First  Prev  1  2  3  4  5  6  Next  Last
Religion: A Mental Illness?
Posted 2/28/12 , edited 2/28/12

papagolfwhiskey wrote:

I'm going to go away and think on this before I decide to make a lengthy response to your comprehensive and erudite post. I must congratulate you and being able to frame a specific question and state a position using your own words. Further I'm glad someone here can actually string two coherent sentences together and doesn't start an OP with a question that parses out as 'how long is a piece of string'

I will concede now that there there is a lot of (harsh) truth to what you posted so much so that it is debatable as to weather or not I'll even need to post. Should that be the case, you may take my silence as general agreement with your position.

I'd warn you that you're going to be as popular as someone who describes a religious person's god as their "imaginary friend" but I think you know that.

One final thought that occurred to me. The endemic 'mental disorder' that you high light is not limited to 'believers'. As can be inferred from the complaint embedded in my compliment to you; I think a general failure of logic and language skills to be rampant in society today. I fear for the future.

(Edit: PS - as the posters above me have amply demonstrated.)


Thanks! You're probably one of the few people so far who managed to fully comprehend my post. Isn't it scary?

Anyway, just in case people think I'm making up some facts:

- It is an accepted FACT that some people fail to reach the formal operation stage in cognitive development. Some people only partially reach this stage in relation to their specialty, however it is very common nowadays for an individual to be "lacking" in their abilities to construct deductive reasoning. What can I say ... religion is, enforcing this?
Posted 2/28/12
Religion has nothing to do with mental illness. You find mentally ill people who are agnostic, etc, just like you find them everywhere in anything. Most critical people have always compared much of religion to 'cults'. The one thing cults teach all people is how to identify 'conditioning'. Whether social or cultural all of us have some degree of conditioning even in economics which is why advertisers have some regulations to prevent that effect. If you raise a human child from birth with typical tried and true methods to absolutely believe without question that this or that is true , it will take a while before or even 'if' they start to rebel, and then only if they live in a culture where questioning things is the norm as opposed to cultures where daring to even think of questioning anything will be met with punishment (sound familiar?). Religion is about conditioning. For many reasons allot of people will embrace their conditioning completely, others will take some of it and ignore other parts and some will rebel against it completely if their culture allows it. I am an atheist but I don't hate or look down on anyone who embraces a philosophy based on some form of mysticism. We are all conditioned from birth in many ways no matter where we are born. There is no escape from it. The real problem is with any single individual human which is very simple: will you choose to join in any type of violence and (persecution, a form of violence) against others or will you fight against that part of your conditioning and stand alone embracing empathy for your fellow human beings.
75434 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
49 / F / Center of the Uni...
Offline
Posted 2/28/12

SegaValkyrian wrote:

Apart from offending the large varieties of religions in your post,I can't say I agree with your assessment.

For example on the world's biggest religions is Buddhism.It is a highly respected religion in terms of fostering peace,harmony and understanding within human society,however much like Confucianism its leader was a mortal man who walked on this earth.

His teachings were so intriguing to the East that they built a religion around his namesake and absorbed everything that he taught.

For many,religion is the same as a spiritual philosophy.

Would anyone here consider following philosophy as a mental illness too?

I understand many people are disenchanted with Christianity but that does not mean all religions should be placed on the same judgement.


I think the intended "offense" should be a given. The OP didn't mince words about her stance on religious beliefs. Unfortunately, free speech and true discourse cannot live in a world where none say anything to which another might take offense. This is the argument often brought up in defense of those who say things that others claim are racist or some kind of '-phobic'. However you do raise what I think is a valid point. At the risk of getting into a debate about semantics perhaps we should ask the OP to clarify exactly what she means by 'Religion'?

45769 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
28 / F / pLaNeT eArTh???
Offline
Posted 2/28/12 , edited 2/28/12
Exactly..I need more clarification. Even though religion has a set definition, it's exact meaning is different for each individual, and I need to understand what she means by Religion.

By clarify OP: I mean are you talking about organized religion, worshiping God, believing in God, one or two of those, all, or something else entirely? Please specify.
Posted 2/28/12
@SegaValkyrian, Maiden_aya

Sorry, I blame my ignorance on different types of religions to provide the correct term to what I'm specifically referring to. I don't really delve into religions, so I would appreciate it if anyone could give me the correct term to what they infer I'm saying? Then I can edit my post to make it clear. My bad!

I suppose philosophies are out of context with my first post as long as they don't impede with logical thinking.
45769 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
28 / F / pLaNeT eArTh???
Offline
Posted 2/28/12
Well what do you personally feel religion is? Not even getting into specific religions. My main thing is before I could discuss anything is knowing if you include just a belief in God too as religion.
75434 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
49 / F / Center of the Uni...
Offline
Posted 2/28/12

heIIow wrote:



Thanks! You're probably one of the few people so far who managed to fully comprehend my post. Isn't it scary?

Anyway, just in case people think I'm making up some facts:

- It is an accepted FACT that some people fail to reach the formal operation stage in cognitive development. Some people only partially reach this stage in relation to their specialty, however it is very common nowadays for an individual to be "lacking" in their abilities to construct deductive reasoning. What can I say ... religion is, enforcing this?


You're welcome, scary perhaps but unfortunately all too common, expected even.

While I agree with your fact. I see it too often not to. I'm not sure I agree with your final assertion. First off, for an otherwise well considered post I think 'religion' is too general a term. 'religious fundamentalism' I think is more relevant and more easily argued. The post referring to Buddhism and Confucianism has a point as well. Though he loses me with the assumption that only Christianity has flaws or makes people unhappy.

Even then, I'm not sure that religious indoctrination is the root cause of all problems I see with people who cannot string a coherent sentence together. I could (and do) blame on bleeding heart left wing ideas about not harming self-esteem by correcting students. or political correctness gone amok to the point that no one can say anything in simple clear language with risking offense to some one. I think these social practices are at LEAST as damaging to the development of logic and language skills as anything 'illogical' parents and non-school authority figures may attempt. In point of fact most developing teens go through a phase of believing they are smarter, more right and more righteous than their parents. If they had a command of the sort of thinking you say is lacking their odds of rejection the indoctrination of their parents and parents peers would be increased.

However the idea that rigidly clinging to dogmatic beliefs that do not pass the test of logic, could be viewed as mental illness remains an interesting concept to explore.

75434 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
49 / F / Center of the Uni...
Offline
Posted 2/28/12

heIIow wrote:

@SegaValkyrian, Maiden_aya

Sorry, I blame my ignorance on different types of religions to provide the correct term to what I'm specifically referring to. I don't really delve into religions, so I would appreciate it if anyone could give me the correct term to what they infer I'm saying? Then I can edit my post to make it clear. My bad!

I suppose philosophies are out of context with my first post as long as they don't impede with logical thinking. :)


Religious Fundamentalism perhaps? Dogmatic belief? are you concerned with organised groups? (religions) or individual points of view? (belief, faith)

I personally don't have a problem with faith, even though I find myself unable to share it. The largest harm I see comes from organized bodies of religious believers, controlled from the top down, with closed and rigid Dogma. The includes many Christian sects, especially the loudest ones, an unfortunately loud and highly media exposed number of Muslim groups/governments, and even some of the Jewish faith. I've been trying to think of a label that best fits those groups just to save listing them and only them every time we reference religion. If it were ME running this thread I'd narrow the focus down to Religious Fundamentalism. Any faith that openly permits or encourages it's 'doubting Thomas' ' to thrive is demonstrably 'less ill' than one that claims a lock on all the answers to all the questions and denies debate or question on the basis of "Because I said so"

Posted 2/28/12

papagolfwhiskey wrote:


heIIow wrote:

@SegaValkyrian, Maiden_aya

Sorry, I blame my ignorance on different types of religions to provide the correct term to what I'm specifically referring to. I don't really delve into religions, so I would appreciate it if anyone could give me the correct term to what they infer I'm saying? Then I can edit my post to make it clear. My bad!

I suppose philosophies are out of context with my first post as long as they don't impede with logical thinking. :)


Religious Fundamentalism perhaps? Dogmatic belief? are you concerned with organised groups? (religions) or individual points of view? (belief, faith)

I personally don't have a problem with faith, even though I find myself unable to share it. The largest harm I see comes from organized bodies of religious believers, controlled from the top down, with closed and rigid Dogma. The includes many Christian sects, especially the loudest ones, an unfortunately loud and highly media exposed number of Muslim groups/governments, and even some of the Jewish faith. I've been trying to think of a label that best fits those groups just to save listing them and only them every time we reference religion. If it were ME running this thread I'd narrow the focus down to Religious Fundamentalism. Any faith that openly permits or encourages it's 'doubting Thomas' ' to thrive is demonstrably 'less ill' than one that claims a lock on all the answers to all the questions and denies debate or question on the basis of "Because I said so"


I did a fair bit of research but couldn't find the perfect term at all. So I decided to use 'theism' to make things simple! But I feel like this is going to cause it to digress into another religion thread because of this...
45769 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
28 / F / pLaNeT eArTh???
Offline
Posted 2/28/12 , edited 2/28/12
Okay now your question is more clear when you use that term. No and by actually being specific you are avoiding discussions listing specific religions..this way you will only get replies that are going to either negate or affirm your belief.

Edit: And thank you for clarifying. I may answer in a couple days once I've done more research on those psychological brain functions and developments and then cross reference it with theism.
20198 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
21 / M / My own, made-up w...
Offline
Posted 2/28/12 , edited 2/28/12
Good Post! I can see why you would label religion as a mental disorder. But MOST mental disorders are something you are born with, not something someone can apply to you The word i think would be better suited is "Mental Misdirection" (Well i think anyways).

I think religions need to just STFU about what religion is better and why. That is what causes most of the wars we face.
Personally the only religion i find not to be misguided is Buddhism. They have very peaceful intentions for all men and women unlike other religions.

Also have to say that i personally think that a PERCENT of Muslims in general seem to be Ill, some of there methods and ways of thinking are just inhumane and barbaric!
Posted 2/28/12

The developmental cycle following egocentricism is the formal operational stage of cognitive development, wherein the individual gains the ability to look at things from a logical perspective. The individual gains the ability of deductive reasoning, abstract thinking, and most importantly, empathy.


Empathy is shown already at the age of 2. If not, there is a disorder. Almost all people have empathy to each other. If this wouldn't be the case, the person cannot respond to another, because the person would not understand the emotions of others.


Here is an example of a monke- I mean an individual that lacks the element of empathy:


mangasurf wrote:

I consider myself a pretty devout Roman Catholic although i'm not perfect. I respect every other religion, but I do believe Catholicism is the true religion (but doesn't everyone else think there's is as well). We'll figure it out through death i suppose though . I respect Atheists viewpoints somewhat since everyone was given free will, but for some reason I don't like them very much. sorry.

Here's a question to the Atheists. Why not have a religion? What happens when you are wrong? lol you might be wishing eternally you would have believed. Its like never gambling because you don't believe you'll win. If you are right (which i don't believe you are) then uh nothing happens i guess? cool. but if you are wrong, ehhh not so good.


I've more respect to this person that has been quoted then the OP who claims this person is a monkey. Absurd. This person here is disrespected because of his or her belief. Either way, it looks the OP is even missing the empathy in this case to respond in a normal way.



Nowadays it has become common for people to not fully reach the formal operational stage, which is clearly a problem in mental development. It is an illness in a psychological pattern, reflected in behaviour, and is not considered part of a normal development of a human being. Therefore, it is a mental disorder.
If society would pinpoint this problem and fix the issue, scientific development would increase significantly as a huge number of people would gain the ability to think logically - henceforth the amount of scientists delving in scientific research would increase too. The reason no one can convince the religious is because they are missing a significant part of the brain. It’s like trying to describe to a color-blind person the color red.


Please state the facts regarding this. I am a atheist, and I do not believe in a god or in a religion, but I do totally disagree with this. Do not claim such things without facts.

Posted 2/28/12

Maiden_aya wrote:

Okay now your question is more clear when you use that term. No and by actually being specific you are avoiding discussions listing specific religions..this way you will only get replies that are going to either negate or affirm your belief.

Edit: And thank you for clarifying. I may answer in a couple days once I've done more research on those psychological brain functions and developments and then cross reference it with theism.


No problem. However just to clarify I am as a matter of fact avoiding discussions about specific religions, because this thread isn't to discuss the validity of religion at all.
75434 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
49 / F / Center of the Uni...
Offline
Posted 2/28/12

Zangai wrote:

Good Post! I can see why you would label religion as a mental disorder. But mental disorders are something you are born with, not something someone can apply to you The word i think would be better suited is "Mental Misdirection" (Well i think anyways).

I think religions need to just STFU about what religion is better and why. That is what causes most of the wars we face.
Personally the only religion i find not to be misguided is Buddhism. They have very peaceful intentions for all men and women unlike other religions.


Really. We are 'Born' with Post Traumatic Stress Disorder?

39360 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
M / Floating by.....s...
Offline
Posted 2/28/12
@hellow

i agree with you on the the formal stage of cognitive recognition that many lack. I think myself alone to see religion specially heavy believers that they limit themselves to mentally grow to their full potential in some cases. My deist is the answer. he/she knows everything/ this is why its happening because of he/she (the he/she is who ever god they have...don't wanna step on toes)
but that kind of logical thinking right there is not logical at all. I just have to ask why i just don't accept and as being human beings I think we all should be that way but unfortunately were not.
But people are who they are free will just don't push it on me!!!!!
First  Prev  1  2  3  4  5  6  Next  Last
You must be logged in to post.