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Post Reply Do you think we exist?
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22 / M / Denmark
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Posted 5/5/13
So what i get from reading this OP is that we might be nothing as we're in such a small scale compared to whats around us, but yet we keep multiplying and growing.

My only conclusion to this, if we were just abit more destructive, we would be equal to a virus.

Oh well, its all organisms so why not
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Posted 5/5/13

peaka10 wrote:

T-o logically no

It's the old tree falls in the forest conundrum
If a tree falls in forest dose it make a sound? (yes and no)
It’s dictated by how you wish to view it.


:blush: its best not to think about it.



I've never understood this argument. When there is impact, there is sound because earth has particles for it to travel through. Just because no one is there to hear it doesn't mean it doesn't make the sound. The converse argument applies philosophy to the word sound. It implies that sound itself has to be heard to exist or be the word "sound", which is the same kind of argument going on here almost.

EX: If something impacted in space, it would not make a sound. There are no particles for it to travel through.
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23 / M / Texas
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Posted 5/5/13
What if I told you that everything you know is a dream?
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Posted 5/5/13

sound exist as vibrations.

if the sound has no where to go it can't be generated

(if no one was there to acknowledge it how do we know it made a sound )


we can continue this as a private message if you like.


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Posted 5/5/13

peaka10 wrote:


sound exist as vibrations.

if the sound has no where to go it can't be generated

(if no one was there to acknowledge it how do we know it made a sound )


we can continue this as a private message if you like.




Unless there is some legitimate reason sound wouldn't happen in the absence of human beings, it is safe to say it does.
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Posted 5/5/13 , edited 5/5/13

Mycow8me wrote:


tgislayer wrote:

If you think of us (the earth) in terms of how infinitesimally large the universe is and how infinitesemally small we are in comparison, Do we really exist?
Im a mathematician you see and if you can consider how much area the earth takes and compare it to the infinite area of space, we are technically nothing. Do you agree?



How are you a mathematician and arguing that something can be equal to nothing if insignificant enough. That's the equivalent of a mathematical statician saying that something will never happen, when statistics prove that it will happen (eventually).


A mathematician would recognize that "something" cannot be equivalent to "nothing". Good lord, reading this post felt like dividing by zero.


To be fair to you, OP is indeed wrong in saying that something is equal to nothing, but both you and he ignore the crucial point. Notice that he said infinitesimally small in comparison. If you consider this mathematically, then it could be true that something equals nothing depending on your definition of "comparison." For example, suppose I defined "equal in comparison" as "the same difference." Then suppose that "nothing" equals 0 and "something" equals some positive finite number, let's say, 1. For any finite difference between 1 and any number, I can always find a number such that the difference between 0 and this other number is the same. Since both are contained in an infinite interval, they are "equal in comparison." Thus, something equals nothing in comparison to infinity. OP then took this, and concluded that since they are "equal in comparison," that makes them "equal" -- which is not true. We absolutely are something, even if not "in comparison."

Also, depending on what sort of mathematical structure you're working with, 0 and 1 can definitely be equal based on how you define them, but then they would probably be irrelevant to the question, so I'll leave it as a side note. I don't want to start an argument, because you're basically correct with your conclusion, even if your logic is off. But I wanted to correct two things that I saw wrong -- the second of which is this:

I think you are seriously misunderstanding what Statistics is if you think it can "prove" that something will happen. It can't. In fact, Statistics exists in large part because we can't yet prove that something will happen. Decisions based on Statistics, as far as I'm concerned, are basically the highest form of "educated guessing" available to man.
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Posted 5/5/13 , edited 5/5/13

peaka10 wrote:


sound exist as vibrations.

if the sound has no where to go it can't be generated

(if no one was there to acknowledge it how do we know it made a sound )


we can continue this as a private message if you like.




I'd rather not since we seem to be in agreement. That was a cross example of the fallacy. Implying that sound doesn't exist because we don't hear it (philosophy). Implying that sound doesn't exist because it can't travel. (philosophy)
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Posted 5/5/13 , edited 5/5/13

JoeSurf wrote:

What if I told you that everything you know is a dream?


I don't know about that. But my earliest memory is waking up from a dream in which I was slightly older than I am now. Used to think it was somebody else but I know it was me now. Not something you can just tell people but it's the truth. I must have been like 3 or 4. Have thought about it every day for decades...
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Posted 5/5/13


I think it was poorly worded and I shouldn't have used the word prove but in reality, if there are statistics for it it's already been proven. I shouldn't have used the word "will" and used "can" instead.
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Posted 5/5/13
Yes, you're all figments of my imagination.
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Posted 5/5/13
All this talk reminded me of this video.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=diVqham5cKA
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31 / M / So Cal
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Posted 5/5/13
I don't think this thread exists. You're just talking to yourself.
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16 / M / behind you (jk un...
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Posted 5/5/13 , edited 5/5/13

wrote:


varnlestoff wrote:

I think, therefore I am.


Descartes hilariously claimed this. However, regardless of one's ability to think, existence still is even without acknowledgment.




I disagree with this I would argue that the world is a product of thought....

I don't know how to explain it very well but Ill try my best, first lets establish a sense of reality. I am, for this instance, defining reality as all "things" that can be observed in some fashion.
("things" is a less technical word than it should be)
Ok now lets try to imagine a hypothetical situation in which there is a universe, a plane of existence, but there is no life. this life does not necessarily have to be intelligent, just life in general from bacteria to animals to plants to humans there can be no life. now in this situation nothing technically exists because there is nothing to confirm existence of something, there is no living thing which can observe something of that universe and say/think "yep thats real" this universe is nothing more than an idea, not a reality, unless some entity of thought can observe otherwise.... much the same is our universe just an idea, the only thing that differentiates our universe from the hypothetical one is that we are here observing our universe, and it is this fact that we are observing it which makes it a reality, rather than just another hypothetical plane of existence.

so basically existence isn't necessarily evident without something and it's ability to think being able to observe and acknowledge observation of some existence.

and this is really confusing even to me reading it again, but its the best way that i can explain this idea, its really abstract and so it might come out as sounding insane when explained like so but hopefully it made a shred of sense...


and i know i cut off the rest of your quote but this was the basis of your claim so i just went with it....


my answer to the overall forum topic:

our existence is a product of our thoughts...


so yes





a619ko wrote:

Yes, you're all figments of my imagination.

Posted 5/5/13

wrote:

I think, therefore I am.


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Posted 5/5/13

kinga750 wrote:


JoeSurf wrote:

What if I told you that everything you know is a dream?


I don't know about that. But my earliest memory is waking up from a dream in which I was slightly older than I am now. Used to think it was somebody else but I know it was me now. Not something you can just tell people but it's the truth. I must have been like 3 or 4. Have thought about it every day for decades...


That sounds like a Deja vu. It happens. Maybe it's God's way of telling you that you are on the right track. It's another way of Him saying, "I'm with you along the way."

Otherwise, I wouldn't know a better explanation. This is just from what you've revealed to me.
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