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Post Reply Crunchyroll to Now Stream in 1080p
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Posted 1/13/12
Hell yes ^^
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28 / M / Netherlands
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Posted 1/13/12
i will super like this announcement bring on that seemless 1080p streaming!
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20 / M / Karakura Town
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Posted 1/13/12 , edited 1/13/12
Yes, I just upgraded my internet connection, si I'll be able to use this !!!
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41 / M / Sano-shi, Tochigi...
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Posted 1/13/12
AWESOME !!!
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Posted 1/13/12

agila61 wrote:


RyanSaotome wrote:
If thats true, then I'm all for this. Any idea what the bit rate is like now?

That link says twice the bitrate, and its only going to be available when they are given 1080 resolution materials.


I know you're commenting based on information from a (previously linked in this thread) customer service member's forum post, but bit rate isn't a good measure since we know there's an implicit resolution increase. If you increase the resolution or the sampling and then deliver it, it's going to increase the bit rate substantially. But if that's just double the rate from the same source material, it's not actual content that's being delivered. There is no improvement. So if they deliver upscales, the bit rate is going to jump mainly due to the resolution change as well as because of the upscaled edges and lines being artificially introduced by that very upscale.

For example, I can encode standard old tv signals at 12mbit/sec. It would look the same as at 6mbit/sec, because the source quality is from 480i broadcast. Similarly, if I take a DVD, and upscale it to 1080p, it's going to increase the bitrate substantially, but the source content is still DVD quality. 1080p is 2.25 that of 720p just due to the resolution increase alone anyways: (1920x1080)/(1280x720)


The materials delivered to Crunchyroll are, of course, 1080p, since Japanese digital HD television broadcasts in 1080i.


You can watch or broadcast 480i material in 1080p, as everyone has done with upscaled DVDs or watching old reruns on their HDTV. There is no quality improvement though unless they went back to the original film masters and captured at a high quality. Unless they do, it might be perceived as better because of watching it on a bigger screen or doubling the lines of resolution, or the smoothing of edges and what not due to the upscale, but there is no additional quality being delivered.


Crunchyroll has said they are only going to be streaming in 1080p if they get 1080p material. So if there is upscaling going on, its the Japanese animation producer doing the upscaling.


End users will often ask for things that they think are better but actually aren't. Especially if they are comparing to pirated material, the quality difference is mainly going to be due to a better encoder, better native player as opposed to though a browser and Flash, and data on a disk as opposed to buffered/streamed. An upscale is still an upscale and artificial; if the industry does it, it's not based on higher quality source material.

However, with the BluRay and backgrounds point you made, if the industry actually has upped their game, then 1080p will matter and matter substantially. I just haven't heard anything to that extent that this is actually the case aside from that customer service claim and those pirating and wanting to validate their activity, but I'm more than inclined to believe the side of the issue that source material has improved given CR has decided to deliver on it.. I was hoping someone had actual solid background industry or insider info and especially a real technical comparison.
Kyrek 
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Posted 1/13/12 , edited 1/13/12
Not too bad. Nice little new option. Now if only I can get an option to right click and view video statistics like youtube, that would be great to check performance...
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18 / M / Stoke, England
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Posted 1/13/12
Holy moly.
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36 / M / Missouri
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Posted 1/13/12
That's awesome, now if you guys would just make an application for home consoles and sell OST downloads this site would be pretty much perfect.
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23 / M / Texas
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Posted 1/13/12
I already caught onto it yesterday. Thanks Crunchyroll!
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21 / M / Sweden
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Posted 1/13/12
nice! now just license nisemonogatari in Sweden and i'm happy
venik 
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25 / M / The Netherlands
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Posted 1/13/12
That is awesome. Thank you Crunchyroll!
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31 / M / Oslo, Norway
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Posted 1/13/12
Best news so far this year! Good timing as well, since I just upgraded to fiber..
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26 / M / Poland
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Posted 1/13/12 , edited 1/13/12

bluerunner wrote:

Ill trade you your 1080p for that little fucking annoying ad of Nisemonogatari that was floating around the bottom of my screen I have to x out of when I log onto my paid account! No ads should mean no ads, if I wanna watch it I'll go find it my damn self.


I have it too. But unlike you I can't watch it. Why do you make me watch or click on ads of anime that are region blocked? Are you sadist? It annoy me the most, as it appears on nearly every page. If you want advertise it , advertise it for people who can actually watch it.

And yes, another point is no ads mean no ads.
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53 / M / Northeast Ohio, USA
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Posted 1/13/12 , edited 1/13/12

bluerunner wrote:
Ill trade you your 1080p for that little fucking annoying ad of Nisemonogatari that was floating around the bottom of my screen I have to x out of when I log onto my paid account! No ads should mean no ads, if I wanna watch it I'll go find it my damn self.



mapokl wrote:

I have it too. But unlike you I can't watch it. Why do you make me watch or click on ads of anime that are region blocked? Are you sadist? It annoy me the most, as it appears on nearly every page. If you want advertise it , advertise it for people who can actually watch it.

And yes, another point is no ads mean no ads.

Well, "no ads" has a qualifier, but I don't think the Nisemonogatari ads qualifies. Someone should start a petition drive to kill it.


aPromethean wrote: I know you're commenting based on information from a (previously linked in this thread) customer service member's forum post, but bit rate isn't a good measure since we know there's an implicit resolution increase. If you increase the resolution or the sampling and then deliver it, it's going to increase the bit rate substantially. But if that's just double the rate from the same source material, it's not actual content that's being delivered. There is no improvement. So if they deliver upscales, the bit rate is going to jump mainly due to the resolution change as well as because of the upscaled edges and lines being artificially introduced by that very upscale.

Well, golly, that sounds so plausible on the surface.


For example, I can encode standard old tv signals at 12mbit/sec. It would look the same as at 6mbit/sec, because the source quality is from 480i broadcast.

In other words, if a signal is uncompressed, just increasing bitrate does not add anything. That is something important to keep in mind with an uncompressed signal.


Similarly, if I take a DVD, and upscale it to 1080p, it's going to increase the bitrate substantially, but the source content is still DVD quality. 1080p is 2.25 that of 720p just due to the resolution increase alone anyways: (1920x1080)/(1280x720)

... but, of course, the h.264 encoding of fields of the same color does not increase by 2.25 due to the resolution increase. Areas of fine detail could easily have a bitrate demand scaling up with resolution, but as we know areas of fine detail in anime tend to be more static backgrounds.



The materials delivered to Crunchyroll are, of course, 1080p, since Japanese digital HD television broadcasts in 1080i.
You can watch or broadcast 480i material in 1080p, as everyone has done with upscaled DVDs or watching old reruns on their HDTV.

You certainly can, but of course we are not discussing catalog titles from 2001, we are discussing simulcasts and other material that is currently broadcast in Japan in 1080i.


There is no quality improvement though unless they went back to the original film masters and captured at a high quality. Unless they do, it might be perceived as better because of watching it on a bigger screen or doubling the lines of resolution, or the smoothing of edges and what not due to the upscale, but there is no additional quality being delivered.

Yes, but in those cases, the materials would have been delivered to Crunchyroll as 480p, and Crunchyroll has already established that they do not stream those materials in 720p. There's no reason to expect they would upscale material to 1080p that they do not presently upscale to 720p, and indeed they state the opposite.



Crunchyroll has said they are only going to be streaming in 1080p if they get 1080p material. So if there is upscaling going on, its the Japanese animation producer doing the upscaling.


End users will often ask for things that they think are better but actually aren't. Especially if they are comparing to pirated material, the quality difference is mainly going to be due to a better encoder, better native player as opposed to though a browser and Flash, and data on a disk as opposed to buffered/streamed. An upscale is still an upscale and artificial; if the industry does it, it's not based on higher quality source material.

But if the industry does it, it certainly is more likely to be an upscale algorithm that is tuned to give the best results from the original source material, colored animated drawings against a colored drawn background. They've had substantial experience in broadcasting in 1080i to get settled into the ins and outs.


However, with the BluRay and backgrounds point you made, if the industry actually has upped their game, then 1080p will matter and matter substantially. I just haven't heard anything to that extent that this is actually the case aside from that customer service claim and those pirating and wanting to validate their activity, but I'm more than inclined to believe the side of the issue that source material has improved given CR has decided to deliver on it.. I was hoping someone had actual solid background industry or insider info and especially a real technical comparison.


Its important to remember that the "customer service claims" that you are talking about are from a company that originally consisted of a group of software engineers that presently consists of around two dozen people, so its not like a "customer service rep" is staring at boilerplate text on a screen in a big back office somewhere: that will be coming from very close to the boiler room where they perform the encoding of the materials delivered from Japan.

So when one of the Crunchyroll "customer service" people says that there are series with backgrounds being done in 1080 resolution, that seems to me to count as industry insider info.

The balance of the industry insider info that this discussion has rested upon has been a few details that have slipped out in various text and podcast discussions, and then echoed around various discussion forums in the echo chamber effect.

And the echo chamber is prone to misinterpretation. To take one example, someone may get a detail from, say, a discussion of Bleach production, and get the impression that because of its popularity, Bleach "must be" state of the art. However, given the big share of its income coming from merchandising rights, versus some after-midnight seasonal series that rest heavily on BD/DVD sales for their break-even, and given the ability of the seasonal series to get a substantial portion of the work completed in advance of the series premier, its more likely that upgrades in technique are introduced first in seasonal series.
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Posted 1/13/12 , edited 1/13/12
and please add higher quality 720p streams!
something with 4-5 mbps and moar reference frames!

@neutral_eyes i dont really see a huge different on my Dell 24" 1920x1200 U2410 Monitor on that screenshot, if you took it using prt screen and did you disable all the post processing that nvidia/amd has enabled in their drivers?
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