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Do Religions which preach peace fuel more wars than they prevent?
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77 / M / Florida, US
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Posted 1/29/08
I don't think religion causes more wars. It's merely another set of belief of and moral guidelines that prevent violence while inevitably resulting in some violence at the same time. Just like any other set of strong beliefs. Even societies without religion have conflict and turmoil over belief systems and due to their cultural/social values. On a mathematical sense, does the existence of religion result in more war/violence than it prevents? I dunno . I'd have to be a mathematical genius and have to have every possible information available on that matter to even have an estimated answer for that.

And yes to the guy above. There are atheists that also resort to violence and war. No one is immune to violent/aggressive actions aside from rare individuals who have a strong mental/emotional resolve and dedication to peace.
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28 / M / United Arab Emirates
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Posted 1/29/08

neuroneuster wrote:

I dont second some of your opinions, we dont actually realize what makes a war.
There is actually no war in this world, but they were demanded to do so.
I'm not a Christian, thus I don't know why they did war. There is history where Christian fighting the Muslim in the name of God.
Every war I learn is for God. Everything they did is for God. It just depended on how and to who they fought.
In Islam as I learn, they did some steps before war. First, they asked their opponent whether they wanted to accept their religion or obey Islamic law, so no fight and chaos will occur. They did a diplomatic way, but many opponents of them refused to co-operate so there is nothing to do except, WAR.
But, in history, they fought and warred between the soldiers ONLY. They didn't relate publics. Even they ensure those publics, kids, women, priests, trees, and natural beings were not being killed, damaged and destroyed. That is how some religions warred.

However, the mean today is different. They said they do it for God, but they don't consider other's life.
Religion before wasn't like this. It's harmonious than what we think.
So my conclusion is, as the time passes by, many menkind forget their own religion.
And, religion has to do nothing with why soldiers nowadays kill publics.
We should ask them whether they understand their religion concept or not.


That is quite an accurate portrayal of what the Islamic Empire used to do in the olden days, when it actually was a superpower. However its a little off. They gave their opponents 3 choices:

1. Convert to Islam
2. Become a protectorate, having to pay tribute.
3. War

But as you said, it mostly came down to war hehe.

Many ancient wars were indeed fought over religion. But many others came because of either need (Need for better lands to live in) or conquest(British-french wars, it would be more appropriate to call them national pride wars, or Zero-Sum ones). Or in a worse case, a leader who wants to conquer the world for no reason but to make himself seem like a great leader, such as Alexander the Great or Genkis Khan. Expansion is another reason (The Roman Empire). One reason that is also overlooked is blood feuds. This was especially common in pre-islam arabia. Many tales and poet heroes (A hero genre which is kind of exclusive to arabia. Where a skilled warrior who has done great feats in battle should also have peotic skills to boast about his achievements, romance, and tribe leader. The most famous one bieng Antar Bin Shaddad, who was the strongest slave fighter of his war era. He was the illegitemate son of the tribe leader + he was in love with his white cousin Ablah. Check out the story) were born in that Era, it is certainly more romantic than bloody in the way it was portrayed in the arabic culture/history.

All that bieng said, we conclude that religion isn't the only cause of war :p
Posted 1/29/08

SantaBla wrote:

bull.

Do you see atheists going around and burning things down? No. It's mostly religion extremists that do those things.


They are called chavs in England, they have no god yet they do do some stupid stuff cos they are the scum of the earth . Also political extremists tend to burn things as well

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Posted 1/29/08
I think the the opening was completely one-sided to begin with.

I also have no desire to get into another retarded discussion like this, where everyone just wants to blame christianity for everything.
Posted 1/29/08

fenderhawk wrote:

I think the the opening was completely one-sided to begin with.

I also have no desire to get into another retarded discussion like this, where everyone just wants to blame christianity for everything.


I was balanced in the opening, and this thread isn't just about christians you moron actually read the opening properly before you post stupid comments. This is after all a debate so feel free to defend religion and put in the points you seem to think i missed in the opening, this will be a boring thread if nobody does take the view that they don't cause wars.
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Posted 1/29/08

Stickmania wrote:


fenderhawk wrote:

I think the the opening was completely one-sided to begin with.

I also have no desire to get into another retarded discussion like this, where everyone just wants to blame christianity for everything.


I was balanced in the opening, and this thread isn't just about christians you moron actually read the opening properly before you post stupid comments. This is after all a debate so feel free to defend religion and put in the points you seem to think i missed in the opening, this will be a boring thread if nobody does take the view that they don't cause wars.


You sound pissed off, care to tell me why? It was balanced my ass.

Besides, if I want to defend religion, don't get pissed off at me. You made the topic, afterall.
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25 / M / MA
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Posted 1/29/08 , edited 4/18/08
no, its just idiots (kinda like bush) who are kinda smart enough (unlike bush) twist religion to justifying their own ends, such as conquering people or what not. the religions themselves aren't bad, people could choose any religion to justify themself, its just that the more people that follow a religion and the more contradictory it is, the easier it is to use it. (for example, the bible says alot of things, and then the opposites, but I'm still christian)
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38 / M / some where
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Posted 1/29/08 , edited 4/18/08
yes. majority of the wars were started because of difference religion
Posted 1/29/08 , edited 4/18/08
In general, modern religions are more "civilizing" than older ones. Remember that people pretty much always have religious beliefs, even people who claim to have none. Also, before Christianity and Islam, for example, you had people who had religious beliefs involving cannibalism and headhunting. Those sorts of religions made it impossible to form a civilization and were replaced with more "reasonable" religions that had a civilizing influence.

Probably the religion that has been the most bloody in the past century is communism/marxism. This religion has killed more of its own people than any other religion in history. And to this day supposed athiests continue to believe in this religion claiming that it just wasn't "done properly" before.
Posted 1/30/08 , edited 4/18/08

shibole wrote:

In general, modern religions are more "civilizing" than older ones. Remember that people pretty much always have religious beliefs, even people who claim to have none. Also, before Christianity and Islam, for example, you had people who had religious beliefs involving cannibalism and headhunting. Those sorts of religions made it impossible to form a civilization and were replaced with more "reasonable" religions that had a civilizing influence.

Probably the religion that has been the most bloody in the past century is communism/marxism. This religion has killed more of its own people than any other religion in history. And to this day supposed athiests continue to believe in this religion claiming that it just wasn't "done properly" before.



While I agree that communism has caused a lot of deaths and stuff it isn't a religion, one of its key ideals is that there is no God, trust me on this I did an A level exam on communist Russia this morning.
Posted 1/30/08 , edited 4/18/08

fenderhawk wrote:


Stickmania wrote:


fenderhawk wrote:

I think the the opening was completely one-sided to begin with.

I also have no desire to get into another retarded discussion like this, where everyone just wants to blame christianity for everything.


I was balanced in the opening, and this thread isn't just about christians you moron actually read the opening properly before you post stupid comments. This is after all a debate so feel free to defend religion and put in the points you seem to think i missed in the opening, this will be a boring thread if nobody does take the view that they don't cause wars.


You sound pissed off, care to tell me why? It was balanced my ass.

Besides, if I want to defend religion, don't get pissed off at me. You made the topic, afterall.


Well not so much pissed off at your opinions dude but the fact that you left a moronic and pointless post because so far you haven't actually defended religion have you. All you have done is state that you think this thread is just about christians so you refuse to take part, yet you post anyway, and then claim im attacking you for defending christians when you have thus far made no attempt to defend anything. You haven't left a relevent opinion for me to attack yet. As I said before please do, I want people with your views to post so we can have a balanced debate. You clearly have them otherwise you wouldn't think my post was unbalanced.
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Posted 1/30/08 , edited 4/18/08
i don't think this discussion is solely about Christianity... it is just an example... Furthermore, I think that Christianity is not the only religion that preach for peace....
Posted 1/30/08 , edited 4/18/08

Stickmania wrote:


shibole wrote:
Probably the religion that has been the most bloody in the past century is communism/marxism. This religion has killed more of its own people than any other religion in history. And to this day supposed athiests continue to believe in this religion claiming that it just wasn't "done properly" before.


While I agree that communism has caused a lot of deaths and stuff it isn't a religion, one of its key ideals is that there is no God, trust me on this I did an A level exam on communist Russia this morning.


You don't need God to have a religion, you just need faith. Communism/marxism basically involves a lot of faith.... faith which is very misplaced. (I mention atheists simply because they tend to claim they have no religion.)

Simply not believing in god doesn't make one a rational person, and the absence of god doesn't keep something based on faith from effectively being a religion.
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Posted 1/30/08 , edited 4/18/08
atheism is just a label. it's easier to just say you're an atheist because it makes people realise you dont believe in a higher power. otherwise you'd get in a discussion about the whole thing. just like when you call someone a pagan, it's more a generalisation than a clean cut definitive.
Posted 1/30/08 , edited 4/18/08

shibole wrote:


Stickmania wrote:


shibole wrote:
Probably the religion that has been the most bloody in the past century is communism/marxism. This religion has killed more of its own people than any other religion in history. And to this day supposed athiests continue to believe in this religion claiming that it just wasn't "done properly" before.


While I agree that communism has caused a lot of deaths and stuff it isn't a religion, one of its key ideals is that there is no God, trust me on this I did an A level exam on communist Russia this morning.


You don't need God to have a religion, you just need faith. Communism/marxism basically involves a lot of faith.... faith which is very misplaced. (I mention atheists simply because they tend to claim they have no religion.)

Simply not believing in god doesn't make one a rational person, and the absence of god doesn't keep something based on faith from effectively being a religion.


Well technically religion is tied with a god but fundamentally they are similar i see your point.
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