First  Prev  1  2  3  4  5  6  7  8  9  10  11  Next  Last
The truth
42080 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
M / Texas
Offline
Posted 1/16/13
My thoughts?

Fact is easier to come by than Truth. And Truth may even be easier to come by than Context.

What happened in Newton, if you are to believe the media at all, is that a deranged individual stole his parent's guns, killed the parent, and then massacred children in as spectacular a fashion as possible, before killing themselves. He destroyed his computer, and otherwise attempted to obscure his motives.

But how does that relate to guns? And, in the larger context, despite this being a horrific event, it is an incredible, extreme rarity, a total outlier when dealing either with gun violence or public safety generally. People seem to be in a rush to either ban or defend guns, but people don't seem to recognize the two things that need to be considered:

1.) Would the changes in law actually have prevented the shooter from getting his weapons? Would they have stopped a murderous young man with a death wish from killing spectacularly, even if he wasn't well armed?

2.) Would the changes in law prevent people from defending themselves when they would normally defend themselves, thereby opening them up to greater threat? Does the law, aiming to disarm stealth psychopaths, cause greater harm by disarming good people, but not villains?

There's not really a 'true' answer to those questions, and even 'fact' would be elusive, given that we are speculating about future events, an unknowable 'context'. In that case, we should default to 'principle', and it's pretty clear what principle we have in place: that the individual might be empowered, and made dangerous, by their possession of a firearm.
Posted 1/16/13

agira wrote:

It has come my understanding that no one actually wants to hear it. We close our eyes to it and pretend not to see it. I saw an article yesterday where it was said that there are actually people who doubt what happened in Newton. I went a bit off subject... But what I want to know are your thoughts on truth in general.


Sometimes it is better to give a white lie than give the truth. Only on rare and certain occasions though. The truth in general is always the best way.
86959 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
94 / M / Pennsylvania
Offline
Posted 1/16/13
The truth is ive gotta take a huge piss right now, no lie.
48163 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
28 / M / London, England
Offline
Posted 1/16/13

shard147 wrote:

My thoughts?

Fact is easier to come by than Truth. And Truth may even be easier to come by than Context.

What happened in Newton, if you are to believe the media at all, is that a deranged individual stole his parent's guns, killed the parent, and then massacred children in as spectacular a fashion as possible, before killing themselves. He destroyed his computer, and otherwise attempted to obscure his motives.

But how does that relate to guns? And, in the larger context, despite this being a horrific event, it is an incredible, extreme rarity, a total outlier when dealing either with gun violence or public safety generally. People seem to be in a rush to either ban or defend guns, but people don't seem to recognize the two things that need to be considered:

1.) Would the changes in law actually have prevented the shooter from getting his weapons? Would they have stopped a murderous young man with a death wish from killing spectacularly, even if he wasn't well armed?

2.) Would the changes in law prevent people from defending themselves when they would normally defend themselves, thereby opening them up to greater threat? Does the law, aiming to disarm stealth psychopaths, cause greater harm by disarming good people, but not villains?

There's not really a 'true' answer to those questions, and even 'fact' would be elusive, given that we are speculating about future events, an unknowable 'context'. In that case, we should default to 'principle', and it's pretty clear what principle we have in place: that the individual might be empowered, and made dangerous, by their possession of a firearm.


I'd like to point at that the truth, doesn't need to be an answer. Just what you said alone is "the truth". And a very specific truth. A truth that forces us to stop, think, and question what needs to be done.
42080 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
M / Texas
Offline
Posted 1/16/13 , edited 1/16/13

FacelessRed wrote:
Please don't speak so vaguely about things such as truth. You can't give a demonstration of evolution? Well it's clear you haven't ACTUALLY read a scientific paper on Evolution. What do you want as proof? Pokemon? http://i.imgur.com/2RRv0.jpg How about that? Not good enough? Mutations are a part of evolution to you know.

No you can't disprove gods existance, but you also can't prove it. Speaking on a philosophical level about what real truth is, saying that our senses betray us is only a paper thin argument. That is what SCIENCE is for. To not trust out eyes, to not trust our nose, to not trust our sight. But to figure it out, study it and verify by every means possible of what is playing out before our eyes.

I'm not having a go at you, but that kind of thinking doesn't actually answer anything, nor does it allow questions. That kind of thinking is only a dead end.


The manta ray's... appendages, that are used for mating, apparently, and are sex specific to the male? Hum?
15049 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
26 / M / Waco, TX
Offline
Posted 1/16/13
Well first of all, the "assault rifle" that was pulled out of the car was not an AR15 like the media claims. It was a Saiga shotgun. The media claimed that there were 2 pistols used, then changed it to 4 pistols used, but the coroner said all of the kids were hit with 5.56/.223... yet the gun was in the car? That right there is questionable enough. This was just an event to get a push towards gun control.

Washington and Chicago have the strictest gun control in the US yet they have the highest crime rate and gun murder. So how exactly is gun control helping? FACT: It isn't. It won't help. It only puts law abiding citizens at greater risk.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ooa98FHuaU0
48163 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
28 / M / London, England
Offline
Posted 1/16/13

shard147 wrote:


FacelessRed wrote:
Please don't speak so vaguely about things such as truth. You can't give a demonstration of evolution? Well it's clear you haven't ACTUALLY read a scientific paper on Evolution. What do you want as proof? Pokemon? http://i.imgur.com/2RRv0.jpg How about that? Not good enough? Mutations are a part of evolution to you know.

No you can't disprove gods existance, but you also can't prove it. Speaking on a philosophical level about what real truth is, saying that our senses betray us is only a paper thin argument. That is what SCIENCE is for. To not trust out eyes, to not trust our nose, to not trust our sight. But to figure it out, study it and verify by every means possible of what is playing out before our eyes.

I'm not having a go at you, but that kind of thinking doesn't actually answer anything, nor does it allow questions. That kind of thinking is only a dead end.


The manta ray's... appendages, that are used for mating, apparently, and are sex specific to the male? Hum?


It's got legs, it's a recessive gene that mutated and caused it to grow legs. (that work, there's also a video on it, and this is a baby) I was using it as an example of where Evolution comes from, If Evolution wasn't real, why the hell would it even have DNA for legs. Sorry if it seemed like I was using it as an example that manta rays are evolving legs. they aren't, infact they apparently got rid of them.
42080 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
M / Texas
Offline
Posted 1/16/13
Jesus, I need to verify that with an article. A Saiga shotgun is just... I mean, that's WAY more than anyone needs to carry.
15049 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
26 / M / Waco, TX
Offline
Posted 1/16/13
You can see the video of the officer clearing the chamber. A shotgun shell comes out and it is a side charging handle, not a rear charging handle like the AR15.
42080 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
M / Texas
Offline
Posted 1/16/13 , edited 1/16/13

FacelessRed wrote:
It's got legs, it's a recessive gene that mutated and caused it to grow legs. (that work, there's also a video on it, and this is a baby) I was using it as an example of where Evolution comes from, If Evolution wasn't real, why the hell would it even have DNA for legs. Sorry if it seemed like I was using it as an example that manta rays are evolving legs. they aren't, infact they apparently got rid of them.


http://www.flmnh.ufl.edu/fish/education/questions/RayBiology.html#states

From what I understand those are claspers, that are essentially important to sperm transfer during mating. I'm lookin' at articles, though it seems it's easier to find reposts and commentary than the original source for the image.
48163 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
28 / M / London, England
Offline
Posted 1/16/13

shard147 wrote:


FacelessRed wrote:
It's got legs, it's a recessive gene that mutated and caused it to grow legs. (that work, there's also a video on it, and this is a baby) I was using it as an example of where Evolution comes from, If Evolution wasn't real, why the hell would it even have DNA for legs. Sorry if it seemed like I was using it as an example that manta rays are evolving legs. they aren't, infact they apparently got rid of them.


http://www.flmnh.ufl.edu/fish/education/questions/RayBiology.html#states

From what I understand those are claspers, that are essentially important to sperm transfer during mating. I'm lookin' at articles, though it seems it's easier to find reposts and commentary than the original source for the image.


Interesting, but my point certainly still stands. I don't know if these were claspers, but if all baby sting rays have them, what can I say they be claspers. But there are much more compelling evidences than my example.
Posted 1/16/13
I just needed to read the "It has come my understanding" part to want to kill myself
4137 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
22 / home
Offline
Posted 1/16/13

AruarianDance wrote:

People prefer convenient lies to the truth that will disrupt how they live. Do you mean Newtown? the shooting?


Yeah
42080 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
M / Texas
Offline
Posted 1/16/13
Oh, I know, I just thought it'd be something I really ought to know about if it were legs.

The fact that there's genetic change over time within species is extremely testable, as is the fact that environmental pressures can produce it. Right there, you can prove evolution. No dispute, and I can get links. There is a dDNA/dt, we're all happy.

But that said, I'm a religious individual and believe that intention and meaning is foundational to the universe and life. I don't accept evolution as most people understand it, and given recent discoveries and epigenetics, I'm pretty confident we don't have the whole picture yet.
42080 cr points
Send Message: Send PM GB Post
M / Texas
Offline
Posted 1/16/13
What is the 'it' that we pretend not to see? The massacre itself? Or the implications of?
First  Prev  1  2  3  4  5  6  7  8  9  10  11  Next  Last
You must be logged in to post.