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Why do we anime fans not support the industry?
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Posted 10/27/12
I thought the topic was supporting the industry I didn't see anything in it about dvd pirating, but let me tell you a dirty little secret about pirateing. I'm going to reference the music industry because I can speak from experiience. I imagine the anime industry and the movie industry are relatively similar. it sucks to have your lifes work taken and not get a penny for it, but it's a real kick when some garage band is playing your song. Imagine, they felt that strongly about it to try it themselves. Real Piracy is when it's not even offically released and some one got a hold of a copy and is selling it on online. Now were talking braging rights "I got it first" thats why people stand in line forever to buy the latest what not, for three times as much as it will be in 3 months
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Posted 10/27/12 , edited 10/27/12

Raphow wrote:

so what's your concern?
does pirating anime hurt you in any way?
if the anime industry is not capable of sustaining the business i won't mind if they stop producing anymore,
anime is just a means to pass time.
As soon as there are any anime available where i live, i will gladly buy them.


hahah yeah it hurts everyone and the whole industry if you pirate instead of paying genius.
Somehow i really doubt you "will pay when it becomes available" since you have the opportunity to subscribe to crunchyroll for $60 a YEAR and you havent done that.




agila61 wrote:


andydono wrote: EDIT: Saying "I spread the word" doesn't really count.

Saying "I spread the word" counts if you are spreading the word on legit access. Tweeting a bit.ly of a Crunchyroll series, or a Funimation series, or the licensed Tezuka series that Viki are putting on Youtube ... that all counts.

Saying "I spread the word" doesn't count if your reply to "sounds cool, where can I watch it" is a link to a torrent download site or a leech streaming site.


LOSazimuth wrote: Cause the shit's expensive as fuck

Yeah, I understand, living in the Democratic Republic of Congo, your money doesn't go very far and since so much streaming is region blocked, you have to buy imports to ...

... oh, no, wait, your profile says you live in San Diego, where you get a bucketload of the season's series simulcast to you to watch with "free to you" ad streaming from Crunchyroll, Funimation, and Hulu ... and a site subscription per month for Crunchyroll, Funimation or TheAnimeNetwork is about the cost of a fast food meal or two.

So, no, that's no excuse for someone living in the US to use.


hahahhahah i love this!!

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Posted 10/27/12 , edited 10/27/12
Many fans support it... It's the same with ANY industry, some stuff gets stolen, but some is legit..
I personally have a paid account here, I purchase deals when I see them, I buy some printed shirts, etc.
Also I don't pirate, I'm always a worrier when it comes to illegal stuff I'm too scared to watch stuff for free.
And the majority of people on here probably support it.

Also, not entirely sure how it is a "struggling" industry...look up info about Japan.... There are entire districts thriving on anime, manga and eroge sales...


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Posted 10/27/12
Although i've cut back a LOT on watching fansubs and pirates online, I also feel in some cases it is justified. For example, I live in the UK where, in general, we get completely shafted on what is made available to us. Sure, I can order online and import, and this is something I do regularly but I recently wanted to check out the Nanoha series. First of all I looked at buying it but, and I don't really like to use the money excuse, It's near enough impossible to find a legit copy of it, and when you do, it's pushing $200 for the 12 episode set. The show isn't streaming on CR or any of the other legal sites, so I was essentially left with no choice. That said, I am committed to importing the movie Blurays when I have the money so I can at least support the industry in some capacity.

Back in the old days, fansubs were a lifeline to anime fans, and the whole scene was a lot smaller, but with the advent of legal streaming I see no real excuse to not grab a premium membership to the likes of CR or wherever. I am torn on one point though... We don't have the luxury of seeing these shows regularly on TV, and if it hasn't been picked up by a legal site (or is unavailable to your region) I have no problem with piracy to a certain extent. However, in my personal opinion, if you've enjoyed a certain series that you've pirated, I think it's only fair that you shell out some money to own it on dvd or bluray when it becomes readily available to you.

People have a tendency to playdown the effects of piracy, claiming it has little to no real effect on the industry (and entertainment industry) but that is just the ramblings of crazy people. Anime is a business... If they make no money, they make no anime. Piracy has pushed us towards surefire sellers and stuff like that. Why do you think there's so much moe stuff lately? because they know that's where they'll bring the money in from as the higher ups in these companies are seeing huge drops in revenue generated from more interesting and unique shows as everyone is just going "lololol yar har fiddledeedee".

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Posted 10/27/12
yes you don't know anything just because something is online doesn't mean it's pirated. FUNimation is a huge anime company and they offer subscriptions via online viewing they also offer dvd's but their main profit is the web videos because they don't have to make and ship the physical dvds. This topic should be locked because it was obviously trying to claim crunchyroll is a illegal site when it's not and the poster is obviously not a crunchyroll viewer either that or the poster is a hypocrite.
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Posted 10/27/12 , edited 10/27/12
Well, the original poster is in posession of a premium member account, so you're already wrong. Also, I'm not sure what Funi's limitations are like exactly, but there's also Viz media who only allow streaming to the US. I know that licenses etc... are needed for further afield, but when you alienate a LARGE proportion of your potential viewing audience, some will no doubt look for more dubious ways of accessing the content they desire.
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Posted 10/27/12 , edited 10/27/12
Well, money issues are sometimes the only issue. Not everyone can just freely spend money on anime even if they wanted to. There are other more necessary things. Plus, there are also sites like Crunchyroll where people can simply watch anime for free. You honestly can't expect everyone to purchase the products and support everything. It would be great if everyone could but since not everyone can, you get what you get. A lot of people watch anime for free but there are also a lot of people who support them by buying the products.
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the South Bay
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Posted 10/27/12 , edited 10/27/12
Sometimes anime watchers living in countires like USA and Canada , forget there are many others from other countries who cant afford to buy the legit dvd or bluray. And some cant even afford the legal streaming.

The reason for most is economics. The dollar or yen or english pound are not affordable. .

Since I am a professional working person who is earning in $$$,$$$ .$$ dollars a year so I can afford it like alot of proffesional utakos that I see during the conventions. So I have been watching ligit streaming ever since everyone in the Industry are now streaming and buying my favorite anime official copy. I buy the manga of my favorite title that is worth collecting. And I care about the america voice actors , so I buy the dubb versions .

But I know people
who are just barely survivng with in their means , so they go to where it is free but at least subscribe with CR.

You can never role out the fact that the number 1 reason why people to go where it is free and or cheap is economics.

And maybe another reason why people go download the anime is because they can ..

which is what the slew of police activites in Japan against uploaders and dowmloaders to scare them if they get caught... but the world wide web is vast and there are countries that the interrnational copyright laws does not affect them.

So its basically a race between the legit distribution and the not legit.

And since the anime industry is so slow in regocnizing the changes, they are so behind in the times. Ten years ago I have made a comment about this trend and see how much struggling the anime industry is having right now.

Companies should hire consultants to watch these trends.


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Posted 10/27/12 , edited 10/27/12

MikiSayaka wrote: Also, not entirely sure how it is a "struggling" industry...look up info about Japan.... There are entire districts thriving on anime, manga and eroge sales...


First, the "struggling industry" is something that is specifically about anime, not about manga. Manga is not a struggling industry in Japan at the moment. However, anime is indeed struggling a bit. A decade ago the advertising revenue generated by anime started dropping off, since the Japanese population is aging and since the popularity of regional broadcasts declined with the availability of bootlegs on the internet.

And the "crazy prices" that Japanese collectors pay came from pricing anime for sale to home video stores. Over the last decade, the home video rental stores have declined substantially, leaving much of the industry dependent upon a fairly small number of otaku willing to pay the extremely high prices to support their favorite shows.

Its not like its teetering on the edge of immediate collapse, but its not thriving, and is smaller than it was during the domestic Japanese anime boom in the 1990's.


animegurl7 wrote:

Well, money issues are sometimes the only issue. Not everyone can just freely spend money on anime even if they wanted to. There are other more necessary things. Plus, there are also sites like Crunchyroll where people can simply watch anime for free. You honestly can't expect everyone to purchase the products and support everything. ...

Watching on Crunchyroll is supporting anime. Its either directing part of the subscription to the people who made that series, or directing part of the ad revenue to the people who made the series.

Now, sure, the ad revenue is very small ... probably less than a penny per episode per viewer. But if someone who cannot afford to subscribe can get ten other people excited about a show, and get them to watch that show on Crunchyroll ... that's great support. First because its ten times as much advertising revenue. Second because maybe one of those other people can afford to subscribe, which as an even bigger impact.

Watching the ad-streams, watching subscription streams, buying merchandise, buying the licensed manga that its based on ... there are lots of ways to support the anime industry. Buying home video, whether produced for your country or imported at insane prices from Japan, those are two other good ways to support the anime industry, but they are not the only ones.
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Posted 10/27/12 , edited 10/27/12
I agree the manga industry is indeed still thriving.

We always have a misconception that anime is popular in Japan , when I was there couple years ago and was exposed to high schoolers , I sure observed that it wasnt a popular thing to do.
Indeed and the fact there is a growing populations of NEET in Japan as well. So I dont think they will be buying much legit stuff
.
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Posted 10/27/12


Yes but it's not dying, it's going through the same thing the music & movie industries are going through due to bootlegging.
We might see less content being created, however that's not necessarily a bad thing.
Everyone was jumping on, making any anime they could, hoping to get a winner. Now that they have to be more careful, only anime that they KNOW will sell is going to likely be made into projects, which will lead to awesome anime coming out with good content. I'm okay with that.
And hopefully CR is able to pick up on the majority of said products
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Posted 10/27/12
I happily contribute to the industry by having paid accounts here as well as Funimation. And i am much happier paying them to watch all this rather than pirating. On both sites i have access to all the shows on file, in HD, commercial free, and it's awesome. The only time i don't watch stuff on these sites is when they don't have the specific show that i am looking for. Not too long ago i was thinking about cancelling my Funimation account, but this topic made me stop. If they can let me watch whatever i want, whenever i want, and i choose not to do that then that is my fault. They can have the what...7 bucks a month if it means it helps them make dubs, release Blu-Rays, and keep getting awesome new titles (which i coincidentally watch). All i am saying is that you don't have to buy every release, and every shirt, and every retail item, but you should support it by at least giving this site 7 bucks a month for something that is completely worth it. Do what you want to do and spend as much money on things, like this entertainment form, as you see fit. But, always put yourself in the other persons shoes. If you spent countless hours making a worthy anime/manga just to know all the people that enjoy it pirate it, wouldn't you be a little mad?

Cheers!
Posted 10/28/12
Spoon feeding.
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Posted 10/28/12 , edited 10/28/12

DrummerBoy88 wrote: I happily contribute to the industry by having paid accounts here as well as Funimation. And i am much happier paying them to watch all this rather than pirating. On both sites i have access to all the shows on file, in HD, commercial free, and it's awesome.

My threshold is three simulcasts that I am happy paying to watch. Crunchyroll hit that bar for me sometime in the middle of 2009, and has stayed above that level since ... with one season where I was on the borderline, but then they signed Giant Killing halfway through its first season and it was above that bar.

Funimation does not look like they will always be above that bar for me. However, since they started their Roku channel, I have been watching a number of catalog titles there. However, I expect as I catch up on catalog titles at Funimation, I'm going to hit the point where I sign up for a month at the end of the season to catch up on the best simulcasts from that season.


MikiSayaka wrote: Yes but it's not dying, it's going through the same thing the music & movie industries are going through due to bootlegging.

The music industry has flipped from relatively cheap concert tickets to sell lucrative records, to relatively cheap recorded performances to sell relatively expensive concert tickets. Anime doesn't have that option.

And if current trends continue, yes, the current seasonal series anime industry will die sometime in the next decade or two. Whether being in that situation can be called "dying" is a question of what meaning you attach to "dying".

That won't be the end of the anime industry ~ there will still be ongoing series, there will still be anime theatrical releases, there will still be manga cover disks ~ but it will be the end of a big part of what we think of as the anime industry.


We might see less content being created, however that's not necessarily a bad thing.

Everyone was jumping on, making any anime they could, hoping to get a winner. Now that they have to be more careful, only anime that they KNOW will sell is going to likely be made into projects, which will lead to awesome anime coming out with good content.

An effort to make an awesome anime is always riskier than an effort to make cheap derivative crud, so the more careful the anime industry gets, the fewer really awesome anime are likely to be produced.

We are more likely to get a steady supply of awesome anime from a healthy industry than from one that is slowly dying. That is one reason why people support Crunchyroll, because getting back to an average 20% international rights income would make for a more financially healthy industry which would be in a better position to experiment with different ways to turn the current trends around.

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Posted 10/28/12
There's no argument here at all. The answer why people steal is simple: Greed. Greed is the root of all evil, imo. "I deserve this, I'm going to take it." "I don't have the means to obtain this, I want it cheaper." "You have something I don't, that's unfair." This simple concept, greed, is the cause of all strife in the world, as much as you want to say something more philosophical is the cause.
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