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Pros and cons of being male or female?
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24 / F / NY
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Posted 12/17/12

Kurenai_Taka wrote:


kitsuneshoujo wrote:


Denmi-Sama wrote:


kitsuneshoujo wrote:

Motoko only partially counts. She's badass, intelligent, and competent thats all pluses in the "strong female lead" department. Also she isnt there to make the male characters look better (arm-candy only, only there to be saved). Where she looses points is what she wears and her figure. She's drawn and clothed in such a way to titillate male readers. I'm not saying a girl with big boobs cant be any of the pluses I mentioned, but she was drawn like that to be eye-candy.


But I mean she's a cyborg. :/ lol she doesn't have to wear clothes. (But yes I do understand what you mean.) BUT her purpose is far from just eye-candy!

So it has to be a strong female who's not particularly "sex candy" in order to qualify?

I mean since it's about anime - it's kind of hard to find a "normal-looking" character. But I'll give it a go:

- Shizuku from My Little Monster I think would be the best example but if you haven't seen the series then I won't spoil anything...

- Inaba from Kokoro Connect

- Nana O from Nana



I was just wondering what you thought.


I meant the way she was drawn was meant to be eye-candy, not that she was meant to be eye-candy (make sense? lol). Most manga with female leads drawn by guys are going to be drawn to look sexy, because thats just want guys like. Strong and able to kick ass, but still feminine and looks good in tight clothes. So... she doesnt have to look butch to qualify as 100%... whatever.

What were we talking about again? I feel side-tracked. lol

Oh and you're really cute btw. >.>


I like this conversation you have going on here... you both have valid points regarding Motoko (still love her)

There's also Revy from Black Lagoon - totally badass and more than capable of kicking your butt up behind your ears (albeit perhaps a little trigger-happy / crazy). Sure she wears rather revealing clothing, but she strikes me as the type of character who doesn't actually care what she's wearing and just wears that cause she can't be bothered to find anything else (when she goes to Tokyo in winter, she's appropriately dressed for the weather)

If we go into secondary / support characters, I'd have to say pretty much any female character from Hiromu Arakawa's Fullmetal Alchemist counts. They all contribute to the story line in significant ways, they have proper characterization and they're not drawn with the stereotypical huge bust, tiny waist, and revealing clothing. That's a good chunk of why it's my favorite manga. Wonder how much of that has to do with the author being female... (one might also think of Sango from Rumiko Takahashi's Inuyasha - again, a very capable female character created by a female artist)


ABSOLUTELY I WAS ABOUT TO MENTION SANGO FROM INUYASHA!!

But what stopped me was that she wasn't a female "lead". But I truly do sympathize with her character. What pissed me off was when she would go off-tracks and sell out Inuyasha - just to be tricked by Naraku/other scheme - but I did understand her position. (I have to re-watch the series).

Haven't seen Black Lagoon. Hmmmm maybe I will though?

But I LOVE MOTOKO! She's honestly one of my favorite female characters of ALL TIME. She's just pure bad-ass. She has spunk! And she can definitely hold her own in battle. I would like have liked to add Faye Valentine to the list BUT I don't like how she plays all sassy and then gets in trouble and always need someone to bail her out. I want to use her as an example because she is independent BUT she definitely uses her feminity to her advantage - which I guess it's considered a "negative".
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Posted 12/17/12
I see alot of guys saying that all the things a man must do is a con but this is not true for one reason.

Chivalry, appearance(fitness wise), hygiene and manliness
, we allknow that when a woman complements us on one of those things it makes it all worth while and suddenly its a pro.
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Posted 12/17/12

Denmi-Sama wrote:


Kurenai_Taka wrote:


kitsuneshoujo wrote:


Denmi-Sama wrote:


kitsuneshoujo wrote:

Motoko only partially counts. She's badass, intelligent, and competent thats all pluses in the "strong female lead" department. Also she isnt there to make the male characters look better (arm-candy only, only there to be saved). Where she looses points is what she wears and her figure. She's drawn and clothed in such a way to titillate male readers. I'm not saying a girl with big boobs cant be any of the pluses I mentioned, but she was drawn like that to be eye-candy.


But I mean she's a cyborg. :/ lol she doesn't have to wear clothes. (But yes I do understand what you mean.) BUT her purpose is far from just eye-candy!

So it has to be a strong female who's not particularly "sex candy" in order to qualify?

I mean since it's about anime - it's kind of hard to find a "normal-looking" character. But I'll give it a go:

- Shizuku from My Little Monster I think would be the best example but if you haven't seen the series then I won't spoil anything...

- Inaba from Kokoro Connect

- Nana O from Nana



I was just wondering what you thought.


I meant the way she was drawn was meant to be eye-candy, not that she was meant to be eye-candy (make sense? lol). Most manga with female leads drawn by guys are going to be drawn to look sexy, because thats just want guys like. Strong and able to kick ass, but still feminine and looks good in tight clothes. So... she doesnt have to look butch to qualify as 100%... whatever.

What were we talking about again? I feel side-tracked. lol

Oh and you're really cute btw. >.>


I like this conversation you have going on here... you both have valid points regarding Motoko (still love her)

There's also Revy from Black Lagoon - totally badass and more than capable of kicking your butt up behind your ears (albeit perhaps a little trigger-happy / crazy). Sure she wears rather revealing clothing, but she strikes me as the type of character who doesn't actually care what she's wearing and just wears that cause she can't be bothered to find anything else (when she goes to Tokyo in winter, she's appropriately dressed for the weather)

If we go into secondary / support characters, I'd have to say pretty much any female character from Hiromu Arakawa's Fullmetal Alchemist counts. They all contribute to the story line in significant ways, they have proper characterization and they're not drawn with the stereotypical huge bust, tiny waist, and revealing clothing. That's a good chunk of why it's my favorite manga. Wonder how much of that has to do with the author being female... (one might also think of Sango from Rumiko Takahashi's Inuyasha - again, a very capable female character created by a female artist)


ABSOLUTELY I WAS ABOUT TO MENTION SANGO FROM INUYASHA!!

But what stopped me was that she wasn't a female "lead". But I truly do sympathize with her character. What pissed me off was when she would go off-tracks and sell out Inuyasha - just to be tricked by Naraku/other scheme - but I did understand her position. (I have to re-watch the series).

Haven't seen Black Lagoon. Hmmmm maybe I will though?

But I LOVE MOTOKO! She's honestly one of my favorite female characters of ALL TIME. She's just pure bad-ass. She has spunk! And she can definitely hold her own in battle. I would like have liked to add Faye Valentine to the list BUT I don't like how she plays all sassy and then gets in trouble and always need someone to bail her out. I want to use her as an example because she is independent BUT she definitely uses her feminity to her advantage - which I guess it's considered a "negative".


Yeah, Sango sometimes had some rotten luck! Especially when all the male characters kept getting stronger and she got left behind. She's by no means weak, but compared to characters like Inuyasha, Sesshoumaru, Naraku (and even Miroku to some extent), she gets left in the dust.

So true about Faye! I was thinking of her too, but I find it annoying how she often can't actually do anything on her own come crunch time... (definitely a con)

Black Lagoon is definitely fun (especially if you like shoot-em-ups and mafia wars and stuff) and I like that it manages to incorporate some noticeable character development
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Posted 12/17/12
Faye Valentine is a Princess Leia character. Shes able to kickass like a guy, but shes simply there to be rescued and serve as a love interest (even if its sibling love) to the main characters. <-- Talking about Leia not Faye. Also I dont like how she dresses.

Oh and I love Tonari no Kaibutsu-kun.

How about Claymore (any of the girls)?
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Posted 12/17/12 , edited 12/17/12
Come to think of it after listening to music, I'd give males the pro of having the better voice for singing. Maybe I'm biased by what I listen to, but I'd say male singers can cover far more useful range, both in terms of pitch and in terms of emotion/expressiveness. Usually I just hear female singers hit high pitches and sound "nice". Maybe I'm listening to the wrong female singers; Bjork at least covers some different ground than most, but other examples are welcome.

A few examples (not that I expect any to like the music, but just to support my point).
Probably people will be appalled at my horrible tastes, but so be it.

Edu Falaschi, Angra - singer for a fairly unknown band, but very talented.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4enXtBjWL2o

Same band, but different singer, Andre Matos, just because it's amusing that a guy can sing this (cover of a Kate Bush song):
Not that I think it is great, but it does show what a guy can do with a falsetto if they really work at it.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YBe5JIl4KR8

Chris Cornell, Soundgarden, regarded as one of the best singers in modern time.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=frCx3MQJLO4

And of course, no example of male vocals would be complete without David Bowie:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x6MDhtBEmCs
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20 / F / Canada
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Posted 12/17/12

kitsuneshoujo wrote:

Faye Valentine is a Princess Leia character. Shes able to kickass like a guy, but shes simply there to be rescued and serve as a love interest (even if its sibling love) to the main characters. <-- Talking about Leia not Faye. Also I dont like how she dresses.

Oh and I love Tonari no Kaibutsu-kun.

How about Claymore (any of the girls)?


Nice analogy with the Princess Leia thing... and I don't know Claymore, sorry... (should I? )
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Posted 12/17/12
Yes, you should go read Claymore! Theres also an anime that covers about the first 10 or so volumes.
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34 / M / Dallas, TX
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Posted 12/17/12

kitsuneshoujo wrote:

Cons of being a guy:

Your junk is always in the way when you sit down.
You have a very limited wardrobe compared to a girl's; to me it always felt like the gray coveralls from 1984 (an Orwellian movie).
It gets hard every morning and sometimes sticks out in random embarrassing angles.
Girls wont hang out with you because they think all you want is to get into their pants.
You're not supposed to cry or show emotion because, remember, you're a man and men are automatons, not people
Girls ignore you because you're not an unrealistic sex-god with six pack abs.
You're looked at oddly if you say you like romances.
You're assumed to just like girl-girl romance because it's double the boobs.
You're assumed to love porn and think about sex all the time.
Masturbating is disgusting and is way to short-lived.
A guy's body has maybe three erogenous zones.
You're supposed to be aggressive and macho.
If you say you like pink people ask if you're gay.
If you can tell several shades of any colour from each other people look at you funny.
Same thing as above, but with flowers.

This post is not a claim that guys have it worse than women, just that I personally hate being a guy and would trade places with a girl on her worst period days any time.


good post, I agree with everything and would like to add:
Men are seen by society as disposable.


a couple of cons for women that haven't been listed:
Neoteny, hurts women in today's society.
False sense of empowerment through corporate materialism.
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Posted 12/17/12

ahatestory wrote:

Come to think of it after listening to music, I'd give males the pro of having the better voice for singing. Maybe I'm biased by what I listen to, but I'd say male singers can cover far more useful range, both in terms of pitch and in terms of emotion/expressiveness. Usually I just hear female singers hit high pitches and sound "nice". Maybe I'm listening to the wrong female singers; Bjork at least covers some different ground than most, but other examples are welcome.

A few examples (not that I expect any to like the music, but just to support my point).
Probably people will be appalled at my horrible tastes, but so be it.

Edu Falaschi, Angra - singer for a fairly unknown band, but very talented.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4enXtBjWL2o

Same band, but different singer, Andre Matos, just because it's amusing that a guy can sing this (cover of a Kate Bush song):
Not that I think it is great, but it does show what a guy can do with a falsetto if they really work at it.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YBe5JIl4KR8

Chris Cornell, Soundgarden, regarded as one of the best singers in modern time.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=frCx3MQJLO4

And of course, no example of male vocals would be complete without David Bowie:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x6MDhtBEmCs


Hmm I actually like this music (yes I actually listened to it - no I'm not appalled at your taste)

... I'm not sure about saying males have the pro for singing voices. It's true that females who sing high just for the "glory" of being able to reach those notes are often annoying and not necessarily good singers, but I find that there are plenty of female singers who focus more on the song and the message (the "emotion/expressiveness" as you say) than the ability to go up high (at least in what I listen to...).

Ex: The Cranberries
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6Ejga4kJUts
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zz-DJr1Qs54

Loreena McKennit sings "high" but she makes it work for her!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eKfbVAO6VGA

Feist has a voice that's very smooth and easy to listen to
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KbnHmFKxPgA

Funny that you would put that Wuthering Heights up as one of your examples! Kate Bush is one of my favorite singers (and she does some pretty interesting things with her voice; it sometimes sounds more "experimental" in that she bounces around all over her range in ways that you wouldn't necessarily expect http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s8y5GthjgSU )
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27 / M / NY
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Posted 12/17/12

kitsuneshoujo wrote:

Cons of being a guy:

Your junk is always in the way when you sit down.
You have a very limited wardrobe compared to a girl's; to me it always felt like the gray coveralls from 1984 (an Orwellian movie).
It gets hard every morning and sometimes sticks out in random embarrassing angles.
Girls wont hang out with you because they think all you want is to get into their pants.
You're not supposed to cry or show emotion because, remember, you're a man and men are automatons, not people
Girls ignore you because you're not an unrealistic sex-god with six pack abs.
You're looked at oddly if you say you like romances.
You're assumed to just like girl-girl romance because it's double the boobs.
You're assumed to love porn and think about sex all the time.
Masturbating is disgusting and is way to short-lived.
A guy's body has maybe three erogenous zones.
You're supposed to be aggressive and macho.
If you say you like pink people ask if you're gay.
If you can tell several shades of any colour from each other people look at you funny.
Same thing as above, but with flowers.

This post is not a claim that guys have it worse than women, just that I personally hate being a guy and would trade places with a girl on her worst period days any time.


im more or less agreeing with this guy
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Posted 12/17/12
Males
Cons:
Embarrassing Morning Wood.
Erections lasting more then 4 hours.
Having to be the family leader. (ie. Man of the House!) Actually, I consider that a privilege.
First to go to war. Also first to die.

Pros: FireMAN, PoliceMAN, MailMAN, PresidentMAN, And anything else that only a guy can do...Which is pretty much EVERYTHING!!!
(except make babies alone, we only need woman for that, and sandwiches.)


Uhhmm, and I'm not just saying this because I am a biased male...
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17 / M / North Dakota
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Posted 12/18/12 , edited 12/18/12

funkstylz wrote:

How can you start a post like this and not expect sexism. That's exactly what this is creating.

On a side note, a lesbian friend and I got into an argument about this once and she won with: "Id rather have something that bleeds once a month than something that has to throw up every day". Lol

Also, I can probably count on 1 hand how many men can walk into a building, band over a table, and instantly enslave 40% of the people there...

Why dont you go ahead and point out all the sexist posts for me than.........hmmmm. Be it there are some bordering, there is no arguments. yet.

EDIT: actually the post above is probably gonna get some people pretty mad.
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Posted 12/18/12

TheDreamHare wrote:

OUR PERIODS.
Long crude and tasteless rant below:


I agree, except for the birth stuff, because it's only temporary, and you get something for your trouble (beautiful baby). I don't see how anybody who's never experienced birth could say that it's a bad thing about being a woman. I've done it 4 times, and I'd do it again if it wouldn't kill me, but it might, so I won't.
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F / Earth
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Posted 12/18/12

a619ko wrote:

Males
Cons:
Embarrassing Morning Wood.
Erections lasting more then 4 hours.
Having to be the family leader. (ie. Man of the House!) Actually, I consider that a privilege.
First to go to war. Also first to die.

Pros: FireMAN, PoliceMAN, MailMAN, PresidentMAN, And anything else that only a guy can do...Which is pretty much EVERYTHING!!!
(except make babies alone, we only need woman for that, and sandwiches.)


Uhhmm, and I'm not just saying this because I am a biased male...


Well, the first 3 are only cons if you're single....if your not, they're pros. I got no problems with what you listed as the pros, as long as they don't make a mess, and if they do, they clean after themselves.
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21 / F / canada
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Posted 12/18/12
periods
i absolutly hate it!!


pros: like to dress up, put make up, do girly stuff, etc..
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