First  Prev  1  2  3  4  5  Next  Last
New Fall Title: Majikoi~Oh! Samurai Girls
The Wise Wizard
79367 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
54 / M / U.S.A.
Online
Posted 10/9/11

milkyjezzy wrote:

Um...Why does it say it starts on Oct 7? It doesn't. A week late isn't a simulcast. I'm usually not one to complain since I know how the industry works, but don't advertise and then not deliver.

You may want to read that initial message again:

For everyone living in the US and Canada, you will be able to watch it as it starts this Saturday, Oct. 8th at 9:30am PST.

As you may have noticed, the actual date was the 8th (and it was indeed posted that day), not the 7th, and "it" refers to the simulcast, not the series.

As to "a week late isn't a simulcast", that is old ground I covered before, but don't really care to go over again. If you think a simulcast means something must be posted the same day as the first station in Japan airs it, there really is little point.

1978 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
۩۞۩۩۞۩۩۞۩۩۞۩۩۞۩۩۞...
Offline
Posted 10/9/11
will waiting for this anime
17121 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
Offline
Posted 10/10/11

TheAncientOne wrote:
As to "a week late isn't a simulcast", that is old ground I covered before, but don't really care to go over again. If you think a simulcast means something must be posted the same day as the first station in Japan airs it, there really is little point.


Considering that most US shows only air on one station and that anything airing it later than the original air date is considered a rerun, it's perfectly natural to assume simulcast means it should be streamed at least on the same date as the first airing of the show, if not at the exact same time. You can define simulcast however you want but everyone else has pretty much agreed that, if it's not streamed on the first air date, then it's not simulcast, it's late-cast. When it comes to defining terms, popular opinion always wins. Your definition doesn't match popular opinion, whether you like it or not, whether you think it's wrong or not. You can try to change popular opinion to match your definition but until the majority of the world agrees with you, you are wrong.

Do a poll, if you don't believe me about where popular opinion rests.

Also, I think it's worth noting that the only show that hasn't aired and isn't already decided to be streamed by another website is Boku wa Tomodachi ga Sukunai. So, if that's not the next show announced, the show will be a late-cast as well. There are a couple other shows this season that haven't aired but both have already been picked up by other streaming sites and I've yet to to see Crunchy get simulcast rights to a show already being simulcast by another site.
36857 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
21 / M / England
Offline
Posted 10/10/11
Back to torrenting then
69868 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
53 / M / Northeast Ohio, USA
Offline
Posted 10/10/11

LordZel wrote: Considering that most US shows only air on one station and that anything airing it later than the original air date is considered a rerun, ...
I'm not sure if you've noticed, but anime tends to be shows broadcast on Japanese television, which isn't like that. So people's assumptions based on a national network system are just wrong, unless the series airs on the NHK.

As far as what most people think, it could easily be a different result if you just survey people that talk about anime on internet discussion forums and if you were to survey all the people who happen to watch. While the tendency to mindlessly assume that another country's TV network works like the one the commenter is used to is certainly strong, so is the tendency to mindlessly parrot company written press release text.

And the marketing hypesters are a lot looser than "an hour after some Japanese network does its broadcast of the series".
The Wise Wizard
79367 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
54 / M / U.S.A.
Online
Posted 10/10/11

LordZel wrote:
Considering that most US shows only air on one station and that anything airing it later than the original air date is considered a rerun, it's perfectly natural to assume simulcast means it should be streamed at least on the same date as the first airing of the show, if not at the exact same time.

Given that Japan doesn't have nationwide television networks like the U.S., that natural assumption would be perfectly wrong.

As an example, while Fate/Zero airs on Tokyo MX and Gunma Television Saturdays at midnight, it airs at different times on multiple other stations, ending with Digital BS11 at midnight the following Friday, and Channel smiling at 2:00 AM the following Saturday (2 hours after Tokyo MX has actually shown the next episode).


You can define simulcast however you want but everyone else has pretty much agreed that, if it's not streamed on the first air date, then it's not simulcast, it's late-cast. When it comes to defining terms, popular opinion always wins. Your definition doesn't match popular opinion, whether you like it or not, whether you think it's wrong or not. You can try to change popular opinion to match your definition but until the majority of the world agrees with you, you are wrong.

In stating that popular opinion is what determines definition, you have also just given those that engage in simulcasting to redefine it however they see fit. In fact, they already have. The dictionary definition of simulcasting means to simultaneously broadcast (i.e., as in a sports event simulcast on TV and radio). What anime simulcast has ever met that criteria?

Here is the airing schedule for Fate/Zero:
http://cal.syoboi.jp/tid/2277/time

By perhaps little coincidence, the last station in Japan to air Majikoi is again Channel smiling, this time 90 minutes shy of one week after the first station airs it.

Here is the airing schedule for Majikoi:
http://cal.syoboi.jp/tid/2276/time



Also, I think it's worth noting that the only show that hasn't aired and isn't already decided to be streamed by another website is Boku wa Tomodachi ga Sukunai. So, if that's not the next show announced, the show will be a late-cast as well. There are a couple other shows this season that haven't aired but both have already been picked up by other streaming sites and I've yet to to see Crunchy get simulcast rights to a show already being simulcast by another site.

While Un-go has been announced by Anime on Demand in the UK, that would not prevent it from being announced as a simulcast by CR, although it is unlikely it would be available to UK members.

I expect none of the remaining Kadokawa shows (such as Mirai Nikki (Future Diary)) will be announced for Crunchyroll until NicoNico.com finally makes their announcement, which appears to be on the 14th. (I assume they are delaying the start of their simulcasting in an attempt to make a splash at NYAF, given the date).

As to CR not getting simulcast rights to a show already being simulcast on a different site, it appears you forgot about Fate/Zero.

FYI, Boku wa Tomodachi ga Sukunai aired on October 7 at 1:55 AM in Japan.

It was unlikely to be simulcast at all, given that it is on TBS. The only anime on TBS that has been listed by CR among the simulcasts in more than 2 years is The Idolm@aster, which it should be noted appears here over 3 weeks after the first airing in Tokyo. In fact, the only other relatively recent TBS simulcasts I can recall were Aria: The Scarlet Ammo at Funimation and IS: Infinite Stratos over at TAN. I have no doubt whatsoever that a list of TBS shows that were not simulcast during the same period would as long or longer.

29069 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
26
Offline
Posted 10/10/11


I actually meant to post that in the Sekaiichi Hatsukoi Season 2 thread. And my post still stands. I want to know why it says it's starting October 7th, but when I go to actual page, it says Anime members won't get it for 4 days. What's the explanation for that?

Get off your high horse, seriously. Having a "holier than thou" attitude doesn't make it any more likely that anyone will listen to you. In fact, it does just the opposite.
The Wise Wizard
79367 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
54 / M / U.S.A.
Online
Posted 10/10/11

milkyjezzy wrote:
I actually meant to post that in the Sekaiichi Hatsukoi Season 2 thread. And my post still stands. I want to know why it says it's starting October 7th, but when I go to actual page, it says Anime members won't get it for 4 days. What's the explanation for that?

The explanation for that is that apparently you are looking at the second episode of season 2. As you will note below the first episode of season 2 was posted for members 3 days ago, which was indeed October 7:



17121 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
Offline
Posted 10/11/11 , edited 10/11/11

agila61 wrote:

I'm not sure if you've noticed, but anime tends to be shows broadcast on Japanese television, which isn't like that. So people's assumptions based on a national network system are just wrong, unless the series airs on the NHK.

As far as what most people think, it could easily be a different result if you just survey people that talk about anime on internet discussion forums and if you were to survey all the people who happen to watch. While the tendency to mindlessly assume that another country's TV network works like the one the commenter is used to is certainly strong, so is the tendency to mindlessly parrot company written press release text.

And the marketing hypesters are a lot looser than "an hour after some Japanese network does its broadcast of the series".


I was never asserting that what the majority believes is correct or not. I fully understand why they (Crunchy staff) use the term simulcast the way they do. You could technically "simulcast" a show a year later, if it's being rerun a year later. I'm just trying to say that you shouldn't expect that "simulcast" will have any significant meaning to people who want to see it when it first airs. It makes me wonder why they brand anything with the term simulcast since it really has no significant meaning to the viewer since it really does not relate to the first airing of a show.

I'm merely trying to point out a failure in communication between Crunchy staff and Crunchy viewers/subscribers. It feels like an attempt to generate hype that could and often does end up causing backlash from fans.


TheAncientOne wrote:

Given that Japan doesn't have nationwide television networks like the U.S., that natural assumption would be perfectly wrong.

As an example, while Fate/Zero airs on Tokyo MX and Gunma Television Saturdays at midnight, it airs at different times on multiple other stations, ending with Digital BS11 at midnight the following Friday, and Channel smiling at 2:00 AM the following Saturday (2 hours after Tokyo MX has actually shown the next episode).


I'm already aware of this. I'm not trying to argue against that. In fact, you're only serving to strengthen part of the point I'm trying to make and that is the fact the meaning of "simulcast" does not agree with the natural assumption most viewers here would make.


In stating that popular opinion is what determines definition, you have also just given those that engage in simulcasting to redefine it however they see fit. In fact, they already have. The dictionary definition of simulcasting means to simultaneously broadcast (i.e., as in a sports event simulcast on TV and radio). What anime simulcast has ever met that criteria?

Here is the airing schedule for Fate/Zero:
http://cal.syoboi.jp/tid/2277/time

By perhaps little coincidence, the last station in Japan to air Majikoi is again Channel smiling, this time 90 minutes shy of one week after the first station airs it.

Here is the airing schedule for Majikoi:
http://cal.syoboi.jp/tid/2276/time

While this is certainly informative it misses the mark of what I was attempting and apparently failed to point out in my previous post. Crunchy staff use "simulcast" as a label that is supposed to have some significant meaning to viewers but since it has no actual relation to the first airing of a show, it really has no relevance to the people it's aimed at (Crunchy viewers/subscribers). Though, I stated this much further up in this post.


While Un-go has been announced by Anime on Demand in the UK, that would not prevent it from being announced as a simulcast by CR, although it is unlikely it would be available to UK members.

I expect none of the remaining Kadokawa shows (such as Mirai Nikki (Future Diary)) will be announced for Crunchyroll until NicoNico.com finally makes their announcement, which appears to be on the 14th. (I assume they are delaying the start of their simulcasting in an attempt to make a splash at NYAF, given the date).

As to CR not getting simulcast rights to a show already being simulcast on a different site, it appears you forgot about Fate/Zero.

FYI, Boku wa Tomodachi ga Sukunai aired on October 7 at 1:55 AM in Japan.

It was unlikely to be simulcast at all, given that it is on TBS. The only anime on TBS that has been listed by CR among the simulcasts in more than 2 years is The Idolm@aster, which it should be noted appears here over 3 weeks after the first airing in Tokyo. In fact, the only other relatively recent TBS simulcasts I can recall were Aria: The Scarlet Ammo at Funimation and IS: Infinite Stratos over at TAN. I have no doubt whatsoever that a list of TBS shows that were not simulcast during the same period would as long or longer.


I didn't forget Fate/Zero. I was specifically saying that anything that Crunchy picks up aside from Boku wa Tomodachi ga Sukunai would almost certainly be a "late-cast" and not what the majority define "simulcast" as. However, it seems my info on the air date was off and it already aired.

Still, this means that any show Crunchy picks up at this point would be "late-cast" since I really don't see Crunchy getting the chance to air something like the new Last Exile, Un-Go or Guilty Crown on the same date it first airs in Japan, since all of them already have a website with "simulcast" rights, which is something we seem to agree on anyways. Really, what most people who subscribe here really care about is that Crunchy is making their releases before the fan subs do. That's not happening with anything that is released days or more after the first airing. This is the thing most subscribers are in contention with. In the end, arguing over what is "simulcast" and what is not doesn't change that fan subs are releasing the "late-cast" shows long before Crunchy does and that is a problem.

For the record, shows I was personally looking forward to this season (in no particular order):
Fate/Zero
Squid Girl
Last Exile: Fam, The Silver Wing
Guilty Crown
Persona 4
Shakugan no Shana III (I just want closure at this point)

There were two others that caught my interest (and are being streamed elsewhere) but I'm no longer sure about my choice to watch them. So, out of the 6 shows I'll probably watch this season, only two are being shown on this site and only one is being shown ahead of fan subs. There wasn't much last season that I really cared about but in previous seasons Crunchy had no problem airing at least a large portion of the shows I wanted to see ahead of the fan subs. I'm not quite ready to drop my subscription over it but it's getting a lot harder to justify the expense.
The Wise Wizard
79367 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
54 / M / U.S.A.
Online
Posted 10/11/11

LordZel wrote:
Still, this means that any show Crunchy picks up at this point would be "late-cast" since I really don't see Crunchy getting the chance to air something like the new Last Exile, Un-Go or Guilty Crown on the same date it first airs in Japan, since all of them already have a website with "simulcast" rights, which is something we seem to agree on anyways.

I agree with you on Last Exile and Guilty Crown, as the established rule is that if Funimation licenses something first, it will not be on Crunchyroll.

Regarding Un-go, however, look back and you will see I specifically disagreed with you. The fact that Anime on Demand has it in now way prevents Crunchyroll for either licensing it or simulcasting it the same day, as AoD doesn't obtain rights for North America or any of the world outside Europe (and possibly only the UK).

At this point, Un-go is still a very real possibility for a Crunchyroll simulcast. If licensed by Crunchyroll, it should also be a same day simulcast, just as No. 6 was in the Summer. (Keep in mind No. 6 was also a noitaminA anime from Bones).


Really, what most people who subscribe here really care about is that Crunchy is making their releases before the fan subs do. That's not happening with anything that is released days or more after the first airing. This is the thing most subscribers are in contention with. In the end, arguing over what is "simulcast" and what is not doesn't change that fan subs are releasing the "late-cast" shows long before Crunchy does and that is a problem.

While I won't argue that some people subscribe here to get shows before the fan subs are out, I have my doubts about that being being the prime motivator for the majority, as the rippers (not fansubbers) are close behind. In the end, it matters little, however, when the alternative to showing a title late is passing on it altogether. I for one, subscribe to CR for a legal source of anime, no ads, and predictable good video quality.

The timeliness is actually the least important factor to me. Of all the simulcasts I watch, typically half I do not view until the season is either nearing completion or over. In some cases it is because I expect a series not be so good, while for others, it is because I expect it to be good enough that I don't want the frustration of waiting a week between episodes.

Another factor, of course, is that I simply don't watch fansubs of any show that has a legal source, no matter how poor the video quality, number of ads, or days of delay for that source. Also, since early Summer of last year, I haven't streamed or downloaded a single fansub, and have absolutely no intention of doing so for any series being broadcast, whether they have a licensed simulcast or not.
17121 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
Offline
Posted 10/12/11

TheAncientOne wrote:

While I won't argue that some people subscribe here to get shows before the fan subs are out, I have my doubts about that being being the prime motivator for the majority, as the rippers (not fansubbers) are close behind. In the end, it matters little, however, when the alternative to showing a title late is passing on it altogether. I for one, subscribe to CR for a legal source of anime, no ads, and predictable good video quality.

The timeliness is actually the least important factor to me. Of all the simulcasts I watch, typically half I do not view until the season is either nearing completion or over. In some cases it is because I expect a series not be so good, while for others, it is because I expect it to be good enough that I don't want the frustration of waiting a week between episodes.

Another factor, of course, is that I simply don't watch fansubs of any show that has a legal source, no matter how poor the video quality, number of ads, or days of delay for that source. Also, since early Summer of last year, I haven't streamed or downloaded a single fansub, and have absolutely no intention of doing so for any series being broadcast, whether they have a licensed simulcast or not.


Wanting the shows to stream before fan subs release isn't necessarily about being impatient (though there are those that do feel that way). It's also a matter of feeling like a sucker for paying for something when it's available for free (with no ads and often at better video and/or better sub quality) elsewhere. I'm pretty sure the majority would prefer to have a legal source of anime to watch and the more advantages that legal source has over illegal sources the easier it is to not feel like a sucker for deciding to pay for it. It's a lot easier to justify paying a premium when you're either getting it sooner or getting better quality. If you're not getting any real advantage aside from saying it's legal, it gets harder for many to stick to the moral high ground on an issue that many see as being a moral gray area to begin with. This is especially true for those who have a harder time devoting money to what is essentially just a luxury.

I'm not trying to argue whether its the right or wrong opinion. I'm just pointing out that fan subs are more or less setting the bar on quality and Crunchy doesn't always measure up. I realize this isn't entirely the fault of the staff at Crunchy but they really need to find a way to be more competitive with their releases. Sure, grabbing a show and releasing it a week late is probably better than not grabbing it at all. I'm just saying that they need to get better at negotiating better deals with the shows they do grab. If this means traveling to Japan and becoming friends with the people who usually own the rights to these shows, then I'd say it is entirely worth that level of effort.

Funimation in particular seems to be skilled at out negotiating Crunchyroll for shows. It's really not unusual for Funi to cherry pick two or more of the shows each season that are most likely to be popular. I realize they like to leverage their ability to do DVD releases in their negotiations but that shouldn't stop Crunchy from being competitive.

Also, Crunchy has had problems with more than just failing to negotiate good deals for simulcast releases. For a long period during the summer, their servers were so bad I'd often (with duration of days, not hours) not be able to watch anything at all (keep in mind, I'm in the US and part of the main viewing audience). It still happens occasionally. Some down time is expected but the level of down time they had was unacceptable. They also don't always do a good job quality checking their releases. More than a few times I've seen episodes that were unwatchable, not the right episode or just had really terrible encoding problems on release day and it took them hours or even a day or two to fix the problem. I'm not saying these problems aren't unexpected and that they never get resolved. I'm just saying they need to step up their game on their quality checking and do a better job making sure their servers are working. This kind of problem is entirely the fault of Crunchyroll staff and since it's something that should be 100% within their control, they really need to fix this. If they don't have control of the servers streaming their video then maybe they should consider rolling out their own servers. Usually, it's not only cheaper but more reliable too (even if it's only cheaper because it's more reliable). At the very least, they should consider finding a better hosting service.

Combine their less-than-stellar quality with their failure to pick up a decent share of quality shows to simulcast and the future of Crunchyroll as a whole starts to come into question. They haven't completely fallen flat on their faces, yet, but it's obvious they're having problems keeping up. I'd just hate to see Crunchyroll fail because there really aren't any other sites that could fill the void, if they did fail. The only reason I didn't cancel my sub during the summer was that I hoped (and still do) that they'll turn things around. However, if there's another period where I go entire days without being able to view anything, I probably will cancel.
First  Prev  1  2  3  4  5  Next  Last
You must be logged in to post.