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Cure to all disease.
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Posted 2/11/13

justanotherguy_2005 wrote:


immitis wrote:

Fun fact. Cure all disease and our immune system will slowly weaken over generations, and as nature is want to do a new one we can't cure will show up eventually.

Also on the point of age wearing on mental health. What most people forget is a lot of the wear and tear on your mental health is your bodies degrading with age. Presumably if the average life span has come to such a point, that would be a issue already solved through reduced or reversed strain of your bodies natural ability to repair.


This is most definitely true. People already weaken their immune systems and those of their children by using so much hand sanitizers and things of a similar nature. The more we are exposed to, within reason, the stronger our bodies get.



FlyinDumpling wrote:

Ugh, people really need to stop using the over population theory. When people think over population, they start believing they need to exterminate their kind.


And the problem with that is?....


Because it's fucking stupid. The world is able to support over 40 billion people.

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Posted 2/11/13

mhibicke wrote:

Has anyone considered the shortening of telomeres, or the build up and agglutination of protease-resistant misfolded proteins?
Most of the problems associated with aging are due to the inability of the body to repair itself on a cellular level, due to shortened telomeres. Until a technique to lengthen telomeres can be successfully used on humans without causing horrible cancers, we are going to get old, sick, and die.
Likewise, many age-related diseases like Alzheimer's, Parkinson's, and Huntinton's Chorea are caused by the accumulation and agglutination of protease-resistant misfolded proteins. Most people are aware of transmissible spongiform encephalopathies like Mad Cow Disease, but are not aware of how similar some other neurodegenerative diseases are mechanistically. Anyway, the reason that they are associated with aging is because it takes time for the misfolded proteins to build up and begin to damage cells. The older you live, the longer these proteins accumulate. While some of these misfolded proteins are ingested (like by eating contaminated meat), many spontaneously misfold internally. This is uncommon, and by itself negligible. However, misfolded proteins are sometimes infectious, and so can touch properly folded proteins and cause them to flatten and misfold as well. Then the flattened proteins stack up on each other and occlude normal cellular function.


Kudos to your contribution! I'm curious though, when you mentioned expanding the longevity of telomeres without the affliction of cancer were you pertaining that to telomerase?
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Posted 2/11/13 , edited 2/12/13

mhibicke wrote:

Has anyone considered the shortening of telomeres, or the build up and agglutination of protease-resistant misfolded proteins?
Most of the problems associated with aging are due to the inability of the body to repair itself on a cellular level, due to shortened telomeres. Until a technique to lengthen telomeres can be successfully used on humans without causing horrible cancers, we are going to get old, sick, and die.
Likewise, many age-related diseases like Alzheimer's, Parkinson's, and Huntinton's Chorea are caused by the accumulation and agglutination of protease-resistant misfolded proteins. Most people are aware of transmissible spongiform encephalopathies like Mad Cow Disease, but are not aware of how similar some other neurodegenerative diseases are mechanistically. Anyway, the reason that they are associated with aging is because it takes time for the misfolded proteins to build up and begin to damage cells. The older you live, the longer these proteins accumulate. While some of these misfolded proteins are ingested (like by eating contaminated meat), many spontaneously misfold internally. This is uncommon, and by itself negligible. However, misfolded proteins are sometimes infectious, and so can touch properly folded proteins and cause them to flatten and misfold as well. Then the flattened proteins stack up on each other and occlude normal cellular function.


I did watch a video on telomeres and how it increased the lifespan of mice greatly, but increased the chance of cancer significantly. They did mention one species that is completely immune to cancer, which is the naked mole rat. Either Aubrey De Grey is attempting to address this issue, or he believes that there is another way to prevent the genetic mutation which leads to most of our bodily diseases in the first place.

I know one of his ideas is to make wilt buildup impossible by either rendering it harmless, or by outright blocking/destroying it. This would greatly reduce genetic mutation as well, serving as an affective way to emulate the effects of something like telomeres. Lastly, your input on misfolded proteins is exactly why Aubrey rejects the notion of death simply being due to "age", when in fact, it's due to all of the diseases that build up to a point where they manifest after you have been around long enough. Age doesn't kill anyone, disease does. Age is simply a disease modifier.

If you don't want to die of a terrible disease tomorrow, then there's no reason to think that dying of the same disease 60 years from now is better, just because your body is able to produce it easier at that point.

It might be better to die tomorrow. Because being old sucks. You are sick more, you have little energy, your body is breaking down, destroying itself, producing painful diseases. Before you die at a nice old age, you will have suffered through years or agony, being forced to not be able to do many things which you once could. So not only do your options become limited, you have to realize that you will never do any of those fun things again.


Kudos to your contribution! I'm curious though, when you mentioned expanding the longevity of telomeres without the affliction of cancer were you pertaining that to telomerase?

It has been observed that telomeres increase the risk of cancer in mice, and so it's known that it would cause it in us as well. The potential benefits of telomeres are too great to simply dismiss it however. People will attempt to reduce the risk of cancer due to the use of them. All in all, we live in great times, compared to just about any other century in human history.
Posted 2/12/13
ummmmmm the sun has only lived half its life u dumbass my gosh try to act so damn smart but having 40 billlion ppl wont work plus this world is allllll about money so u have to be rich to get it im sure plus even if they did figure that out the military would be all over it like stink on shit to much money to be made for suffering as well ie pay docs for helping with syptoms instead of paying once to solve the real problem...jeeze dont yall ppl know what makes this world go round anymore ppl only care about themselves and there bank account!!!
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Posted 2/12/13

Realtaliation wrote:
Kudos to your contribution! I'm curious though, when you mentioned expanding the longevity of telomeres without the affliction of cancer were you pertaining that to telomerase?

Thank you. I meant that using a gene therapy that would artificially extend telomeres or stop them from shortening during consecutive replications would also greatly increase the risk of cancer.


netdisorder wrote:
I did watch a video on telomeres and how it increased the lifespan of mice greatly, but increased the chance of cancer significantly. They did mention one species that is completely immune to cancer, which is the naked mole rat. Either Aubrey De Grey is attempting to address this issue, or he believes that there is another way to prevent the genetic mutation which leads to most of our bodily diseases in the first place.

I know one of his ideas is to make wilt buildup impossible by either rendering it harmless, or by outright blocking/destroying it. This would greatly reduce genetic mutation as well, serving as an affective way to emulate the effects of something like telomeres. Lastly, your input on misfolded proteins is exactly why Aubrey rejects the notion of death simply being due to "age", when in fact, it's due to all of the diseases that build up to a point where they manifest after you have been around long enough. Age doesn't kill anyone, disease does. Age is simply a disease modifier.
.

I think that it is a little more complicated than that. I don't know what you do, but I'm glad you have an interest in biomedical science. You should pursue it further.
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Posted 2/12/13
If medicine can find drugs as amazing as SSRIs (antidepressants) and betAblockers I'm sure given time they can figure something out
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Posted 2/12/13 , edited 2/12/13

mhibicke wrote:


Realtaliation wrote:
Kudos to your contribution! I'm curious though, when you mentioned expanding the longevity of telomeres without the affliction of cancer were you pertaining that to telomerase?

Thank you. I meant that using a gene therapy that would artificially extend telomeres or stop them from shortening during consecutive replications would also greatly increase the risk of cancer.


netdisorder wrote:
I did watch a video on telomeres and how it increased the lifespan of mice greatly, but increased the chance of cancer significantly. They did mention one species that is completely immune to cancer, which is the naked mole rat. Either Aubrey De Grey is attempting to address this issue, or he believes that there is another way to prevent the genetic mutation which leads to most of our bodily diseases in the first place.

I know one of his ideas is to make wilt buildup impossible by either rendering it harmless, or by outright blocking/destroying it. This would greatly reduce genetic mutation as well, serving as an affective way to emulate the effects of something like telomeres. Lastly, your input on misfolded proteins is exactly why Aubrey rejects the notion of death simply being due to "age", when in fact, it's due to all of the diseases that build up to a point where they manifest after you have been around long enough. Age doesn't kill anyone, disease does. Age is simply a disease modifier.
.

I think that it is a little more complicated than that. I don't know what you do, but I'm glad you have an interest in biomedical science. You should pursue it further.


Well I do not know what Aubrey's exact methods are, so I am left to generalize what he has outlined. Actually, seeing as Aubrey cannot solve this problem, at least yet, we still do not know just how complicated this is. All we clearly do know is that it is very complicated.

I don't do anything amazing. All I've done is pass the NREMT exam, so my knowledge is limited. I do however think I have a firm grasp on the fundamental idea of longevity research. I would attempt to work my way towards a biomedical profession, except my math is horrible, and I am being pushed to look for work over getting an education. So with the extensive coursework that comes with pursuing that career type, I would have to wait quite a while before I can formally approach it.


SasukeUchiha25100 wrote:

ummmmmm the sun has only lived half its life u dumbass my gosh try to act so damn smart but having 40 billlion ppl wont work plus this world is allllll about money so u have to be rich to get it im sure plus even if they did figure that out the military would be all over it like stink on shit to much money to be made for suffering as well ie pay docs for helping with syptoms instead of paying once to solve the real problem...jeeze dont yall ppl know what makes this world go round anymore ppl only care about themselves and there bank account!!!



If successful, this is going to be a universal treatment. If the SENS foundation gets a lot of donators, the preliminary research will move a lot faster which will lead to investments by government and private industry. So if all of the donators including myself each donated say, $200 dollars a year, I would be one of the people who has the best chances of benefiting from the regenerative medicine. This is as close as a radical medical practice comes to being an externally benefiting charity. Which is very, very good.

For the military to steal this research, it would require a totalitarian government similar to one out of a dystopian fiction novel.
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Posted 2/12/13

netdisorder wrote:

Well I do not know what Aubrey's exact methods are, so I am left to generalize what he has outlined. Actually, seeing as Aubrey cannot solve this problem, at least yet, we still do not know just how complicated this is. All we clearly do know is that it is very complicated.

I don't do anything amazing. All I've done is pass the NREMT exam. So my knowledge is limited, but I think I have a firm grasp on the fundamental idea of longevity research.


No one person can "cure" aging, and Dr. de Grey will not be discovering the fountain of youth any time soon. He's published a lot of essays and review articles on free radicals and mitochondrial DNA in the past fifteen years, but I don't see that he has published any lab work.

Here is a link to a cute diagram that illustrates the perception of science vs reality. The picture is big and awkward, or I would include it directly. http://electroncafe.wordpress.com/2011/05/04/scientific-process-rage/

Message me if you would like me to send you some PDFs of interesting articles on neurodegenerative diseases. I've got a few kicking around that I thought were good.
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Posted 2/12/13 , edited 2/12/13

mhibicke wrote:


netdisorder wrote:

Well I do not know what Aubrey's exact methods are, so I am left to generalize what he has outlined. Actually, seeing as Aubrey cannot solve this problem, at least yet, we still do not know just how complicated this is. All we clearly do know is that it is very complicated.

I don't do anything amazing. All I've done is pass the NREMT exam. So my knowledge is limited, but I think I have a firm grasp on the fundamental idea of longevity research.


No one person can "cure" aging, and Dr. de Grey will not be discovering the fountain of youth any time soon. He's published a lot of essays and review articles on free radicals and mitochondrial DNA in the past fifteen years, but I don't see that he has published any lab work.

Here is a link to a cute diagram that illustrates the perception of science vs reality. The picture is big and awkward, or I would include it directly. http://electroncafe.wordpress.com/2011/05/04/scientific-process-rage/

Message me if you would like me to send you some PDFs of interesting articles on neurodegenerative diseases. I've got a few kicking around that I thought were good.


Sorry I was actually referring to the SENS foundation and their affiliates. I am just used to mentioning figureheads to help get a point across. The whole pointing out the man with the plan sort of thing. I will check out this diagram, and yes I am interested in seeing what other articles you have.
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Posted 2/12/13
Alive for 200 years on THIS planet with THESE people? No thanks. Besides something tells me 200 yrs would be murder on my looks. whew! can you imagine the wrinkles and sagging? my balls really WOULD reach my knees by then. It sounds nice in theory but in reality...no.
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Posted 2/12/13
I think someone did mention in the thread that nations with technological advantage or medical research would be the first to harness and utilize the possibility of the subject that we are discussing, the prolonging and a panacea of life and its ailments. Though I should have mentioned earlier that the likelihood of universal dispersal is very unlikely, and the methods or procedures to bestow such technology or medical wonder will be costly in terms of resources and monetarily. Say, if genetic manipulation/engineering were to be the method of dispersal and implementation then that causes a permanent altering to the individual and their offspring, but include the possibility of the cost of such a procedure, the affluent having access to this primarily then you have a genetic drift in the population, where those who can afford this are superior and those less fortunate end up becoming a sub-species. This then spills over to ethics and social policy, where the majority of the population considered to be a health liability can face discrimination. Though the medium of dispersing this technology with mass production intended, makes me skeptical.

The subject of resources and restructuring of society and production should also be in question, but that is a digression and for another thread topic, and I shan't further it.
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Posted 2/12/13

kalvinh wrote:

Alive for 200 years on THIS planet with THESE people? No thanks. Besides something tells me 200 yrs would be murder on my looks. whew! can you imagine the wrinkles and sagging? my balls really WOULD reach my knees by then. It sounds nice in theory but in reality...no.


Though I think we have slowed aging in mind, you make a point.

Any older and you might just trip.
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Posted 2/12/13 , edited 2/12/13

kalvinh wrote:

Alive for 200 years on THIS planet with THESE people? No thanks. Besides something tells me 200 yrs would be murder on my looks. whew! can you imagine the wrinkles and sagging? my balls really WOULD reach my knees by then. It sounds nice in theory but in reality...no.


Well seeing as you can repair a car to make it run just like new. A similar principle would apply to regenerative treatments. If you weren't wrinkly before, you would not become wrinkly any time soon after receiving treatment. Then there's advances in skin grafting. So if you look old when you receive regenerative treatment, you could possibly just make yourself look young again.

Personally, I don't think wrinkles warrant a death sentence when faced with the option to receive a treatment that extends your lifespan greatly. Not when I would still be able to take a nice warm bath.
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Posted 2/12/13

netdisorder wrote:


kalvinh wrote:

Alive for 200 years on THIS planet with THESE people? No thanks. Besides something tells me 200 yrs would be murder on my looks. whew! can you imagine the wrinkles and sagging? my balls really WOULD reach my knees by then. It sounds nice in theory but in reality...no.


Well seeing as you can repair a car to make it run just like new. A similar principle would apply to regenerative treatments. If you weren't wrinkly before, you would not become wrinkly any time soon after receiving treatment. Then there's advances in skin grafting. So if you look old when you receive regenerative treatment, you could possibly just make yourself look young again.

Personally, I don't think wrinkles warrant a death sentence when faced with the option to receive a treatment that extends your lifespan greatly. Not when I would still be able to take a nice warm bath.


I just used the aesthetic aspect to be funny. I honestly cant say that I would want to be on this planet that long. Its cool if you do and the thought of being able to live that long sounds cool in theory but...this world...its too ugly for me. I have seen horrible things. Things that make most men not sleep at night. (Thanks USAF!!!) Im content to live my 60 and call it quits. Like I said it sounds cool but its not for me. Just my raggedy ass beat up ugly opinion. Please dont hurt me.
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Posted 2/12/13 , edited 2/12/13

Realtaliation wrote:

I think someone did mention in the thread that nations with technological advantage or medical research would be the first to harness and utilize the possibility of the subject that we are discussing, the prolonging and a panacea of life and its ailments. Though I should have mentioned earlier that the likelihood of universal dispersal is very unlikely, and the methods or procedures to bestow such technology or medical wonder will be costly in terms of resources and monetarily. Say, if genetic manipulation/engineering were to be the method of dispersal and implementation then that causes a permanent altering to the individual and their offspring, but include the possibility of the cost of such a procedure, the affluent having access to this primarily then you have a genetic drift in the population, where those who can afford this are superior and those less fortunate end up becoming a sub-species. This then spills over to ethics and social policy, where the majority of the population considered to be a health liability can face discrimination. Though the medium of dispersing this technology with mass production intended, makes me skeptical.

The subject of resources and restructuring of society and production should also be in question, but that is a digression and for another thread topic, and I shan't further it.


The wonder of such a treatment that would render most if not all diseases negligible would potentially drive down medical costs as a whole. Think about it, the whole reason most intensive medical procedures that prolong death are so expensive, is because they aren't very effective. If you have something that encompasses just about every other life sustaining procedure, there would be less resources put into the treatment of individual disease on a per person basis. That's more resources and time delegated to the better treatment.

There's also good reason for a population as a whole to demand it be affordable if it is not, which like you said would bring an ethical debate to the table. Then it would be up to our political representatives to decide whether to allow government based funding to help mass production, and other such necessities that are needed. This is likely the case because to the government, longer lasting workers is more tax money. Also, because it covers both pro-life and pro-choice positions. It could very well garner support from multiple parties. Hopefully, if it happens, it is without tremendous regulation. Although we all know that the FDA would hamper progress to a reasonable extent.

Lastly, the glory that is the global community would likely help in an attempt to make sure that such a treatment not be exclusive to only one body of power. I am sure debate of this nature would make it all the way up to international unions. At least, this is the optimistic outcome. It could go other directions, or not go at all. But I believe it is a reasonable position to take. Any other position is rather defeatist for the global society as a whole.


I just used the aesthetic aspect to be funny. I honestly cant say that I would want to be on this planet that long. Its cool if you do and the thought of being able to live that long sounds cool in theory but...this world...its too ugly for me. I have seen horrible things. Things that make most men not sleep at night. (Thanks USAF!!!) Im content to live my 60 and call it quits. Like I said it sounds cool but its not for me. Just my raggedy ass beat up ugly opinion. Please dont hurt me.


To each their own. I have no qualms with you living your life the way you see fit. I just see it one way for myself. When I witness people living in famine, being tortured, and still clinging to life because it is important to them, then I can't help but to think that life is something worth living as long as possible, no matter what you encounter along the way.

You learn from the good, and you learn from the bad. The truth that holds them together, is that you still have the ability to learn at all.
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