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Posted 1/10/14

UnlimitedEnergy wrote:

But you gotta pay to play I suppose.


I hear that all the time about the money I spend on manga and anime. Then I show them my garage and proceed to explain how I have 2k into the brakes in my one car alone.... If they still argue, Last year, I spent over 500 dollars just on ARP fasteners for an engine.

Quite honestly, Being an Otaku is CHEAP!

I also do rocketry. My 2m tall rocket, cost a couple hundred to build, and costs 20 dollars in aerotech rocket engines... PER LAUNCH! At an event day, I can easily fire off a couple hundred bucks in engines.

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Posted 1/10/14

Vaporisor wrote:


UnlimitedEnergy wrote:

But you gotta pay to play I suppose.


I hear that all the time about the money I spend on manga and anime. Then I show them my garage and proceed to explain how I have 2k into the brakes in my one car alone.... If they still argue, Last year, I spent over 500 dollars just on ARP fasteners for an engine.

Quite honestly, Being an Otaku is CHEAP!

I also do rocketry. My 2m tall rocket, cost a couple hundred to build, and costs 20 dollars in aerotech rocket engines... PER LAUNCH! At an event day, I can easily fire off a couple hundred bucks in engines.



I guess so, but at the same time you get practical use out of your car. So while they can be expensive, you get a return on the investment so to speak.

Figures on the other hand provide no actual return, unless you're the kind of person that never opens them for the sole purpose of increasing the value 20 years down the line when they're super rare or what have you.
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Posted 1/10/14 , edited 1/10/14


I guess so, but at the same time you get practical use out of your car. So while they can be expensive, you get a return on the investment so to speak.

Figures on the other hand provide no actual return, unless you're the kind of person that never opens them for the sole purpose of increasing the value 20 years down the line when they're super rare or what have you.

Well... That can be relative..... True, my cars and bikes have a mechanical usage, but for the most part, it isn't much more than my general use every day car. Where I live, I only have, maybe 6-8mo I can ride my bikes. The old ones take lots of time money to keep running, and not alot of miles since don't want to put a bunch of wear on irreplacable parts. Usually just a short jaunt after work around the city. And really in terms of loss, Sure there is a return on the stuff, but still is thousands of loss in values since time is money and depreciation of parts.

You are quite correct though, it really comes down to the type of person you are. I myself am very picky. What I have for display only items is as follows.

Many many many model car kits.
Multiple video game display pieces.
Gundam Wing kits
Rally Vincent

That is about it, I am quite picky on what I get. Usually any display piece I get has some sort of asthetic appreciation, and I get for that, not so much for the value. It is the reason why I ordered the current three figma for AoT, and definitely going to try for the Armin collectors one....

... Then I will open it up, and put it on display, with value 20 years from now be darned. Getting it for myself and an asthetic appeal. I never discount the value of asthetics. Now the buy everything just to have everything, I think that is less so. I know people who will buy every released piece simply because it is who it is, nothing more. PVCs I can see leaving in the box. Often times they are well displayed inside. But leaving Figma's in the box.... just so dull... Oh how could Vincent ever be presented well without aiming that sniper rifle....
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Posted 1/10/14 , edited 1/10/14

g4enet wrote:


phogan wrote:

http://www.nekomagic.com/?p=19526

They are made the same way other figure and toys are, why they command such premiums ($100 - $300 in some cases) is beyond me.
They are modeled in a 3D CAD package that controls CNC mills to cut out the molds for injection molding. The painting is done largely by machine as well.


CNC'ing a block of steel/aluminum is actually expensive. I have a bow riser that is CNC'ed from a block of aluminum and that bow riser costs 700 USD.



Sorry, going to ramble here. I sorta get rabble when I hear people talk about just plug it into a computer and off you go...

Actually, I calling out on this since CNC is what I do for a living. It is alot more than a simple play in a computer then out pops magic working parts. At the bottom I am going to link a video I did as a project using CAD programming just to go through some of the details of the work involved.

CNC molds for detailed figures, is a pretty poor way to do it. Is alright for large components, but small detail is a no. CNC is never flawless, and it would take an extremely long time to properly cut into a mold the correct depth. It would be fine to a point, but after that, waste of time. Another flaw with CNC is that you can never make a perfectly sharp inside corner. Simply the sharpest you can make it would be the tool radius. CNC would be used for the initial hollowing, but after that, would be hand carved. That link shows it pretty well. Plus the time it takes. The time increases exponentially as you get smaller.

I did a Pontiac logo with some text a while back into aluminium. Cutting time was over 5 hours. For steel with details, it could actually take days to machine out. If you take the time I spent to do the modeling, and finalizing the coding so it would work, a single run would cost you close to a thousand, just because of the time to code. If I ran them off for two weeks straight, still going to be 300 bucks simply for machining time.

ALOT of the cost you pay for is the development cost. Certain things can be CAD modeled, but the base start for much of it still is with hand fabrication. These prototypes would take a fair bit of time. I am betting there is some shortcutting by modifying pre-existing templates though, just efficient that way. Sculpting, rejecting, remaking, all the trimming, finalizing. It can add up to alot of man hours to exactly match. Rapid prototyping isn't fast either. And once it is done, and you are holding it, might be garbage because something doesn't look or scale quite right, or is simply impossible to make.

Then comes mold planning. Easier now that there is software that does that. Isn't cheap though. And the end of the day, a heck of alot of parts to assemble. Even with automated paint application, still not quick and requires alot of people to do all the parts. As compared to other toys from plastic, their details really arent so great, or the parts are simple and repeated. And really think, was it that cheap? Look at the cost for a set of lego. An action set, etc. It is just colored plastic and stickers mostly. Injection lines still showing, fairly simple shapes.

So then comes the question as to why do they command 100-300? Well, it comes down to the details and the time they are made for. These molds, the tooling and jigs, all need to be made, that has to be paid for. The smaller figmas are pretty reasonable priced. 50 bucks, not too bad. The stuff up in the 300 is the large scale PVC's There aren't a high volume of those made. Think about how many a company like max factory comes out with per year. Not a large studio, short batch runs, and there you have it. You are paying for development, not production. Then again, how many are made in a batch? I dunno....

Now for my example.



Anywhoo, enough of the rambling. Sorry to all who read this, but I respect the artisans who do the high detail figs. Those that cannot see the difference between the 300 dollars ones and the 20 dollar ones, probably wouldn't get it ^.^
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Posted 1/10/14

UnlimitedEnergy wrote:


Vaporisor wrote:


UnlimitedEnergy wrote:

But you gotta pay to play I suppose.


I hear that all the time about the money I spend on manga and anime. Then I show them my garage and proceed to explain how I have 2k into the brakes in my one car alone.... If they still argue, Last year, I spent over 500 dollars just on ARP fasteners for an engine.

Quite honestly, Being an Otaku is CHEAP!

I also do rocketry. My 2m tall rocket, cost a couple hundred to build, and costs 20 dollars in aerotech rocket engines... PER LAUNCH! At an event day, I can easily fire off a couple hundred bucks in engines.



I guess so, but at the same time you get practical use out of your car. So while they can be expensive, you get a return on the investment so to speak.

Figures on the other hand provide no actual return, unless you're the kind of person that never opens them for the sole purpose of increasing the value 20 years down the line when they're super rare or what have you.


From my perspective your ideology is dismissing the function hobbyists around the world. Collecting anime merchandise, amateur rocketry, scrapbooking (bleh) and anything of the sort are all hobbies. For the most part you do it for the joy you receive therein, as well as being able to share that commonality with someone who does the same and nothing more.

Riding off of the rocketry example Vaporisor gave, there is no physical "return" on researching, designing and building your own rocket and using your own money to do so if it launches, screws up mid-flight, gets lost miles away from the pad and you never get it back. But you have the story and the memories behind it all, and that's what matters in my book.

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Posted 1/10/14 , edited 1/10/14

Sparktouched wrote:

From my perspective your ideology is dismissing the function hobbyists around the world. Collecting anime merchandise, amateur rocketry, scrapbooking (bleh) and anything of the sort are all hobbies. For the most part you do it for the joy you receive therein, as well as being able to share that commonality with someone who does the same and nothing more.

Riding off of the rocketry example Vaporisor gave, there is no physical "return" on researching, designing and building your own rocket and using your own money to do so if it launches, screws up mid-flight, gets lost miles away from the pad and you never get it back. But you have the story and the memories behind it all, and that's what matters in my book.



Yup, that is what being a hobbist is all about. I do things for the enjoyment of it! This summer I pulled a motorcycle out of a shed, spent probably at least 2500 just to get it ridable. Tons more work left to do, and I could have gotten a mint one for 2500... I did it because I love fixing up old and wrecked things, now I have a fantastic bike, that has more than just the dollars value (I am smiling just thinking about the joy of when I finally got it started and the adventures of that first day of riding that bike ... ...tangent, oops).

What I was sorta getting at was I think that collectibles are a fantastic hobby, and much like you said, one day, poof, my rocket will explode. They all get wrecked, beat up, some point. Same with my cars and bikes. Is a fight against degredation no matter how much I look after them. Figurines on the other hand, if displayed and kept clean, can last an extremely long time. Really, you get alot of bang for your buck! It is only really a waste if you are not doing it for yourself.

My oldest model is in fact over 70 years old, and I have it on loan to a museum. It is a scale model of a Lancaster Bomber, hand painted and carved from plexiglass that was broken plane windows. Made by my namesake while stationed with the CAF in england during WW2. He made 6, I do not know where the other 5 are. The monetary value means absolutely nothing. End of the day, it has no function, but there is nothing I value more than the meaning it has....
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Posted 1/10/14

Sparktouched wrote:
From my perspective your ideology is dismissing the function hobbyists around the world. Collecting anime merchandise, amateur rocketry, scrapbooking (bleh) and anything of the sort are all hobbies. For the most part you do it for the joy you receive therein, as well as being able to share that commonality with someone who does the same and nothing more.

Riding off of the rocketry example Vaporisor gave, there is no physical "return" on researching, designing and building your own rocket and using your own money to do so if it launches, screws up mid-flight, gets lost miles away from the pad and you never get it back. But you have the story and the memories behind it all, and that's what matters in my book.



No, I get it, I'm building my own collection of figures and merch, I just didn't think the car comparison was fitting since you get tangible benefits to having an operating car, versus the feelings of satisfaction and overall enjoyment of collecting figures.

There's no telling how much I'll end up spending on the collection, but I don't think I'll look at the collection and feel regret for having done so. It's cool to get the packages every month and add a little bit more to the shelf, even if the tangible benefits aren't there and it's only joy and satisfaction.
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Posted 1/10/14 , edited 1/10/14


I'll have you know, my lolis are tastefully dressed. They were too cute to pass up.
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Posted 1/10/14 , edited 1/10/14

UnlimitedEnergy wrote:

No, I get it, I'm building my own collection of figures and merch, I just didn't think the car comparison was fitting since you get tangible benefits to having an operating car, versus the feelings of satisfaction and overall enjoyment of collecting figures.

There's no telling how much I'll end up spending on the collection, but I don't think I'll look at the collection and feel regret for having done so. It's cool to get the packages every month and add a little bit more to the shelf, even if the tangible benefits aren't there and it's only joy and satisfaction.


Ahh. I guess it is a car guy thing. My bro actually calls me a "Cartaku" because my house, is pretty much entirely otaku, but then I have my garage which is pure car guy. Not a common thing to be hardcore into both areas. For a while, I was almost myself, is there any benefit to my collection of stuff. So for a few years, I got out of it. Heh, is kinda funny. One moment watching anime romcom, and 15 minutes later hanging out, wearing leathers, and riding our bikes. Sometimes I wonder what them bearded harley riders would look like if I suddenly started talking gundam instead of carbs....

The car guy thing is much like anime. There are different schools to it. Some spend the money not as a hobby, but to show off. Same way some people's collection are. I know of people, and unfortunately I know too many that their collection is less about enjoyment, and more about "I got this and you don't" Myself and my friends however, are much like you seem to be. It isn't just about owning it, but having it displayed, the maintaining of the collection. I relate it to a museum curator or a flower gardener. While many figures exist, your collection, and your layout is the only one in existence.

There is great pride in how you lay it out and organize! Especially for Figma. The way you pose them is unique, and the people who spend hours getting it just right, well that is worth having pride! Plus on top of that there is imagination. That is the real reason why anime is so internationally popular. It went from being kiddish cartoons to true storytelling. What we watch is reflections of our personality, and I do not think there is any anime fan who doesn't imagine just for a moment, "what if...."

Really, my automotive enthusiasm is more heartache than tangible benefit. It is many years of hard work to make something your own. Every vehicle I have worked on literally has my blood poured into it (you want to see a cut, rasp your knuckles on a rusted steel edge when a wrench slips). My first car, I have had for.. well, coming up on 17 years. It was out of commission for a couple years after a semi ran a light and I T-boned it. Got it back on the road, then engine went. Spent alot of money and time rebuilding it again, then a lady ran a stop sign and hit me. barely a couple thou km on the new engine. It really devastated me. I didn't go into my garage literally for 3 years. Still working on fixing it up. Set back two other projects as well. Less tangible than you think.

This gets back to figures. Kinda silly, but the reason I ordered the AoT Figma, was they re-invigorated my imagination. I used to write, cosplay, draw and all that. Once that car got hit, I was in a rut, just working day to day and playing vid games, reading manga series I had started, and watching the odd anime that sparked my interest. One day, I saw magika madoka was going to be in theatres. Signed up to CR to watch the series so I could check out the movie (I am a huge theatre buff). Then I saw AoT, and it blew me away. The figma are not just a collectible, but a form of fan-art, the collection and display, your own unique thumbprint onto the stories that inspire you, however they may.

That is what life is about
PCBFan 
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Posted 1/10/14 , edited 1/10/14


You know Detolfs fron Ikea are really good for display and they have a goid price too. Also you can easily add some optional lighting too it which makes it even look better!

Sadly my setup is not yet done I still need to buy like a couple more of those glass cases just to display my other figures.
PCBFan 
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Posted 1/10/14


Ahh I guess I'll just stick to blu-ray collecting then.
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Posted 1/10/14 , edited 1/10/14

PCBFan wrote:

Ahh I guess I'll just stick to blu-ray collecting then.


Good Idea :p The VHS I have is only because dvds didn't exist yet and laser discs never took off... They are neat to see on a shelf, but that is about it. I don't even attempt to watch them for nostalgia simply out of fear that the VHS player will eat it up.

Plus they take up so much room..... I have all James bonds up to "Tomorrow Never Dies" on VHS, takes up a shelf! Now compare to my robotech protoculture edition which is like 6" across or something....
PCBFan 
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Posted 1/10/14


Yeah they are pretty big for each tape and takes lots of room. I'll probably pass in that and start collecting them limited box sets of anime blu-rays
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Posted 1/11/14

PCBFan wrote:

Yeah they are pretty big for each tape and takes lots of room. I'll probably pass in that and start collecting them limited box sets of anime blu-rays


Much more fun ^.^... reminds me of a funny story actually...

When Tekkaman Blade came out in original format, it was released in three boxes. The first two white, and the last one a black to match the theme of that portion of the show. Shortly after, it was just in a single box for whole show with the cover of the first set. Anywhoo, I had lent them to my brother, and his house got broken into. They were stolen. I made insurance give the value for the replacement of the collectors boxes instead of the show. And it's much cheaper current existing set.

I wonder what the insurer was thinking as I am trying to explain the value of a black case....

Darn, I am getting off topic! They need more box sets that come with figs! Will need to start watching online for releases to order them.
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Posted 1/11/14


Wow. That sucks though. And that must have been pretty hard to explain to the insurance person lol.
Anyways, you can get figures in box sets?? I usually avoid those though since I exoerienced hell when I opened my Tales of Xillia collectirs edition and when I saw my Millia figure I was very dissapointed at hiw her hair is faded and has orange spots on them loooool. So sad... That's why I tend to avoid buying Bandai, Banpresto figures....

And yeah Griffon Company yep... No more just no more.
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