gave has forbidden access


It would be built like a space station...Do you see why I am saying that there is not enough of a desire to make it worth the cost and thus practical? Furthermore, you could use a combination of forms of propulsion. Booster rockets or an ion engine could get you started and then you use the slingshot method to build up some speed. Once you are headed in the right direction a light/solar sail is deployed, suing the sun's light to propel/push the craft and when the sun is too far to make the form of propulsion effective a laser or maser could be deployed to continue providing any necessary propulsion to the sail. After achieving the desired velocity all one has to do is coast. Upon approaching the destination the process is simply repeated in reverse (minus the slingshot)...Simple enough and the physics work out on it quite nicely...

Anyways, I am still saying it isn't going to happen anytime soon...There just isn't the will or desire to do it, despite the costs it would take to build and the amount of time it would take to reach its destination...
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29 / M / Home of SeaBiscuit
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Posted 6/6/07
well putting costs aside but that alone will scrap the project... It'll be hard to calculate the projected path. With all the gravitational interference and unknown matters in space, It'll take quite a long time just to get that down.
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30 / M / Japan
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Posted 6/6/07
I'll go with my biology major side and say that the human race will be gone well before we would have to leave this earth. Either that or we'll still exist in the form of cybergenetic organisms... man, what I'd give to be able to upgrade my own brain or something and play a video game or two in my head when I'm bored...
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