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She Was Asking For It - Abuse in Shoujo
Posted 4/7/13 , edited 4/7/13

papagolfwhiskey wrote:


magicuser360 wrote:


Daemon_Magister wrote:

Look on the flip side.

Shonen themes where the females are the dominant ones.


Difference is, it is played for comedic effect. Like I said in my personal commentary - if the hitting is played for laughs (like a funny kick, or flying punch) it is fine.

Problem is in Shoujo, it is not played for comedic effect, but in a serious manner.


So abuse is okay as long as we laugh at it? It's okay as long as it's just some one being irrational? "oh no, through no fault of your own you might have seen my underwear? >THRUNCH!<

and of course if the male in question actually notices anything. well then... he was asking for it.

Just wanted make sure I understood your hypocrisy.



I think you missed my point. The abuse in the article was serious, and not to be taken lightly, and most certainly NOT played for laughs. I think I mentioned in my first comment that comical abuse was fine from both male and female.

The comical abuse featured elsewhere was like the "abuse" in Tom and Jerry. Played for laughs. Or would you consider that "real abuse" as well?


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Posted 4/7/13
I used to read shoujo a lot when I was younger Middle School/early High School years, at the time I never thought much about the heroines. I was too busy fawning over the male characters and wishing for fake romance. These days I don't read them much because most of the time the Female lead makes me cringe and cry inside.

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Posted 4/7/13 , edited 4/7/13


It's not in your jurisdiction to dictate to us if what an artist creates is comedic or isn't.

Which gender the abuse is coming from shouldn't matter. We're all equals, right?
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Posted 4/7/13
Are people really failing to see the difference between intentionally over the top comedy and supposedly played straight romance now?

There's several fairly obvious differences between over the top Shonen comedy focused on slapstick humor and supposedly idealized Shoujo romance where emotional manipulation is played off as an attractive character trait.
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Posted 4/7/13
I didn't red it all but I get the point. See this is like how I know the exact reason why Rei from NGE is soooo popular in Japan simply put its because she is a woman that begs to be dominated and thats how Japanese men like their women. See Japan may be ahead when it comes to some technology but that's where it stops everything else is still in the past when the women stayed home and men did everything yada yada I could go on for a while but I'll stop here.
Posted 4/8/13
Most shoujo is probably written by female writers. No offense, most women seem to want crappy stuff for other women. You've heard the words "women treat each other women badly" used before.
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Posted 4/8/13
*facepalm* and *rolls eyeballs* on majority of the article

But oh well, shojo mangas were awesome time killers while waiting for updates on my other mangas.

I outgrew shojo manga though and began reading thicker novels and some psychological themed mangas (mostly one-shots, or short stories).
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Posted 4/8/13
Honestly, I would say that its shonen where the most abuse happens. If you look at the very popular shoujo, 'say i love you' 'my little monster' to name 2 on CR, its really not that case at all. Its mostly shonen where the main male character sexually abuses any and every female around, as an excuse for fanservice.
Posted 4/8/13
Hello, that's why some are labeled as mature. Most shojo ends with a happy ending with the douche getting the Girl and overtaking a whole personality change. get over it. you don't have to read it. If you think about it, most boys are like that nowadays. Now they are targeting my favorite manga subject. People need to get a life and keep their opinions to themselves. Ok I'm getting out of this forum before I go into full on rant mode...
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Posted 4/8/13
I'm not entirely certain why the author has decided to attack Shoujo, when the reverse has the exact same issue. To think of all the harems that end in the main character going for the abusive personality trope is mind boggling, to say the least. It isn't the author's intention to insult people, as much as to sell a specific product to a specific set of people who enjoy specific styles of romance.
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Posted 4/8/13
Maybe the reason why this genre is popular is because girls like to be treated like shyt...?!

Girls please confirm...!
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Posted 4/8/13 , edited 4/8/13

magicuser360 wrote:



I think you missed my point. The abuse in the article was serious, and not to be taken lightly, and most certainly NOT played for laughs. I think I mentioned in my first comment that comical abuse was fine from both male and female.

The comical abuse featured elsewhere was like the "abuse" in Tom and Jerry. Played for laughs. Or would you consider that "real abuse" as well?




Perhaps I did misunderstand. Though I read some soujo manga I tend to avoid ignore the ones that imply an ongoing abusive relationship. (that doesn't leave many to read) one I remember that had an abusive relationship in a character's past (Bitter Virgin) was actually a very moving story that didn't pander to tropes being complained about above, but the characters' circumstances were hardly nice.

As for Female on Male abuse in almost every rom com. It stopped being funny to me a long time ago. and I think if the gender roles were reversed it wouldn't be funny at all. but that's just my opinion. What do I know? right?


Demon7trackKh wrote:

I didn't red it all but I get the point. See this is like how I know the exact reason why Rei from NGE is soooo popular in Japan simply put its because she is a woman that begs to be dominated and thats how Japanese men like their women. See Japan may be ahead when it comes to some technology but that's where it stops everything else is still in the past when the women stayed home and men did everything yada yada I could go on for a while but I'll stop here.


I think there is some truth to that. but I think Rei is a special case. I personally think she's popular because she's like a Rorschach blot. People are free to imagine whatever personality appeals to them as rei's own.
Posted 4/8/13

papagolfwhiskey wrote:


magicuser360 wrote:



I think you missed my point. The abuse in the article was serious, and not to be taken lightly, and most certainly NOT played for laughs. I think I mentioned in my first comment that comical abuse was fine from both male and female.

The comical abuse featured elsewhere was like the "abuse" in Tom and Jerry. Played for laughs. Or would you consider that "real abuse" as well?




Perhaps I did misunderstand. Though I read some soujo manga I tend to avoid ignore the ones that imply an ongoing abusive relationship. (that doesn't leave many to read) one I remember that had an abusive relationship in a character's past (Bitter Virgin) was actually a very moving story that didn't pander to tropes being complained about above, but the characters' circumstances were hardly nice.

As for Female on Male abuse in almost every rom com. It stopped being funny to me a long time ago. and I think if the gender roles were reversed it wouldn't be funny at all. but that's just my opinion. What do I know? right?

I have not read Bitter Virgin (and I did not know it was Shoujo - I thought it was Seinen) but if it handles abuse correctly, I might check it out. Female on Male abuse is considered "okay" (and it is not). Reminds me of the crappy series Love Hina. The main girl and other girls as well treat the main guy like garbage and it is played for laughs. The main male was JUST like a spineless, take-everything Shoujo heroine, and it was sickening to see how he put up with the domineering girls around him. Even though it was supposed to be funny it was not.

When I say "abuse is okay when it is played for laughs" I mean things like comically getting angry, hitting the other person with giant hammers, giving them flying punches...Like Tom and Jerry kind of abuse, or the whacking that is featured in shows like Spongebob for instance.

Would you call that abuse? Or just comedy?
Posted 4/8/13

Aimyay wrote:



It's not in your jurisdiction to dictate to us if what an artist creates is comedic or isn't.

Which gender the abuse is coming from shouldn't matter. We're all equals, right?


Guess you missed the fact that it was all my personal opinion on comedic or non-comedic abuse and the only person I was pushing my "jurisdiction" on was myself.

Funnily, you were also dictating and implying abuse with the male as the victim in your statement (is that not dictating to me what the artists intentions were)?

I mentioned both genders in COMIC abuse to point out when its comedy/slapstick/played for laughs, it is fine. I also should have mentioned that when the abuse is no played for those reasons, it is not okay for any gender.

Since you're so against comical abuse, you should also be against shows like Tom and Jerry or a lot of cartoons. After all, they all feature comic abuse as well. Or does that not matter to you?

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Posted 4/8/13
-_- its just a manga genre. It shouldn't be taken seriously. People sure take things to seriously nowadays.
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