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We are all indirectly self centered
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Posted 5/2/13
Do you think yourself a generous person? Do you belive that you help others without regard for yourself? Well here's a thought, and only that. I'm not trying to persuade but rather ponder and discuss the possibility.

Selfishness is a part of our nature and is to be expected from humanity. What i wonder is to what extent do we go to benifit ourselfs? When you gove a gift to sombody, some belive this is thinking of others. What i propose is that it's just a way of indirectly pleasing your own ego. When a man loves his wife and kids and vows to support them through his own will, is it through love (personal attachment, also self centered) or just because he has to live up to his pride?

Lets say you had an opportunity to help sombody you've never met or seen in a big way. But, at the cost of somthing equaly as dear to you. Of cource you wouldn't do it. You can try and make yourself feel good by claiming you would; but when it comes down to it there are little to no one on this earth who would do somthing like that.

So there's my theory. I would love to hear some of your opinions and debate this further! :]
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Posted 5/2/13 , edited 5/2/13

ExplorerOak wrote:

Do you think yourself a generous person? Do you belive that you help others without regard for yourself? Well here's a thought, and only that. I'm not trying to persuade but rather ponder and discuss the possibility.

Selfishness is a part of our nature and is to be expected from humanity. What i wonder is to what extent do we go to benifit ourselfs? When you gove a gift to sombody, some belive this is thinking of others. What i propose is that it's just a way of indirectly pleasing your own ego. When a man loves his wife and kids and vows to support them through his own will, is it through love (personal attachment, also self centered) or just because he has to live up to his pride?

Lets say you had an opportunity to help sombody you've never met or seen in a big way. But, at the cost of somthing equaly as dear to you. Of cource you wouldn't do it. You can try and make yourself feel good by claiming you would; but when it comes down to it there are little to no one on this earth who would do somthing like that.

So there's my theory. I would love to hear some of your opinions and debate this further! :]


I think nature/god (which ever you believe in) gave us an ego because we need it just to have some drive to survive in the first place.

So yeah maybe we are naturally self centered, but so we can actually survive.
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Posted 5/2/13 , edited 5/2/13
I get what you are trying to say, though I wish the English vocabulary would have a more elegant solution to making the idea of ego not sound so harsh, because I know you don't mean it that way.

Ego is just not the right word, because the idea of helping others can be a serious euphoric release for some people, especially if we have emotional ties, we often sacrifice to someone without giving it much thought (often never realizing that we helped someone senselessly. For a relatable example, I often hold the door for people without thinking about it, it's just a polite habit, I'm usually thinking about something and just going through the motions. Other times, I'm consciously trying to help people, even when I feel bad, because I care for their general wellness. This feeds my ego somewhat, an in the general sense it is the appropriate word, but its not quite to the degree as the public views the word. In fact, I may quickly forget I've even helped someone and worry about much more present issues, thus my ego doesn't change for more than a few seconds.

There are also theories of that indirect satisfaction we get from helping people we care about. In a way, if you keep someone happy, they often keep you happy, and thus being good to them is indirectly beneficial to one's own happiness. On the other hand, some of take our relations to heart so deeply that another person's well being is tied directly to their own without conscious thought, as if it affects their own homeostasis.

This is one of those topics where the words used (ego and pride) detract from what is really important, which I believe to be is the conflict between premeditated and non-premeditated generosity.

[Edit] I guess I should go on to say that as far as homeostasis is concerned, being self centered is truly about maintaining ourselves, which often means that we should maintain others, whether emotion is tied to It or not. It's one of those facts and necessities of existence, nothing much to argue about. To put someone else's problems completely over our own (become so extrovert that we are no longer self centered at all) can mean death because we meet the needs of others before ourselves.

Also, another idea to ponder is how some people use their extrovertiveness to justify why they even care for themselves, people who truly want others to be happy must obviously maintain themselves for their sake, but at the same time it ties back to their own happiness and pleasure in making someone else happy (infinite loop)
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Posted 5/2/13
Well I'd definitely somewhat agree with your theory. It logically doesn't make sense to help someone without getting anything in return. It could be that the thing we get in return is indeed an ego boost. But then again, we're humans; we defy logic all the time
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Posted 5/2/13

ExplorerOak wrote:

Do you think yourself a generous person? Do you belive that you help others without regard for yourself? Well here's a thought, and only that. I'm not trying to persuade but rather ponder and discuss the possibility.

Selfishness is a part of our nature and is to be expected from humanity. What i wonder is to what extent do we go to benifit ourselfs? When you gove a gift to sombody, some belive this is thinking of others. What i propose is that it's just a way of indirectly pleasing your own ego. When a man loves his wife and kids and vows to support them through his own will, is it through love (personal attachment, also self centered) or just because he has to live up to his pride?

Lets say you had an opportunity to help sombody you've never met or seen in a big way. But, at the cost of somthing equaly as dear to you. Of cource you wouldn't do it. You can try and make yourself feel good by claiming you would; but when it comes down to it there are little to no one on this earth who would do somthing like that.

So there's my theory. I would love to hear some of your opinions and debate this further! :]


We are the center of our worlds, you cant live life being entirely self less.Thats impossible....

There isnt even much to debate about this, its like an unspoken fact.
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Posted 5/2/13

IcyToastYum wrote:

Well I'd definitely somewhat agree with your theory. It logically doesn't make sense to help someone without getting anything in return. It could be that the thing we get in return is indeed an ego boost. But then again, we're humans; we defy logic all the time


I think the basic logic actually makes perfect sense here, whenever something is given, something is received. Even if you pick up a rock, you take a rock, but you also give effort to change something about it (position, shape, et cetera). The same is true with generosity, you give you time, you gain a reaction; you gain a reaction, you give some time. But the whole idea of an infinite chain of reactions boggles my brain when I think about it to hard XD it's simple though, I think, more or less, sure

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Posted 5/3/13
You are supremely wrong. I bet you are an Atheist.
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Posted 5/3/13
All life is self-centered. They take in what they can use and discard what they can't. They protect what is important to them, because damage to what is important to them is damage to themselves. Being self-centered is neither bad or good, it is just necessary for continued existence. There are excesses to being self-centered that would be bad, but that would where one becomes selfish/egotistical/narcissistic.
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Posted 5/3/13 , edited 5/3/13
This sounds like being selfish rather than self-centered to me. i think we forget that even negative feelings towards ourselves can also be considered self-centered. for example, you were focusing on your own damn pimple on your face and you kept thinking, "omg i am so ugly waaaaah," that you didn't notice your best friend was feeling down because of horrible circumstances. etc etc. i guess that is almost getting off subject, but you get my drift.

anywho, if you have never felt to go out of your way to help another if it means you would lose something trivial (for example, time, but at a reasonable expense, like you're not skipping out on school/work to do this favor) i wonder if that could possibly mean you haven't.. er.. experienced a deeper relationship either with yourself or people in general.

(note: i, myself, was CERTAINLY delayed in learning basic human social interactions such as compassion and understanding. i think i can remember when i was 11-ish and thinking, "meh," at situations i should have been like, "ACK! SOMEONE HELP! I WILL HELP! HOW SHOULD I HELP!?")
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Posted 5/3/13

Shane_Alv wrote:

I get what you are trying to say, though I wish the English vocabulary would have a more elegant solution to making the idea of ego not sound so harsh, because I know you don't mean it that way.

Ego is just not the right word, because the idea of helping others can be a serious euphoric release for some people, especially if we have emotional ties, we often sacrifice to someone without giving it much thought (often never realizing that we helped someone senselessly. For a relatable example, I often hold the door for people without thinking about it, it's just a polite habit, I'm usually thinking about something and just going through the motions. Other times, I'm consciously trying to help people, even when I feel bad, because I care for their general wellness. This feeds my ego somewhat, an in the general sense it is the appropriate word, but its not quite to the degree as the public views the word. In fact, I may quickly forget I've even helped someone and worry about much more present issues, thus my ego doesn't change for more than a few seconds.

There are also theories of that indirect satisfaction we get from helping people we care about. In a way, if you keep someone happy, they often keep you happy, and thus being good to them is indirectly beneficial to one's own happiness. On the other hand, some of take our relations to heart so deeply that another person's well being is tied directly to their own without conscious thought, as if it affects their own homeostasis.

This is one of those topics where the words used (ego and pride) detract from what is really important, which I believe to be is the conflict between premeditated and non-premeditated generosity.

[Edit] I guess I should go on to say that as far as homeostasis is concerned, being self centered is truly about maintaining ourselves, which often means that we should maintain others, whether emotion is tied to It or not. It's one of those facts and necessities of existence, nothing much to argue about. To put someone else's problems completely over our own (become so extrovert that we are no longer self centered at all) can mean death because we meet the needs of others before ourselves.

Also, another idea to ponder is how some people use their extrovertiveness to justify why they even care for themselves, people who truly want others to be happy must obviously maintain themselves for their sake, but at the same time it ties back to their own happiness and pleasure in making someone else happy (infinite loop)


You make some good points, but ego plays a part of being selfish. Also your last comment on introverts is interesting, and a good example of what i'm trying to say.
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Posted 5/3/13

-Vega- wrote:

You are supremely wrong. I bet you are an Atheist.


You have no credability on these forums anymore, after all your tin foil hat posts. Although they where funny and worth a view. Lol! Also, you're wrong, i'm very religous.
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Posted 5/3/13

shotanime wrote:

This sounds like being selfish rather than self-centered to me. i think we forget that even negative feelings towards ourselves can also be considered self-centered. for example, you were focusing on your own damn pimple on your face and you kept thinking, "omg i am so ugly waaaaah," that you didn't notice your best friend was feeling down because of horrible circumstances. etc etc. i guess that is almost getting off subject, but you get my drift.

anywho, if you have never felt to go out of your way to help another if it means you would lose something trivial (for example, time, but at a reasonable expense, like you're not skipping out on school/work to do this favor) i wonder if that could possibly mean you haven't.. er.. experienced a deeper relationship either with yourself or people in general.

(note: i, myself, was CERTAINLY delayed in learning basic human social interactions such as compassion and understanding. i think i can remember when i was 11-ish and thinking, "meh," at situations i should have been like, "ACK! SOMEONE HELP! I WILL HELP! HOW SHOULD I HELP!?")


They're are the same thing.

And if it's a trivial favor you wouldn't mind giving up trivial time; for the sake of feeling like a good person/friend and recieving gratitude.
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Posted 5/3/13
Im just talking here

I don't think its selfish or self centered if you help someone and it makes you feel good at all. Its a deed for a deed. If you want to put it that way. Some people just love helping people because it makes them happy to see the others happiness. Without people that are like that or try to be like that the world would be sad. But I absolutly understand what you are saying all the way and it does make you think but to me its more like a deed for a deed like everything else in life if you want to consider it that way. It is what it is I guess. Interesting thought there. Kind of like a person who gets satisfaction out of hurting another but the other likes the pain. Anyways just an oppsite thought if it make sense. So which would you prefer according to selfishness or self centered?



I like your thinking Deep thoughts that drive me nuts lol.

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Posted 5/3/13

ExplorerOak wrote:

Do you think yourself a generous person? Do you belive that you help others without regard for yourself? Well here's a thought, and only that. I'm not trying to persuade but rather ponder and discuss the possibility.

Selfishness is a part of our nature and is to be expected from humanity. What i wonder is to what extent do we go to benifit ourselfs? When you gove a gift to sombody, some belive this is thinking of others. What i propose is that it's just a way of indirectly pleasing your own ego. When a man loves his wife and kids and vows to support them through his own will, is it through love (personal attachment, also self centered) or just because he has to live up to his pride?

Lets say you had an opportunity to help sombody you've never met or seen in a big way. But, at the cost of somthing equaly as dear to you. Of cource you wouldn't do it. You can try and make yourself feel good by claiming you would; but when it comes down to it there are little to no one on this earth who would do somthing like that.

So there's my theory. I would love to hear some of your opinions and debate this further! :]


I have never helped another individual without any regard for myself because in order to help someone else I must first want to help that person. It's completely selfish to want to help another person. :P



Posted 5/3/13

spacebat wrote:


I have never helped another individual without any regard for myself because in order to help someone else I must first want to help that person. It's completely selfish to want to help another person. :P



I think I like this guy. Excellently put.

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