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Post Reply Suicide.
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25 / M / Hughesville, Penn...
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Posted 6/1/13

spacebat wrote:


lordseth23 wrote:

so I suggest that you just stop now if you insist on being right all the time.


I'm not interested in being right. I'm much more interested in you accepting that you are wrong and acknowledging why you are wrong. I am right too often to care.


How am I wrong? Isn't it obvious that you need to tell me how I am wrong in order for me to realize that I am wrong?
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32 / M / "Spaaaaace!"
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Posted 6/1/13

lordseth23 wrote:

How am I wrong? Isn't it obvious that you need to tell me how I am wrong in order for me to realize that I am wrong? :lol:


Nope, you're smart. I believe in your ability to arrive at that conclusion yourself.
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25 / M / Hughesville, Penn...
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Posted 6/1/13

spacebat wrote:


lordseth23 wrote:

How am I wrong? Isn't it obvious that you need to tell me how I am wrong in order for me to realize that I am wrong? :lol:


Nope, you're smart. I believe in your ability to arrive at that conclusion yourself.


How am I smart?
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26 / M / Pandemonium
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Posted 6/1/13 , edited 6/1/13

lordseth23 wrote:


spacebat wrote:


lordseth23 wrote:

How am I wrong? Isn't it obvious that you need to tell me how I am wrong in order for me to realize that I am wrong? :lol:


Nope, you're smart. I believe in your ability to arrive at that conclusion yourself.


How am I smart?


That's irrelevant. You're trying to derail the conversation. He said he thinks you're smart. That's all that matters. You don't need to know exactly why he believes that you are smart. Take it as a compliment.
And if you want to know so badly, he can tell you after you've come to a realization regarding the subject at hand.
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57 / M / Covina, California
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Posted 6/1/13

lordseth23 wrote:


AcadGlade wrote:



I Really doubt that throwing yourself on a grenade should be called altuistic suicide, because I doubt the one falling on the grenade wanted to die in the first place.


I think that the idea of altruistic suicide should extend beyond that spur-of-the-moment type of situation. Any suicide that directly improves the well-being of an individual should be considered altruistic, and I don't think that they should be considered the result of a mental illness when they are fundamentally no different than any other action one would take to benefit another.


Alfred Hitchcock made a movie about people who had been stuck on a boat or raft because their ship had been sunk by a U-Boat, and there were several in the boat and some in the water clinging to the boat, praying for rescue, but as the days pass buy some die of exaustion, and then there are only those in the boat, then disaster strikes, a storm leaves them for food and water for only a certain number to survive, but that means a certain number have to....what would you do?
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25 / M / Hughesville, Penn...
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Posted 6/1/13 , edited 6/1/13

Syndicaidramon wrote:



That's irrelevant. You're trying to derail the conversation. He said he thinks you're smart. That's all that matters. You don't need to know exactly why he believes that you are smart. Take it as a compliment.
And if you want to know so badly, he can tell you after you've come to a realization regarding the subject at hand.


What realization do you speak of?



AcadGlade wrote:



Alfred Hitchcock made a movie about people who had been stuck on a boat or raft because their ship had been sunk by a U-Boat, and there were several in the boat and some in the water clinging to the boat, praying for rescue, but as the days pass buy some die of exaustion, and then there are only those in the boat, then disaster strikes, a storm leaves them for food and water for only a certain number to survive, but that means a certain number have to....what would you do?


I would commit suicide to ensure the survival of someone.
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57 / M / Covina, California
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Posted 6/1/13

lordseth23 wrote:


Syndicaidramon wrote:



What realization do you speak of?



AcadGlade wrote:



Alfred Hitchcock made a movie about people who had been stuck on a boat or raft because their ship had been sunk by a U-Boat, and there were several in the boat and some in the water clinging to the boat, praying for rescue, but as the days pass buy some die of exaustion, and then there are only those in the boat, then disaster strikes, a storm leaves them for food and water for only a certain number to survive, but that means a certain number have to....what would you do?


I would commit suicide to ensure the survival of someone.

Do you consider your life of so little value, that you could do that?
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25 / M / Hughesville, Penn...
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Posted 6/1/13

AcadGlade wrote:

Do you consider your life of so little value, that you could do that?


Yes, I do not value this life at all, so I would willingly die for the sake of anybody, regardless of who they were. If I had a life that did meet my expectations and that I did value, I would be open to discussion regarding the matter, but I would still be willing to die for the sake of someone who wanted to live.
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26 / M / Pandemonium
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Posted 6/1/13

lordseth23
What realization do you speak of?


The realization of why you are wrong.
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25 / M / Hughesville, Penn...
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Posted 6/1/13

Syndicaidramon wrote:


lordseth23
What realization do you speak of?


The realization of why you are wrong.


How am I wrong?
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26 / M / Pandemonium
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Posted 6/1/13 , edited 6/1/13

lordseth23 wrote:


Syndicaidramon wrote:


lordseth23
What realization do you speak of?


The realization of why you are wrong.


How am I wrong?


Because you seem to believe that sacrificing one's life in an attempt to save someone = suicide.

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57 / M / Covina, California
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Posted 6/2/13
I think I found an article that explains it.

Why People Give Up on Life

“Each way to suicide is its own: intensely private, unknowable, and terrible.”—Kay Redfield Jamison, psychiatrist.

“IT IS suffering to live.” That is what Ryunosuke Akutagawa, a popular writer in early 20th-century Japan, wrote shortly before committing suicide. However, he prefaced that statement with the words: “Of course, I do not want to die, but . . .”

Like Akutagawa, many of those who take their life do not want to die as much as they want “to end whatever is going on,” stated one psychology professor. The wording so commonly found in suicide notes suggests as much. Such phrases as ‘I could not take it any longer’ or ‘Why go on living?’ show a deep desire to escape life’s harsh realities. But as one expert described it, committing suicide is “like treating a cold with a nuclear bomb.”

Although the reasons why people commit suicide vary, certain events in life commonly trigger suicide.

Triggering Events

It is not uncommon for young ones who give in to despair and commit suicide to do so even over matters that may seem trivial to others. When they feel hurt and cannot do anything about it, youths may view their own death as a means of getting back at those who have hurt them. Hiroshi Inamura, a specialist in handling suicidal people in Japan, wrote: “Through their own death, children cherish an inner urge to punish the person who has tormented them.”

A recent survey in Britain indicated that when children are subjected to severe bullying, they are nearly seven times as likely to attempt suicide. The emotional pain that these children suffer is real. A 13-year-old boy who hanged himself left behind a note naming five people who had tormented him and had even extorted money from him. “Please save other children,” he wrote.

Others may try to take their life when they get into trouble at school or with the law, suffer the end of a romance, get a bad report card, experience stress over exams, or become weighed down by worries about the future. Among high-achieving adolescents who may tend to be perfectionists, a setback or a failure—be it actual or imaginary—may bring on a suicide attempt.

For adults, financial or work-related problems are common triggering events. In Japan after years of economic downturn, suicides recently topped 30,000 a year. According to the Mainichi Daily News, almost three quarters of the middle-aged men who killed themselves did so “because of problems stemming from debts, business failures, poverty and unemployment.” Family problems too may lead to suicide. A Finnish newspaper reported: “Recently divorced middle-aged men” make up one of the high-risk groups. A study in Hungary found that the majority of girls who contemplate suicide were reared in broken homes.

Retirement and physical illness are also major triggering factors, especially among the elderly. Often suicide is chosen as a way out, not necessarily when an illness is terminal, but when the patient views the suffering as intolerable.

However, not everybody reacts to these triggering events by committing suicide. On the contrary, when faced with such stressful situations, the majority do not take their life. Why, then, do some view suicide as the answer, while most do not?

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25 / M / Hughesville, Penn...
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Posted 6/2/13 , edited 6/2/13

Syndicaidramon wrote:



Because you seem to believe that sacrificing one's life in an attempt to save someone = suicide.



Let us look up the word "suicide" shall we? (If these are unreliable sources, please let me know)

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/suicide
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/suicide
http://oxforddictionaries.com/us/definition/american_english/suicide
http://www.cdc.gov/violenceprevention/suicide/definitions.html

In looking at all of these definitions, it can be determined that the word "suicide" can simply mean killing one's self, regardless of any external factors that may be present. Therefore, the sacrificing of one's life in an attempt to save someone can be considered suicide according to these definitions, which wouldn't make any of my previous statements wrong. You may want to define the word "suicide" in some other way that would exclude any sort of altruistic behavior, and that would indeed make me wrong according to your personal schema. I don't have any problem with that, you can define words however you want to, but you are intentionally derailing the conversation by refusing to acknowledge the common definitions of the terms used in it, and there is no point in communicating with me if you are just going to assign stipulative definitions to any technical term in the conversation just to say that I am wrong, because I am here to absorb the wisdom of others and learn, not to be manipulated by your personal opinions.

So tell me, what is your purpose in responding to my posts?
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32 / M / "Spaaaaace!"
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Posted 6/2/13

lordseth23 wrote:


In looking at all of these definitions, it can be determined that the word "suicide" can simply mean killing one's self, regardless of any external factors that may be present. Therefore, the sacrificing of one's life in an attempt to save someone can be considered suicide according to these definitions, which wouldn't make any of my previous statements wrong. You may want to define the word "suicide" in some other way that would exclude any sort of altruistic behavior, and that would indeed make me wrong according to your personal schema. I don't have any problem with that, you can define words however you want to, but you are intentionally derailing the conversation by refusing to acknowledge the common definitions of the terms used in it, and there is no point in communicating with me if you are just going to assign stipulative definitions to any technical term in the conversation just to say that I am wrong, because I am here to absorb the wisdom of others and learn, not to be manipulated by your personal opinions.

So tell me, what is your purpose in responding to my posts?


I think you should read those definitions more thoroughly...
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25 / M / Hughesville, Penn...
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Posted 6/2/13

spacebat wrote:

I think you should read those definitions more thoroughly...


I did, now what do you want?
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